Foretravel Owners' Forum

Has anyone found a better price than this for Koni FSD 8805-1010 shocks?  $151.37  http://www.autopartsdealer.com/koni_fsd_shock_absorbers-p247721-p.html?utm_source=froogle&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=froogle&utm_content=APD247721 (http://www.autopartsdealer.com/koni_fsd_shock_absorbers-p247721-p.html?utm_source=froogle&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=froogle&utm_content=APD247721)  The picture of the shock is not the one that fits our coachs.

Everyone who bought them a few years ago when the euro was much lower must be happy.  The price of the Bilsteins has gone up too.

$172 from the Koni web site.

http://www.konirv.com/nextstep.cfm?Model=U280%2C+U300%2C+U320 (http://www.konirv.com/nextstep.cfm?Model=U280%2C+U300%2C+U320)

I would check Autozone. On my SOB they had good prices. They had to order them, but shipping was free and I had 90 days to return them if I didn't like them.

Hi Jerry,
  Try Jeg's or Summit race car parts on line pages. Jeg's was in the 120.00 range about two years ago. Much lowere cost than any of the other on line parts houses.

Jerry,
 
I was going to suggest Summit Racing, where I bought 4 last year for $135 each; however I just checked their website, and they are now asking $193.95 each! Come on!  A $58 increase in a year?  If you can find them for ~$150,
I'd jump on it.

How can I tell if my Shocks are bad?  It has Koni shocks on it and I would guess they are the originals. I can't tell if they are "FSD" or not. The Coach has nearly 60K on it and is a 2003. It rides pretty good, but when I hit some of that wavy pavement at 60mph it goes way up then way down. I don't know if it should bounce that much or not. Any way to tell ?

FSD shocks are gold. Standard Konis are orange.

Yes, Dave answered the "how do you tell" question (by color).

But, FSD's were not available in 2003, so it is a no brainer that you have Koni adjustable shocks.

And if you have excessive movement over large bumps, you need to adjust or replace the shocks.

The beauty of the new FSD's is that they are BOTH softer over the small bumps AND stiffer over the large ones than OE shocks.  More expensive technology, but gives both better ride and better handling.

Brett Wolfe

Jerry,

Just a caution on autopartdealer.com.  They had the best price I could find, but it took a month to get them.  They say they don't stock them, even though they say they're available on the website.  Apparently Koni is very slow shipping to them

Well mine are orange,,,so no doubt they could stand replacing. With the Tag, I suppose I have 6,,is that right? Best to do them all at once? How big a job is the replacement ,,,,something an old guy could do?    If a place is found with a better price, please post it..... I'll bet it sure would improve my ride....

Thanks for the info...

Mike

Mike, I don't have a tag, and used 8, two per tire....as I recall.

I wish  :))
I have 10 with the tag & yours is the same.

UGH,,,,,,OUCH!!!! Maybe it don't ride that bad after all!! LOL
  Maybe I could do ONE every other month,,,,,,,,,,,,gotta stay in my budget........

Mike,

I did one of my ten with my 3/4" drive sockets and decided to let FT do the rest.  Guys here have done it, but you need to remove tires, and even side skirts.  No thanks!

Yup, and I think the ones for the tag are a different model than the others.  We had ours done at around 54K miles in early 2009 and LOVE the FSDs.  Best external money we ever spent on the coach.  Best internal money was for the MCD blinds.

Michelle

I wonder if it would be cost effective to replace only the front shocks, four being cheaper than eight or ten.

The rear, being at the pivot point of the teeter-totter and carrying the bulk of the load, seems less in need of FSD shocks.

I tried just replacing the fronts to test them and found we are happy with just those.
The tag ones are Koni part # 88051011
The fronts are # 88051010

Thanks Barry, that's what i'll try...........now just to find a good place to purchase them..... 

Mike

I did fronts only. Like it. It's where I sit when driving!

