Everyone thinks newer is better when nothing could be further from the truth in my experience. The next year newer would have cost me almost twice as much at the time. Even when I tried to sell it the Foretravel dealer told me nobody wanted this narrow body model and that I might as well junk it if it doesn't run. People always told me that about my 1965 Impala until just a few years ago. Now everybody wants to buy it from me and they chase me around town yelling at me across lanes of traffic while I'm trying to drive!
I could not have said it better!! We're getting 11 to 12 mpg from our narrow (by only six inches!) motorhome with almost the same living space inside as newer coaches. We also love state parks, national forest campgrounds, COE parks and National Parks (where we also get terrific prices due to our lifetime passes). I see new motor homes at the RV shows and come away thinking that our little old U225 is nicer and fits our lifestyle better. And is paid for.
I just wish I had *MY* 1965 Chevrolet Impala 4-speed with the 327 engine back!!! (Not to mention the 1956 Porsche 356A I had just before I got the Chevy.) I guess I should just be content with those memories, huh?
Michelle might want to move this. :)
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: MemoryRoads on July 24, 2013, 03:21:43 pm
Yup! Bet she will! Us older guys loose much........ Even If..we don't get it, we are told that in short order. sigh. Oh yes! I meant tools and stuff!!!
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: fouroureye on July 24, 2013, 05:54:42 pm
Craig, What am i doing wrong since I average between 8.2 and 9.1 miles per gallon. Your milage is awsome! 300hp cat3208T
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wolfe10 on July 24, 2013, 06:15:30 pm
Craig has a lighter coach with smaller engine.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 24, 2013, 07:02:29 pm
Craig, What am i doing wrong since I average between 8.2 and 9.1 miles per gallon. Your milage is awsome! 300hp cat3208T
Well, first of all I am a little lighter than you are and since we do not full-time the coach is not packed with food, clothes, etc.
2. I always drive with the cruise-control ON when we're on the highway and traffic permits.
3. We have a Banks Stinger on a 5.9 Cummins. The engine itself is pretty well known as an efficient engine (my Dodge pickup with the same engine gets over 20mpg. The worst it got was 12mpg with the 29' Alpenlite 5er. People say that the Banks will not improve fuel mileage but I have not found that to be the case. The Banks system improves torque and HP and if you use it all for speed then they're right. But if you don't drive fast then your fuel mileage is bound to improve. I try to drive smoothly and with fuel economy in mind. The Banks outfit claims up to 75 more hp and 171 lb-ft torque gain with the Stinger on the 5.9L mechanical Cummins.
4. I don't drive faster than 61mph on the highway. The truck speed limit in this state (WA) is 60 so I figure that's good enough for me. I don't barrel up to an exit and then slam on the brakes when we get close to the stop sign. I let the coach decelerate before the exit, hit the PacBrake and then, finally, the air brakes but by that time we're going pretty slow.
5. We have a PacBrake but I only use that in the hills, off ramps, and heavy traffic. Usually only as needed.
6. We only have 3,000 miles on the coach so the long-term average is still not in.
7. About half of the mileage is without a toad. We've taken bicycles along but they don't weigh much.
We only have a 4-speed transmission so I like to use the 5th speed someone here on the forum mentioned a few years back: coasting. The Allison MT643 tranny really does coast very well.
Maybe the mileage numbers will go down after a while but so far we've never had a tankful that got less than 10mpg (first trip through the Cascades on I-90 was 300 miles with a Kia Optima on a tow dolly). I was just learning how to drive the rig and every trip has been better.
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: PatC on July 24, 2013, 07:46:36 pm
Craig, I don't think you will notice any difference towing, at least I don't. But I must admit that I have not hit 12 mph yet. Come close but haven't fully gotten there. Pat
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: twobus on July 24, 2013, 10:43:40 pm
11.7 avg here but only over 450 miles so am still suspicious. Doing a toad trip in october, and doing Yellowstone next spring, we'll know more then. But going easy on the throttle and keeping it under 65 will help, as will running through the engine several bottles of lubro moly diesel purge. It seems to do a dandy job of cleaning injectors.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Brad & Christine Slaughter on July 24, 2013, 11:18:46 pm
With my electronic engine and a VMSpc, I get to see my actual mileage...even from the beginning. When I bought my coach, I added the VMSpc and saw that the first nearly 40,000 miles had only netted the previous owners 6.9 MPG overall average from the ISL400. 40,000 miles later, my latest 3800 mile trip (towing 4400 lbs) netted me 9.0 MPG, and my overall mileage has now worked its way up to 7.5. I have had 10.0 mpg trips when not towing and lightly loaded, but an 9.0 trip seems to be the norm. It must have been terrible as the engine was first broken in (Foretravel put the first 24,000 miles on it).
