Hello to all,
I'm new to the forum with a big problem and would like some advice where to turn. I got my 1982 38' Detroit stuck in the mud and over spun the wheels and when I braked between shifts. I snapped the pinion in the differential. My problem is going to be taking the gears out myself where I'm parked and trying to find a used set to put back. I would appreciate any advice in getting the gears out and where to find a used unit or reasonable rebuild service. It's a Rockwell H 106BRDAX26 with 4.88 ratio. I'm in the San Fransisco area. Although I only got 7mpg maybe I should change the ratio, but 40 mph on hills. Are there truck equivalents?
This is my permanent home for 13 yrs and by park rules I have to move it for 3 days every 7 months. It cost me a grand to move it back and if I can't drive it out in 6 months I'll have to junk it. I really like it and the motors great. Starts every time in 2 seconds every 7 months.
I felt like a jerk for breaking it and was upset for days. Since I have learned maybe I could of moved it using the Truck Claw which I could made for cheap. It's a big cleat that attaches to the drive wheels and seems to work according to the videos on the net. Just google it.
I have a 485 page 1982 Foretravel repair and owner manuals that would probably cover several years of coaches. It's the Oshkosh Chassis. It's large at 92mb, but can be enlarged 500% in good detail.
The bad pinion
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F2CQQsuK.jpg&hash=524fe4e39cf13b9e699616290900533d" rel="cached" data-hash="524fe4e39cf13b9e699616290900533d" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/2CQQsuK.jpg)
Tags on differential
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FU2hzsXL.jpg&hash=da4e3a92cd18ae8476edef8b7cf8f523" rel="cached" data-hash="da4e3a92cd18ae8476edef8b7cf8f523" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/U2hzsXL.jpg)
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FpsC3dsW.jpg&hash=8141b3373f2157c55804021fc2b9e063" rel="cached" data-hash="8141b3373f2157c55804021fc2b9e063" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/psC3dsW.jpg)
occasionally the F-106 rockwell will pop up on ebay as they are popular with the rock crawler crowd.
You can find the complete axle or the gear sets as you may need. The Meritor 15120 is the closest direct replacement and taller gears are available for this unit. 4:63 is the tallest available for the F-106. A 4:33 would be a good match for your coach. I hope you find this helpful. I own the same rig as you and love it..good luck to you!
Rockwell F106 Rears (Rear) on HeavyTruckParts.Net (https://www.heavytruckparts.net/search.php?qsearch=TRUE&PartID=4401&ManufMake=ROCKWELL&Model=F106)
Here is another source. Finding the 4:88 or 4:63 will be tough. Most of these units were in the 6 or 7 range
Need a Rockwell Differential or parts? Call us for discount prices now (http://www.eprogear.com/rockwell-differentials.html)
Differentials and Differential Parts | TPI (https://truckpartsinventory.com/parts/differentials+and+differential+parts?s=F106&lat=37.6547222&lng=-122.4066667)
If you pull the chunk out. about any gear shop should be able to rebuild it for you with whatever ratio you want. Or find the parts and have it towed to a nearby gear shop and have it rebuilt.
I think rebuild is going to turn out to be the fix. You would need to find a diff from another pusher unit to swap. As for the ratio do what you like but if your not driving it all that much I wouldn't sweat it.
If you are on hard ground and have a friend and a jack you can pull the pot out of the housing. If you choose to diy the removal and install let us know. Lots of advice available.
Instead of rebuilding it, just get another unit and swap it in. I changed gearing in my RV from 5.13 to 4.33 by swapping out the differential complete. It's heavy, but just bolted in. I bought it from these guys...I think it was like $350 or 400...I know it was under 500 (and there was a nominal "core" charge). VanderHaags.com Home (https://www.vanderhaags.com/index.php)
It will be faster and likely cheaper in the long run.
Got to agree with the guys who want to just switch the third member out. Should be cheap. If you have thought about a little taller ratio, now is the time.
I had a racing AH Sprite and depending on the course, I could pull the axles and switch the third member in less than thirty minutes. Naturally, the coach component is MUCH heavier and a couple of people are nice to have.
Usually, you just break an axle. Too bad.
Pierce
If you change the ratio, wouldn't that effect the speedometer and odometer, and require a change for that as well. Just a thought, hope you get it fixed without too much expense and hassle.
