Foretravel Motorhome Forums => Foretravel Discussions => Topic started by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 01:22:04 pm
Title: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 01:22:04 pm
Long story (more details to follow) but I'm looking at new toads. Question: 1) is there a web site or spread sheet that tells which new/used vehicles can be towed (either flat or on a dolly) 2) Advantages for BOTH flat and dolly tow.
Out shopping for a new car now, will check in later. WE HATE NEW CAR SHOPPING.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Keith and Joyce on September 13, 2018, 01:27:08 pm
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 13, 2018, 01:38:58 pm
Remco is another excellent resource. Enter the vehicle info - find out IF it can be towed 4 down, and if so what equipment is required.
Store : Remco (http://www.remcotowing.com/Towing/Store.php)
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Ted & Karen on September 13, 2018, 02:08:13 pm
From my perspective of living full time on the road for 11 years and having a motorhome since 1999, 4 wheels flat towing is the best and easiest way to go. No need to store a trailer or tow dolly or lock them up so no one steals them, etc. With a good towing system you can hook up, check, and be on the road in 10 minutes ( taking time for second walk around, senior moments you know).
We are towing a 2013 Subaru Outback Premium with 6 speed manual transmission ( must be manual due to full time all wheel drive). Only other way to take a Subaru is 4 wheels up on a trailer.
We chose our toad because it is our only car so we wanted comfort, higher ground clearance, ease of getting in and out, 30+ mpg, full time all wheel drive.
Pick your toad based on your needs and wants and figure out a towing system that works for you.
Good luck with your shopping- ^.^d
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 02:28:47 pm
Blue Ox appears to be the most popular for equipment. DW CAN NOT assist in hooking up road, so can I hook up a bar alone? She can guide but not lift.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: wolfe10 on September 13, 2018, 02:37:10 pm
Have not used Blue Ox, only Roadmaster.
But, if any of the newer generation hitches, they are an easy one person job.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 13, 2018, 02:37:46 pm
We have a ReadyBrute tow bar with Blue Ox base plates on the Cherokee. The braking system in integrated into the towbar. Very easy to connect, simple and no brakeing stuff inside the Cherokee and no modification to the coach. Towing flat os how we have done it since the 1970s. We can connect or disconnect in five minutes or so. We double check each other every time and the lighting too. Easy enough to do for one.
ReadyBrute™ Elite RV Tow Bar (http://www.readybrake.com/store/p4/ReadyBrute™_Elite_RV_Tow_Bar.html)
We had a Jeep Wrangler, these are very popular tow vehicles. We sold ours and got a Cherokee as a toad and daily driver. Almost as capable, much more comfortable and quieter, better fuel economy - better for us.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: MrIrishSam on September 13, 2018, 02:39:15 pm
That should not be a problem
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 02:43:17 pm
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Sven and Kristi on September 13, 2018, 04:25:50 pm
For a number of years we towed a Suzuki Grand Vitara, excellent car, but they are getting old now. We now have a '06 Jeep Liberty 4x4 which tows great but isn't good for fuel mileage. A friend tried towing his 2010 Ford Escape, only to have the transmission burn up (according to the owner's manual, it was towable).
As for braking, many states require an auxiliary braking system. We recently added the Air Force 1 system; expensive, but only requires an air hose to hook up. We were never stopped previously, and could continue to get away with out it, but if we were ever involved in a fender bender (or worse) where we ran into someone, the insurance would likely not cover us.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: kb0zke on September 13, 2018, 06:02:14 pm
Jo Ann drives the car up to the coach. I direct her into position as needed, then I hook up the car. When the two Blue Ox bars are attached I signal her and she does what is necessary to get the car set for towing. I finish up the rest of the hooking up.
When it is time to unhook I usually do everything myself while Jo Ann registers. RARELY takes more than a couple minutes either way.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: its toby on September 13, 2018, 09:01:58 pm
I have a dolly, dont recommend it. It doesn't save any time. You can unhook it to back up but that's a pain. It's two more tires and bearings and brakes to go wrong (they have).
