On a 2003 U295 36 footer, can you add a motorcycle lift to the back? The bike & lift would be about 1000 pounds behind the engine door. With the bike on the lift I could still tow my 4300 pound car. I'm just not sure if the extra 1000 pounds of hitch weight would make the front end too light & affect the ride & handling in a major way. I know on longer RVs its OK, but has anyone done this to a 36 footer?
I think without a tag you will be overweight but I looked at doing it on my 36 320 so the en was heavier.
Recommend you get your coach weighed - see how much weight you presently have on the rear axel. Adding that extra load (cantilevered out the back) might put you over the rear axel GAWR.
Swapping to a lighter towd would help reduce your GCW (combined weight). If you plan to travel in the mountains, your coach would thank you.
We carried a Golding on our 97 U295 on an Overbilt lift with no noticeable change in handling. Our toad at the time was a Suburban.
Idaho tote would reduce the weight on hitch considerably. It's not just weight, but the momentum arm of that weight as you bounce down the road. The tote has swivel wheels and provisions for hitch for tow bar. Freedom Hauler is a successor product with different steer system. Another option.
Being a biker I have also considered this.
My bike alone weighs about 800 lbs.
Tongue weight is 1000 lbs.
not sure how much a lift weighs but maybe too close to 1000 total.
You might give ForeTravel a call about doing that. I would think the level system would compensate by adding more pressure to the rear bags for an additional 1000 Lbs, and keep the coach level. That what it does on air ride semi.
Bruce,
The air bags would keep it level, but the weight would still be added to the rear axle.
This is in kilograms, but should work in lbs.
How to calculate your motorhome's safe weight limits - Caravan Guard (https://www.caravanguard.co.uk/news/how-to-calculate-your-motorhome%E2%80%99s-safe-weight-limits-4104/)
You will be surprised how much weight is added to the rear axle, when the added load is way behind it.
Never looked into motorcycle lifts. Don't most of them require extra "outboard" receivers to be welded to the rear frame member? Surely they don't put all that additional weight and twisting force on just the one central OEM receiver. :o
Of course, extra receivers would still not change how much weight is added to the rear axel.
Total of three receivers on most I have seen. Cost me $1,100 welding to add.
Never bought the motorcycle lift. Long story...
Tim Fiedler
Gen-Pro.biz
630 240-9139
Thank you for all your input. I have not got the 36 footer yet, still looking. That size can navigate to our RV parking space in our yard. That is why I am looking at it more than a 38 with tandem axles. Plus I am concerned about the extra weight and complexity. We just sold our smaller motorhome which we had for 17 years. We hope to buy our final motorhome which we intend to travel in all summer starting in 2022. I was hoping to travel with the bike on a lift and car on a tow-bar for portability. I am also considering if an enclosed car-trailer would be better or not. I am concerned about the availability of trailer storage at campgrounds. We enjoyed RVing out west and staying at state and federal parks. We tend to boondock and camp in the wilderness, rather than staying at RV resortes. We have really enjoyed camping in Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Redwoods, Bodie ghost town, by the ocean, and countless other little spots that are hard to get to in a big rig. So that is where I am coming from, and hoping to do more of. With that in mind I appreciate any advice anyone has in buying the right RV and setting it up for towing the car and bike. Thanks for your advice and insights. ^.^d
Remember the tow rating on the older U models is 10k pounds. The newer nimbus and Phenix are higher.
You might consider getting a truck that can be towed and put the bike on it. You could stay under the 10,000 lb tow rating that way. And no issue on axle weight that way.
Keep in mind not to block any airflow if it is a rear engine. Even if the air goes in from the side it goes out the back.
Seems a great idea. But boy howdy is that thing expensive. 8 footer is $10K. Oof Duh!
