I've been messing around with our accumulator tank for about 9 months now and I think it is dying on me. So here is my dilemma. Would you replace the tank? Or would you just use it as is until the original water pump dies? I am leaning toward the latter. I was also contemplating ordering a replacement pump so that I have it when the original dies. At that time I would then bypass and remove the accumulator tank as others have done.
What would you do?
An IH-45 is not in the cards
Geez, George...you don't have a spare Million bucks laying around? Well, in that case, I would replace the current set up without the accummulator tank when practicable so as not to have the breakdown while I'm showering... ???
George,
Not sure how your plan will work and how your water system differs from mine but the previous owner of my coach had put a new SurFlow 5.7 in (no accumulator now and not sure it ever had one doesn't look like there was any room for one on my coach anyway) and it has worked fine for the couple of years that I have had the coach.
Good luck
George, if you are having a problem with the tank, pull the cover of the end of the tank and push in the shrader valve, if you get water out the tank is bad, you can replace it with a water worker HT-2B, you can find them on the net form $41.00 to $57.00, I replaced mine and use a variable speed pump, I left that setup, so if you use a small amount of water the pump will not run.
George, I am facing the same dilemma. My pump sounds like a Jack Hammer and my tank leaks down over several weeks. I suppose it could be as simple as the schraeder valve in the tank but I'm pretty sure the pump is on its last legs. I replaced the pump on my U225 with a Shure Flo Whisper King silent pump just because the original was noisy. Replacing the pump was a piece of cake. So, my thoughts are like yours, buy a replacement pump and keep it on hand when the old one goes out. But, the cost of a tank and old style pump is less than one of the new variable speed pumps. From what I have read the VSP's have had some problems in less than 5 years and they tend to make you use more water (higher pressure and flow rate).The old style pumps and accumulator tanks typically last for 15 years or better. So I still can't decide which way to go so I am not doing anything right now.
Let us know what you decide. It might motivate me to make a move.
Buy a new accumulator down at Lowe's or Home Depot andinstall it.
Then buy an exact replacement water pump. You can useit with a water bag to make sure you always have a tank of water, regardless of conditions and if the main pump fails you have redundancy. If your water system develops major problems you can live off of the water bag and the spare pump til you fix it. Course you'd have to buy a water bag. Nothing works as well as redundancy.
Regards,
JON TWORK KB8RSA
George, I threw out my accumulator when it would not fit in the space with anew Shurflo 5.7, been three years now and no problems. ( the first Shurflo did die quickly but was replaced by thyem ).
It did take some tinkering with the set screw in the ned of the pump but I now have better pressure than before.
I replaced our stalled water pump with a Flojet 4406-143, and the instructions recommended against using an accumulator tank. I took out the tank (which was leaking anyway), and it works fine without it. As others have commented, the accumulator tank is one place that never gets properly sanitized, so better off without it.
Update: the bladder has broken. But there are no leaks in the tank. Am I risking anything by using the system for the foreseeable future?
My opinion only, but I would say that if there is a risk, half of us would be dead now. Having said that, I will back track a bit. Two things bother me about accumulator's. How do they get sanitized, and how do they get winterized? Maybe there's enough exchange of fresh water, but I can't imagine that there is. Anyway, mine was dead when I got the coach. I took it out and capped the line into it. Works fine that way.
Gayland,
I been sanitizing my water system each year when I take the coach out of storage. First, the antifreeze is drained by opening all three valves in the water pump/heater compartment (on the U270 model). Close valves & fill water tank with an appropriate saniting solution (1/4 cup bleach per gallon water; 1 gal solution per 15 gal tank capacity; 1.8 cups Bleach per 110 gals Water). Run all water faucets to fill with solution...inclusing water heater and the expansion tank. Let stand for 3 to six hours. Drain system and fill with fresh potable water with about one tbsp baking soda (removes any bleach odors & taste which may remain in the system).
I suggest that with or without an expansion tank, this sanitation procedure be performed every six months, specially if you fulltime and use a lot of shoreline water as your usual source.
I forgot to add that I use a water heater by-pass valve, so I do not have to drain the WH of antifreeze, but I do have to drain the water heater once the system has been filled with the sanitizing solution. Returning the water heater by-pass valve to the open position is also part of my routine each year when I begin the sanitation process.
If the accumulator is properly pressured, it should purge it contents at the same time your pump turns on. When the water pump turns on, it will recharge the accumulator with the solution it is pumping. The would be antifreeze, sanitizing solution, or fresh water. The input to the pump would depend on your objective.
Sorry Peter, I didn't make myself clear there, causing you to do a lot of extra typing. But thank you anyway. What I was referring to was getting the old water out to exchange with good stuff. As JD points out (may I call you JD?) a properly pressurized system will probably do that. But what if it's broken, as mine was and George's also. I have a vague recollection of there being rusty looking water coming out of mine when I removed and drained it. Key word, vague, maybe I'm remembering something else. Anyway, the point being, this is a very common occurrence I'm sure. Incidentally, I'd checked into replacing it with one from Lowes, none of them were small enough to fit in the space mine was.