We have to drive the toad when at home and that 90% of the use and we pack the miles on at home. I couldn't buy a vehicle I didn't love just because I could level tow it. However level tow looks way easier and to back up you just unhook and drive the toad out of the way.
I see a trailer in my future better for me and what vehicle I have won't matter.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: BillO on September 13, 2018, 09:14:30 pm
Blue Ox appears to be the most popular for equipment. DW CAN NOT assist in hooking up road, so can I hook up a bar alone? She can guide but not lift.
I've used a Blue Ox for 5+ years now. Since I travel alone (neither dog nor cat offers any help) I do all the hooking/unhooking alone. Very little problem unless you get the MH and towed at really extreme angles in a curve.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Journey, Roam, Explore on September 13, 2018, 09:15:12 pm
I purchased my Jeep Grand Cherokee just.in case we purchased a coach 3 years ago. Great toad but a learning curve for sure. I would not want to tow on a dolly. When we got stuck in a parking lot and had to back up, it took minutes to unhook it. I like having a 4X4 for occasional excursions into the back country. So people get by without a toad, but not something I would want to do.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 09:24:55 pm
Welp, I promised more details later, and it's later, so here we go. In a word or less, this Summer sucked, to wit: Mom passes in February. We're in Austin, she's in New York. Ditch the GW (still known as Alice) and high tail back to the North Country. Arrive home, and there's (SHUDDER) freakin snow on the ground. Take care of the final arrangements and then. . . . ( Da Da Da ) Lawyers. My lawyer, her lawyer, and cops, and court. Did I mention how much I HATE upstate New York in the winter time? Spring comes. Flowers, green grass and trees, buzzing bees, motorcycle rides and kids and grandkids. Awww, hell. Might as well spend some time, right? Right! Lovely day for a ride, and my love and I go out for a ride. I mean, what can happen? Wanna know what can happen? Well, I don't care. I'm gonna tell you what happened! I. FELL. OVER. Knocked myself out and did something to my right wrist. For those of you who dont know, the right side of a bike makes it go faster or slower. The advantage is that DW knew when I was slowing down or speeding up by my yelling "Ow Ow Ow!. @#$%$@@" To which she asks "are you ok?" to my predictable response of "Hell NO!". All. The. Way. Home. Then there's the brain bleed. Never, EVER head butt a horse! Thats all I have to say about that! Then, we move on to the serious shit. For some ungodly reason my heart has decided to stop going "Thump Thump" all the time and goes "Thumpythumpythumpthumpthumpthumpy" every once in a while. Its all good. Medication and perhaps day surgery to electrocute part of my heart so it dont happen on the road. Which brings us to last Friday night. I'm going 30, other car comes in from the right to cross over two lanes and stops. Dead. In my lane. Lots of crashing, lots of glass, lots of "are you ok?" (Pretty much yes, bumps and bruses and black and blue). God, I hate the smell of antifreeze in the evening. All of which brings us to my search for another toad. And the use of Tow bars. DW, as I said before, can guide me in, but can not lift. You all seem to agrees that viable. Whats a good resource to find out HOW to use them? You know, stupid stuff like: Do I unlock the steering? If so, how does the battery keep from going flat? What about brakes? I keep hearing about needing some kind of brake set up for the toad. Is installing the hitch plates to the car something a half way decent shade tree machanic can do, or am I better off having someone else do it? What am I not thinking of? Did I mention how much I hate New York in the summer time when its' 100F outside?
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 09:27:09 pm
I've used a Blue Ox for 5+ years now. Since I travel alone (neither dog nor cat offers any help) I do all the hooking/unhooking alone. Very little problem unless you get the MH and towed at really extreme angles in a curve.
The cats dont help? Slackers!