A 15' wide body tandem axle cargo trailer with drop ramp has worked well for us. It's the same width as the coach, so when dodging potholes, the trailer misses em too. Was carrying a street legal high performance side by side, along with a KTM 1290 Super Adventure loaded through side door toward nose. Couple bicycles. Spare gear. You can back it up, unlike a toad. Everything stays out of sight, locked up and clean. Workshop with some privacy when vehicles are unloaded. Tows amazingly well behind our 300 hp 295 as you've already punched a hole in the air and the close coupled trailer of similar shape is in the slipstream. It's got brakes as standard, so no aux braking system gyrations. Can drop the whole lot in a storage yard without much concern.
If you like keeping a bike immaculate, carrying it on a lift is going to be frustrating. Putting a cover on it is probably going to abrade some paint. Engine access is complicated. Tail lights possibly obscured on coach. For a 650 class beater, sure. Road glide, probably not.
Probably as close as possible to ideal would be a short stacker trailer. Lotus 7 down below, aforementioned toys up top.
Chuck, I'm looking for a wide body 28' so I can haul a side by side and the Jeep Cherokee plus would allow for a workbench in the front. Just haven't found one within my pay grade!!!
Chris
Chris, pm sent.
I pull a 28' enclosed trailer. Its good for 10,400 max weight, pulls better than my f-350. I just watch the water temp on the hills and the mountains. Im guessing it weighs a little over 9,000lbs.
bonus if you boondock, an enclosed trailer has lots of roof real estate available for solar panels. And easily modified to tilt them when parked. Just need a bigger umbilical cord to run both roof a/c's without the genny while traveling.
This isxa pretty neat setup also for taking your toys..
https://www.bestpricetrailers.com/for-sale/MCtowdolly.aspx#.XR0ayjcpCdM
The Carrier and Lift Store – motorcycle trailers (http://www.ehamiltonenterprises.com/towdolly.html)
RV Tow Dolly | Haul your cars, trucks, Golf Carts, ATVs & motorcycles. (https://www.tandem-tow.com/Models.htm)
Thanks everyone for all the info and warnings. Craneman, your truck idea is a good one that I considered, but my wife did not want a truck. Actually we are selling our 2002 Envoy which we have towed and just ordered a 2019 Lincoln Nautilus with the V-6 so it can be towed 4 wheels down. My bike is a black Honda Fury, which I like to keep clean so a trailer may be the best bet.
That is an interesting Idea I had not thought of. Has anyone had any problems storing cartralors while camping. Not sure if some state campgrounds would have room for the trailer. I live in Florida but plan to spend our summers in the wild west. The trailer may be the best way to go, I'm just not sure yet. That why I appreciate anyone's tailoring experience both good and bad. Thanks.
Off-topic disussion moved to its own thread in Fire Ring
I think that you will find that you would be MUCH BETTER ADVISED to get a high quality trailer (they are out there but you have to look hard) designed to do the job. In addition, going with the trailer provides a LOT of additional benefits.
I would suggest that you invest in a 24' trailer (or longer, {if you won't spend a lot of time in California} as size does really matter.
I have been pulling a 24' 8.5' wide trailer which has an interior height of 7.5 feet. The trailer is rated for 12,000# with dual axles.
I pull it usually at its rated limit. I have been doing that for about 150,000 miles with no structural or operating problems.
I am a boondocker and spend a considerable amount of time in the western deserts and therefore a lot of time off paved roads, in the desert and National Forests, etc.. I have not yet been SKUNKED due to pulling the trailer. I have been places that most on this forum can not even imagine. I should write a book..
If you would like more info on this subject, message me with your phone number and we can discuss.
BTW, my trailer hitch weight is around 1600 pounds depending what and how I load. I do use torsion bars
Regards,
Here's a 30' Featherlite stacker trailer for $21,000
99 Newell for sale coach #528 (http://newellgurus.com/showthread.php?tid=5036)
Rickey,
Have you tried searching the Forum for "Trailer" or "Motorcycle Lifts"?
