We are currently in the parking lot of Old Town Motor coach after hours, after having had Cummins, chassis, generator service, and the living room slide bladder replaced. We have not settled the bill yet, we will do that tomorrow morning.
We found the entire staff knowledgeable and friendly. While we are new Foretravel owners (since mid November 2016), we have owned 2 Bluebirds and full timed since 2009.
We had the following done: Chassis lube and suspension inspection, Cummins filters, and oil, air dryer service, generator oil & oil filter, generator new coolant, inspect/adjust brakes, hydraulic filters and oil, check hub levels and rear axle level, inspect belts/hoses, inspect CAC and pipes, set tire pressures, inspect air and hydraulic lines for rubbing, contact points, fraying.
On the slide bladder, FOT could not get us in until 6 March, MOT 13 March. Old Town got us in within a couple of days of initial contact. Isaac has done slide bladders when employed by FOT/MOT. We started the work mentioned above plus slide bladder on Monday 2/20 and finished today on 2/21. They were also tracking down air leaks and doing suspension air bags on another coach at the same time.
We ran into a problem with the slide bladder on 2/20. The slide bladder in the box, marked with the correct number on the bladder itself, was "supposed" to be the correct one for our coach according to FOT and HWH. The wrong size bladder was in the box, and was mis-printed on the bladder itself. This was an error at HWH when manufactured.
All the prep work was done on Monday. The correct new bladder was acquired from FOT on Tuesday morning (marked with the same numbers). FOT is returning the mis-marked bladder back to HWH under warranty.
Since we had the slide half finished on Monday night (through no fault of Old Town), we spent the night in our coach inside their building. It worked out fine.
I will first post some generic pictures of the slide, new slide air block (required by HWH now with new bladders).
931 new air block, 313 working on old slide bladder removal, 354 and 536 slide mechanism inside coach, 503 the new style bladders now being manufactured, and 607 new and original slide air blocks (closest one is the new style).
Next post will detail why the old slide bladder failed (and you should check yours).
This coach had both air bladders (living room and bedroom) replaced in 2010. The living room bladder failed at dead center bottom, in the "slot" (track) for moving slide in/out. In this track, the bladder would bulge outward without a guide/flap to retain the bladder.
The guide/flap on the bedroom slide was positioned correctly, the living room hit dead center on the bladder, instead of going over the entire bladder. This caused two things: bulging of 1/2 the bladder at edge of guide/flap, and wear/rubbing (almost sawing) of the bladder by the edge of the guide/flap.
Pic 1 correct placement of the guide/flap, pic 2 incorrect placement of guide/flap that caused bladder failure.
The OP comments regarding the staff at Old Town is encouraging. We plan to take our Lazy Daze to them later this year for some work and these favorable Old Town comments are reinforcing that we've made a good choice.
Sincere people trying to build a great reputation, one customer
at a time. Have enjoyed having them do work on my coach. From
the waits you encountered shows that there is a need for another
quality facility like theirs here in Nac. That was the reason I went there
the first time.
Carter-
Something else I like is the way they did the billing. Every part used broken out with price, and labor sub divided for the time spent on each line item.
X2 on the billing method. When I scheduled with them, I insured they used this billing method. I had extensive work done by another vendor that had all the parts listed and then an aggregate of all the hours. No specific jobs unless you deciphered by parts.
Excellent service, honest, competent and right on time. Glad they are an option!
Later this spring we will have our coach in Nac. for a few things at FT,MOT & OTM. Then over to Extreme for 2 weeks for fiberglas work.
OTM did us right when we were there last fall.
I want to second all of the gold stars on OTM's chart. Was there End of January fot rad replace, new air bags, install of shocks I bought and other misc items and some good free advice. Excellent attention, service and fairness of price Good people. Also, on short notice they got Beau Reece in to deal with an exhaust manifold leak. Also a positive experience.
David Spoor
1999 U 295
San Antonio/Kerrville
Have an appointment at OTM in late April - hope to be as pleased as everyone else seem to be! I've seen a few gold stars from Michelle as well in prior posts.
