We had the coach at home, no oil leak. Delivered it to Xtreme for very minor glass work. When they pulled the coach into the shop, they noticed an oil leak.
We later ascertained, by Mr. Risch, that it was a hydraulic hose at the very top of the third picture, in a hose bundle, that goes to the steering mechanism. The same pump also supplies the fans.
This is a blue hose, so higher pressure than most others. MOT worked on it after hours while Xtreme did the fiberglass repair. Very fortunately, Mr. Risch with Aubrey Lee came up with a way to splice into the hose and take out the area that had worn on a metal frame brace. Otherwise it would have involved running a new hose from the front to the back of the coach. Expensive.
As it was, they worked with the next door hydraulic hose company and put three fittings together that the hose could be spliced. I must say it was a nasty job.....while we drained the hoses as much as would drain rapidly, it continued to seep from both ends of the cut off hose. Lots of patience, lots of paper towels, Risch working from under the coach, all above his head. I can tell you that if you tackle such, you need a high speed circular saw, the one we had was air driven, Harbor Freight. You cannot get use a hacksaw and get smoothly through the fiber with stainless wire.....just messes it up. You need a very smooth cut to fit on the stainless coupling over the hose....both ends....and then you insert the coupling. More info if you need.
Many thank to Keith Risch who worked to figure this out, his help from others in MOT shop....Aubrey Lee....and the patience of Xtreme while we tied up a bay for a time.
Had I known of such a possibility, I would have tried to inspect that hose run, see if there was an opportunity to rub a hole. Alway learning.
I have used those no scythe hose couplings on heavy equipment. I actually have a tool that starts the braided part up into the sleeve. Like you said takes patience.
Mike,
You were very lucky, actually, to have the leak appear at the time it did. You didn't drive your coach very far, pulled into a shop that immediately noticed the problem, and had knowledgeable people available to make the repair. Couldn't ask for a much better set of circumstances!
Also, a excellent example of cooperation between service shops. ^.^d
Glad to see you got it fixed, Mike. A result that most of us expect when going to MOT and get.
Ah I know that area well now, very tight in there for a big guy like me. I noticed I have some hose going to the radiator that is right against the metal surrounding the radiator, po had it replaced last year, and I wish I could move it, or put something between the hose and the metal area, but it won't move its to tight. Good thing you were in Nag at the time huh? Thanks for the pics, always makes it easier to see what someone is talking about.
Bob
I tie wrap garden hose lengths around mine.
Thanks folks.....yes, very very lucky. And to have and be with these folks to solve it....Greg and Rance and James at Xtreme, and from MOT Eric Barnes, Aubrey Lee and very especially Keith Risch. I was very concerned tying up a bay at Xtreme. They were not at all, did the small fiberglass work on the coach while stranded there, and Risch and James and Aubrey figured the fix and had it done the next night.
BUT what I wish I had done was go over to A&D Hydraulics and inquire about what Chuck said is available......HAD to be an easier way to get past the hose fuzz. Risch did figure out it is best to put the hose part on the hose only part way, then feed in the internal connection (male) part just into the hose first, THEN tighten on the hose, then go back and tighten the male part. Otherwise the plug in of the male part was hard or nearly impossible to thread into the hose, the hose being so tight. (Bet this make no sense reading my writing...oh well. call if need more)
But yes....great circumstances. And glad to hear from Chuck this is a reasonable way to do this, that that type of connection works ok. Way cheaper than a total new hose, but boy o boy, the idea of seeing that happen out on the highway if this splice failed, would do a new hose in a moment. (IF you are new to this area of your coach, IF this was left and run out of fluid, unbeknown to a driver, you would lose power steering, and I understand cooling fans, and I think Risch said you could ruin the pump too.
Trying to find one of the larger Koul tool videos. This is how they work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTv6d3JfMmY
We used aeroquip fittings in the oilfield,have used them on 1/8 to 1 inch black hose imbedded with the stainless,the part that goes
on the hose is left hand threaded and the other half screws into that,used to keep fittings and bulk hose on the platform and make our own up,we had too many different sizes to keep spares for all.