Is ther 4 on the front axle,,,or only 2,,,,?

There are 4 on the front.  ??? Nice try Mike
You are not getting off that easy.  :D :P

well now if your coach has 10,,,,,,,,,,,is there 4 per axle,,,or is my math that bad?  You have 3 axle's,,,,,3X4=12,,,,,,,Is there just 2 on the Tag?

Barry is correct (as usual)

Front axle: 4
Drive axle: 4
Tax axle: 2

Brett Wolfe

If you have a tag you get a discount & only need 2 on the tag :D

Ah,,,OK,,, I gotcha!!  My next project!  Thanks

ok, saying I buy four at $151 shipped, what is the going rate to have them installed?  I need to know if my RV mechanic is being reasonable.

Tom,

I am sitting in FOT's parking lot and will ask Billy Jack tomorrow what they would charge.

Thinking about changing all mine as I believe they are original.. May not be needed but one of those things you do and say omg what a difference. Hopefully...

Jeff & Carol,
 
You will really like the better ride, and with less money in the safe it will be faster off the line.

Hi there Barry,
 
So what are the 3 Koni numbers for my coach with a tag... same (almost) as most other Foretravel coaches regardless of the year??
 
Jim
2002 U320 42'
 
Barry Beam" barrybeam@beamalarm.com
To: frerichs@rcom-ne.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: [ForeForums] Koni FSD shocks

Four

Yes the same
The fronts & Rears are # 88051010
The tag are Koni part # 88051011

I ordered them, I can wait a month.  Expected ship date Nov 25 Thanksgiving, doubt if they will be working that day.  Even the Bilstein shocks are about $95. 

If I don't get out of Nac soon won't be any money in the safe....this "free" parking at Fot is ending up costing about $1,400 a day. 

Jeff,
 
If you change your shocks yourself,  lots of penetrating oil wrench and an air wrench are almost a necessity.
 
Jim
2002 U320
 

You got us beat.  Mudflap, stainless steel logo and some misc stuff dinged us for around $350.00 Don't forget you get to use and the "free" laundry

I recall about 20 minutes each times 8 shocks at MOT x hourly labor charge

Tom,
 
In May of this year I had the four front Koni FSD's installed, which required the fender skirts to be removed.  I believe the listed (by FT factory) labor per tire to remove and replace each shock was 0.5 (1/2) hours, so whatever the hourly labor rate (Keith Risch at Encore RV here in Nacogdoches did ours) is, that should give a fair estimate.  In addition to the shocks, Keith had to drop the oil pan and replace a broken oil dip stick tube.  The total cost, including 4.5 gallons of Delo 400 15W-40 was $540. I just found my invoice: 4 shocks took 2.0 hours at $90/hour. Dipstick tube replacement was 3.0 hours ($270).  The tube, oil, taxes, etc. made up the difference. I can't believe he was able to remove the skirt, the shock, install the new one, and the skirt in 30 minutes, but that's what I was charged.  Very reasonable, IMHO.

I purchased 4 Koni FSD Shock's (part no. 88051010) for the front of my Coach and had them installed yesterday...  In a week I'll be traveling 1400 miles from South Texas to Congress, AZ, anxious to see the difference in the ride....

Best price I could find was from LTD Autoparts, Florida. 1-888-211-1538,,,,,$164.00 each shipped. It took 7 days from the day I ordered them until UPS delivered. The Shocks were delivered direct from Koni in Hebron, KY.....

Summitt Racings best price was $193.00 each, plus a $12.95 delivery charge......

We have a local guy(Mission, TX) that does a lot of work on all of our RV's and cars/trucks etc., that insalled them for me and charged me $50.00.TOTAL............... It took him less than 1 hour to replace all 4 and he never took off a wheel......

I'm happy! :)

Mike

You have a great mechanic at a great price.  Can you share his name and phone number?

