I've noticed that the driver's seat isn't as comfortable after 500 miles as it used to be after 250 miles. My right hip gets sore a lot sooner now than it did even last year. Maybe I'm just getting old and creaky, but I'm wondering how difficult it would be to switch the driver and navigator seats. Jo Ann won't drive the coach, so for the past four years I've always been the one in the driver's seat and she's always been the one in the navigator's seat. I'm wondering if switching the seats around might be a bit more comfortable for each of us.
Yes, I know the real cure is to either replace or rebuilt the seats, but the budget won't allow that at this time. If/when we do that work we will want it to be the first step in other upholstery work, so we'd like to have a plan of what we want before we start spending money.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
I have switched at least twice no problem
MOT un-upholstered our chairs, put in all new foam, re-installed the upholstery and cleaned the leather. A huge improvement. Less than $600. Took about two days.
But swapping might work. Try it out.
I am replacing my Flexsteel pilot seat with a Villa pilot seat. Has anyone already done this?
The holes seem to be similar, but not the same. I will probably drill two additional holes to line up with the Flexsteel holes. Is there any need to weld up the unused holes to keep the original strength?
I assume the Villa wiring is probably different than the Flexsteel wiring. Does anyone have the wiring for each?
Would appreciate any additional thoughts on this project.
Thanks,
Trent
David,
I've had my seats out a couple of times. I don't think there would be an issue switching except the controls would be on the left side not the right side. I'm sure you'll get used to that pretty quick. :) Mine are held on to the pedestal with 4 bolts. Remove 8 bolts & 2 wires. Do some huff'n and puff'n then replace 8 bolts and 2 wires. 8)
Trent,
I know on the FlexSteel seats the wiring is self contained. All it needs is positive and negative 12v which is already there. I'd be surprised if the Villa seats weren't the same. You will probably need to drill some holes or do an adaptor plate on the pedestals.
see ya
ken
I noticed a Cadillac commercial the other day on tv and they were
telling about their cooled and heated seats, I know that is nothing
new but I wondered if any of the high end seat builders had added
the for coaches? Sure would make driving a lot easier.
Carter-
Kenhat.......I switched my seats also. My question is......why move the pedestals?
My Power Chief seat is heated and has fan cooling
No reason I can think of. Maybe I didn't write that clear enough. How about "Remove the bolts from the top of the pedestal"? :)
see ya
ken
Trent,
Foreforums search is your friend:
Removal of Flexsteel Seats (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=14639.msg86027#msg86027)
If it is like our '98 Flexsteel and a pair of 2000 model year Villa seats, the rotation bearing races are identical, and therefore, that was the logical point to effect the changeout of the two seat styles. The one point to be aware of is that some Villa seats have much more padding and depth than the Flexsteels, so it is important to measure the bearing to seat cushion vertical height for both seats, to make sure the dimensions are acceptable. Our Villa was about 1/2" to 3/4" higher, which was not a problem for us.
If the seats are compatible, just unplug the Flexsteel 12Vdc plug (both are 12Vdc seats) and remove the four bolts that separate the seat from the top half of the rotating top-works. This makes handling the seat much easier. Then remove the turntable center nut (large wrench, 1 5/16" I think, one flat at a time) and separate the top and bottom halves of the seat "Lazy Susan". Remove the Flexsteel top half rotating platform (that has the dc motors, seat rotation detent pin, etc.) That exposes the bearing race, which for a '98 FT is the same race for Flexsteel and a 2000 model year Villa. Just reassemble in reverse, using the Villa top half rotating platform and seat.
The only dicey part is reworking the detent pin and the slot that the pin locks into (the pin that holds the seat locked in the forward position and is released by the lever on the side of the seat). That took some ingenuity and a bit of metal work. And I made my first pin out of metal that was too soft and the next owner had to remake it.
The Flexsteel to Villa conversion was well worth it to us, for all of the reasons enumerated in the original ForeForums post.
Carter,
The Knoedler Air Chief (no electric power seat functions) comes standard with heating and cooling. The electric powered Grand Chief and Power Chief (Power Chief has an additional electric seat-back rake motor and control) air seats can be optioned with forced
ambient air and heated air cooling fan). Almost all of the FT's and Newells with air seats get optioned that way. When driving, I use the cooling most of the time and it works great through the seat bottom and back perforations. The only problem I have is remembering to shut the fan off at the end of the drive. I usually don't remember, so when shutting everything down for the night (and there is this quiet hum going on) I have to relearn all over again.
The seat "leak down" issues mentioned in my original post were resolved by replacing a leaking Knoedler controls manifold assembly.
Good luck!
HTH,
Neal
Neal,
Thank your very much for your link to a previous thread. It answered my questions about the steps needed to accomplish the change.
Trent
Neal,
Why not rewire from power that comes on with the key and then
go through your fan switch? That way the fan could never be left on.
Carter-
Use plastic electric tie wraps around the 4 bolts to keep them from falling through the floor!
What a panic when you see the bolt disappear chuckles!
Flexsteel driver chair to Villa chair may have surprises when completed.
Some have found the installed Villa to be different height, different seating depth, feet no longer reached pedals, may not fully rotate because of not enough open space behind chair, new floor holes may not be as crash worthy due to holes no longer going though in-floor frame support.
Even though FOT only installs Villa in place of Flexsteel, the above issues may still exist.