Recently made up some Aeroquipt style hoses, these were to extend fuel lines through the engine compartment to new primary filter location.
Like Dave says, the hose insert part of the fittings are left handed. When using the wire reinforced hose it's easiest to cut it with a small right angle grinder and a thin composite metal cutting blade. This will cut it clean. (I consider this grinder an absolutely essential mechanics tool, it's the one power tool other than a cordless drill that's always in the kit.)
So, cut the hose to length, clamp it to something sturdy. Grease the left handed threaded fitting that inserts into the hose, start tightening it. Reverse thread. I didn't have any problems inserting it, the cleanly cut hose probably helped here. Tight but readily doable. Stop tightening when the hose is 1/8" from bottoming out in the fitting. Voila!
Easy enough to carry some 1/2, 5/8, 3/4 fittings and a few feet of hose, could get you out of a jam.
"The money you save in Bandaids, pays for the tool!" Ha ha love it.
Good to know. Going to use them on the fuel hose I have left from the filter to the ECM cooler and then to the primary filter back to the engine.
Next year.....
Yes John, did in time figure it left-handed thread!
That is Chuck the kind of grinder that we used, borrowed from Rance.
Chuck hits it out of the park with the grinder and cutoff wheel. Never try to use a hacksaw as the resin disks make a clean cut and you don't need a vice to hold the hose. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Diablo-4-1-2-in-x-0-040-in-x-7-8-in-Thin-Kerf-Metal-Cut-Off-Disc-DBD045040101F/202830995 and the electric grinder from the page at: Search results for: '4 1/2" grinder' (https://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?dir=asc&order=EAScore%2Cf%2CEAFeatured+Weight%2Cf%2CSale+Rank%2Cf&q=4+1%2F2%22+grinder)
A $10 air tool from HF with a narrow kerf disk also does a good job. A diamond disk works too and you can cut stainless or stone with it.
Pierce
I am sure a posting I wrote a few years ago would show up in searches, as I mention that as I had found multiple places were the hoses get rubbed thru, by vibration as they are too close to framing and engine parts. I remember Don and Tys were visiting us at the time and as he had their coach over my pit he also rapped rubber hose pieces around those points after me showing him. I too had a hydraulic hose wear thru and lost the contents of the tank on the Hwy at Hilton Head Island. It was because of that issue that once home checked all of the hoses and fixed the ones likely to have same thing happen. I did warn you all of this possibility at the time.
JohnH
Not sure otherwise how to search for all that may go wrong. I just hope this experience triggers one or two to prevent what we had but I doubt in a year anyone will see it again. 😀
Those of us who spend a lot of time under our coach are more likely to spot potential trouble areas. I have found and applied protective wrap to several worn hoses. Some places are very hard to see and get at, so I'm sure I have problematic spots that have escaped my notice. Every little bit of prevention helps forestall disaster. If a coach owner doesn't have a good comfortable creeper, then they should ask Santa for one. Put the coach up on safety stands, and spend a afternoon rolling around viewing your baby's private parts. Might be surprised what you discover!
Yes, this hose had disappeared into one of those hidden recesses where rubbed. After I get it back, need to look further. And a hose back to front goes through a number of places need to try to see, but direct seems unlikely, maybe mirror and flashlight? TBD.
Well, got the coach back from Xtreme today. Less than a coach buck. That great news. And beside the larger repair, we had a chip on the front left panel by the gen door. I would have been happy with some kind of glue in that hole, and they were going to just do that as a filler. But they could not stand that apparently, fixed it so could paint it and did.....and my paint is difficult to match up, James calls it a pearl, I think besides color has some other coating, maybe clear?
ANYWAY.....Xtreme had warned me of a six month wait when we began to beg for repairs. But with weather travel impacts to a few customers last week and cancellation, and mine had only a small fracture of fiberglass on the rear upper corner when the shed jumped over and shattered the 12x 8 inches of glass, I got in after only a four month wait! (it was a non-structural injury)
Now it is back to MOT to re-tie the lines/hoses, and we will inspect other hoses for wear points. Dang that coach drives good too!
