When at Cummins today, I pointed out to the floor supv. that there was a very small fuel leak at one of the fittins after the water separator. Does anyone know about these fittings? Do these have o rings, or could it be that the fuel hose itself is rotted?
replaced mine do to dry rot.... If I remember right the new hose just slides back over the ''Barb'' style fitting and that's it.
I do remember the worst areas of dry rot was at the fittings
That's the way it looked like to me too. But I don't know what makes up the fillting and if leaks are likely to develop at the fitting as well.
If Forrest doesn't have new fuel lines, treat him (her?) to new lines. It's time! On our last holiday adventure, the generator started sucking air in the fuel lines. At FOT they showed me all the cracks in the line connected to the fuel filter for the "big" engine (C8.3-325). There was also a small amount of fuel beginning to seep from various places in the lines. I felt fortunate to get it fixed before I found myself on the tow hook.
Alton at FOT said they have recently been replacing fuel lines on a lot of 97-98 models.
I talked to someone who had the "big engine" lines replaced at a Cat shop. The price was more than triple what we paid at FOT. It's good to have it done at a "FT friendly" place.
The genset fuel hoses were replaced in 2010. I know its getting time to replace the main fuel lines. It may have to be done now. I'll wait and see the recommendation from the Cummins shop. The cost to go to Nac for maintenance is a premium of $1,000. So even though I know I will pay a premium to have the work done in Cincinnati by Cummins as opposed to FOT...I'm stuck! If the cost is $2,000 in Cincinnati vs. $1,000 at FOT it's a wash. I really don't know what replacing the main fuel lines costs.
I gather all the problems with fuel line "rotting" must have to do with use as much as age as I look at our coach and see the lines look good, the air bags have no problems and a lot of other things I read just do not show up!!. Maybe the dry climate helps??
JohnH
We had both generator and main engine fuel lines replaced this winter at Nac. Two coach bucks ($2000). They are using
Parker Parflex HTFL line material for the main runs, and change to flex tubing where needed.
Peter & Beth,
Here is the posting from when I went through the procedure of replacing the main fuel hose myself. Other than the last bulkhead, which is a tight fit -- it was fairly straightforward.
It is Alive !! Replacing the Main Fuel Hose (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=16973.msg111153#msg111153)
Michael,
Thanks for the input. You have to be a contortionist to have changed that fuel hose. Did you have to slide the fuel tank out of the bay in order to do this job? You're a lot more resourceful that I could ever be.
^.^d
Peter,
I did not have to slide the main tank out. However -- it did require stuffing/wedging myself on my belly as far in as I could to get a wrench on that fitting. I guess I'm lucky to be 6'1" and 175 lbs.
After completing the job and with it running, I did check the return line for any signs of drips or leaks as Gary O told me to do -- before I replaced the galvanized steel covers in the basement.
I've been meaning to take a few close-up pics of the old hose and post them -- so others can compare their existing fuel hoses to mine.
And, as I related last week about a newly surfaced issue with my Gen-Set surging -- only under load, it looks like that one is next. There's even a youtube video some guy made on the same model Coach -- showing the step-by-step process for that one.
Yup, he was on the forum as well. His coach was a 1995 U280. He had to reluctantly sell his unit a couple years back.
(on edit) The Unicoach configuration is no fun to get at the fuel hose fittings on top of the tank.
When I did mine I took a fork lift to pull the propane tank out just to fit up and reach the fittings.. I had a friend on standby to pull me out by my feet just in case I got stuck up in there..The rest was quick and easy
BTW I cleaned and repainted the propane tank when I had it out so I killed 2 birds with one stone...All in all its not that hard of a job
Update: Fuel line has been replaced from the fuel/water separator to the engine. I asked Mike (Fl. Supv.) at Cummins to inspect the lines the rest of the way. "It's hard to tell" was the answer. Over an abundance of caution, I told him to replace it all, return line as well. It's better new than 17 years old.
I asked FT to check my fuel lines when I was in for service during the Buddy Rally. The verdict: good to go for now.