I ordered 8 from autopartsdealer.com for $151.37 each and no shipping.  Ordered on Nov 4 and they arrived today Nov 18 (2 weeks).  Haven't put them on yet, and I am sure it will take me longer than an hour for four. 

Does it seem a little strange to anyone other than me, that the front and rear shocks are the same.  The rear axle is much heavier than the front, four wheels vs. two, and more weight on the rear axle.  The front and rear brake pads and rotors are also the same size, although the rear has larger air chambers for more clamping force on the pads.  With that in mind the rear pads will probably wear out before the front pads.  At least that seems to be the case on my coach, the rear pads are showing more wear than the front. 

Sure George,,,,,,It's called Angel's Auto and Truck repair and is just a couple miles from our place at Retama Village in Mission, TX. http://mpmcfall.tripod.com/id12.html (http://mpmcfall.tripod.com/id12.html)   

I don't have the telephone no., Its only a couple miles away and I just drive over when I need something....  It's a small operation and probably wouldn't work for any real serious stuff, but the regular run of the mill, brakes, muffler, alternator, shocks, etc, stuff Angel is great...
He did a lot of Exhaust work on my Volvo Semi truck..

Any one in Retama Village or Bentsen Palm Village next door would be able to direst you to him....It's on Scheurbach???,St.<sp>(something like that)  Angel speaks good English.........Flat Rate,,,$50.00 per hr.....No Checks, but does take credit cards. I always pay him cash,,,,he likes that!


By the way, our place down here is for sale or rent if you would ever be interested.........Its rented Jan, Feb and Mar, this year, but Dec is open as is next year...

Mike

how did he go about adjusting them for the different weight  and bounce ??
Installed in how long !/?/!/?, for what !!

Bill,

FSD's are not adjustable (actually "self" adjusting), so that part of it is a non-issue.

Brett Wolfe

Thanks, Mike.  I have put him in my book.

Just had Koni FSD Shocks replaced at FOT.. Eight shocks and labor total just under $1500.00.  $32.00 labor per shock and $155.00 per shock. (approx).  WHAT a difference...think the originals were still on...140K miles ago...

Add that darn Texas sales tax to get a true number...

Just FYI

Bret,
'splain "self adjusting" please

You will love them. I replaced mine the second trip out and wow is all I can say. I 20 became much nicer to drive.

John,,,Did you replace just the FRONT or did you do all of them?

Mike

Bill,

Most shocks are a compromise.  If stiff enough to handle the large bumps, they are over-stiff on the small ones.  If they ride soft enough over the small bumps, they allow porpoising over the large ones.

The FSD's don't have to make that  choice of "should we be soft enough for the little bumps OR firm enough for the large ones" because they have an extra set of valves in the shock that says it can be BOTH softer over the small bumps AND/AS WELL AS firmer over the large ones.

So, FSD's do give  a softer ride over the small bumps AND better control over the large ones.

Brett Wolfe

I noticed the old shocks I took off (Orange)  had good resistance when I pulled up, but when I pushed them back down there was hardly no resistance at all........................The New "FSD's" had a lot of resistance both going up and down...  Which I think will help on mine a lot!!

It seemed when I hit a bump the front end would go up,,,,,then come down quick, with very little shock resistance....  I'll find out soon if these  correct that......

I didn't really see any type of "adjustment" on the old ones.....I kept them, I'll have to go take another look.

Mike

Rebound Adjustment Procedure
Some shocks can be adjusted while still on the vehicle by removing the lower nut and compressing the shock fully from underneath. If you can do this, follow the instructions below, bearing in mind that clockwise turns will increase the force in the shock, and counterclockwise turns will decrease it. If there is insufficient room under the vehicle, remove the shock and hold it vertically with the dust cover on top. You may use a vice to hold the bottom attachment. If you do mount the shock in a vice, we recommend you use soft jaws to minimize damage to the shock.