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: kb0zke on September 13, 2018, 09:44:19 pm
The details of how to set a car's transmission, etc. for towing vary. On the Jeep, the drill was to get it hooked up, then: 1. Vehicle in park, engine OFF, key ON 2. Push tiny button on console until light changed color. 3. Start car, put in either D or R and see if it tries to move. If not, shut down, put in park. If it does, repeat above steps.
On the Lincoln, put car in neutral, ignition in ACC.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Michaelhayley on September 13, 2018, 10:01:13 pm
Moby: you've had a rough year! There are good YouTube videos on 4 down towing. Try rvgeeks and " towing" or "tow Bar".
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 13, 2018, 10:21:43 pm
The details of how to set a car's transmission, etc. for towing vary. On the Jeep, the drill was to get it hooked up, then: 1. Vehicle in park, engine OFF, key ON 2. Push tiny button on console until light changed color. 3. Start car, put in either D or R and see if it tries to move. If not, shut down, put in park. If it does, repeat above steps.
On the Lincoln, put car in neutral, ignition in ACC.
What is this mysterious "little button on the dash"? Is it a factory thing or was it installed by the "little button fairy"? What does this button do? Anything or does it energize the corbonite device? Inquiring minds. P.S. Don't let my sick humor turn you off, imma having fun. No harm. No foul.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 13, 2018, 10:50:41 pm
Moby,
You and Brian (Mr B3) should get together and compare notes. Same kind of humor, and he also occasionally falls off his bike...
Ah. But the question remains, does he head butt horses? Won't go into the full story now. I will say I did go to the nearest metro hospital for the brain bleed. Triage nurse said nice story but NOT the strangest of the night. I soooooo want to know THAT story!
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Rich Bowman on September 14, 2018, 03:24:02 am
I think you'll find each towed is different on how you prepare it for towing and how you have to care for the battery. Some based on the towed and some based on the brake system you chose. Each owners manual should give the details for that car.
On ours, you use the secret factory button, put it in Park and take out the key. I put in an Optima HD dual use battery and can tow for about 3 days without having to worry about the Jeep battery needing to be recharged. The original battery was good for about two.
Rich
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Rick & Robyn on September 14, 2018, 06:32:02 am
Follow this link fow tow bar comparisons:
RV Tow Bar Comparison Guide (https://www.rvupgradestore.com/rv-tow-bar-comparison-guide-a/599.htm)
Note the Demco unit has supported tow bar arms which should be a benefit while hooking up.
Whether or not you need a non-binding tow bar release should be considered.
In my research I found no good reason not to use the ready brake system. Inexpensive, easy to install, and no issues towing our Suburban.
I did my own installation and rating me as a shade tree mechanic would be a stretch.
Lots of information on YouTube and forums.
Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: folivier on September 14, 2018, 08:02:18 am
To get an idea of how difficult it will be to install the baseplates on whatever toad you buy look at this Demco site. They have instructions on most toads. I've done 2 Jeep Libertys, 1 Chevy Z71, and 1 Tahoe. Both Jeeps and Tahoe involved taking the front bumper fascia off but wasn't that hard, the Tahoe did need 1 hole drilled through the frame. The 2004 Z71 was the easiest, just bolt the plates from underneath. Baseplate Fit List (https://www.demco-products.com/rv-towing/baseplates1/baseplate-fit-list/)
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: kb0zke on September 14, 2018, 08:39:29 am
Moby, the little button is on the console, just forward of the shift lever. If you didn't know it was there you wouldn't see it. You push it with the point of a pen or pencil. Once you know where it is it is easy to do.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Johnstons on September 14, 2018, 10:14:09 am
We have towed 4x4 Suburbans and a Tahoe and are now on our second Wrangler. The Wranglers are a piece of cake because of the non-locking column. The newer Suburbans say to unhook the battery. We love our new JL Rubicon.