We are camped at OTM right now. We had scheduled to get our airbags replaced just as a precautionary measure since they were the originals . Impressed with OTM's persistence and skill in tracking down a pesky air leak in the system which we had been struggling with. Courteous, knowledgeable, competent. And ditto on the clear billing.
Was we able to get the price on the replacement of the bladder? what did they have for hours ? and cost on parts?
Thanks
8am -5pm is the hours. They will stay late if needed to finish a job. Replacement bladder costs similar to MOT and FOT (perhaps lower due to labor rate difference). I had a lot of work done, so the total cost does not apply.
For the bladder only:
For the large living room slide (160" wide). All prices rounded up/down to even $.
Parts:
Bladder $1628
Air manifold (now required by HWH with new bladders) $832
Vacuum y modifier for manifold $30
double side tape: $62
New slot cover (since ours was mis-applied upon build and caused this failure) $35 (if yours is correct not needed)
Primer for bladder replacement: $30
3/8: air couplings:, 3 each: $36 for all three
Labor for slide bladder only: 12.5 man hours @ $90 per hour: $1125
$3743 give or take $2.00-$3.00 in the rounding. Add $35 if your slot cover bottom middle at bottom of slide is not correctly placed.
Smaller slides than 160" wide would be less. Larger slides would be more.
Remember to add 8.25% tax rate on top. Should come out to about $4050 with taxes.
EVERYONE SHOULD IMMEDIATLEY CHECK THE SLOT COVER IN BOTTOM MIDDLE OF THEIR SLIDES!! See post 2 in this thread.
Hi,
Does a '02 have a slot cover for the living room slide? I do not see one. With the slide out the bladder does project up into the open slot a little where there is nothing for the bladder to contact.
Jim
2002 U320 42'
In my opinion, yes It should have that slot cover. In your case, perhaps FT failed to install it? See this thread: Emergency '03 slide bladder repair (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=10319.msg47944#msg47944)
That thread is where I lifted the photos from to display the issue.
Mine does not either.. Bedroom yes but no on the livingroom.
What does the new "air manifold do? Is it recommended as a retrofit for existing bladder systems? Thanks
It is not Recommended it is mandatory !!
Has a valve in it that doesnt allow the air to back out and to hold( so it doesnt slowly drain out) (as I understood it)..
Thanks. I guess that would only be an issue if there was a leak somewhere upstream of the bladder.
My bedroom has it because the bladder is newer, and the living room has one but it's thin.
Can a new slot cover be put on easily, or does it require pushing the slide in?
Does anyone have pix of how the slot cover is attached?
Wondering also.. It looks like it needs added. Both bladders are new on mine and I am thinking it should have one
I would not personally retrofit the new manifold on an existing bladder. I still have our bedroom slide bladder on old manifold. I also kept the removed one during this service as a spare. HWH requires new manifolds on new bladders for any form of warranty.
This part may or may not be true: the new manifold does not require the compressor run to create vacuum to deflate the manifold. I read that somewhere, never verified it.
I did not watch the slot cover be added. I do know it was the last thing they did during bladder replacement.
It is my opinion that having the bladder inflate without it causes too much bladder bulging in the "slot", and possible rubbing on the edges of the slot. (I could be wrong, but I would want it if missing) Also see this older thread: Emergency '03 slide bladder repair (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=10319.25)
Since our B/R slide bladder failed in exactly that spot in 2010 (as discussed in the Emergency repair thread you linked), we agree that not having it would be lifespan-shortening for a slide bladder.
When that bladder was replaced by MOT, they discovered the guide/flap just laying there in the space underneath the slide. It simply was never installed when the coach was built >:(
I'm guessing that the slot cover needs pushed in to R&R it, unless a piece of sheet metal can be slid in under the (now-thin) original.
Wow, what does it do and why is it now suddenly required?
Jim
2002 U320
See the previous posts and pictures, and the link to another thread within this thread.
It is not "required" officially by anyone I have spoken with. Purpose: It keeps the bladder from bulging in the slot at bottom center of the slide (visible only when slide is extended).
My opinion (not based on talking with FOT nor HWH): Not having it "may" cause premature bladder failure. Having it, and having it installed correctly past the edge of the bladder "may" increase bladder life. Again, my opinion only, based on my own visual inspection, photos of others coaches "slot" and guide/lack thereof, and a previous thread linked above.