Nice not having to try to compensate/consider what the generator takes, as that fuel doesn't go through the Cummins ECU to be counted and reported by the VMPpc.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: John S on July 25, 2013, 07:08:10 am
Towing costs me a half a mpg. When I am tow less i will get 8.6 to the grandkids house when I pull the wrangler 8.1. Now I am pulling a Grand Cherokee, so I will have to see what it does to the mileage
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 25, 2013, 09:17:32 am
11.7 avg here but only over 450 miles so am still suspicious. Doing a toad trip in october, and doing Yellowstone next spring, we'll know more then. But going easy on the throttle and keeping it under 65 will help, as will running through the engine several bottles of lubro moly diesel purge. It seems to do a dandy job of cleaning injectors.
It took me about 1100 miles to start to understand how to drive our motor home without being heavy-footed on both pedals. We keep a logbook just like we did on the boat when we were cruising that details the trip, fuel, oil, etc. One big difference is that I used to take sights on prominent points, lights, buildings, etc. when we anchored so a quick check with the hang compass would tell me if we were dragging.
And the awning is a LOT easier to stow on the motor home. :D
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: jor on July 25, 2013, 04:10:42 pm
Quote
Nice not having to try to compensate/consider what the generator takes, as that fuel doesn't go through the Cummins ECU to be counted and reported by the VMPpc.
Hey, Brad, I never thought of that! Makes sense.
Speaking of mileage, our 320 weighed 1,030 pounds more than our 300 (both loaded the same). They have close to the same engines (ISM 450hp vs. M11 400hp) and tow similar weight toads. I drive them about the same, 60 to 65 using a lot of cruise and usually in "mode" in rolling hills. The 300, however, according to the VMS is getting close to 10 while the 320 would usually get 8 to 8 and a half. Kind of an unexpected bonus. jor
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on July 25, 2013, 04:20:43 pm
I am very envious concerning the 11-12 mpg with the 5.9BT Cummins as my Freightliner FL60 with the 5.9 BT w/CAC and Allison 545 crane truck that is 14,000 lb normal travel weight can only muster about 9.5-10 if driven mildly. It is a 195 HP version and runs 65 mph at about 2600 rpm. Just envious and curious.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on July 25, 2013, 07:30:42 pm
"How many miles per gallon?" I get this question all the time. I am happy with low 8's. range is mid 7's to mid 9's. It all depends on the roads, the wind, driving speed, towing or not and of course the driver. My answer is that our coach uses everything we put in it, sometimes faster than others. I like to include the miles and fuel used by our Jeep Wrangler and come up with a fleet average MPG rating. It is not uncommon for the Jeep to be driven 1/3 to 1/2 of the miles the coach is driven on any given trip.
Roger and Susan
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 25, 2013, 07:38:15 pm
I am very envious concerning the 11-12 mpg with the 5.9BT Cummins as my Freightliner FL60 with the 5.9 BT w/CAC and Allison 545 crane truck that is 14,000 lb normal travel weight can only muster about 9.5-10 if driven mildly. It is a 195 HP version and runs 65 mph at about 2600 rpm. Just envious and curious.
Dave... I suspect that windage has a lot to do with it. And gearing. And tires. As well as how they tuned the engine. It would not surprise me to learn that a truck carrying a crane moves a lot more air out of the way than a U225 when going down the road. (Plus the U225 is enclosed for about 2/3 of its body length.)
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Kent Speers on July 25, 2013, 07:57:45 pm
My 93 U225 averaged about 8.5 mpg. Sometimes we would get over 11 mpg but you can't really judge on single trips or a couple of tanks of fuel. I always suspected that the Banks System would improve mileage so I am not challenging Craig's numbers but a standard BT5.9 at 62 mph will probably be 8.5 to 9 mpg over tens of thousands of miles.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave Cobb on July 25, 2013, 08:03:15 pm
I have read and reread Craigs wonderful claims and wish it was true on Kent's U225 that we bought and drove another 7000 miles. I remember getting from 6.78 to 9.4 per tank. The info went with the coach when we sold it in the logbook. I so wish that Kent had installed the Banks before selling me the coach.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Kent Speers on July 25, 2013, 08:09:56 pm
Dave, if you hadn't been towing an Army Tank, Chevy Avalanche, you wouldn't have gotten the 6.78.