Some websites indicate the Wranglers have a locking column requiring some tricks but Mike Harbordt had a good post about that on the forum. Most don't lock and all you have to do is put the transfer case in neutral, make sure that it is disengaged, kill the engine, lock the doors and tow
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: drcscruggs on September 14, 2018, 11:35:56 am
FWIW, Most all folks love their jeeps for toads. I have a GMC terrain and it tows 4 wheels down (it is 2wd). Haven't towed it much though. I would recommend you consider one of these as they are both good. I realize there are a lot of varied opinions on this. I also have a GX470. It is towable but I have not gotten the stuff to do it. It is a little heavier. That is one of the reasons I bought it (used) as the newer GX460 is not. Best of Travels
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Bob & Sue on September 14, 2018, 12:22:51 pm
+1 on the JL Rubicon Rick. We love ours. The best resale value of any, were told.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Journey, Roam, Explore on September 14, 2018, 12:42:52 pm
What is this mysterious "little button on the dash"? Is it a factory thing or was it installed by the "little button fairy"? What does this button do? Anything or does it energize the corbonite device? Inquiring minds. P.S. Don't let my sick humor turn you off, imma having fun. No harm. No foul.
Moby sorry to hear about your recent troubles... that what don't kill you makes you stronger they say.... Anyway the button is a small nub of thing, you have to depress it with a ballpoint pen or something like that, it puts the transfer case in neutral. Its a MULTI Step process and is a pain in the ass, but its what it it. Had a guy come in to my Emergency room a little while ago with a nice subdural hematoma from getting head butted by a sheep. So yeah, that shit happens. Live and learn...
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Sven and Kristi on September 14, 2018, 02:53:55 pm
That was quite a story. "Fate" does not show mercy for those who recently suffered a loss. The day after my dad died, my mom wanted to get away for all the people coming to the house, so I took her for a ride into the nearby mountains to get her mind off things. The head gasket blew and we were on a back road waiting for a tow truck to bring us back to San Diego. That got our minds off dad for a short while.
Back to the toad issue: I attached base plates to our Grand Vitara and Liberty. The GV required some drilling and both required removal of facia. There are videos on line, possibly for every car out there. The other part is the wiring for signal and brake lights. I elected not to splice into the car wiring and drilled a hole into the tail light housings for an additional bulb. I've always used Blue Ox with the bars that fold up onto the back of the RV, rather than the front of the car (no ball hitch). Be sure that the tow bar has a rating higher than the weight of the car, with a safety factor. I use a 10,000# tow bar for a 4800# car.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 14, 2018, 03:04:16 pm
Tried a wrangler the other day. Entry issues for the DW first off. Drove a bit "skittish" for my tastes. Guessing from the short wheel base.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 14, 2018, 05:02:40 pm
Moby, go back and try a Cherokee if the size of the Wrangler was OK. We looked quite a bit at SUVs of that size and liked the Cherokee. Found a really nice 3 yr old one with 21000 miles. Price was right too. MPG could be a bit better but for a 4WD that has done everything we want it to do and tows easily it has been good. The number of towable cars, trucks and SUVs is shrinking.
We liked the trim and interior better than the Grand Cherokee and it weighs 1000 lbs less.
This is always a function, towability, budget balancing act. Don't forget to budget for towing gear and setup. I hope you find a good fit.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Dave & Danette on September 14, 2018, 05:53:13 pm
We just traded our wrangler in for a Grand Cherokee for the same reason, wife had trouble getting in/out. Love the GC! Easy base plate install, we use Blue Ox also. Highly recommend.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 14, 2018, 07:56:03 pm
Moby, go back and try a Cherokee if the size of the Wrangler was OK. We looked quite a bit at SUVs of that size and liked the Cherokee. Found a really nice 3 yr old one with 21000 miles. Price was right too. MPG could be a bit better but for a 4WD that has done everything we want it to do and tows easily it has been good. The number of towable cars, trucks and SUVs is shrinking.
We liked the trim and interior better than the Grand Cherokee and it weighs 1000 lbs less.
This is always a function, towability, budget balancing act. Don't forget to budget for towing gear and setup. I hope you find a good fit.