There is a wealth of information along these lines of questions, regarding both motorcycle lifts and trailer options/experiences. The following are just a few of my contributions that may be of use to you:
Towing enclosed car trailer (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=19122.msg133607#msg133607)
Cargo Trailers (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=14228.msg81989#msg81989)
Towing an Open Car Trailer (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=19136.msg133725#msg133725)
New Owners (http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=32214.msg287467#msg287467)
A lot of newbies and "trailer option analyzers" become paralyzed in imagining all sorts of trailer towing and site access problems. Over the course of 22 (+) years of Foretravelling, we have done it many different ways:
- large car Mercedes 420 SEL (in Trailer),
- large van (HONDA Odysseys - 4 of them, all wheels down as well as in trailer),
- HONDA Goldwings - 2 of them, in trailer, w/car
- Suzuki dual purpose, trail and street - 2 of them, same
- a BSA Lightning Rocket, same
- a Triumph Bonneville, same
Not everyone will be the same, but we find the trailer to be the easiest to use and the best in terms of practical, everyday use. Everything remains secure, there is minimal to no damage from the elements (I'm admittedly OCD about appearance and upkeep. The upkeep, on the road, of the coach plus trailer plus contents is easier with an enclosed trailer than with any other alternative). An enclosed trailer is easiest to maneuver and back up, easiest to use around small filling stations and the return on money spent remains the highest (meaning a good trailer retains high value and the enclosed vehicles remain pristine. A "bargain trailer" - not as much return on your investment, and there are a number of ways to get "stung" if you don't do your homework - see the referenced and other Foreforum threads that you can easily search for).
Last summer we travelled 10,150 miles, across 30 states, over 7 months and we unhooked the trailer only three times. Once for service at MOT on our way west, Once for new trailer tires in Eagle Nest, NM (four year old tires - zipper failure started in sidewall - not unusual for trailer tires - tires are the achilles heal of trailers), and once at Extreme for some end cap repairs (2002, 2003 FT nemesis) and new carpet/flooring at Infinity in Nacogdoches TX, on our way east. We drove less than, or very occasionally up to, 300 miles per travel day, usually put up by 3:00 PM on travel days and seldom stayed less than three days in any one location, some locations as much as 2 to 3 weeks. We stayed in and around 11 national parks traveling from FL to stops in AL, TN, MO (Branson), AR, OK, TX, NM (Eagle Nest and Angel Fire), CO, UT (Salt Lake City), AZ (Lake Havasu City), CA, AZ, TX, AR, TN, VA, WV, MD, PA, CT, NH, CT, PA, VA, SC, GA and back to FL. In addition to the coach travel, we put on a little over,5,000 miles touring on the Goldwing over the 7 months.
So, a few decent apps on your computer and/or smartphone, a little calling ahead to determine availabilities, a few common sense skills with a GPS and it was no problem over a 7 (+) month, wonderful trip last summer. We've had similar experiences with a full summer in the Canadian Maritimes and a full summer's tour of the Great Lakes, IL, WI, the UP, MI, Toronto and upstate NY.
We don't like having to make schedules, deadlines and much prefer wandering from Point of Interest (POI) to POI, with the good weather, rather than having to plan everything out to the Nth degree and then worry it to death. After two mid-April weeks in Branson and making our return trip appointments in Nac., we were headed for Puget Sound, but fire-driven, poor-air-quality turned us back southwest in Salt Lake City. We spent the summer in the National Parks instead. We wanted to be in NH for a late September wedding. Those were our summer constraints. There were lots of nay sayers with tales of lack of reservations and small accommodations, but our only upsets were an I-40 E, pot-hole-driven, cracked windshield in Memphis and an I-40 E, adjacent lane, oversized load, truck tire explosion that drove a large GATOR under the front of our coach and broke a generator exhaust weld. We had no campground or boondocking problems at all.
Rickey,
You know better, I'm sure, but a 30' Stacker would be way more than a 36' FT would be happy with. A 36' coach requires careful homework to minimize wasted trailer weight (height, insulation, interior panelling, cabinets, aluminum vs. steel, eye candy accessories like cargo lifts, etc.) and finding a trailer that maximizes your cargo carrying capacity (just big enough but no larger than necessary to carry the intended vehicles). Like Jon says: put wise money into a high quality (all aluminum) trailer with the highest rated axles, brakes and tires that well exceed any anticipated cargo that you might envision. Doing less than that "sets you up" with safety risks and a boatload of unpleasant frustrations.