Lead Foot!!!
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave Cobb on July 25, 2013, 08:12:22 pm
Or towing the 18' Work & Play toy hauler!
But got to say the new coach tows the tank Avalanche very well. And the Banks system for the C8.3 is less money than for the 5.9, so we might just see that in the future.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: J. D. Stevens on July 26, 2013, 11:28:09 am
Our first coach, SOB 37' DP, got about 9 mpg. It had the Cummins B5.9 with Allison 6 speed. My recollection is that it weighed about 23,000#. We did not tow. We drove it the same way we drive the U295 and drove many of the same roads. We get a bit over 7 mpg with the U295.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: John Haygarth on July 26, 2013, 02:04:16 pm
Tne U295 we have with the Banks stinger and resonator gets min 9mpg on a trip unless it is all mtns and slow driving. I drive around 60 and on the trips to Mexico etc and across Canada and States 2 yrs ago it totalled 9 and as good as 10 mpg even with the tracker behind and lots of canned friut and wine with us. Keeping an eye on the VMS pc helps too John H
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on July 26, 2013, 02:30:34 pm
I gotta fess up, the last venture Thru Wy, Mt, Co, Ka, Ok, Tx and back home over 4700 miles, the average per the VMSpc was 7.5 mpg. Considering towing the Ford pickup woth the ATV ( heavy), temps in the upper 90"s, miles of strong head winds, miles of quartering winds ant as high as 6500' elevation, and most driving in the 70+ish, am not unhappy, yes 35 mpg would be nice, but I still am in the real world. ;D
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 26, 2013, 02:39:52 pm
I am tempted to install the 3" resonator/muffler (3050 I think) on the U225 even though people I respect for knowing lots more than I do about that sort of thing tell me it's a waste of time with my puny engine. Only about $200 worth of parts and a few hours of cutting and fitting. Bet it would sound better.
Not to mention getting rid of about 200 pounds of ugly muffler!
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave M (RIP) on July 26, 2013, 02:44:08 pm
Don't laugh, the resonator will make you happier despite what your experts are preaching.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Caflashbob on July 26, 2013, 03:03:18 pm
I gotta fess up, the last venture Thru Wy, Mt, Co, Ka, Ok, Tx and back home over 4700 miles, the average per the VMSpc was 7.5 mpg. Considering towing the Ford pickup woth the ATV ( heavy), temps in the upper 90"s, miles of strong head winds, miles of quartering winds ant as high as 6500' elevation, and most driving in the 70+ish, am not unhappy, yes 35 mpg would be nice, but I still am in the real world. ;D
7.11 on my 97. All the weather mentioned. Somewhat faster at times. Sometimes slower on the interstate where the truckers can blow by me. Ran a certain extra amount of gen times as the batteries were weak and aqua hot. Rarely plugged in
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: gam on July 26, 2013, 04:17:31 pm
We spend 6 months a year in the coach and travel light. We don't dry camp more then 2 or 3 days at a time so I don't have more then 1/2 a tank of fresh water, gray and black ET, and fuel most of the time under 3/4 full. With a range of all but 1500 miles why fill the tank? Our toad weights about 3100 LBS. About 10,000 miles for the season on the coach and 12,000 on the toad .For us that's about 1060 gallons of diesel and 430 gallons of gas.That's an avg of 14.76 mpg, better then pulling a 5th wheel with a pickup? Gam
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: twobus on July 26, 2013, 08:28:38 pm
Applause! b^.^d
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart on July 26, 2013, 08:34:25 pm
While I may not agree with Craig on all subjects, he hits it on the head here---exactly. With a much heavier 102 inch U300, we get between 5.5 and a shade over 12 mpg. Craig will kill us on the hills and city driving as far as fuel goes but with our 3.07 rear end, 60 mph and flat ground, it is almost an equalizer on the plains. With his weight, frontal area and a lower numerical rear end, I expect he could get 14 mpg or better. Two speed rear end would be the key here like some Country Coaches have. The Cummins B engine is really excellent for everything.