Does it have one of those "fairy buttons" mentioned above?
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 14, 2018, 08:35:57 pm
It has an 8 or 9 speed automatic transmission. There is a rotating knob for Normal, Mud, Sand, Snow, 4WD Low. Another comes with another option for Rock Climbing. Probably actually called something else.
When you want to tow you press a small button with a pen untill it flacpshes. This electrically shifts the transfer case into neutral. You make sure it shifted properly. Put the transmission in Park and that is it. We have a checklist, one side to hook up the other side to unhook.
We added a power steering wiring harness too that enables the power steering while everything else is off. There are situations like twisty very rough roads on which the wheels can get just farr enough off center that they don't straighten up right away. In several years it has happend twice. You just stop and give the steering wheel a tug to line the wheels up. The power steering enabling is two switches. This turns on the power steering so that it actively adjusts back to straight. This may only be a 2014 thing, ask about it.
No matter how you do it with which toad, a check list helps until it is routine and thenhelps as the double check.
We drive in the snow, on the beach in Oregon, rugged Forest Service back roads, rutted roads through the woods. It just goes. Maybe not quite as brutish as our Wrangler was but much more comfortable. This is our fifth Jeep going all the way back to a 1947 CJ2, a civilianized WWII Willys.
It is a southwestern red colorlike our Chili Pepper Red '98 Wrangler and has heated and cooled leather seats. Perfect for MN in the winter and anywhere when it is hot. It has turned out to be a great choice when we went from three cars to two. We looked at a 4x4 F150 4 door short box, same year. With low miles it was twice the price of the Cherokee and much heavier. But there was a bit PU lust in my heart.
Lots of good choices out ther for every taste.
And OBTW, tough times to live through, sorry to hear about it. Life happens, stay calm, figure it out, move forward. Next year is probably going to be better.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Dick & Sue on September 14, 2018, 09:49:01 pm
You know, you can't beat the F150 4x4 for flat towing. And when we aren't flat towing, we are driving it. Today we knocked off 690 mile from home on our way to Florida and will finish up with another 600 miles tomorrow. Plus, she rides great with plenty of cargo room for road trips. My DW says, there isn't a secret hand shake. When you are done setting it up, the dash screen shows "You are in 4 wheel towing mode".
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Realmccoy on September 15, 2018, 08:41:46 am
I have a 2018 Chevy Colorado z71 4x4. In the process setting it up to tow. High step up, comfortable ride, decent mileage, adequate off road for where we like to go in New Mexico, Colorado, fishing and skiing. Also does a great job towing the boat and handles car seats for grandkids. The etrailer website sells lots of tow equipment and has excellent videos showing installation of tow plates for specific vehicles. Colorado has a v6, eight speed transmission, comfortable seats, quiet ride, and an electronic transfer case with neutral. Manual includes detailed information on how to tow behind recreational vehicle. No tow for 2 wheel drive models. Will need to disconnnect battery for towing, I'm installing Roadmaster remote disconnect solenoid. Lots of discussion on IRV2 website on Colorado starting in 2016. Used BlueOx towplate, not for the faint of heart to install. Video was great on etrailer. I've used a tow dolly. I wouldn't have one unless primarily a stationary snowbird or visiting RV commercial parks with pull throughs. Same for a trailer, I almost bought Subaru Forester with manual trans but Subaru can't make up its mind if they recommend it's use as a four down tow. You will get both yes and no as an answer. Many do tow manual model and love them. Forester can't tow my boat, at least not within guidelines. Looked hard at Wrangler JL 4 door. Leary of buying new generation before bugs worked out. A year of two in the field always exposes a couple of design flaws or weaknesses that get corrected.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Dave & Danette on September 15, 2018, 08:54:24 am
We chose the Jeep GC for many reasons, but mainly because once you put the transfer case in neutral that's it! No fuses to pull or battery/driveshaft disconnect, lube pump whatever. Also there are no speed restrictions.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Moby on September 15, 2018, 11:40:23 am