Praises for Xtreme and MOT working this out.
Upon inspection of our "new to us" coach about eight years ago I noticed a hose that went to the top driver's side of the radiator was up against the air intake housing and was quite abraded where the hose and housing met. I slit a piece of hose lengthwise, put it over the abraded area, bent some sheet metal around the hose assembly, fastened everything in place with a few hose clamps, then used a braided steel fishing leader to hold the hose assembly away from the air intake housing.
Still holding and still no more abrasions.
The power of very slight movement to (over time) wear through material is always impressive to me.
We built our house from scratch back in 1981. Common building practice in our area of the country is to lay all the plumbing pipes down, then pour a concrete slab on top of the pipes. Two decades after we moved in, we had a slab leak in the middle of our living room. Not fun. After they finally located it, and tore up the cement to expose the pipes, we found out two copper water pipes had been installed with one laying diagonally across the other and touching. Even totally incased in cement, the pipes moved enough from (?) to eventually wear a hole through one pipe and cause the (very expensive) leak. Amazing to me.
Water hammer?
Yes, that was one theory. Another was movement due to temperature change, although that sounded less likely to me.
You can't possibly be serious, right? The pipes are embedded in the floor slab?
Mine were until electrolysis ate a hole under my living room. I moved them to the attic. Mine was built in 1951 though.
Same with my 60 year old house, easiest fix was to plug old line, [drain line] and find shortest route to outside of slab and run PVC around outside of slab to city sewer line.
They are building a house down the street,can see the pvc sticking up,will take a look,I think the actual horizontal piping is in the
dirt and not concrete,will take a look.
Getting back to the post,think if I ever redid hoses I would use the cover that Pierce talked about.
Question,we have the mechanical 8.3 with the mechanical fuel pump,runs great,have noticed when the engine is running the
bundle of hoses above the fuel tank make what I would call a vibrating thumping,it's only noticeable if you open the door,has
anyone else noticed this?
I'm serious as a crutch. This is standard practice for a site-built home...even today. When they did our foundation, the pipes were laid out on the ground, and then kinda supported in different places by the wood braces and the rebar that reinforces the concrete. Then the plumbing is buried under the concrete, which ends up kinda flowing around the pipes. Makes it quite tricky finding the leak. The water travels under the slab until it finds a way out. In our case, it came up during the night in the living room wall 20' away, and flooded the whole living room.
SORRY I tried to derail the thread! I HATE it when people do that! :-X
Yes, I hear the same sound. It is quite loud. I think the noise is coming from the lift pump on the engine, and being transmitted forward to the fuel tank by the fuel lines.
I visited the folks at AD Hydraulics today to ask about putting the fittings on a hydraulic hose.
Very nice folks, very sympathetic to the situation we had. Turns out that new hydraulic hoses do not come with clean cut ends but have some of the fabric rough and would make it very hard to attach the fittings. So they, as we, need to cut the hose cleanly. He used a cut off saw with special fine blade, diamond maybe?
I had asked about a tool to help one thread the fittng on. Said no need, just make that very clean cut and then clean up the cut so there are no threads....in fact he said my panic idea to burn them off would work but a pair of scissors would do good. He prepared a very clean hose end, then screwed the fitting on, using a wrench, lubricated the fitting with a little special grease. Leave the fitting 1/16 inch from the hose being seated fully into the fitting, screw in the male connector. He said the expansion of the hose by that connection causes a very strong attaching of the screw threads into the hose. No need to worry about it not being as good as a hose.
I think Chuck said about the same earlier in this thread but I liked seeing it done.
This is common practice for ranch style homes in the west. Even in New Mexico, problems come up with the heated floor with some types of pipes, either plastic or copper. Our neighbor thought we had a spring under the house as water was flowing down the hill to their yard. I pumped cement into the old line, let it set for three days and ran a new one overhead and down the wall. No wonder slab/stick/drywall homes blow down so easily in a hurricane.
Pierce