If you have a 36 foot DDEC U300 you will get 12 mpg at 60 mph on flat ground, no headwind. If you don't, you need to run 110 psi in the tires COLD (and leave them alone on hot days), have proper front end alignment and not have any exhaust manifold leaks to reduce turbo pressure. New tires really reduce mileage until they are well used. You also have to make sure the transmission is locking up as that can also kill mileage (upper second, third and fourth in our 350hp DD). Full timers with lots on board and full tanks will see a little less MPG. Mechanical engines will use 3 to 5% more fuel.
Electronic mileage is great but I measure the tank with the rig exactly flat using 6 gallons per inch. I can get within one eight inch dipping it. ODO is right on.
Our old mechanical DD 4107 Buffalo bus with less weight, less frontal area and a lower numerical rear end got even better mileage, especially in hilly country.
Pierce
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 27, 2013, 12:55:44 am
.For us that's about 1060 gallons of diesel and 430 gallons of gas.That's an avg of 14.76 mpg, better then pulling a 5th wheel with a pickup? Gam
One of the big reasons we got rid of the 5er and moved to a Class A was the ability to choose what we tow; boat, Jeep, glider, sedan, trailer for the in-laws, Harley on a trailer, kayaks on a trailer... my choice. The ability to tow 3 in-line notwithstanding (in some states - but not the one I live in).
That is versatility! But there were many other reasons; not the least of which was the marvelous view of the countryside which our pickup never managed to give us.
Craig :)
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart on July 27, 2013, 02:54:34 pm
Forgot to add to check air cleaner telltale as this made a big difference on ours. Replace the stock good/bad indicator with one with the numbers. Then check with DD, Cummins or Cat to see how much restriction each engine can work with. Operate at full throttle on a hill and then check the number on the telltale. You can then plan ahead for air cleaner change.
A non-contact thermometer to check for dragging brakes is another good tool to potentially increase mileage as well as giving longer pad and disk life. Something like the model below: Non-Contact Infrared Laser Thermometer (http://www.harborfreight.com/non-contact-laser-thermometer-96451.html)
Drive down the road and stop without using the brakes on an incline and then check brake temps for one warm or hot one. Naturally, set parking brake.
Pierce
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: PatC on July 27, 2013, 03:58:52 pm
With his weight, frontal area and a lower numerical rear end, I expect he could get 14 mpg or better. Two speed rear end would be the key here like some Country Coaches have. The Cummins B engine is really excellent for everything.
Don't Craig and I wish!!!! I know that there are times that we can hit 14 mpg, but without a flow meter, we never see it. But it does average out in the long run to a respectable 10 to 12 mpg. I think the Banks system is helping Craig. We don't have one, but I have toyed with the idea of turning it up some. We are still stock from the factory as far as I know. But I am running synthetics. I have never seen a overall average of 12 mpg, but have way to much up and down around where I travel. Will find out if she can do better this coming winter when we head to Galveston, then hopefully west to Arizona.
Pierce mentioned the idea of a two speed rear end. Might help on down hill runs, but I doubt we would get it into high range much. The 5.9 lacks torque and power for that. I relate it a lot to the old Detroit Diesel 6-71 238hp engines the company I hauled for had when I first started. They would not get out of their own way hauling 80,000 lbs with a 13 speed underdrive Roadranger! There were hills in Pennsylvania oil country that I had my doubts of making it to the top. But they were fun to drive when empty weighting only 25,000 lbs (aluminum tankers). And we were empty almost half of our mileage. They may have been a similiar horsepower as the Cummins 5.9, but when you put that power through the Foretravel's Allison slosh-box, a lot of momentum is lost.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 27, 2013, 05:12:49 pm
A non-contact thermometer to check for dragging brakes is another good tool to potentially increase mileage as well as giving longer pad and disk life. Something like the model below: Non-Contact Infrared Laser Thermometer (http://www.harborfreight.com/non-contact-laser-thermometer-96451.html)
Drive down the road and stop without using the brakes on an incline and then check brake temps for one warm or hot one. Naturally, set parking brake.
Yet another RV tool that every owner should have!!! Under $40. So many uses; some of them impractical but fun ("hey, I'll bet you $10 that the hood of that toad is hot enough to fry an egg!")
We should make a list.