Yes it would, with the amount of error depending on the amount of change. Two ways of dealing with it. In an older coach like that, you can just allow a bit in figuring speeds and ODO miles or you can send the speedo to the speedometer shop. I had to send dozens to the shop to change speedo faces and gears from Ks to miles when I exported/imported grey market cars. It's not an expensive change.
Think that if I only started my coach every few months, I would learn to live with it.
Pierce
Thank you so much for all the suggestions :D I will check out the links and sources you suggest tomorrow. I would like to just take out the gear member and replace it with something used. I do want to drive this across country.
I will keep in contact with this thread and post photos.
I did contact ProGear before and they want $2400 to rebuild with a 4.63
This is definitely be a DIY on the hard. I assume I jack up the frame, how high of the ground should I get it.? Would disconnecting the rear airbags allow me to drop the axle for more room to work.? Is there sufficient clearance to slide the gear assembly rear ward and clear of that beam right behind the differential?
and a pic
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F3F88vBC.jpg&hash=9c4c5599b060d4ef244ae1227b9c9561" rel="cached" data-hash="9c4c5599b060d4ef244ae1227b9c9561" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/3F88vBC.jpg)
Is the gears being used in a pusher any different? Are the gears reverse from the regular truck unit? Or does my engine run in reverse than the normal mount?
My home 13 yr ago a little worse for wear now.
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FIHYtDG1.jpg&hash=8d1f3884e4e71c5d11cbd92cd611a7f4" rel="cached" data-hash="8d1f3884e4e71c5d11cbd92cd611a7f4" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/IHYtDG1.jpg)
You could just use a gps or a smartphone as your speedo. Also I have seen dash kits for hot rods that use god signal built into the speedo to avoid having to wire it all in.
I believe the third member is the big problem right now and we should concentrate on helping with that. The speed and distance doesn't matter if the coach won't move. Let's see what helpful advice we can give and thank our lucky stars it isn't us!
Go to this link and you can see some pictures of how I did the install. Our pushers have different suspension and don't have that beam across like yours. Pics: Rear end gear change from 5.13 to 4.33 on 8.3 Cummins u270 (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=22757.msg195567#msg195567)
There is no difference in the diff ("third member") on a pusher or a front engine. The difference is in the axle housing.
It is too hard to get the depth perception on a photo, but raise the coach all the way up and block. Then measure what you have for clearance. If not enough then remove the bottom bolts on the air bags an jack up and block. Some long studs the size of the bolts can let it come out to where a floor jack can finish the job. It usually takes 2 people, one to work the jack and one to balance the third member.
If you need more room underneath.Jack up one side with a bottle jack.put 2x? Under tires then do other side. Keep doing that until you have enough room. Put s 4x4 6x6 or whatever under jack until you get whatever height you need. Just think safety. I think you can do way cheaper than pro gear. I am having a RS402 Eaton put together right now for my peterbilt 1160.00. Keep calling around. You can find a shop that will put one together with the ratio you want just keep calling gear shops.
Parking brake is rear wheels only. Seriously block the front tires?
I like the long stud idea. Learn something everyday.
Pierce
You mentioned the manuals for the Oshkosh chassis. I need to find some
for my project.
Thanks,
Carter-
Nice pics. I'll will follow your suggestion and take the axle with me.
.
Craneman, Thanks for the suggestion. I too like the stud idea.
Stump., I'm going to do some serious calling next week. As a railroader safety was drilled into my head and I'm sure to keep the wheels on till the jobs done, got some good rubber pro blocks for the wheels. Thanks
Texas Guy, Those manuals I converted into PDF's and I will send them to you on a flash drive or dvd if you want. 100 mb big but great detail.
.
Rent a rolling shop floor jack with the transmission deck plate on it.. will make it a bunch easier to handle the pumpkin, and a small engine lift on wheels , so you can get it into a pickup bed without busting a gut.
Just out of curiosity. Doesn't the speedometer drive come from a front wheel? Then no need to change anything. Seems a long way to have a speedometer cable run from the rear all the way up front. (I'm thinking '80s technology here)
The '81 I have has a generator attached to the speedometer port of the transmission and it drives the electrical speedometer.
