Ok. Bought 8 new bags, 3 new ride height complete valve kits and a rebuilt air pressure regulator. Going to have my repair shop do it. These guys have never done a FT. I purchased 8 Harbor freight 12 inch receivers to make it safe when I work under it. When they let it down on my blocks, can they still get the bags out once they dump the air with the 12 inch blocks in place? Should I just let them figure out a way or suggest they use these? Any order of replacement? When they go to adjust the valves to 8.5 inches on the bags at ride height, the blocks can't be in so what is a safe way to get under it? I read where the rear valves need adjusted first then the front one. Also use DOT teflon paste on all the air connections?
Any suggestions would be appreciated to help them get it right
Thanks
The rears can be done from the outside. Drive up on blocks to do the front.
Dan it's a lot easier to pull wheels to change bags. More room. Also a great time to do brake caliper slide pin cleaning and inspection. Possibly add helper springs to calipers at that same time if they haven't been done. IMO
Scott
As Dan said, it is way easier to pull the wheels and the job will go faster including pulling and replacing the wheels.
If you do end up having them pull the wheels, I certainly agree about pulling and checking slide pins. Had a front wheel pulled to replace the seal, and they decided to pull the slide pin just in case after having visually inspected all of them. Significant pitting of that pin. Ended up having to replace all slide pins because of pitting and added helper springs just because. Pins are expensive, but you are saving some labor if wheels already off.
I've changed the bags on 2 coaches & it can be a much different experience on each individual coach. It's hard to generalize that one method or process is always better than another because the factory installation is different from one year to another, or from one coach to another. Many of the recommendations that I've seen would not have applied to my coach, and what worked best for my coach might not work for yours. I'm just saying, consider all of the advice but be aware that yours might be different and be prepared to adjust as needed.
Yes, good point bdale. Thanks
Ive got helper springs that need to be installed. Anything you or anyone else suggest to do at the same time as the helper spring install? Red tractor and Beau Reece both said my airbags and shocks are ok. My goal is to head to Alaska in summer of 2021 for a couple months.
OK, here are some photos of the air bag R&R on our coach. If you use an air/hydraulic jack to lift, there is no reason to remove the wheels as there is plenty of room to get the air bag in place and if the old bag is out and the plate clean, the new bag can be in place in 10 seconds without compressing it or anything. If the coach is not high enough, it becomes difficult and for no reason so get the up high. You will need to remove the fenders or make a special tool like I did for the four nuts with little working space. One of the other members one upped me with a tool like mine only with a ratchet box so it's much faster than mine. I did make a different safety stands as you can see. I would recommend starting the air fitting removal process before taking the bag off or you will have to find a vise or something to hold it. Use a tool that fits well on the brass fitting as you don't want to damage it. Vise Grips are a no-no. Loosen the fitting just a bit so you can easily take it off once the bag is out. I bought stainless nuts and washers as the new bags don't come with either. If you do decide to remove the rear wheels, make sure they are torqued correctly when you put them back on. So, with a 3/8" or 1/2' air impact and a couple of extensions, the 16 bottom nuts are no more than 5 seconds each to remove. The air stud nut is easy to remove leaving about 4 nuts (3/4" tool needed) that are difficult.
Pierce
Looks like two photos didn't load right.
The third photo in the first group is golden! I had thought about freeing the bag from the mounts, but not about getting it out of the cavity!
First photo in the second group. What is this used for?
Matt B
Thanks Matt! This photo didn't load correctly and I added (second photo) it to the second post. It shows the 20 ton air/hydraulic jack extended far enough to remove the bag. I adjust the safety stands a couple of times on the way up just to be safe. Both safety sands are used on each bag R&R.
I did one air bag after we bought the coach and had to put a knee on it to compress it, put the black vinyl cover back on the air stud so the bag could not expand, and lots of other things that made my blond hair turn grey (I wish). Air jack also makes changing tires a breeze for one person.