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: PatC on July 27, 2013, 05:37:18 pm
Hey now Dave, I use to pull 8 axle Michigan steel trains cross Ontario, from Lackawanna, NY into Michigan, grossing somewhere around 135,000 lbs with that combination. That is where I found out just how much torque a 4 & a quarter Cat had when they walked away on the hills with more weight! When I graduated into a 335 Cummins, I thought I was in seventh heaven!!!
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: LI_Pets on July 27, 2013, 06:04:58 pm
I gotta fess up, the last venture Thru Wy, Mt, Co, Ka, Ok, Tx and back home over 4700 miles, the average per the VMSpc was 7.5 mpg. Considering towing the Ford pickup woth the ATV ( heavy), temps in the upper 90"s, miles of strong head winds, miles of quartering winds ant as high as 6500' elevation, and most driving in the 70+ish, am not unhappy, yes 35 mpg would be nice, but I still am in the real world. ;D
You know that if you got 9 mpg you would have saved onlyy 100 gallons on 4700 miles or $375 or .08 a mile
Be happy
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on July 27, 2013, 06:16:55 pm
You know that if you got 9 mpg you would have saved onlyy 100 gallons on 4700 miles or $375 or .08 a mile
Be happy
You can save a lot more than that with good fuel economy. The extra miles you can travel on a tank, coupled with the GasBuddy smartphone app, means that you can plan a trip more effectively and keep money in your wallet. Turns out that a lot of places are selling fuel priced higher than the national average. With my old pickup truck and a 5th wheel I had to re-fuel every 300 miles or so whether the price of fuel was reasonable or not. With an RV capable of going 1000 miles between fillups I can use a smartphone app to check my route for fuel at the best price; often UNDER the national average or at least less than many places along the freeway.
Then your smartphone can tell you how to get to that low-priced fuel and you can even check to see if it's easy to get to the pumps.
Craig :)
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: MemoryRoads on July 27, 2013, 06:48:37 pm
When it's all said and done...it's like Roger said:
"How many miles per gallon?" I get this question all the time. I am happy with low 8's. range is mid 7's to mid 9's. It all depends on the roads, the wind, driving speed, towing or not and of course the driver. My answer is that our coach uses everything we put in it, sometimes faster than others. I like to include the miles and fuel used by our Jeep Wrangler and come up with a fleet average MPG rating. It is not uncommon for the Jeep to be driven 1/3 to 1/2 of the miles the coach is driven on any given trip.
I'm drivin' a 40' U320 and drive it conservatively averaging, low to mid 8's from NW coast to SE coast diagonally. I tow a Hyundai mini-station wagon, called the Elantra Touring, manual trany. and get 30-35 on it.
..so if half my mileage is above 30 and half below 10, then I'm near 20 mpg on an annual basis. That is as good as any Greenie/wishful thinker out there, or others with slide rules. I'm gonna play so gotta pay, and in the end, I don't think I'm doing bad.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Dave Head on July 28, 2013, 10:45:57 am
For me, there are two main components in achieving good fuel mileage after the basics (friction: tire pressure, wax/Rejex; weight reduction; speed; mechanical). 1. Attitude - consistency in driving 'gracefully' - a soft foot on the gas, and a soft foot on the brake. Awareness and anticipation of traffic conditions is huge. 2. Monitoring - Electronics is a huge plus - that boost gauge can be used the same way a vacuum gauge can be used in a normally aspirated vehicle. Achieve the lowest boost for steady speed and you will be amazed at the difference at the pump.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 02, 2013, 06:42:47 pm
Filled fuel tank to the tippy-top... just over 75 gallons. Then 27-gallons of LPG. Then off to Scooteney Reseroir, 38 miles away, for shakedown of coach after all the work. Also did some checking on mpg with the logbook.
We have traveled 2969.5 miles since our very first fillup in December of 2011. With the latest fillup we have put 272.463 gallons into the fuel tank. Overall mpg for life of the coach is 10.8987 mpg. However the last 1,124.6 miles we put 95.98 gallons of diesel into the tank for a mpg of 11.716 mpg.
I think this reflects a learning curve on my part plus the first 300 miles of driving included 200 miles through the Cascades on I-90 plus long grades up and down near the Columbia River. Even so, no trip around here is flat (even though it appears to be that way, often enough). But I am learning to drive the coach smoothly and keep the boost pressure at 10psi or below (after reading Dave Head's remarks).