HTH,
Neal
Two major issues pushed us to sell our 21' stacker at a $10K loss. The first was the anxiety over low overpasses in the eastern U.S.(not a concern with a one level trailer. The second item was tiedowns. They were a continuing adventure. The car moved two different times causing damage to both the front and rear. The motorcycle came lose two different times, causing damage as well. When specifying a trailer, pay attention to their locations and strength, as well as your ability to install the tiedowns and check them. I wish I'd had cameras mounted in both levels of my stacker. They would perhaps have saved me some money.
Brett,
From my experience, you are not the first to have tiedown problems.
I would be curious to know more about your problems and what the height of your stacker was.
I've addressed this topic before, but I grew up around heavy equipment and one of the things that I had drilled into my head as a teenager was to never try to tie down sprung weight. Equally important, always try to use tiedown gear where the breaking strength of each individual "link" equals at least twice the total weight of the tied-down component.
So, I only considered trailers that had swivel, "D" rings, 10,000 lbs breaking strength (6,000 lbs working strength) tiedown rating or more, that were through-bolted to frame members and backing plates. I used the same criteria for those that I have added.
All of my car straps are rated at 15,000 lbs or more breaking strength and all my motorcycle straps are rated at 6,000 lbs or more breaking strength.
I have also never trailered any load tied down by attaching to the frame of the vehicle. In other words, I tie down each of the wheels/tires and let the car (or motorcycle) weight ride on their own suspensions. That's easy to do with the car by just using (4), 3" sewn loop straps, looped through the wheel spokes, ratcheting to four swiveling "D" rings.
The motorcycle is a bit more complicated. It gets driven into a CONDOR ride-in chock, the front wheel/tire is then loop-tied to the CONDOR chock vertical member, the rear wheel/tire is ratchet-loop-tied to the same two "D" rings that the front of the car is tied down to. I then just lightly secure the bike upright with two steadying tiedown straps, letting the Goldwing's 900 lbs move up and down on its own suspension. I used to snug the whole Goldwing down more but found that I was causing front fork seal weeps by keeping the forks compressed.
I've been doing this for thirteen years now and never (knock on wood) had any problems with breakage or movement. We did have trouble with all four of our HONDA Odysseys, but due to an unrelated phenomenon. The front wheel bearings would "Brinell Harden" from the trailering (bearing sitting on one spot and that spot becoming work hardened from the constant constraint). None of the other trailered vehicles have shown any idiosyncrasies.
HTH someone — don't try to tie down sprung weight and don't skimp (you must tie down every wheel/tire, or the vehicle weight will shift, guaranteed).
Neal
Neal,
I probably made most of the mistakes you reference. Instead of swiveling D-rings I had E track installed on the lower level for the car. I used J hooks into the frame holes in my SSR designed for towing, but that is tying down sprung weight. I then tried straps that wrapped around all 4 tires but even they would slip off tires. For the bike on the upper level I used a chock as well and its bolts loosen even with thread locker. I used heavy straps at the triple clamp as the manufacturer recommended and had them bounce out of the D rings until I used plastic ties on each hook.
The stacker was 13' 3" high and I had to regularly tighten loosened hardware.
In the end the kicker was just getting tired of lying on my belly rigging, tightening and checking tiedowns. If I were to do it again(which I won't) I would buy a trailer with external fenders and wide side doors on both sides to provide access to tiedowns.
Bikes require a brace between the front tire and the fender.
I can't visualize what you're recommending.
My neighbor a couple of years ago, in New Mexico, after hold down strap(s) broke !
Can you mount it up front? Adds weight to the nose of your rig-will not block any air to the engine. Leaves the rear open to tow your car/trailer.
Maybe check with this guy for tips on properly securing a load on a trailer. His hitching and driving, maybe not.
Just rereading all your post & wanted to thank everyone for their advice. I will be looking for a used high quality aluminum trailer between 20 & 24 feet with an extended hitch. ^.^d