I did an on-line search and everything I found was described as a "vertical tank." But since I am not going to replace my accumulator tank, it is a moot point.
JD works well. It is less common and easier to spell than Dave.
Gayland,
Not to worry about the extra typing...I like to be redundant most of the time. It just gives me something to do... ;D
Besides, it never hurts to remind folks of alternatives...
I am revisiting the issue of accumulator/water pump issues. Our tank bladder has ruptured so I have three choices:
1. Do nothing. But I do not like the constant surging of water we get without the tank working properly and it could become a place to harbor bacteria.
2. Replace the tank. I've seen prices from $200 down to around $168. And now I just found a Shurflo plastic tank for only $43 at PPL.
3. Remove the tank and replace the pump to get rid of the pulsing. If I go with this option I am considering the Shurflo 5.7 (but it has a history of problems, but for which Barry recently reported has the ability to adjust its flow) or the AquaJet 5.3 (which Steve and Michelle have and like). Steve said the installation instruction on the AquaJet were very cautionary for installations like ours with multiple off/on switches. However, I would think that this has no bearing on a correct installation because at some point only two wires go to the pump and those would be the only two wires I would work with.
I am looking for input from those of you who have had either of these pumps for a while as well as general suggestions from anyone else (need I say that?).
My time line for this repair is before the end of March.
As always, tank you.
I went the Shurflo 5.7 route a year ago and have loved it with no problems.
Brett,
Is that without the accumulator tank?
George,
Since I have found out about that adjustment on the 5.7, there has been no more pulsing. I am wondering if that pulsing may have contributed to having to replace it several times. Time will tell. With the replacement I got 3 more years warranty.
George,
I removed the accumulator tank.
Wow, I am really behind the curve on this one...............not to derail the thread, however, I didn't even know I have an accumulator tank...........out of curiousity where is it and what is the purpose of having one.
Thanks.
If you have one it should be very close to your water pump. The purpose of this tank is to even out the "pulsing action" created by a standard pump. With an accumulator tank the water you "demand" by opening a faucet is the water in the tank for which it is kept at a fairly constant pressure because of a rubber bladder that forces the water out as it is replaced by the pump. Also, with an accumulator tank you will have times when you use a small amount of water as in rinsing out a glass and at those times the pump might not even come on. But with the new variable speed pumps, one does not really need the accumulator tank. Whew! I hope I got it right.
Now. Back to the question at hand, please.
After 5 years without an accumulator tank I just reinstalled a new one. I took it out when I installed a new Flowjet variable speed pump. I got used to the slight delay when I opened the facet but everything worked fine. That same year I installed a new water heater (Atwood - not Aquahot). Occasionally the temperature/pressure relief valve would leak a little. I replaced it twice, I followed directions about creating an air gap at the top of the tank, and resigned to it leaking by adding a drain tube so the front of heater wouldn't be wet all the time. Recently while researching residential water heater installations, I kept coming across discussions on how an accumulator is sometimes necessary (or req'd by code). The reason: thermal expansion (they actually say the water's density changes with temperature). It's most noticeable in colder climates (I'm in Boise, ID) where the incoming water is very cold and you heat it to a high temperature (like I do to give me more "virtual" capacity - by adding an optional adjustable thermostat). Since the original accumulator tank location is rather cramped and the tank can be located anywhere in the cold water circuit, I found a nice, "hard to use for anything else" corner under the kitchen sink. I mounted it on a length of reinforced hose with the water fitting pointing down (for winterizing). This so I can pull it out and check the pressure easily. No more leaking from the relief valve.
I don't know if this information applies to an Aquahot and this is just one guy's guess of a problem and it's fix.
John wrote "the tank can be located anywhere in the cold water circuit....."
Now why didn't I think of that? I just took out my washer/dryer. I should be able to mount a tank in there, hook it up to the washer water supply and turn on the valve. Is there any reason not to go with a bigger size tank, say 5 gallons instead of the 2 gallons?
George,
I removed my accumulator tank and installed a ShurFlo 5.7 in 2002 (at least, I think that was the year.....I can go back and check). I purchased the initial pump from Camping World, at an FMCA show in Perry, GA, at a promotional show price, during the early days of the Shurflo 5.7's availability.
Two days ago, I installed my FOURTH replacement pump (covered by Shurflo warranty each time, but also varying degrees of hassle from Camping World each time). I would not keep doing it except out of stubbornness and cost conservation.
Right from the start, I did things correctly with new, 12 Ga., stranded wire upgrade all the way from the 12 Vdc fuse panel, the Shurflo specified inlet strainer, the 18 inches of lead-in and exit reinforced, ½" I.D. soft, flexible tubing.
