Foretravel Motorhome Forums => Foretravel Discussions => Topic started by: Benjie Zeller on June 14, 2012, 08:43:58 am
Title: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 14, 2012, 08:43:58 am
May be of interest to someone. No reserve so could go pretty cheap!
Big 40' 1997 Foretravel U320 with 400HP Cummins M11 and selling W/ NO RESERVE! (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280899980151&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en#ht_4582wt_1167)
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: drcscruggs on June 14, 2012, 11:22:59 am
I looked at motorhome and liked it and the no reserve status (means will sell). I then looked at their feedback and though it was good, certainly was a lot of "private" transactions. Waaay more than I would expect. I certainly would view, evaluate my purchase prior to paying the bill to insure representation and description was accurate.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: wolfe10 on June 14, 2012, 11:36:26 am
As it is up north, check bulkheads. If driven on salt roads and not hosed off, they could be a real issue.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Peter & Beth on June 14, 2012, 11:41:27 am
As it is up north, check bulkheads. If driven on salt roads and not hosed off, they could be a real issue.
I agree. It is a certainty that a 97 Unicoach will need to have the bulkheads redone...about $1,300 done by others front & back. But, this is a well built unit with the long lasting M11 engine and 4060R Allison. Peter
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: PatC on June 14, 2012, 11:42:03 am
The phone numbers come back to these two outfits.
Total Outdoor Adventures 1090 Manchester Ave Wabash, IN 46992 Phone: 260-414-1978
and
Trucks Plus (260) 571-1868 1812 S Wabash St, Wabash, IN 46992-4120
Trucks Plus has a BBB rating of F. Reason 2 "Problems with Product / Service".
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave Head on June 14, 2012, 11:50:32 am
roof and sidewall delam would be my major concerns, plus the condition of the aquahot. If it goes for $25-30K it would be a heck of a deal if repairs were less than 10K.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 14, 2012, 01:52:11 pm
I like the relocation of the retarder wand versus mine which is next the the wall. Good idea
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Barry & Cindy on June 14, 2012, 06:27:34 pm
RE: I like the relocation of the retarder wand versus mine which is next the wall.
Side dash panel is made up of square segments and any light switch or retarder joy stick can be easily relocated from one square to another. Lift up the side panel and make changed from underneath.
Retarder stick should be mounted where you can easily and quickly use it.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 14, 2012, 09:08:14 pm
roof and sidewall delam would be my major concerns, plus the condition of the aquahot. If it goes for $25-30K it would be a heck of a deal if repairs were less than 10K.
Would your budget go up if it were a 450? Just asking.
The coach may well have 28k miles as it has creation windows without seal creep. May be a real deal either way.
Bob
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave Head on June 14, 2012, 11:36:29 pm
Since I own a 400hp M11, I will say no. I get 9 mpg most of the time. The 97's were 450 hp - the other improvements are what's critical - aquahot, ducted air, dual pane windows, maniblock system and smart wheel are made the 97 a step up in my opinion...
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 12:03:32 am
Good chance it is a 450 M11 and the listing agent just made an error.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: John Haygarth on June 15, 2012, 12:07:31 am
any body on the board live close to inspect?? I may be interested as a project for a few months. NADA has this unit -ingood condition at between 35-45k after the 10% discount. HMM John
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: kenhat on June 15, 2012, 12:15:58 am
Looks like a new microwave. I wonder if the door opens? I ran into this when I was thinking of replacing mine.
If it does open I want the brand and model. :)
see ya ken
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 12:42:27 am
any body on the board live close to inspect?? I may be interested as a project for a few months. NADA has this unit -ingood condition at between 35-45k after the 10% discount. HMM John
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 15, 2012, 12:50:56 am
Since I own a 400hp M11, I will say no. I get 9 mpg most of the time. The 97's were 450 hp - the other improvements are what's critical - aquahot, ducted air, dual pane windows, maniblock system and smart wheel are made the 97 a step up in my opinion...
The 97 weighs more so the change to the 450/1450 was a help. Mine is just fast enough. Less power to weight ratio would be not as much fun for an old Rv sales manager with a heavy foot like me. I would think your 95 is similar to my 97.
I sold a lot of L10's in monacos way back when. These have more power by quite a bit.
