I guess it has been well over a month since I was on here asking advise on the 1998 U270 36ft that has been sitting for some time next to where I work. With your support I have a price in mind that I think is fair considering that the unit needs some things attended to such as a small crack in driver side windshield, bad case of the side windows snaking and tires with good tread but eight years old. Over all the unit is clean. Tires would be the first to address.
I felt the owner was over priced (45K) so I didn't even make an offer at that time. Well some time has passed and its still there, so he asked what I would pay as is. I told him my price and said he would think on it.
My question to you forum folks is.... the 1998 is 15 years old right now, is it logical to assume that with TLC and proper maintenance and occasional upgrades that another ten years of ownership is possible. I see that there are many on here with mature machines and wonder if you experience the nickel and dime to death syndrome that is common with cars, trucks and other machines. Or is the F/T quality similar to....lets say an aircraft build, where well maintained machines seem to fly forever and carry their years well, never going out of style.
Kevin
I shouls hope so. I am remodeling an 01 and hope for a lot more than ten years. I have friends with early 90 models that still have them on he road. The issue will be parts but FT owners have ecoe adept at new ideas.
I would say 15 years is probable, I have a 2000, and expect at least that as a useful life. Service the driveline per manufacturer's spec, keep up with maintenance, especially any water leaks, and use it, don't let it sit. The driveline will outlast any of us, and parts shouldn't be a problem for that 15 years from now. Most of the RV based systems are with quality top of the line manufacturer's, and even if parts are not available, new modern systems can be fitted 9on mine, TV's, Refrigerator, Camera and video monitor, silver leaf, and headlights/taillights come to mind).
Go for it, but make sure someone helps you with a pre-purchaase inspection.
As you describe I would say 33k.
Just my 2 cents,
I have a 1996. Just spent a bunch (several coach bucks). Putting in a resonator, new AGM house batteries, a couple of new tires as they are 5+ years old with significant cracking but really good tread, and recently a new water pump, and misc small stuff. I plan on keeping mine a while and have no reservations about that. It runs great, rides great, went to Colorado over Xmas, and still gets looks and comments when I pull into a park. BTW, provides me with satisfaction and I believe that the money is well spent. I have seen a lot of older and newer motorhomes that seem to me to be a bigger hole into which to pour money. My motorhome is really a toy, I don't full time and frankly don't get to use it as much as I would like. I don't think I could justify buying a newer motorhome (FT) right now. I have kids in college. Now that's another subject, but plenty of coach bucks being spent there right now. Many people have said on this forum that they would rather have a 15 year old FT rather than some of the brand new motorhomes built today. Can say I agree with that. Agree also with the obvious sage advice to do a pre-purchase evalation that will hopefully prevent any big unexpected purchases.
Kevin, we recently bought a 1993 U300 and expect to get several years of service from it. Yes, I'm putting some money into it but that is to be expected. Had I not misread the date code on the tires we would have offered less and arranged for new tires before we drove it home. Oh well, God was with us and we made it home safely. If the tires have another 60 miles left in them all will be good. The refrigerator worked when we first looked at it, but has since died. We're replacing with a residential one. That upgrade was decided upon before we even started looking seriously. I'm in the process of replacing the fluorescent lights with LED strips. Again, a planned upgrade.
Ask your questions here. Several people have already done whatever it is that you are about to do and will be glad to give you advice.
It's easy to see one of these things running indefinitely, given proper maintenance. That's how those old aircraft survive, by dint of good original construction and solid, ongoing maint. It really seems to me that the key to happy ownership of an older coach is to either have the $ to pay for maintenance and repairs, and in the case of FT coaches we are blessed with a supporting manufacturer and several highly regarded repair facilities, or enjoy doing it yourself. Really seems if you're going to pay to have it done then the best approach might to be to start with a later model coach, if you're a diy guy then pretty much any year without major problems is good. Personally, my problems have been very minor, I have done a lot of work in refurbishment and repair of prior body damage, but other than a couple of fuel filters nothing that would prevent us from getting down the road.
Our "93 was great ... and after sitting it had some minor issues. Our ' 95 was super and is going strong with Keith Elms. We are now in an '02 and can not see the end of it's lifespan.
No problem. Mine's at 22 years. I see three things that can kill a coach: 1. fire/smoke, 2. major collision, 3. (the biggest) Neglect (i.e. left outside with roof leak unattended to for years)
Ideally, you want to have the coach in a garage next to your house so you can tinker with it at anytime. The U270 is a simple but quality coach that I would guess will be the least expensive to keep up. The oak interior is nice because finding the wood for upgrades is easy. No slide or Aquahot maintenance.