So far it seems some coaches have it and some don't. And on some two slide coaches, one slide has and one does not.
Each person will have to decide the importance.
I looked it over, and it looks to me like you can add this guide from the outside without removing or pushing in the slide. It may take a flexible stalk on a drill motor for a pilot hole for screws or lag bolt, (if no hole already there, or even pre-threaded) then correct length socket extension to put in a lag bolt or bolt if already threaded.
It looks like a L shape (think L bracket, but padded) . I "think" you can deflate the seal, push this into the slot, then secure it to back wall of the slot.
My cell camera doesn't quite fit into the slot for a good angle, but these pics may help envision it. Ignore the blue painter tape in there - he likely used it to temp hold it while he secured it.
Edit: If you don't have this guide, do you have a single hole at the back where the silver bolt or lag is in the photo? If so, perhaps one day when the slide was extended, it pulled the guide loose, and dropped it on the ground?
Here is a picture of an older thinner guide, that may show the angle and view better. I makes me even more convinced this can be installed from the outside with slide extended and bladder deflated.
Dan,
Can you please find out what that piece is called, and if it can be installed easily...........where I can buy one?
I am at Foretravel today. Part is Slideout Slot Cover. $35.13 list, $32.53 w discount. Foretravel parts: 1-800-955-6226 or parts.texas@foretravel.com .
At back of your slideout slot, bottom center, is there a predrilled hole? Is it threaded or non threaded? Shine a flashlight in and you can probably tell. Just wondering, as I don't know the answer on any of the coaches.
Looks pretty easy to me overall to install from outside with bladder deflated. See pictures I just took minutes ago of the actual part.
Would this part also be appropriate for 2002 slides? Thanks
Is that foam? Or a hard plastic? looks to be 3/8" flat bar or is it plastic?
Hard plastic outer shell, with chamfered edges where bladder rides. Foam glued to hard outer shell - foam fits in the slot.
I "think" so. Verify with FOT or MOT. MOT might also have this part in stock. They do have some slide bladders in stock now.
Don,
Were you able to confirm that the slot cover can be installed easily?
We were tied up all day waiting on various things, so have not spoken to a tech about the install (did get the pics at parts department though). Waiting on MOT upholstery department to come to our coach right now. However, visually, by looking at the part, looking at the slot, looking at the part in the slot, I would venture to say yes. Sure looks doable to me.
I still have no answer back from anyone missing this guide whether or not there is a hole predrilled on the back wall of the slot, and if there is, is it threaded? Shine a flashlight in and it should be apparent.
Can a few folks missing the guide shine a light in the slide slot externally and check if there is a pre-drilled hole, and if so does it appear threaded? That would help others determine how doable self install is. If I was missing the guide and out of the Nac area I personally would attempt the install myself. Worst case $35 for the part, then carry it along. (being extremely careful not to damage the bladder if drilling a hole in back wall of the slot - insert small piece of wood over bladder while drilling).
** If there is a pre-drilled hole on back wall of slide slot, yet no guide, I see several possibilities:
Guide not installed due to error at build.
Guide removed then not reinstalled during bladder replacement.
Guide pulled out during slide extension one time, then fell on ground.
Does anyone know if HWH sells the slot covers?
I too had a wonderful experience with Old Town. My friend from Canada had his coach there on consignment. He decided to bring it home. I was free at the time and jumped at the chance to fly down and bring it back. I picked the coach up and made it a 100 miles north and the alternator failed. I parked for the night ran the generator with the boost switch on and recharged all the batteries, leaving in the AM for Old Town. They quickly and immediately diagnosed the problem. Joey drove me to a shop where they have their alternators rebuilt, the alternator was rebuilt, we returned and it was immediately installed, tested, all was fine.
I might add that the price for the repair and the labour was more than reasonable.
I have been in the automotive business most of my life........I have never met anyone or any shop that would go that far out of their way to help a customer... I CAN not find the words to express my gratitude, and Joey was so helpful it was beyond belief. All I can say is if all people in Texas and as helpful as Joey was.... God Bless Texas !!!
Respectfully,
Dave from B.C. Canada