For those without AquaHot and don't like the fan on the furnace, the Mr. HEater buddy heater is a great option. I have the small buddy that I use in the house, but I think this hose is designed for the "big Buddy".
I haven't explored around the RV, but I figure it can easily be tapped into the stove or furnace supply line.
Amazon.com - Mr. Heater Big/Tough Buddy 12-Feet RV Hose, Quick Connect x... (http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-12-Feet-Connect-8-Inch/dp/B003CMBV10/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1421896926&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=271802+H)
I am a full time dry camper with 500 watts of solar power and have used a Portable Buddy in 2 Foretravels. I am very happy with it. I also know of another Foretravel owner who uses a Portable Buddy and a Big Buddy.
In my case, I run a 12' hose from a 5 gallon tank in through a window, temporarily, when I need heat but my friend had gas line extensions installed with bulkheads and quick connects.
I guess it depends on how cold it is where you are and how often you use the heaters but I think most will agree they are much more cost effective than using the furnace(s).
The buddy heaters are certainly quieter. I think for boon docking they are great....less/no power use.
Anytime you can heat only the area you are in, you will save fuel
Ordered the small one with small round cyl for fuel; totally portable on ebay. Will help at home if power goes out and be ready for outdoors at camp site or inside motorhome. Might even use in golf cart since I have an enclosure. Tks for the input DAN
Is it ok to use these unvented heaters inside an RV? Seems like a fair amount of carbon monoxide and water vapor would be generated.
Chuck: I can only speak from the reviews I read and the info from questions asked: May not be legal to use inside in California, all other states OK. Has low 0 2 sensor. No venting required. Use indoor like any other propane stove. Read recommended for rv use. DAN
I don't know, Chuck. I would be pretty leary of running these inside a closed coach. Lots of folks die every year from carbon monoxide in RVs, ice fishing houses and places heated with improper venting.
If the AquaHot fans are too noisy the look for the relay near the front heater blower that is used to turn it on when the AH calls for LR heat. I added a switch in the control circuit so that when the AH is on the front fan is not. Makes it much quieter for watching TV and the other fans run longer and the heat is more uniform. Simple to do, you just have to find the relay.
Roger
Here is a photo off our 20,000 BTU heater. We use this exclusively for heat. I installed it in the coach three years ago and had a similar unit in our fifth wheel. Carbon monoxide does not seem to be an issue as our detectors never go off. Units do have an O2 sensor but I don't believe that RVs are built that "tight", in any case it has never gone off for lack of oxygen. Works for us, keeps us toasty and uses much less propane than the furnace (we don't go in areas where we worry about the basement) and we get all the heat produced.
Roland
I think the directions for the Heat Buddy recommends a window open about an inch or so.
Roy
Well, I guess that's working well for you Roland. Personally, that scares me to death seeing that flame in such close proximity to flammable materials. And surely there is a carbon monoxide danger as well? I'm surprised to learn this.
Due to safety concerns, these cannot be sold in California. I don't know about using them. In any case, be careful.
Speaking of heat, hard to beat the Aquahot performance but not keen on the bulk and complexity of it. My biggest beef with the original propane heaters is noise, followed by frequent cycling.
I looked a bit at alternatives, originally considering using the existing heater tank for an accumulator, and firing it with a propane tankless style heater. Once again, though, noisy suckers outside anyway though the pex piping and installation of heat exchangers and fans looks to be readily doable.
What about Espar diesel heaters? These seem to be in broad usage, available new for reasonable cost. Espar - RV Heaters, Motorhome Heaters (http://www.espar.com/business-units/fuel-operated-heaters/applications/rv.html) Give you the functionality of an aquahot it seems, in a small package.
Pretty good ebay/craigslist availability also. Probably one of those things that would cost $$$ to have installed but a diy looks pretty interesting.
There is a glass plate in front of the flame, the flame is below the glass and recessed to the back of the unit. We are always present when the unit is running. Nothing flammable or non flammable for that matter near the unit. W e had considered a ceramic propane heater but the ceramic bricks are in the open and I feel they are more dangerous than this heater.
Roland
I don't believe propane gives off carbon monoxide but it defiantly use oxygen and increases the carbon dioxide content so I
wouldn't use it. Rv heaters and furnaces vent both intake and exhaust to the outside
I have had a couple of these non vented propane heaters and they work very well. Yes, they do use Oxygen and the burning of propane increases the water vapor inside. I have used these for my hunting cabin (in conjunction with the furnace) and they work very well. They are designed with the intent of cutting off if oxygen gets unsafe. I really don't know the mechanism. My experience has been positive with them. They are very fuel efficient, quick to heat up, and quiet. I too have had concerns with safety but can say after several years of use (on an intermittent basis) they are pretty dang good ( and I feel safe). Yes, I have a 295 and use propane but think the addition of the little buddy may be a very good idea.
Roger, I'm all over your plan for disabling the front heater blower. More info please.
I understand the RVIA regs forbid the ome to install these, an owner an.
FWIW, did some searching on the web, and....Yes, they do give off carbon monoxide. They don't put out much if burning clean and really are safe. There are people who die of propane/carbon monoxide poisoning but this is more common with other fuels. I think all FT's come with a CO detector. I use mine now with the the vented propane furnace and I feel certain it will work or alarm with the non vented (if I had one). They also noted that most homes have some exchange of air due to leaks. This would increase the safety. There isn't a big draft anywhere on my FT but you could crack a window to increase the margin of safety.