First of all, thanks for all the suggestions and comments. The search continues. Lord, I hate shopping for cars!! But heres a more technical rather than opinion question: Given that I am (was) towing a #3200 vehicle with a dolly (guessing #200-#250) lets call the total curb weight #3500. And given that Alice is a '93 U225 with the 5.9 Cummins, what do you all think would be the MAX curb weight I can get away with safely? TIA
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 15, 2018, 01:57:57 pm
What is the difference between Gross Combined Weight Rating and the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating? For your coach it might be 5000 lb. if you a flatland traveller then that may be OK. If you are heading for the mountains then less would be better.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Sven and Kristi on September 15, 2018, 02:00:53 pm
You have to take into consideration the total weight of the motorhome in addition to anything you would be towing. This is my understanding: Find your vehicle's GVCW (Gross Vehicle Combined Weight) rating and compare that to how much your vehicle weighs fully loaded (topped of fuel, water and everything you normally carry, including food and yourselves). Hopefully, the GCVW is higher and the difference is what you can tow.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: rworley on September 15, 2018, 03:03:11 pm
We also have a '93 U225 and we love it. We could use a little more HP; but, we can live with what we have.
We tow my wife's Chevy Captiva at times. We have to pull a fuse so the column is free and put the transmission in neutral.
We have towed a 24' enclosed trailer in the past, with sand rail and motorcycle and misc. tools, etc. I would guesstimate that trailer weighed in the neighborhood of 6000-6500 pounds loaded; maybe. Towing was fine on the flats; pretty slow going in the mountains of Idaho, Montana, etc.
We often tow my '79 International Scout II without any problems. (The U225 is still pretty slow going up hill.) We put the transfer case in neutral, transmission in park and lock the front hubs per the owner's manual instructions. Estimated curb on my Scout is 4190 lbs.
We have had that problem where the front wheels don't straighten out; especially in soft terrain. We had to stop and turn the steering wheel; problem solved.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Mike Leary (RIP) on September 15, 2018, 04:57:04 pm
We also have a '93 U225 and we love it. We could use a little more HP. Towing was fine on the flats; pretty slow going in the mountains of Idaho, Montana, etc.
When you say 'pretty slow', what does that mean? We only have 20 hp more than you, and we do 45 on most of the grades we climb (6-7 %) around here. Have never towed, but am considering it when we head back to the PNW for a visit.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 15, 2018, 06:19:12 pm
What is the difference between Gross Combined Weight Rating and the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating?
Roger, and Sven, and Moby, and rworley:
On my '93 U280, the manufacturer plate does not list a GCWR. It only has the GAWR for each axle, and the GVWR. I am guessing it is the same situation for Moby's '93 U225. Makes it kinda difficult for an owner to calculate allowable towd weight.
If you want a good laugh, check out the numbers for '93 models on the beamalarm page. The U300 is the only one with a reasonable rating.
I question the reliability of the source for the (GCWR) numbers for the "lesser" models.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: rworley on September 15, 2018, 08:41:47 pm
Mike Leary,
By slow I mean 20-25 mph when pulling the big trailer up 6-7% grade; 35-40 towing the Scout.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Old phart phred on September 15, 2018, 11:43:28 pm
I seem to remember stumbling across the gcrw in my foretravel manual somewhere, but not on the data plate. It was pretty high for my coach so i did not even bookmark it. Heck i can load up my coach with 3500 lbs of stuff inside assuming either the waste tanks are empty or the water tank is full. Without exceeding my axle ratings.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 16, 2018, 10:57:31 am
I seem to remember stumbling across the gcrw in my foretravel manual somewhere, but not on the data plate.
Phred,
Your coach GCWR is not listed on the beamalarm page linked above. I know Barry (the author of that page) did his best to assemble the pertinent data from all available sources. If he could not locate the info for your coach, it must be a closely guarded secret.