Putting the spare tire on: If you jack the coach until the tire is just slightly touching the ground, it's easy to work it back and forth until it's off. I try to raise the driver's side of the coach with the HWH so I can slide the spare out of the compartment and when it rotates at the edge of the compartment, the angle is easier to lift the high side and roll it into position.
Pierce
So if I understand...
The gray plate, thread and nut things are the safety stands. They would go between the frame and the axle carrier, parallel with the coach, to support the coach if the air jack were to fail.
Matt B
Your 1996 U295 can't be much different than my 96 U270 only special tool was a willing and able partner. All eight bags without removing tires or fenders, rear bags were easy less than 30 mins. each.
Was wondering, If after you take off the Bag air line, you connect another line with shutoff valve and pull a vacuum on it and shut off the valve. will the bag stay collapsed for easier removal.? Just a question 'cause I have never done that job....yet.
A valve in the line won't work as it won't go through the mounting plate. BUT I use a brake bleeding hand vacuum pump with the tapered nozzle just stuck in the end of the air bag inlet. When bag is compressed then the 1/4" hose will feed through the mounting plate and keep the bag compressed.
So in short Yes
Mike
As you can see in my photos, there is no advantage to compressing the air bag. Once the fasteners are off at each end and the plate cleaned off of all the dirt, the old bag is out and the new one in place in seconds. It's not even hard. The only way to make the switch hard is to make the mistake of not raising the coach high enough. The point I'm making is that you can see with fully expanded bag in place, there are several inches above it so the clearance is huge.
Pierce
Tools
Looks like you ground down the 3/4" to clear the 2"x3". Nice.
Pierce
Actually the 3/4 clears. The 1 1/8 had to be thinned up on the end to clear tube. Also made a hat socket to go over air line fitting and use with 3/4 wrench. Makes it real easy
Scott
How about a photo of the "hat" socket? Picture is worth a thousand words. Are we talking about the small fitting the air line goes through or a socket to remove the brass fitting that goes into the hollow air supply stud in the air bag?
Thanks,
Pierce
Hopefully this is a more complete picture. Tape and die are 3/4-16. Not needed but there in no need for a friction lock on the big nut.. I put a drop of thread lock on it. Big size is 1 1/8 with end clearanced. Breaker bar make it work better than a ratchet.
Scott
I like the white tool for the air fitting. Good shot of all of them.
Pierce
Thanks, I'm just lazy
Scott
FYI
Not all bags are created equal. Some don't allow the coach raise to max. Not sure which ones. I would do the research if replacing with another brand.
The CONTITECH are fine
Chris
I have good years and have found that I'm unable to get 12" safety blocks between the frames. I come up about a 1/2" shy.
On a somewhat related note, I have found the overnight leak that I have. When I raised the coach up completely it became very evident, you could hear it from a few feet away. It is the bag that sits in front of the rear passenger tire. Can anyone with an 01 confirm whether or not the tire needs to come off to replace this? I'm wondering if it's something I should attempt to do here in Q or just take to a shop.
Same question here.
I did mine without taking the tire off. Might want to PM Scott (DSD). He made some tools that simplified air spring replacement.
Scott's Post (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=40196.msg404334#msg404334)
I just removed all the screws from the rear fender cover and pulled the bottom out enough to reach up and get to the forward upper fastener...came out with no problem with the tire still on...
You could use a smaller bottle jack to get the extra height to get your 12" safety stand in, there's plenty of room to work with..
The back end comes up much more slowly the than the front. I had trouble getting the rear safety blocks in too until I read this suggestion by somebody: sorry do not remember who, so cannot offer credit.
Start by letting the air tanks fill. I like to use high idle so the compressor fills the tanks faster.....I forget the exact button , but I think you push the cruise set button twice, or you can manually rev it up some.
With the air tanks full, push and hold the raise button and watch your air pressure gauges. Pressure will drop pretty quickly.
