Foretravel Owners' Forum

A very distressing situation arose on Thursday last when our Sealand Magnum Opus VacuFlush Turbo Turd 3000 commode declined to flush. The procedures for "manual override" and "service" were not cooperating, either. Calls to Sealand / Dometic (who apparently purchased Sealand and have renamed it Dometic Sanitation) led me through sequential layers of voice prompts without the joy of ever reaching a human being. I finally left a voice mail message expressing my frustration and asking for help on Friday morning. 

But ... on to the real problem. After much study of the TWO owners manuals (because we seem to have a hybrid collection of toilet and electronic components) we determined that the "board" that manages the toilet functions was still good (Hooray!, because that is about $700!) but that the Flush Valve Motor which operates the half-ball closure at the bottom of the bowl was the culprit.  No help coming from Dometic, I called Environmental Marine here in Florida and began tracking down said motor.  I DID reach a human being!  A fellow named "Fernando" was trying to find the model toilet and then the motor in question and having great difficulty.  Why, you ask?  I asked also, and finally Fernando was able to tell me,"Oh! I half no seen one offf dose for a bery long time!  Maybe two or tree years! Dat is ossolete! You need to buy a new toilet!"        Crickets.        "Really?", says I, "And how much would a new toilet be?"  "Oh, well, I can sell you the new model for $1372.45!  In Almond, juss like you wan'!"  "I think I will pass, but thanks anyway.", says I ... and I call Foretravel.   
Billy Jack (who has a mind like a steel trap) thinks he has a motor squirreled away and finds it.  We make arrangements for Next Day, Red Tag, Hot Label UPS and I cross my fingers and set up a visit from a repair guy who is coming from an hour away but knows Sealand toilets.  Oh ... and it is raining like no body's business and the campground facilities are waaaaay far away.  Of course.

Saturday dawns stormy, windy, monsoons, tornado warnings ... and no UPS.  We are still investigatingTHAT issue, but bottom line is that it becomes Monday before there is a chance of toilet repair and it is STILL raining.  At about 3PM on Monday, the motor arrives and we determine that it looks like the part pictured in the manual, so it is safe to begin chiseling the commode off the floor (it has been grouted in by the last owners tile job).  Yup ... there are the "works" of this Sealand, exactly as pictured ... but guess what???  The motor is probably just fine.  It is the "Motor Arm" that works the half ball back and forth that has broken!  BECAUSE IT IS PLASTIC!!!

And because these toilets are "ossolete", there are none of these little 4" plastic bits on anyone's shelf, either!  Repair Guy is disgusted with the cheapness of the part, given the function it is meant to perform, and we all agree that his machinist should give a try to fabricating a new one from metal.  He leaves, and will return for the next attempt at repair.  Oh ... and I get a phone call about 5pm on Monday from some chirpy gal named "Heidi" at Dometic, telling me that she is the Human Being I requested in my message on Friday.  She becomes almost indignant when I express my feeling that they are doing a less than wonderful job at supporting the products that are still in use out in the big, wide world and cannot seem to understand why I am unhappy at the thought of spending a cartload of money for lack of an $8 piece of PLASTIC!!! ... and Oh, by the way,Heidi ... I called you for help 3 days ago!

The real message in this overlong post is to alert folks who may have a 3000 Series Sealand VacuFlush commode that there are no parts left. They have been "superseded" by the 4000 series!  I will be taking the motor back to Foretravel when we go there on April 1. Start pricing the Thetford units, in case your toilet fails.  I am going to do more research when we get to the Factory in April.  It has been a loooong 5 days!

Sounds like Carol is constipated...  NO NO NO I meant exasperated.  Sorry.
Gary B

Thanks for the heads up (ooh, bad pun)  Does Thetford make a vacuum-pumping toilet?

Think marine, rather than RV, and you might come up with some other options.  The Tecma Silence Plus macerating commode has been mentioned a couple of times before

Soon-to-happen toilet upgrade - Microphor to Tecma Silence Plus (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=17064.0)

sealand electric toilet (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=10623.msg50381#msg50381)

Carol,
Have you ever thought of writing a book for Foretravelers?  You're too funny...and, sorry for your trials & tribulations...I realize this must be very frustrating.  However, the way you articulate it...very funny!

(on edit)... I know guat ju meen...LOL

                 Wow, just wow. ??? I'm with Peter on the book. Carols crazy commode adventures or something like that. I am just glad you vent by written word verses taking a sledgehammer to the bathroom. Though I am sure you guys have had visions of shattered china at this point.

                        Could a machine shop copy and make the broken plastic arm out of aluminum or something a bit more substantial?