Because of too many unknowns, we chose to have Flexsteel make new chairs that are identical to our OEM chair and we installed them on our OEM base. Flexsteel told us our OEM swivel base is non-standard and much lower then what they offer.
Although not yet completed, here is a summary of what I learned and did to replace my Flexsteel cockpit seats with Villa seats.
After removing the old seats, I made templates for both of the old Flexsteel seats and both of the Villa seats.
Copilot seats:
My existing copilot seat had a much smaller footprint than the other three. It was only about 10" square, with four holes about 8" square. After removing the seat, I discovered that the four extra holes lined up exactly with the Villa copilot seat. Problem solved! (See related copilot pictures.)
Pilot seats:
The templates revealed that the two rear holes for both seats lined up pretty well. The forward two holes of the Flexsteel seats were about 1 1/4" further forward than the Villas. There were two straight forward solutions: drill two new 1/2" holes through my Foretravel floor, or drill two new 1/2" holes through the Villa base (3/16" steel plate). The decision was easy.
In the process of drilling the two new holes, I used a set of good Ryobi gold bits. I started with 1/8" and went up a 1/16" larger bit at a time. The larger bits were the type that had a smaller drill size at the tip, with the larger size a little further up the shaft. It took me a long time to get though the bigger ones and by break time, I had just finished the 5/16" size. During the break, my brain started functioning again and after the break, I went from there to a normal 1/2" drill bit. The (brand new) 1/2" bit drilled the two holes MUCH faster than the little steps I have been using. (I think my biggest problem was the bits were probably designed for use in wood, not steel plate.) (See related pilot pictures.)
I hope this information is useful to others considering upgrading your seats.
Trent
I think the hardest part is going to be "explaining" to Jo Ann why she gets the crappy worn out seat. :))
We tired of our still original, 1996 Flexsteels and decided to use the bones and throw away the label. Super comfortable and part of our overall renovation.
Quite a change!
Alan, them look great, what brand
Alan, them look great, what brand
These are the original Flexsteels reupholstered. They used to be the off white leather with the rolled cushions that came in the coach in 1996.
Alan who did you use for the reupholstering?
Alan, did you redo the couch also
I have the same problem with my front seats, the foam or whatever is in the seat is worn out. Thinking of removing the seat and getting a redo at an upholstery shop. In the meantime though, I bought a seat cushion at Costco for $20. Wish I had it on the last trip. Comfort Gel Seat Cushion (https://www.costco.com/Comfort-Gel-Seat-Cushion.product.100351467.html)
Trina at MOT. We are reupholstering the couch in dark chocolate. Should be installed on Monday.
Continuing our work, here is the original cloth covered couch reupholstered in dark chocolate leather in a more modern style.
The front seats and sofa came out beautifully. Don't know the cost, but no matter how much, you got your monies worth and then some.
Nice
Alan,
Looks great!
John M
Looks VERY nice!
Nice job!!
I kind of wish I didn't see this. Hmmmmm. It looks amazing!
Roger, I'm assuming that was $600 per seat. We'll be at Old Town in Nacogdoches in a couple of weeks to have our bulkhead fixed, so we might check out upholstering the seats (provided the bulkheads don't kill our balance).
Our '89 GV seats are blue leather---and hot!
We bought two long haired white/black tipped sheepskins and strapped them to our Flexsteel seats & backs with bungee cords. No more sweating, nice comfortable seating.
Only thing is Rocket refuses to walk on them or even sit on them. He does everything he can to find a way to get up to the dash and not touch the sheepskin wool.
I inquired at MOT about getting our seats reupholstered with new foam and pleather was quoted $1650 per seat.. had to move it down the list a bit...
FT was $1350 each plus the covering material when they quoted mine - so not out of line for NAC
Tim Fiedler
Sure Start Soft Start (http://www.gen-pro.biz)
TCER Direct (http://www.tcerdirect.com) generator-gas-prod (http://www.generatorgasproducts.com) 630 240-9139
Gen-Pro
You might check around at bigger motorhome dealers, I found two new takeouts from a dealer flexsteel six way power and ultra leather for 1200 bucks for the pair. They were the right color and still had the plastic on them. And nice seats.
This one of them
I believe you mentioned this before, Roger. When in NAC last month, I asked the man in charge of upholstery about doing this. He gave me a quote of $1500 each. I am able to get new Flexsteel in Riverside for $900, which we may do, but it is further down the list. New house batteries will have to come first.
From a previous post:
We had our seats done in Puerto Peñasco, about an hour below the border in a pleasant seaside town. The cost was $550 for both including R&R at our RV park. I never liked the OEM vinyl Ultrafabrics (Ultraleather) Foretravel used so chose a heavier duty vinyl. Figure 3 days for the job. They have a ton of fabrics or you can bring your favorite down.
Pierce
We are here in Puerto Peñasco .. front seats from Munoz was 800$ for both fronts. I can get mine done in Las Vegas for that price so we turned it down. Twig introduced us to Sammy .. 600$ for the front seats so we had our couch and European recliner and foot rest done also.. didn't have time for the dinette .. but was able to order extra material for that later when we are home.. I will post some pics when they are done
Our coach came with 2 brand new Flexsteels. Adjustable everything, including the arm rest's. Air lumbar, butt warmers, power leg rest pass.,power everything. 5K installed including new bases
Chris