So I got to thinking that while the speedometer seemed to track well with the GPS perhaps the odometer had an error. So on the way home this morning (38 miles) I checked the odometer against the mile markers along the highway and discovered that we show 0.1 miles less than we actually travel every 5 miles. So every 50 miles we actually travel 51 miles... and every 100 miles we actually travel 102 miles.
So our overall mpg is actually 11.1167mpg and the last 1200 miles is actually 11.9504 mpg.
So, not exactly 12mpg but pretty close.
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: MemoryRoads on August 02, 2013, 08:53:20 pm
Dave! Don't forget that you wont be happy until and unless you wear out your generator (as stated in the past), so add fuel for that A.C. and refrigerator! :o Dang, now your down to my 20 mpg average. :D (old math)
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 02, 2013, 09:01:36 pm
Finally found the secret of figuring honest fuel mileage, very simple. Coach VMSps showed 7.5 mpg, but figuring in the toad and ATV, my mileage becomes 22.5 mpg, Simple new math ;D
Well, rats! My Wrangler only gets 17mpg so even with the new math I'm only 14.5!!! :(
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: bbeane on August 02, 2013, 09:40:07 pm
Oh yes, a 238 & a 13 sped Road Ranger works great teaching how to row your way up/ down the road as it is non stop shifting just like rowing a boat. 318 & 13 speed is lil better barely.
Barely, but a buzzin dozen warmed up good with a manual 5&4 and 4.11 gears now we getting somewhere, and oh yea straight stacks. That's why I'm near deaf but it was fun till the 1693 TA 425 Cats showed up.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: bbeane on August 02, 2013, 09:56:08 pm
We get an honest 8 MPG (calculated with my wallet at the fuel island) towing the jeep most of the time running 65-70. Been the same for 8 years, all east of the big river. I suspect that will go down once we get out west, although we where out there NM, Utah, Co, MT, ID with a SOB 36' with a 5.9 towing a 20' trailer an the fuel mileage seemed to avg about the same on the round trip from Florida.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart on August 02, 2013, 10:00:43 pm
Craig,
How many pickup trucks get that good mileage? A lot of older Suburbans and non-diesel trucks only see 7 mpg. Hard to believe a huge RV can be so economical. My old SOB only got 4.8 before the engine change. How much longer before everyone realizes diesels don't have to smell badly and you don't have to oil your feet and hands at the pump.
Pierce
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 02, 2013, 11:12:57 pm
How many pickup trucks get that good mileage? A lot of older Suburbans and non-diesel trucks only see 7 mpg. Hard to believe a huge RV can be so economical. My old SOB only got 4.8 before the engine change. How much longer before everyone realizes diesels don't have to smell badly and you don't have to oil your feet and hands at the pump.
Pierce... we seem to be shooting ourselves in the foot here in the USA as far as "state of the art" goes. Of course, Detroit never made a car they hadn't already made... but still....
I had a 1970s Dodge Class B van that got 7mpg no matter what I did. I even installed an aftermarket cruise-control, fuel monitor computer and it still only got 7mpg. Luckily, gas was only about 70-cents a gallon; too bad I didn't have much money. I would have been overjoyed to get 11.95 mpg!!!
We bought a 1984 VW Rabbit Diesel that got 55mpg and was actually sporty to drive (as long as you didn't insist on snappy acceleration). It could out-corner most cars in the curves, too.
My 1994 Dodge 3/4-ton with the Cummins 5.9 gets about 20mpg but never got more than 11mpg towing our 29' Alpenlite 5th wheel.
Why we don't have diesel hybrid cars is beyond me; an easy 80mpg the way the Prius does it but if it were done the way a locomotive does it (the diesel generating electricity which the vehicle then uses for propulsion) we should get up into the low 100s.
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: PatC on August 02, 2013, 11:44:20 pm
We bought a 1984 VW Rabbit Diesel that got 55mpg and was actually sporty to drive (as long as you didn't insist on snappy acceleration). It could out-corner most cars in the curves, too.
One of the best handling snow cars I've ever driven!!! But one that I had, had blow-by so bad that it would fill up the intake, and when you hit a hill it would just take off flying and they was no stopping til the oil got through the system. She went through all kinds of oil. The blow-by finally caught up with her ::)
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: danieljeff545 on August 03, 2013, 05:29:48 pm
We just returned from a 1700 mile journey from MI over to Niagara Falls and the Anirondack Mountians. Drove through the mountains and over to the 1000 Islands region. On a side note...a beautiful trip if you haven't seen the area spend some time there...I averaged 11.8 running between 55-63 MPH. That's using my pen and paper lol...it was out first week long trip and we are happy with it. It sure beats the 8 MPG pulling the TT with the Escalade!!