IF you have not ever had your coach 4-corner weighed, you should see about having it done. It may surprise you! Our coach is not what I would call overloaded - we are only using about 1/2 of our under coach bay space for our essential junk, and have not yet fully stuffed all the overhead inside cabinets. Even so, when we got our coach weighed at Escapees (Livingston, TX) we found out we are currently slightly over our GVWR. I can get us very close to "legal" by driving with only 1/4 tank of fresh water, so we have instituted that rule.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Old phart phred on September 16, 2018, 06:22:40 pm
30,000 gcwr, 26,500 gvwr for my coach as indicated by the oshkosh spec sheet. Weighed Around 7k on the front 9k axle, 15k on rear 17.5k axle. Since has been on a diet. No toad yet.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: sedelange on September 16, 2018, 09:24:25 pm
Just tuned into this discussion. If I am understanding correctly, the OP has a 93 U225. That would indicate a 24,000 GCWR and a 22,500 GVWR. To me that pretty much indicates you can tow 1,500 lbs unless you are significantly lighter than 22,500.
Personally, we have a 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland which tips the scales at 4750. We love the Jeep. I can connect and disconnect in a couple of minutes. We have 45,000 on the odometer and we have another 45,000 towing. One of 5he best vehicles I have ever owned. Easy in/out and extremely comfortable seats. I always carry a couple of toothpicks in the cup holder to work the transfer case disconnect switch. My pens seemed to disappear, but no one steals my dirty toothpicks.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: kb0zke on September 17, 2018, 10:11:37 pm
Boy, does this discussion bring back a few memories. Back when we were still researching all sorts of coaches, both motorhomes and towables, I finally figured out that something was going to tow something else. Once Jo Ann realized that, too, we were pretty much set on a MH. I was directed to the Beam Alarm page noted above, and very quickly the choice was made. We had to have a U300. We simply couldn't get by with such a small towed. That 6,000 pound towing capacity seemed like a bit of overkill when we had the Jeep, but now that we have the MKT I'm glad to have it.
Of course, the coach doesn't seem to know that the Lincoln is there, so I have to keep a close eye on the rear view camera.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Journey, Roam, Explore on September 18, 2018, 11:24:03 am
Yeah, I have to say, despite the complexity of the Jeep Grand Cherokee it's a great car. 4X4 when you need it. Fairly decent fuel economy for a 4x4. Air suspension so you can raise it up for higher clearances or lower it for someone to get in easily. Seats go down in the back for more storage space. Can carry stuff on the roof too. But don't think your coach will tow it. To heavy. Try a Mini Cooper. Light, fun fast.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Bob & Sue on September 18, 2018, 02:15:19 pm
We were unable to find our GCWR anywhere on anything including calling the Fortravel factory. Their answer defaulted to like 3,000 and I very much questioned that response because they didn't seem sure of the answer.
Finally among some sales literature in found the answer of 6,000 over the GVWR of 28,000 for our U280. Now I keep that paper very handy, in case we're stoped and question by whomever.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 18, 2018, 06:46:40 pm
Often the gross combined weight rating is about the same as the gross vehicle weight rating and the towing capacity. Gross combined weight rating is closely related to the capability of the towing vehicles braking system.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 18, 2018, 09:54:02 pm
Finally among some sales literature in found the answer of 6,000 over the GVWR of 28,000 for our U280. Now I keep that paper very handy, in case we're stoped and question by whomever.
I would very much like to see that sales literature. Any chance you could take a photo (or scan it) and post it here? Thanks.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck Pearson on September 21, 2018, 10:13:49 am
As far as a Toad for Moby's U225, think light, real light. If you can locate a Geo Tracker in good condition, it's a superb go anywhere 4X4 toad. Right at 2K lbs. Mazda Miata possibly.....
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: wolfe10 on September 21, 2018, 11:11:48 am
Add Ford Focus and Hyundai Elantra MT to "light toads".