The failures have been as follows:
1. Pump 1 developed internal leakage from outlet to inlet (continual On/Off/On/Off cycling).
2. Pump 2 developed a never shut off condition (continued to run at a low speed crawl and motor got so hot it blistered the Shurflo motor paint and scorched the floor of the utility bay)
3. Pump 3 would run but the outlet pressure decayed and the pump motor got so hot it would seize and not restart.
4. Pump 4 began not shutting off. I adjusted "Barry's Phillips head machine screw", in center of the pump head, 1/8th turn. The pump would then reliably cycle and shut off but it then started leaking out of the pump to motor casing joint about three days later – about a pint of leakage per eight hours (overnight). Careful disassembly and re-assembly disclosed nothing and did not improve the condition.
We do use our pump a lot:
- We always filter fill and then immediately divorce from shore water, using our own tank and pump to keep our TOTAL fresh water system fresh and turning over.
- If we are on the road and I'm heading "dirty" into an RV park with an unknown coach/car/trailer washing policy, I pull over and use my own (low pressure/high volume) pressure washer and onboard water to arrive clean. I installed a sillcock in the utility bay, direct from the Shurflo pump outlet, to accommodate this. I also use a hose, off of this sillcock, each day when I wash the collection of bug specimens off of the front cap of the coach, after a day's drive. I have never had an RV park object to this.
- When the Shurflo 5.7 is operating properly, the volume is great for showers and my exterior washing demands.
- The volume is easily twice what I originally had for volume.
- The noise is very low and is much improved over the original accumulator and pump. When the fresh water tank becomes low (last six inches of the tank), my plumbing is such that the pump starts to hum (minor cavitation, I assume). That lets me know that I need to refill the fresh water (an audible reminder mechanism).
- The surging of the pump, as it hunts for both the proper variable pressure and variable flow rate, is "different" from any other system that I've ever experienced. It was a little unnerving at first, but I no longer notice it. Newcomers on the coach often mention it as "somewhat (to very) strange".
- The five pumps for the price of one isn't all that bad except for the hassle of finding the purchase paperwork. Of course, the inoperabe pump problems tend to happen at the least convenient of times. And I've come close to ending all future relationships with Camping World, a couple of times, over their conduct associated with a couple of these pump problems.
- If I had known all of this before hand, I would never have gone the Shurflo 5.7 gpm route. I would have stayed with the accumulator and used something like the (now available) Shurflo 4008 "Revolution" pump, "on/off", (KISS PRINCIPLE!!.............not variable pressure, not variable flow, not solid state, not "computer controlled"), 3.0 gpm, 55 psig. In retrospect, the 3.0 gpm and 55 psig would likely have been plenty of volume and pressure for my needs.
- I have met more than a few others with similar tales of Shurflo 5.7 woes, and Googling "Shureflo 5.7 PROBLEMS" will provide you with a wealth of significant reading material.
I hope that this is of some use to you or others that contemplate this change (before or after any poor Shurflo 5.7 experience).
May your flow be strong and trouble free! :D
Neal
Neal:
Your thorough response is extremely helpful. Thank you.
After reading of all of the problems you had with the Shurflo, I have decided to buy the AquaJet 5.3.
To me, the hassle of having to replace the Shurflo more than once is just too much of a PITA. I will have to partially disassemble part of one bay to replace the pump.
Many of us have said this before, but it bears repeating: the knowledge and assistance here is nothing short of remarkable.
George, the Water Worker HT-2B is an exact replacement for the tank that is in our coach's. :)
I don't think so. From what I read 2 gallons for our size systems is probably overkill. Two gallon units are often used in residential systems. That's really the only reason I purchased a 2 gallon is because it was easy to get at Home Depot.
Shurflo does make a 21 oz unit:
Accumulator Tanks (http://legacy.shurflo.com/pages/food_service/beverage/accumulator_tanks/tanks.html)
21 oz sure does seems too small. Searching on the web, the cost seems to be about the same as a 2 gal unit.
Bill,
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I was ready to sit down tonight and order a replacement pump because I was going to tear out the old pressure tank and at the same time put in a new variable speed pump because without the tank we are hearing an annoying pulsing sound. So I have ordered this tank from Amazon for a few pennies shy of $38 including S&H. When the pump goes south at some future point, then I will address replacing it.
George, when you replace your tank,make sure you replace the cone washer in the end of the Pex fitting,you can get them at most RV parts stores.
I, excuse me, Steve and I just replaced my Shurflo pump yesterday (Steve took pity on the feeble old man with the bad shoulder). The accumulator tank was still good after 18 years. The new pump is twice as quiet as the old one due to a new floating mount system.
THANKS !!! Steve for caring for the elderly.
Bill,
Thank you for the heads up. Is the washer in the attached photo what I need to get?
George, that looks like the one.