                     

Carol,

Per the VacuFlush parts catalog I'm attaching, it looks like the 3000 series drive arm kit is dometic part number 385311417 (do double-check me on that - I've added a screenshot for the base of the 3000 series - I think you're talking about item 25 in the exploded diagram, right?)



I'm seeing a couple of places online that claim to have that p/n in stock.

Michelle

Oh, yes... telephone customer service at its best!

Apropos Peter's comment...  I am reminded of a story about an interview of a potential candidate for an off-shore call center position.  The applicant is told that in order to determine if he/she can speak English well enough for the job, he/she must use the words pink, yellow, and green in a sentence.

The candidate thinks for a moment, and replies:  "I hear, 'green'... 'green'... so I 'pink' up the phone... and I say, 'yellow'!"

'nuff said!  :P

Perhaps you could just move the black tank :)) :)) and install a Torpid Turd 100?  Only one moving part (bowl movement :)) plus valve.) 

Gravity is our friend, although levity helps...

I like the foot operated non-electric toilet, but maybe they won't work if not near the holding tank?

I have heard of some on our forum who have changed electric toilets to foot-pedal units.

Thomas Crapper would be so proud of Dometic. :P :P :P :P :P

I am feeling "flush" with the success of our newly machined "motor arm" for the toilet.  It was a work of art.  The part that you found, Michelle, was likely the one we need.  However ... with shipping it would surely be $60.00 or more, and this custom job in metal cost me $100.  I am happy.  I now have a much clearer knowledge of what happens when I activate the handle and stuff disappears on it's way to the black tank.  You never saw any happier people than Jeff and I and Repairman Bill bending over the commode and beaming like proud parents as it flushed and started the chugachugachug.  Of course, the weather here at Ho Hum in Carrabelle, FL has been sunny and clear since this morning, so the excitement of navigating the darkened parking lot in lightning and pouring rain would not have been the case tonight ... but I am one happy girl, I can tell ya!  This life is such an adventure!!  We are really grateful to have found the repair guy, Bill West from Panama City. His machinist buddy put another job on hold to create the replacement part and bring toilet harmony back to my coach.  The rest of the Turbo will likely break before this new part will!

Sometimes you luck out and find a real repair man. Great that this adventure is "behind you".

Carol,

Might I suggest you commission Repairman Bill and his machinist to fabricate a few extra metal arms and sell them on the forum?  You could recover your initial "proof of concept/development" costs.... :))

-M

That is a great Idea

I have passed that info on to Repairman Bill West ... Outdoor Recreation World, Panama City, FL  850-215-1200.  He has kept the plastic part that was used for the fabrication specs and his machinist can do another.  His machinist charged us $100 because he kindly dropped another project to work on ours ... and the finished piece was perfect.

I have been happily flushing for 12 hours, now!!!  I must mention that on his way here yesterday to complete the repair, Bill's truck had a failure and the fuel pump died. In spite of waiting for a tow and his family to bring him another vehicle, he did not put us off.  He arrived at about 7:30 PM, worked until 9 on my toilet, then went to Tony Pasquale's coach and replaced an oil sensor on his generator.  He is a repairman and a mechanic ... NOT a parts changer.  I would certainly rely him again. 

Carol, Hope the pressureswitch solved Tony's problem.
Dave M

Hi Dave,
After placing the new switch in we ran the genny for almost an
hour and it did not shut down.  Hopefully that was the problem and it is fixed.  Karma  ;)
Dave Thanks again for your help.

Tony

Still in FT shopping mode here -

Do all FTs of the years 2000-2003 have these vaccu-flush toilets? From the description Carol gives, they seem to be more complicated than necessary. What is their benefit over the simple mechanical flush type? Can they be easily replaced with the mechanical flush toilet?

BTW Carol, it would help us all if you could write a good review of Repairman Bill's service at rvservicereviews.com.

We have an '03 with a simple, Sealand Traveler 510+; so the answer is no, not all coaches in those years.  It is my (also simple) understanding that the vacuum-flush toilets are in coaches of a certain length and floor plan where the black tank is not directly under the toilet, hence the need for the "assist."

As Pat describes, the VacuFlush are used when the floorplan/tank layout causes the toilet not to be directly over the black tank because the plumbing run requires some form of pumping assist.  It's not year-dependent; we've seen a 2007-2008 with one as well.  You can't replace them with a standard, gravity-fed model (although there are other designs besides the VacuFlush that may work in the application, such as the Tecma Silence Plus (which I just discovered is a Thetford model).

We have a VacuFlush and while more complicated, it does flush really, really well.

-M

Think of the newer coach's with the bath & a half, guess they need at least  one vac-flush, maybe two :(
Happy here
Dave M