I finally got it out. I had a lot of trouble getting the cone washers out or the axle plate and many other things to do. So I just kept putting it off. I finally got an excellent stud extractor by Shop Iron for $20. I have youtube of me using it. Stud Remover (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlPSDzzQw6A)
stud extractor on wheel
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FvT31gRE.jpg%3F1&hash=a50881b676907d7e1c659e84c3b196f8" rel="cached" data-hash="a50881b676907d7e1c659e84c3b196f8" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/vT31gRE.jpg?1)
I decided to lift axle center by running a 1/4" cable thru the floor to a jack to lift it up over a bar and to lower to a rolling cart.
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FWNTbKBG.jpg%3F1&hash=056bd87286f45521086290780a590901" rel="cached" data-hash="056bd87286f45521086290780a590901" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/WNTbKBG.jpg?1)
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FoKXi3ow.jpg%3F1&hash=eff0153643d8f2e57c4cee065af4c5f2" rel="cached" data-hash="eff0153643d8f2e57c4cee065af4c5f2" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/oKXi3ow.jpg?1)
(https://www.foreforums.com/imagecache.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F2KC05wy.jpg%3F1&hash=9be73bdd824f0cc7b3c517df005cfc56" rel="cached" data-hash="9be73bdd824f0cc7b3c517df005cfc56" data-warn="External image, click here to view original" data-url="http://i.imgur.com/2KC05wy.jpg?1)
if anyone knows of a used Rockwell F106 around 4-5 ratio let me know. Thanks
Can you take your Chunk to a gear shop and have them put a pinion gear in it? Check out the proformancepros link they have different ratios!
Rockwell
F106 Rears (Rear) on HeavyTruckParts.Net (https://www.heavytruckparts.net/search.php?qsearch=TRUE&PartID=4401&ManufMake=ROCKWELL&Model=F106)
Meritor F106 Ring Gear and Pinions on VanderHaags.com (https://www.vanderhaags.com/Search-Results.php?manufacturer=meritor&model=f106&inventorytype=ring-gear-and-pinion)
F106 5.83 Ratio Ring and Pinion with Bolt Kit A36162-1 PRT-006 | eBay (https://www.ebay.com/i/121514164996?chn=ps&dispItem=1)
https://www.proformancepros.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ZBG-F106
Thanks for the links, HeavyTruck did not have one and the others didn't seem to have axle ratios in the 4. something. Hoping to find one out of some old truck, military truck or foretravel. The military had a 4.33 ratio and last April a guy said he had four but he doesn't answer now. Bummed
I added more pics to my post.
Look Here
Search - LKQ Heavy Truck (https://www.lkqheavytruck.com/search/?page_id=8)
Goodys LKQ Truck Parts Toledo Oh 800-537-8690 Tag#993353
Call this number and give them that tag number
Showing a 4.62 Ring and pinion for a F106
Thanks for the search. I called and the lady was great she said it was #993253. For $500. I don't think I could rebuild the unit. I don't have the knowledge or tools or place.
I really like to find the dif. center used.
I found a obsolete meritor page with the F106 ratios. They had fast ratios of 4.63 and 4.88 and standard ratios starting at 5.29 through 7.80.
I feel finding a complete chunk with the 4.88 or the 4.63 is going to be like finding a Unicorn.
Personally if I were in your shoes and this 4.63 set ,which you said you wanted a little more top speed is correct for your diff. I would find a gear shop or maybe even the local Vo Tech school and see if they can set it up for you. The internals in your chunk bearings etc should be good. That's just my opinion this high gear ratio does not come up doing searches. Plenty if 7 stuff but no 4 stuff.Another thing is if you were to find the Unicorn. If your luck is like mine it would be on the other side of the country and the freight charges for the heavy thing would probably break the bank. Something to think about. I'll keep my eyes open for your Unicorn. Good Luck!
Thanks for the research. There must be some burned out 1980's Foretravels somewhere.
The odds are zero. Maybe fifty made 35 years ago? Not that it does not exist but finding it?
Be real.
Call and check with these guys. I bought a differential from them when I swapped mine from 5.13 to 4.33 Mine is a merritor, I paid like $400
VanderHaags.com - Truck Parts and Accessories (https://www.vanderhaags.com/Search-Results.php)
I'll try. Did you change the whole differential or just the center?
The whole 3rd member is one piece. Pull axles and it drops out. Pictures here: Rear end gear change from 5.13 to 4.33 on 8.3 Cummins u270 (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=22757.msg195567#msg195567)