FWIW, I think one of these things would be a good idea if you were ever stranded. You don't need the battery or electricity to run it. My uncle who lived in springfield Illinois years ago had one installed when he lost electricity for a day or two and had an invalid wife at home with no heat. He was very knowledgeable about HVAC (as he had a company for a while) and was convinced that these were great back ups. At my hunting place the non vented heater is near the kitchen table. This is great as we can turn down the furnace during the day and still be toasty in the kitchen dining area and burn less propane. I usually turn down or off at night though (as we aren't sitting at the table then and don't need).
Best of travels
This works quite well. I will try to get some pictures in the morning and post specifics. The only challenge was figuring out which terminal on the relay does what after you get by the initial trauma of pulling the dash apart. The switch enables the front fan to come on when the AH living room circuit is on or disables it. If the ignition is on the fan operates as it usually does.
Roger
Which have a 5-7 year lifespan and should be replaced if older than that. Same as the LP detector. Smoke detector can be anywhere from 5-10 years.
I have replaced my CO, fire/smoke and LP detectors. Thanks Michelle for reminding us of that important fact.
Roger, my dash is apart and I can take pictures in the morning, if it will save you the effort.
I am only going to install a switch to be able to shut the darned thing off "at will". Did you install it somehow to automatically prevent the fan from running whenever you are on AquaHot?
After all of these years of owners exclaiming about "how quiet the Aqua Hot is", I was dismayed to find that the constantly cycling dash fan (at least on the 2002) has louder dB and is more annoying than the 1998 single propane furnace design.
Let me know about the picture. My dash is still in pieces at the moment. I figured it out based on Jim McNeece's description and then just finding (sound and touch) the cycling "permission" relay.
Neal
Roger and Falconguy, I have the panel removed right now to install a switch to reset my tank sensors so I can easily post a pic tomorrow of the switch I put on our front Aquahot blower. It made a day and night difference in the noise level and more even heat as Roger said.
It's a little trouble to find the relay but well worth the effort.
As I recall the relay was on the driver's side of the blower box towards the rear corner. The relay is one of these black cubes. I think there are four terminals in a square pattern and one off to the side. The one off to the side is the one you want as I recall. It is kind of why I wanted to open it up to see. Put a switch in the line leading to the odd terminal. Add wire as required to get a switch where you want it. I put mine on the bottom curve of the lower dash panel above the go pedal. It is the round switch. The square switch is a defrost control work around for something else that went aouth.
Find the relay and confirm which wire does what.
This switch will interupt the AH telling the front blower to come on. On or off this switch will have no impact on the operation of the front blower in heat or AC when the ignition is on. If the ignition is on the AH cannot tell the front blower to turn on.
It will do what Neal wants, turn the front blower off when AH is on.
I am also experimenting with speed controllers on the other two AH heat exchanger fans in the LR. A single loop feeds all three heat exchangers. A single pump moves heated coolant through the loop. If the front blowe is off and the other two are running at a slower speed they will be quieter and extract heat slower from the loop and in order to add the same amount of heat into the room will run longer.
We have in-floor heat in our home and the rate of heat transfer is regulated by flow rate through the loops. Temperature is measured at the beginning and end of the loop. Flow rates too fast mean less heat transfer, to slow and the return water is much cooler. Running the AH fans slower and turning off the front fan reduces the rate of heat transfer.
Controlling one fan is easy. To do both the wiring from the speed controller needs to get routed into the AH location. Way easier said than done in our 36'.
I do all of this stuff and have a hard time remembering to take pictures.
Roger
As a follow up. The "Big Buddy" has the proper connections to directly connect to the low pressure piping in an RV. It has a quick connect that bypasses the onboard regulator.
The smaller portable buddy (which I use around the house) does not have a bypass for the onboard regulator. It's designed to only be connected directly to a propane tank. I'm sure it could be rigged up to work on the low pressure header, but it really isn't worth the effort.
The down fall of these buddy heaters is they do not have a thermostat built in. However, an empire heater can be had with thermostat in radiant or convective (blue flame): Empire Heating Systems: Vent-Free Radiant and Blue Flame Heaters (http://www.empirezoneheat.com/ehs/index.php?view=vent-free-radiant-and-blue-flame-heaters&parid=94&pagid=175&mlnid=80)
We have one of the Harbor Freight unvented heaters installed for a back up. 49 state legal. They have a thermostat as well as a low O2 cutoff. You have to really believe the moon is made of cheese to think the low oxy cutoff will really work. Ours generated high CO until I repositioned the burner. CO at high altitude and a possible heart condition can be fatal if the low oxy level does not kill you during the night. Going outside for fresh air won't do much good either as it takes many hours to get the CO out of your blood. Just keep a window cracked when using it and don't forget.
The radiant variety are less attractive as they may overheat anything in front of them.
Pierce
I have the medium sized Buddy heater which can use a disposable propane cylinder or can run from a barbecue bottle with a hose adapter. I've used it both ways. It can be used to heat up an engine to get it to start in very cold weather, which was what I intended it for initially. I used it a few times inside my coach to see if the fumes would kill me and so far I have no drain bramage :P
Got a small Buddy Heater and operates on small propane cylinder. Puts out lots of heat but have not used for a long length of time. These appear to be good heaters. Got mine from Academy on E Bay. DAN
This is just what the doctor ordered! If it been a snake it bit me!!! WOW What a great idea, there goes the sofa and all that crap under it . In comes a nice love seat that reclines . Just need to keep a window cracked And get the love seat in ;)