Agree DIY is cheaper, but over 5 yearsI have had all my maintenance done by MOT or Parliament - Genny, chassis, driveline, aqua hot, you name it if it had a service interval I have had it maintained at or better than manufacturer spec, and I think I average about $2-3K a year on that stuff. Upgrades are another matter, but I find it WAY cheaper to upgrade this coach a few thousand a year (tailights, roof paint, residential refrigerator, TV's, stuff) than buy a newer coach and ride a faster depreciation curve down hill.
Buy, it you wont be unhappy - start at $30K
Good luck!
So long as you realize that any large piece of equipment is not free to keep you will be OK. There are the normal maintenance items, consumable items, then the unforeseen. Foretravels are well built vehicles that are loaded with features any of which can fail. Unless you own something really simple like a little red wagon you will have to pay to keep it in good shape. You are buying a high end coach, no matter what it's age, and the enjoyment should be commensurate with it's qualities. On a life cycle cost basis the Foretravel offers a good return and has an exceptionally long life. Go to the RV lot and look at other manufacturers and look at coaches of a similar age - if you can find any - and you will see what I mean. Also don't forget the excellent factory and owner support that we owners enjoy.
Keith
Mine is 24 years old and I plan on using it 10 more years... I haven't had time to read all reply's and this was probably mentioned... keeping it under a roof for weather protection is the life of most anything we own be it boat car motorcycle or automobile.. that is the life of equipment.
Thanks all for the great info.....met with owner and gave offer of $34K no higher (I offered 2K more than my gut was saying simple because some history and no travelling exper. He said $39.5 is the lowest he will go. He will actively try to sell now so if anyone is interested I would be happy to pass on what I have learned about this unit. It is located in Vernon, B.C. Canada. Maybe he will come back if it doesn't sell.
Cheers
Kevin
If you don't make an offer you won't get the coach. I probably could have gotten our coach for less because the seller was anxious to sell, but I wanted to make a fair offer.
You might suggest to the seller that he check NADA for a reality check. They put the coach at $20-24K. After seeing that he may think more kindly of your offer. While NADA isn't the official word on prices, it is ONE source for pricing information. Since both of you are in Canada there may be something different there.
he will struggle, wait, it will be yours....and if not, there will always be "next weeks deal of a lifetime"!
My wife always told me that, and she ways 100% right.....
Patience today, and Tim is correct, the seller will stew over the weekend and be back. There are always going to be another Foretravel, just having that one so handy and in your location might make it worth a little more to me.
I have bought a number of motorcycles, one toy hauler, and our first Foretravel out of state. Sometimes it just is more fun, to think of the delivery trip as an adventure and hopefully from somewhere I have not ridden. I watch ads all the time to find another motorcycle way east or west, so that I might do a fly and ride adventure trip.
NADA online book values are unrealistically low for any type of Foretravel in halfway decent shape as I see it. You might see it differently though. While there are good deals to be had, one might have to be Johhny on the Spot with their dealing to capitalize on such an offering, or they might miss out and have to pay considerably more than book value, especially if the rig has been well kept. And, to be truthful, before I'd sell my U280 for book value, I'd buy an RV lot with cover and security on a good fishing lake and park it for long time use.
James
James
At the risk of turning this into another NADA thread, NADA values seem to be low for many vehicles. That said, though, often lenders only look at NADA or similar sites to get an idea of what a coach is worth. Before we made the offer on our coach I checked NADA. Not surprisingly, it was quite a bit lower than what the seller was asking. I used the NADA price as a guide in making an offer. Remember that NADA and other such services use AVERAGE condition, so if a coach is in better than average condition it is worth more.
One also has to factor in the distance the target coach is from you. Ours was a six-hour drive away, and the closest by far to us of those on our list. We went down to look and came back home the same day. A few days later we made the deal, and scheduled a pick-up date (subject to weather). We drove down, thoroughly went through the coach, spent the night in it, and after breakfast and good-byes we headed home. Had we gone to MOT to buy (as was our original plan) we would have had at least one night in a hotel, and probably two or three, plus a night in a campground on the way home, and probably three times the fuel cost. All in all, it probably would have cost us at least $1000 more if we were buying at a greater distance.
We're going toad-shopping tomorrow, but we won't buy anything. If there is something that is interesting I'll look it up on NADA and KBB. If either one lists a lower price than the dealer's asking price, I've got something to go on. In addition, I've already checked the trade-in values of our two cars, so I have an idea of what they are worth.
Well stated, David!