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: fkjohns6083 on August 10, 2013, 01:07:01 pm
With our 91GV with the 3208T cat diesel towing an 09 Ford taurus at 60 to 65 mph over a 10,000 mile trip we averaged 9.5 mpg. Trying to get an accurate mpg no. on a short trip is tricky as the fuel line to the tank is long and I have had differences of up to 5 gallons before auto shutoff. I usually go until it shuts off automatically and then top off until it wont take much more. Doing it the same way every time is important. ---- Fritz
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 10, 2013, 04:51:21 pm
My friend drive his giant dually diesel PU and fifthwheel to TX every winter from MN for a four month stay. He says he gets about 7-8 mpg. Once there however they rarely go anywhere because that big PU only gets 8-9 w/o the fifthwheel. We were in TX and NM and points between MN there and back againg and got a pretty honest 7.9 We also put on about 1000 miles on our Wrangler which averaged about 16 mpg. We are OK with what we have. If we want to use less fuel we just don't go as far. We are planning a 3 month spring trip to SE US. We try to average about 75 miles a day. Another way to use less fuel.
Roger
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Gary Bouland (RIP) on August 10, 2013, 08:43:24 pm
Short trip this summer, 3500 miles, avergaed 8.7 for entire trip. GA to CO, NE and return. One oddball fillup showed 11.2, damned if I know why, did not include that fill in overall average. Gary B
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: lgshoup on August 10, 2013, 10:09:17 pm
I'm going to get the MPG I get no matter what. Taking all the fuel in gallons and all the miles and doing the math it comes out to 9.0. I don't subtract for generator since in 18 years it has only 600 hours. Don't use the Aqua Hot (you can have it if you take it out and terminate all the hoses, etc.). I'm sure when in Illinois or some other flat state we might be getting maybe as high as 12 and in those with hills we could be as low as 5. Remember that, while you don't get the return on the downhill that you invested on the uphill, you do get some reprieve. I've got lots of other things to worry about than mileage here or there.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Tim Fiedler on August 10, 2013, 11:13:59 pm
Hmmm, how do you hear water?
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 11, 2013, 01:14:00 am
I want to get the best mpg I can get because:
1. I'm not rich and better miles-per-gallon means I pay less for my RV travel and can buy cool gizmos for it with the money I saved;
2. Better miles-per-gallon means more gas stations passed on a tankful... you might not appreciate this as much if you hadn't once owned a 1959 Chevy with a 409 engine and a 4-barrel carb; and
3. Getting almost 12 mpg annoys the crap out of people on rv.net.
Actually, #3 is worth it all by itself. :D
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Bill Chaplin on August 11, 2013, 05:40:20 am
Easy way to get more MPG than the other guy. Do it the same way he did. LIE ABOUT IT
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Brad Metzger (RIP) on August 11, 2013, 08:52:19 am
Here at CG there is a Monica , Knight 40 ft size . He ask me about my MPG . I told him 6 to 10 , he said he gets 14 to 18 . The devil in me said , gee , you should get it checked as something is bad wrong . Most people get at least 20 MPG with a rig like yours . The guy didn't have much to say after that . :P :P :P :P Brad Metzger
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 11, 2013, 09:28:25 am
Here at CG there is a Monica , Knight 40 ft size . He ask me about my MPG . I told him 6 to 10 , he said he gets 14 to 18 . The devil in me said , gee , you should get it checked as something is bad wrong . Most people get at least 20 MPG with a rig like yours . The guy didn't have much to say after that . :P :P :P :P Brad Metzger
LOL... that was soooo nawty! I bought a bandsaw from a guy who had just bought a huge 5th wheel with at least 4 slides and was towing it with a 1-ton dually Dodge-diesel (automatic). He told me he was getting 18 mpg. I'm not as quick as Brad is... I just smiled. :P
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Bill Chaplin on August 11, 2013, 09:29:48 am
:P :)) Here at CG there is a Monica , Knight 40 ft size . He ask me about my MPG . I told him 6 to 10 , he said he gets 14 to 18 . The devil in me said , gee , you should get it checked as something is bad wrong . Most people get at least 20 MPG with a rig like yours . The guy didn't have much to say after that . :P :P :P :P :)) Brad Metzger
SEE, I TOLDED U
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: John/Pat on August 11, 2013, 09:44:50 am
Bill great reply. I used to say"and you had straight A's in math" but I like yours better John
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Johnstons on August 11, 2013, 09:52:25 am
Hmmm.....I get 8 towing the Wrangler. It gets 19 by itself but uses zero fuel being towed so I could add them together and get 27. Using that math I could get 50 towing the wife's Jetta diesel.