Bob
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 15, 2012, 12:52:02 am
any body on the board live close to inspect?? I may be interested as a project for a few months. NADA has this unit -ingood condition at between 35-45k after the 10% discount. HMM John
That would be wholesale
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: John Haygarth on June 15, 2012, 12:05:26 pm
Benjie, I will not go over 25k on it so will let you keep bidding and hope you get it. I just wanted to play with it then sell. John
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 12:39:14 pm
John, I'm not sure I'm willing to go up to 25K. I'm technically looking to sell my U295 and wait to repurchase something until my 2 year old is about 4. I'm bidding because if I get it super cheap, then why not! Maybe I shouldn't have posted it here! ;-)
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: John Haygarth on June 15, 2012, 02:45:17 pm
Benjie, once I knew you were bidding I decided to let you go for it as it is not important to me. There are many others out there I can buy, but I do not unless I get it below wholesale like the one we have and the first one. So carry on my friend. John
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 02:57:37 pm
Thanks John! If I decide to drop off under $25K, I'll let you know! I'd basically be purchasing this site unseen other than the pics. I'm willing to take a large amount of risk at a low enough price, but my guess is this may go for quite a bit more than $25K. I'm doing some more research and going to call them, but I'm a little concerned about things like delamination, bulkhead, roof leaks, how the engine/transmission/generator has been maintained, etc. Basically, all the high cost items that you can't see in pics!
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Peter & Beth on June 15, 2012, 03:26:13 pm
I think a fair allowance for deferred maintenance & repairs on this unit is $10,000. I assume new tires, full bulkhead repairs, batteries, starter, alternator and full fluid changes to start. Maybe a full detail at $1,000 may be in order as well. Then the problems may begin, but I've allowed enough to keep me happy with the purchase at no more than $25,000. Then again, maybe the seller is barking up the wrong tree and will pull the unit off the auction before it's done.
Peter
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: wolfe10 on June 15, 2012, 03:54:00 pm
Peter,
Actually, $10,000 may be way low if things like the coolant have not been maintained (this is a linered engine and if run for a year without SCA or ELC coolant, the cylinder walls could be shot). And as we have seen, bulkhead repair can run from a broken bolt or two to complete separation requiring rebuilding. $1,300 is NOT worse case scenario for bulkhead repair.
Not trying to paint a gloomy picture, but there are some coaches not worth even (what you think is) a bargain price.
Just went through this on another forum on an SOB. Exceptionally low price (low enough that many though it was a scam), but upon inspection, it was determined that the unit was in FL with windows that had leaked for a LONG time-- mold, and even mushrooms growing inside. No price would make that one a bargain.
As with any purchase CHECK IT OUT or have someone who is competent check it out for you.
Now, on one you have never seen, as long as the seller is legit, make an offer "Subject to inspection and test drive satisfactory to buyer-- said inspection and test drive to be complete by DATE." Obviously, the shorter the lag until the DATE, the more likely a seller would be to hold it off the market until you can inspect.
Have bought and sold sailboats that way-- last one a two year old Pacific Seacraft Crealock 37' we sold to a guy who lived 2,500 miles away. Selling price more than our stick home. We agreed on price, he flew in that weekend, did a quick look and called a marine surveyor to inspect. By Monday, we had money in our broker account and the boat was mast down and loaded on a custom 18 wheeler on the road from FL to WA. But, had he not been satisfied, he would have only been out his expenses, nothing for the boat.
Brett
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: spoiled122843 on June 15, 2012, 04:10:13 pm
I have tried to buy RV's on ebay in the past that were no reserve. Everytime I was outbid at the last second. A month later the same unit would reappear. Inquiries would get "the buyer didn't pay", but there would be no bad feedback posted. Many times there is someone they know with a top bid set that will actually get them above what they want. A review of the past sales shows one that looks a whole lot like this one that was pulled by the seller. Didn't dig far enough to see if it was the same seller. Big ticket items are risky.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 04:18:36 pm
I agree. It was listed, I started watching, cancelled, and now relisted. We'll see how it goes.
Best Regards, Benjie
Benjie Zeller (512) 587-4628
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave Head on June 15, 2012, 04:19:46 pm
With protected bid identities a straw buyer for the dealer can bid it up to where they want.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Benjie Zeller on June 15, 2012, 04:19:48 pm
Brett,
There is really no way to cheaply determine whether the cylinder walls are shot, correct?
Best Regards, Benjie
Benjie Zeller (512) 587-4628
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Peter & Beth on June 15, 2012, 04:33:30 pm
Actually, $10,000 may be way low if things like the coolant have not been maintained (this is a linered engine and if run for a year without SCA or ELC coolant, the cylinder walls could be shot). And as we have seen, bulkhead repair can run from a broken bolt or two to complete separation requiring rebuilding. $1,300 is NOT worse case scenario for bulkhead repair.
Not trying to paint a gloomy picture, but there are some coaches not worth even (what you think is) a bargain price.
Just went through this on another forum on an SOB. Exceptionally low price (low enough that many though it was a scam), but upon inspection, it was determined that the unit was in FL with windows that had leaked for a LONG time-- mold, and even mushrooms growing inside. No price would make that one a bargain.
As with any purchase CHECK IT OUT or have someone who is competent check it out for you.