Update: Picked up Forrest. I had to reschedule the rest of the fuel line replacement as the fuel tank is full. Pumping out so they can move the fuel tank to get to the fuel lines and fittings at the top of the tank would have cost about another 4 hours of labor including the time to pump it back in. I know, the tech does not have to stand and wait for the tiny pump to do its job. But, that's how Cummins charges to pad the job a bit and increase their margins... money, money, money, money.
Will get it rescheduled once the fuel tank is at about the 1/4 level.
They had quoted 6 hours plus the hose & fittings.
Question: Is it wise to replace the fuel hose fittings? Or, can these be reused? Also, the fuel delivery hose to the lift pump from the fuel/water separator has been replaced. How many feet of hose is needed to replace the delivery to fuel/water separator hose & return fuel hose back to the tank?
Thanks in advance!
Peter,
I also had first replaced the line from the pre-filter to the lifting pump on the CAT, hoping that was the only one sucking air. I simply used a razor knife and cut slits from the hose fitting -- down past the barbs (being careful not to actually cut through into the brass), removed the dry-rotted hose, and then clamped the fitting lightly into a vise and pushed the new hose over the barbs.
There are no clamps used on the OEM set-up and so I saw no need to use any.
However -- as I've posted earlier -- the main line also needed replacement (from the pre-filter forward to the tank). My U300 has the pre-filter mounted to the chassis with access through the outside bay door where my three engine start batteries are -- just forward of the rear wheels. I walked out the distance from there to the main tank, and added a few feet to consider the curves through the bulkheads. That number came up to be 30 feet, and that's what I bought.
With the change-out done, I see I could have gotten by with 28 feet -- or so. But it's okay, as the extra length can easily sit in a loop above the main tank, secured with tie-raps.
Hope that helps.
Michael
"Question: Is it wise to replace the fuel hose fittings? Or, can these be reused?" Peter, my general rule of thumb is that if a part is removed in order to access another part, the removed part is replaced with a new one UNLESS the old one is still in new condition. My reasoning is that if the fittings are removed now, it is no more work to replace them with new ones. The old ones may be damaged or worn and might fail somewhere down the road, leading to a much larger repair bill then.
My fittings (all four) were just fine. Simply look at the mating surfaces to make sure there no grooves, nicks, or corrosion present. In my racing days we used aeroquip fittings ( steel and aluminum types) that many times were re-used when doing engine re-builds, oil cooler size change-outs, dry-sump pump rebuilds,etc.
It's very rare for a fitting to wear out, it's usually a failure/leak where a hose assembly type (higher pressure than our application) using a swaged flex hose - to- rigid line/fitting design -- would fail at the swaged area from deterioration of the hose itself, or excessive flexing over a long duty-cycle.
http://www.hwhcorp.com/ml24976.pdf (http://www.hwhcorp.com/ml24976.pdf)
IMHO -- it's over-kill to use new fittings on these fuel suction hoses.
Peter, I can give you an idea of how Foretravel does the job on a 1997 U295 36'. For Cummins and Kubota engines: 15 hours labor, 40' each of three different sizes of HTFL fuel line, 50" fuel hose, 7 fittings, and 2 hose clamps.
I went in with about 1/3 tank of fuel. They emptied the tank, pulled one house battery and some panels, pulled the tank and replaced all fittings. They put everything back and put (most of) the fuel back into the tank.
Generator and engine have run reliably since the repair. I see one place where I may put some pipe wrap on the fuel because it looks as if it my chafe on the bottom side of the floor deck.
Alton said they are replacing fuel lines on several coaches each month. They have some experience.
Thank you all for the replies. I did have the genset fuel hoses replaced a couple years ago. They did have to move the fuel tank then. In retrospect, I should have had them R&R the main fuel hoses then. It would have cost a bit less then as opposed to now. Ya live & learn...
I think replacing the fittings is a small amount to pay for insurance. If I were to do the job myself, I might use the old fittings as I would take good care to not damage them. When someone else works on your vehicle, I follow their recommendations unless they are outrageous, in which case I walk away rather than force them to do it my way.
The replacement hoses for our repair were very different from the original hoses. New fittings may have been required. I don't know. The total cost for the fittings was less than $90.
Replaced every fuel line in my 97 in the last year. Hard and cracked. Every one. Main return and gen feed.
Mechanic had to slide the fuel tank out to one side to get to the fittings I understand. Emptied the tank to help him.