I had a long time to look for our Foretravel - almost two years! There were only three 36 foot 1994 U280's that were to my liking. One was in Oklahoma and it had recently been updated throughout...beautiful coach, and spendy! One in West Virginia, I think it was, and it was excellent condition in most all aspects. The third one was the one I bought, and it was in between the other two in terms of overall condition. The one in Oklahoma was considerably more costly than the one I settled on. I flew down from Alaska to take a look at it and test drive it. I also traveled to Nacogdoches and Carthage in East Texas and test drove two there. The trips were costly, but I'm an old East Texas boy, so I mixed in some visits with my relatives. That said, when one buys their coach, it pays to spend the time and money needed to satisfy their aims.
James
Yes I am comfortable that my offer was not a "low ball offer" but a reasonable one. The coach I would class as good condition, but not a pride of ownership unit with the said mentioned repairs required, a good polishing and a pet odour that would hopefully disappear with a good cleaning(we love pets) but DW has allergies.
So we will see....as my DW likes to say..."if its meant to be"
It sounds as if you have done your homework! Good luck in your pursuit!
James
Kevlor80, good luck on the negotiations. Hopefully you will succeed if this is the couch for your purposes.
Not to steal the thread, but I find myself in similar setting. I have located a 96 U-320, 40 ft. It seems in good condition, not perfect but not rusting apart either. It has 50K miles, and may need rear tires that I know of. Everything else works according to the owner. Haven't been inside yet. I feel the asking price is high, was wondering what others, more experienced thought would be a "reasonable offer?"
Thanks in advance,
Larry
My first Foretravel, a 1990 U280, was listed at something like $99k (probably was 1999 or so). I had passed it over, as I found two others in the $80k range. I finally called them, told them I was interested, but that it was probably too much for me. I told them I was looking to spend under $80k...they came back with $79k and I bought and loved it for a half-dozen years. Everybody has a different reality as to what their coach is worth. Just make a fair offer, no matter what the asking price, and you may be as surprised as I was.
Brad,
Thanks for the advice. I will do as you say and see what the owner says. If this one doesn't fly, I'll wait for the next flight :D . Any way around it, the bricks and stix have to sell first, and the owner is aware of this. The really nice thing about it is that it is only 20 miles from the house, so I have been known to sneak by and peek at it from time to time.
Larry
Larry,
Here is a table of price points for what I think is the proper depreciation range.
original MSRP (per spec sheet) = $370,000
% of MSP $
13 48100
12 44400
11 40700
The curve is coming close to asymptotic here
HTH
We purchased our 1988 40ft GV in 2003 third owner over the internet $32K with 78K miles. We have FT for about 5 years since purchase.
ABout complete cosmetic restoration in and out ($12K).
Would not have considered without this Forum's info because of CAT 3208.
The structure, systems and surfaces are superior. We have 128K now.
We sit for months at a time and she runs like a top.
FT we think we would like a unihome basement, but solved issue with millitary shipping containers and our tow-dolly.
She is strong smooth and purrs like a kitten.
John & CHERYL
Here is a different prospective; I had my 1994 U300 40' 6V92 Detroit up for sale this past winter because I felt it was not being used enough. I thought I had priced it fairly @ $ 39,500.00 as the coach only had 52,000 miles on it and was in relatively Good/Great Condition. I establish my value by looking at the costs of the various components, Diesel Gen Set @ $ 10,000. Detroit 6V92 @$ 10,000. Allison Transmission @ $ 6,000. 6 Aluminum wheels with tires @ $ 1,000.00 each, etc. Then I looked at the priced of a New or Newer Roadtech or similar brand. I decided my coach was worth a lot more then my asking price so I took it off the market and decided to use it more and also let my adult children take it on family vacations. I know I will have some additional maintenance cost but that is easier to justify than taking a beating on a Great Coach. I am fortunate that two of my Sons are Firefighters and drive large trucks daily, and the other two have jobs that are affiliated with large vehicle driving, so I am confident that they will all be able to handle and maintain the Coach as it should be. My personal opinion is that, like an Airplane, any Foretravel that was manufactured as a "Wide Body" would be a Good investment as long as it was maintained properly, and was not driven on Salted roads or stored on bare ground where moisture would rot the underside components.
I had bought a 1995 U295 contingent upon my inspection for a good price - $70,000 back in the middle of 2003, and when I flew into San Antonio to inspect it, I liked everything about it except the smell inside the coach. Whoever had detailed it used too much air fresehner/deodorizer. I just could not take it, it was that strong, which led me to think that the reason for it might have been to mask another odor, like smoke. When I complained to the owners, they agreed that it was powerful, even after they had repeatedly let it air out. The 1994 U280 that I had wanted to buy back then had been bought by the party that I got it from about a year later for $92,500.00(?), as I recall. As has been noted, just make a fair offer.