Fully collapse the shock absorber while turning shock slowly counterclockwise until you feel the adjustment nut engage in the recesses of the foot valve assembly. Once the adjustment nut has engaged, it is a good idea to make a mark with a black felt on the dust cover and shock body (to make it easier to keep track of adjustment turns).

The damper may have already been adjusted so gently turn it further to the left counting the half turns until you feel a stop.

DO NOT USE FORCE.
If you want to increase the forces, keep the shock absorber collapsed and make a minimum of 1 half-turn (180 degrees) clockwise. In case of prior adjustment add the number of half-turns previously found. The total range is about 5 half-turns.

Pull the shock absorber out vertically without turning for at least 1 cm to disengage the adjusting mechanism. The shock may now be turned freely and reinstalled on the vehicle.

ADJUSTING DIRECTION
Clockwise = Firmer Counter Clockwise = Softer

The link to adjusting the Koni non-FSD shocks (as Barry posted):  http://www.konirv.com/adjustment.html (http://www.konirv.com/adjustment.html)

And absolutely, Konis do the vast majority of their dampening on EXTENSION/REBOUND, as dampening on COMPRESSION adds to the effective spring rate.  Said another way, dampening on compression makes the ride harsher/stiffer.

Brett Wolfe

In taking a closer look at the old ones, I see on the bottom of the shock it says "adjustable" and has an -------> with a + on it....

However that's not an issue with the new FSD's..........and I don't believe I'll mess with adjusting the remaining non-FSD ones on the rear..

I will "pitch" the old ones.

Thanks Barry and Brett for the info...

Mike

If the old ones are still good and not leaking, someone might want one or two to replace a defective shock.  I will have some old Bilsteins in a week or so.  If no one wants them, I will try Craigslist. 

Mike,

To adjust the orange Koni's, compress them all the way, then twist the bottom section with respect to the top.  You will feel a click at each adjustment.  I think three rotations are available.

Thanks Brett, When I get a minute I'll play around with them a little...

Can anybody use these Shocks I took off????

The Coach is 2003 and had 55K miles on it, so they are no doubt originals..... 

Let me know ASAP if anyone can use them,,,,,,If you want 'em their yours....


Mike

I have installed the 8 new Koni FSD shocks and here is the results.  It seems to ride a little better with out as much bouncing after a dip in the pavement, otherwise the ride is about the same.  As I am not a full timer and driving it frequently, it is rather difficult to make a judgement about the ride and I have only driven it about 25 miles after the installation.  For those who said it is a lot of work, it is and it isn't.  For the dedicated DIY'er with the right tools it shouldn't be very difficult.  It's just a matter of removing and replacing 2 bolts for each shock.  Getting to some of those bolts is the problem.  If you are a large person that will make it harder.  I am  6' 165 lbs.  There was reference of 200 ft-lbs of torque for these bolts, they were not that tight.  I could loosen all the nuts using an 18" ratchet.  None had rusted threads though and I used PB blaster.  The nuts are fine thread and self locking, so it takes many turns to get them off and on, and once loose they cannot be turned by hand.  Lots of wrenching unless you can use a power tool.  Wrench size for both the nut and bolt is 1 1/8".  I removed the rear fenders to replace those 4.  I think removing the rear wheels would have worked too.  The front rear upper bolts are difficult to get to.  Removing and replacing the rear fenders was more work (not difficult) than the 4 shocks there.  I did not remove the front fenders to change the front shocks.  The right front was the easiest to get to, the tie rod and drag link make it difficult for the others.  About 4 hours for me for the front 4 as I didn't have any power tools, or a gofer to hand me the tool I forgot before I crawled under the MH. 

The rear shocks seemed to be the most worn out and that was where the leaky one was too.  They are easier to compress by hand than the front ones.  Not sure if that is a way to test shocks, but I am throwing away the rear 4.  The front 4 Bilsteins  still seem to be good, and maybe that is why I don't notice much difference in the ride.  If anyone wants them let me know, they are located in Austin, TX.  Used for 65K miles.  Free if you come get them. 