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: nitehawk on September 21, 2018, 11:19:29 am
We had a 1997 Geo Tracker ragtop 4x4 and it felt like driving a go cart in heavy traffic. Felt quite undersized compared to the other vehicles on the road. Had lots of power necessary to keep up with traffic but felt unprotected. Currently have 2006 Saturn Vue AWD. Sacrificed weight for protection.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Sven and Kristi on September 21, 2018, 11:42:02 am
As far as a Toad for Moby's U225, think light, real light. If you can locate a Geo Tracker in good condition, it's a superb go anywhere 4X4 toad. Right at 2K lbs. Mazda Miata possibly.....
Trackers are rebadged Suzuki Vitaras. Excellent gas mileage and a lot of fun to drive. I prefer four cylinder (fuel injection) to the heavier and harder to maintain V6 that does not provide substantially more power. I've had both.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: craneman on September 21, 2018, 11:53:45 am
Moby if price is an issue an earlier Grand Cherokee can be picked up for under 3k My current 2001 cost $3,100 back in 2013. I towed a '96 behind my '81 FT and it only had 225 hp. I have only towed Cherokees or Grand Cherokees since 1994 when I bought the '81
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Bob & Sue on September 21, 2018, 01:41:22 pm
Here ya go Chuck. Looks like I fibbed, the the GVWR and consequently the GCWR is a couple K more than I stated.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Old phart phred on September 21, 2018, 03:09:57 pm
that's odd, on my chassis you add the front axle weight rating 9000 and rear axle weight rating 17500=GVRW of 26500. Maybe they changed how that number is derived. Moby have you weighed your coach?
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: jcus on September 21, 2018, 03:35:04 pm
2000 lbs, great offroad, not so much for highway trips.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Chuck & Jeannie on September 21, 2018, 05:19:31 pm
Thanks for posting that sheet, Bob & Sue! That is an interesting document, but I am wondering if it can be applied to earlier models. The fine print at the bottom says it is for the 1996 model U280. I've not heard of a actual 1996 U280, but I have read some old Forum posts indicating that the factory made a few of them (6 perhaps?). You guys have a 1995 model, which I thought was the last year they were sold. We have a 1993 model. If you look at the 1996 U280 data on the beamalarm page, the axle weights on your sheet are slightly different. The axle ratings on your sheet are actually the same as those given for the 1996 U320 on the beamalarm page! Would they have used the same axles on the U280 and the U320?
At any rate, I will choose to believe that the numbers on your sheet can be applied to the earlier models, because it is the first time I have seen a reasonable towing capacity given for ANY U280 model. 6000 pounds is a LOT more realistic than 2000 pounds, and is also well above what we have been towing for the past 4 years without incident.
that's odd, on my chassis you add the front axle weight rating 9000 and rear axle weight rating 17500=GVRW of 26500. Maybe they changed how that number is derived. Moby have you weighed your coach?
Not yet. I need to but she's still not accessible
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: rworley on September 21, 2018, 11:21:06 pm
I haven't weighed ours yet either. Maybe not a newbie; but, still learning... I hope.
We just hook up and go. Luckily, no incidents....knock wood.
roger
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: wolfe10 on September 22, 2018, 09:41:47 am
Until you do weight so you can accurately set tire pressure, go by the PSI on the GVWR plaque to the left of the driver's seat.
Those PSI are based in each axle being loaded to its GAWR.
Likely these pressures will be a little high. Said another way, if your axles are not loaded to full GAWR, you will be over-inflated.
Title: Re: Toads
Post by: Doug W. on September 22, 2018, 06:23:04 pm
Until you do weight so you can accurately set tire pressure, go by the PSI on the GVWR plaque to the left of the driver's seat.
FWIW: My 96 U270 36' loaded for fun with full fuel and water weighs 10K on steer and 17k on the drivers. Axle gross is 12k and 19k per plaque. Tires on steer max out at 6175 pounds at 110psi., duals/drivers a little less.