Now, on one you have never seen, as long as the seller is legit, make an offer "Subject to inspection and test drive satisfactory to buyer-- said inspection and test drive to be complete by DATE." Obviously, the shorter the lag until the DATE, the more likely a seller would be to hold it off the market until you can inspect.
Have bought and sold sailboats that way-- last one a two year old Pacific Seacraft Crealock 37' we sold to a guy who lived 2,500 miles away. Selling price more than our stick home. We agreed on price, he flew in that weekend, did a quick look and called a marine surveyor to inspect. By Monday, we had money in our broker account and the boat was mast down and loaded on a custom 18 wheeler on the road from FL to WA. But, had he not been satisfied, he would have only been out his expenses, nothing for the boat.
Brett
Brett, Thanks for straightening me out. I stand corrected as I defer to your knowledge & wisdom. Bottom line...sight unseen purchase not a good idea. And as we all know an online picture does not show all the detail needed to appraise condition of even a couch. Peter
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: wolfe10 on June 15, 2012, 05:25:07 pm
There is really no way to cheaply determine whether the cylinder walls are shot, correct?
Best Regards, Benjie
Benjie Zeller (512) 587-4628
Correct. In fact at the Cummins Maintenance Seminar at FMCA, for many years, they brought in a cylinder liner from an ISL. Evidently, the owner put in "regular" Prestone after loosing coolant. The engine had less than 20,000 miles, but a hole right through the cylinder liner (water jacket right through to the combustion chamber). NOT warranty-- owner abuse.
That is one reason that asking for (and getting) maintenance records are so important. You will NOT wear out any of today's diesels, but you can neglect them to death.
If the present coolant is "low silicate for diesel with added SCA", there are test strips that test for: SCA concentration, pH and freeze point. Every place that works on diesels have them. They do not work on the ELC-based coolants such as the Texaco coolant that came in many later model Foretravels.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on June 15, 2012, 05:47:49 pm
There are all sorts of panic issues if your fearful of buying anything, take a nice coach for example, you might like to worry about the transmission, it might have a bearing going bad that has not showed up yet, or a rear axle cracked or bent, brake rotor that had a flawed casting that has not shown up yet, I could go on and on, but hope you get the idea, when you buy anything, it is a crap shoot, you pay your money and take your chance. If that is too high a risk, move on to another hobby. Simple eh! Dave M
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: wolfe10 on June 15, 2012, 05:57:14 pm
Dave,
Totally agree. But it is possible to "tilt" the results in your favor.
No guarantees, but as you know from your level of mechanical knowledge, there is (or should be) more to buying than seeing photos of an interior.
I have advised for many years, it is cheaper to pay top dollar for a well maintained coach than think you are getting a good deal paying much less for one that has been neglected or abused.
Stepping off my soap box now.
Brett
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 15, 2012, 08:16:39 pm
I rolled the dice on mine two months ago. So far the mentioned figure here should not be exceeded. Made a 3500 mile trip with stuff leaking and no deisel aquahot function. Used the alternative heating sources instead.
More fun than Vegas.
Not for the faint of wallet. Drives really well. We hope to get another 10 years minimum and I see no problem getting it.
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on June 15, 2012, 09:03:44 pm
Bob, I just had Rudy do a complete rebuild of my A-H a few weeks ago while in Nac, new motor, fuel pump and lots of other little goodies and total ran about $1,100.00, now I hope for a few years of wonderful use, just annual PM on it, but nothing major I hope. Nothing is free, I like for things to work properly. I have found the most economical part of the coach is the diesel fuel. Whooppie ! ! Dave M
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Caflashbob on June 16, 2012, 01:06:01 am
Bob, I just had Rudy do a complete rebuild of my A-H a few weeks ago while in Nac, new motor, fuel pump and lots of other little goodies and total ran about $1,100.00, now I hope for a few years of wonderful use, just annual PM on it, but nothing major I hope. Nothing is free, I like for things to work properly. I have found the most economical part of the coach is the diesel fuel. Whooppie ! ! Dave M
I agree. Started in the business in 1984. Thank goodness my mechanic has scrounged a complete good aqua hot unit. Need to figure out how to install a glendinning power cord reel in a 97. He gave me a new one of those also. Incredible scrounger. And a 458 xantrex inverter. I am an old friend.
He said to wait on the motor replacement as the blower and fuel pump go at the same time according to him. Is that true?
Title: Re: EBAY '97 40' U320
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on June 16, 2012, 09:44:17 am
Aqua Hot issue turned out to be the gear on the fuel pump had broken teeth, I had a new motor, so installed new bearings on fan, new gear and fuel pump, etc etc & more etc, wanted it "new" not "repaired", in my world "repaired" usually lasts a few weeks at best. So far all is happy happy, only time will prove yea or nay. Cheers Dave M