Nice job Jerry,,,,,,well done!   

Mike

As an after the fact exercise, I did an internet search on how to tell if motorhome shocks need replacing other than the obvious leak, cupped tire wear, etc.  Found this statement by Brett Wolfe in an Open Roads forum: "You mention that you do a bounce test on your car's shocks. Same for the motorhome. No, you can't test them by hand, but you can by driving over regular parking lot speed bumps at normal (low) speed. If an axle bounces more than 1.5 times they need replacement."  I also found a comment that if most of your driving is on smooth highways, you will probably think you wasted money on the Koni FSD's, however if you drive on bumpy roads you will think they are great.  Maybe I need to drive the road into Chaco Canyon again. 

The fact that the my old rear shocks had less resistance than the front shocks, falls in line with my theory that equal size parts on the rear axle wear out before equal size parts on the front axle, due to more weight on the rear axle. (brake pads, rotors, air bags, shocks)

No need for Chaco Canyon here in Southern California.  Any CalTrans maintained (?) freeway will do.

I got mine from Summit Racing last spring for $131 each.  :))  Great timing!
I also replaced them myself, hard work, not recommended unless you're a brute for punishment.
However, I'm glad I did it.

I've got pictures, etc. if anybody is interested.

Can the pics be posted here along with any procedural write up so all can benefit?  I know I would like more info.  Thank you.

I've only replaced with Bilsteins so far, so can't comment about the Koni's (I would like to be able to comment on them, though :)).)
The Bilsteins are gas-filled and getting them compressed to install the bottom bolt was a pain.  I used a band clamp (from Home Depot, Lowes, etc.) to compress the shocks and hold them compressed while I installed the bolts.  Also needed to use an air impact wrench on the upper bolts, since access with a ratchet was hard.

Our experience with Konis has been great. In '07 we headed for Newfoundland with a new set of Goodyear tires. By the time we got home to Texas, the front tires were cupped so badly that some cords were beginning to show and the rears were showing just a little cupping. I took the coach to FT to get the front end checked and they said that it was in good condition and near perfect alignment,. The coach was handling poorly (hard to hold in a straight line especially on narrow roads like state highway 21 near Nac). We bought a pair of Michelins for the front at the tire dealer in Nac and drove the 170 miles home. The coach still felt squirrely so I ordered a set of eight Koni FSDs from Summit Racing and had them installed by MOT. This solved my problems completely to my satisfaction. We had about 85k miles on the coach when we left for NFL and nearly 130k now and it handles like it did when it was new and no more tire cupping. Note that our coach is a 34' Foretravel.

Could you compress the new Bilsteins by hand by pushing down on them with the bottom end on the ground?  I can do that with the old ones I took off and I am wondering what the difference is with old vs new.  The front ones are stronger than the rear ones.  The Koni's not being gas filled could be pushed together rather easily, but then extending them took some effort and time.  Did make it easy to install as far as lining up the bolt holes. 

I could compress the Bilsteins by pressing them down on the ground, but they were pretty stiff.  Impossible to get on without some way to hold them a bit compressed.  I'm happy to hear that the Konis don't need that, since they will be the next shocks for the rig.

Dave, if you installed Bilsteins, I doubt that you will ever need to replace them with anything. I like the Konis but I don't think anything beats Bilsteins. They should be good for the life of the coach if they are anything like their automotive shocks.

Kent,

We have Bilsteins on the 1997 U295. I wanted to change them before our December trip, but couldn't get into FOT until January. I think our coach porpoises and rocks too much. I expect the Konis will help. We put them on our previous 1997 37' DP. The new shocks along with Henderson's Motion Control Units for the air bags made a remarkable improvement in that coach. The FT, however, rides better with old shocks than the SOB did after the upgrades.

I have high hopes for improvements from new shocks and a proper all wheel alignment from FOT. We plan to get that work done in January.