Wonder why so many people lie about MPG?
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 11, 2013, 11:11:20 am
Think about how many people say that algebra was something they'd never use in real life. I suspect that there are a lot of RV drivers who either never learned how to calculate miles per gallon or have forgotten.
And I bet some just use the fuel gauge as an indicator of how much fuel they've used.
If they have a constant readout they just pick a number they've seen on the screen and tell it to everyone. Preferably while going down a hill.
I have always kept track of mpg on my vehicles because it's a good indicator of a problem if it suddenly changes but I don't think many people do that.
Craig
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: John S on August 11, 2013, 11:27:24 am
Here at CG there is a Monica , Knight 40 ft size . He ask me about my MPG . I told him 6 to 10 , he said he gets 14 to 18 . The devil in me said , gee , you should get it checked as something is bad wrong . Most people get at least 20 MPG with a rig like yours . The guy didn't have much to say after that . :P :P :P :P Brad Metzger
Brad you have me laughing right now. Well done.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: fkjohns6083 on August 12, 2013, 11:13:42 am
I really think that it all depends on how many fill ups are involved. Just one fill up has alot of error in it depending on pumps, auto shutoffs, etc. I think that over a long haul and many fill ups that those high numbers would smooth out to a more realistic number.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: John S on August 12, 2013, 12:11:40 pm
I usually just take the year and the number of gallons and figure it out but that includes lots of generator time too. So the best way is with Silverleaf.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart on August 12, 2013, 12:42:29 pm
If you dip your tank at fill-ups or even between WITH YOUR COACH LEVEL, you get a dead accurate MPG reading. At exactly 6 gallons per inch on our U280-300 rectangular tanks, it's a no brainer with accurate measurements within a gallon easily calculated by anyone. With tanks that have a more complex shape, it would still not be that difficult to mark a measure as you fill a near empty tank.
High or low number MPG calculations are a function of basic math with the results determined by topography, winds, coach factors, etc. with only the miles travels vs. the stick measurement necessary for the figure. The service station fuel pump totals are not even relevant using this method.
Pierce
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: lgshoup on August 12, 2013, 02:27:50 pm
Tim, I put in an on-demand heater that has been really great. They said I'd get about 900 gallons of hot water on 20 lbs of LPG and that's what it's turned out to be. I got tired of the expense of the annual adjustments, the leaking fuel pump and subsequent clean-up, the leaking fresh water line, etc., so I just valved it off and it takes up space.
Title: Re: MPG discussion
Post by: wa_desert_rat on August 12, 2013, 03:02:51 pm
There is no need to over-complexify the process of keeping track of miles driven per gallon of fuel consumed.
1. Determine the accuracy of your odometer and calculate a correction factor;
2. Keep track of every fillup including date, odometer miles and gallons;
3. You do not have to fill up every time as long as you track how many gallons you put into the tank and when;
4. You can calculate mpg on every fillup but do not average those to determine your total mpg over a long period of time... instead add up all the gallons and subtract beginning mileage from current mileage. This will give you a much more accurate idea of your overall mpg;
5. Avoid using the trip meter unless you are absolutely certain you zero it at every fillup;
6. If you want fairly accurate mpg information every time you fill the tank, try to fill the tank to the same place every time but remember that if your coach is not level at every fill-up the gallons it takes to fill the tank will not be the same;
7. Be aware of "foam" which distorts the tank fuel levels. Diesel fuel foams more than gasoline and it will even shut off a pump nozzle too early in the process. I can shine a flashlight into my tank to determine the state of the foam and simply wait until it dissipates and then fill slowly to the base of the fill intake; and,
8. If you have an on-board mpg calculator do not rely on its reading unless you have carefully calibrated and verified it by manual calculations.
Miles per gallon equals the number of miles driven since last fillup divided by the number of gallons it took to fill the tank to the brim (or to the same place as last time) (plus any gallons put into the tank between fillups).