Once the tanks pressure start rising again and gets above 90ish PSI, coach will be at max height.
Turn off the HWH using the off button so it does not return to travel height and hustle back there and put in the safety stand....unless you have a helper that can do it for you.
If you use a HF air/hydraulic jack, you can get way more room than you need to take any airbag off and on and put in any safety stand/block. Zero need to remove any wheels. Raising the coach with HWH air makes it 10x harder.
Pierce
Here is the clearance you should have with the air bag in place.
Pierce
You do not need to remove tires , but slide pin service will need to be performed some time. More room with them removed. No skins fenders need to be removed. Front tire can be turned so as to allow changing half the bags then rotated the other direction to change the other two. Rear one are not a problem. Tools are loaned out currently but expect them to be finished with them any time. (I'm not rushing return) could be shipped to you directly if you need them.
Scott
Thank you for the offer to share the tools. I may take you up on that later on when the rest of the bags go. I'm currently in Q and need to get back on the road so I'm going to limp over to AGM and have an appointment in Yuma to have it replaced next Wednesday. They're pretty darn new looking so I'm just going to replace the one. Because of where the leak is, Keith Risch thinks it failed internally so hopefully it's just a one-off deal.
I had MOT do a brake service and put all new slide pins and helper springs in before I picked it up a couple months ago. I don't like taking chances with brakes so I just bit the bullet right off the bat. Glad I did too, they were pretty corroded so it was just a matter of time.
I am not following how you got such clearance. To me, this picture looks like the new airbag is sitting on the tire ready for install. The next shows crazy clearance. Instead of a safety block did you actually slide a jack in there and jack it up?
The safety blocks is lots of room.
I'm getting close ....right rear todo this week
Yes, I use a HF air/hydraulic jack to get the the clearance. If one airbag has a major leak, you may not be able to raise it al all. I made a couple of adjustable safety devices. Coach air to the jack will raise the coach WAY up and make the job easy and safe. The adapter is only held in place with the ViceGrip until the jack comes up and then it locks itself in place. The jack adapter is to make sure the jack can't slip off. In the finished product, I trimmed the adapter center part so all of the jack and spring would fit without interference Here are the photos.
Pierce
Impressive! thank you for sharing!
You are welcome. Anything to make it easy and safe. The first bag I changed was much harder. I had to compress the bag on the ground with my knee, put the black vinyl cap back on the air fitting and then put it in place before air got around the cap.
The HF air/hydraulic jack is the key but when you look underneath, you realize you need somewhere secure to use as a lifting point or risk an accident. I bought two 20 ton jacks on sale at HF by combining coupons so was only about $60 each. They can be used without air also but it's slow. The air hose is cheap and you only need a 25 footer or a dispenser like I have. Also reasonable if on sale. The hose on the reel is junk so I replaced it with a poly hose. If you have a welder and a 64 1/2" band saw, you are home free. Otherwise, find a friend or machine shop.
Besides the jack, the two other things that make it go fast are the little tool Scott made to remove the brass air fitting on the top of the bag. The next thing is the little ratchet tool to take the hidden 3/4" or 19mm nut off. If you clean the dirt/stones off the top plate, it make putting the nuts on easy. The bags don't come with nuts so I purchased stainless nuts and washers. I used my 18 volt 1/4" impact to adjust the safety tools. They go between the 2x3" rectangular tubing and I use two on each bag installation. Although you can't see it in my photo, the tire remains on the ground the entire time while I change the bag.
The only item not pictured in either my photos or Scott's is an air impact. Either 1/2" or 3/8" works well in removing the bottom nuts in about 5 seconds each. Coach air can be used here also. Another option would be a HF 110V electric impact. They are also inexpensive and in removing a wheel to change tires, I first loosen the lug nuts a turn and then the electric impact spins them off quickly. About $39 at HF, more for the HD model.
Naturally, a tire has to have a chock on the front and back of a tire. The air jack also has to be flat on a firm level surface.