Bulkhead issue for new owner:
He bought an RV with ,000 worth of damage. His warning to you... - RV Travel (https://www.rvtravel.com/20kdamage982/)
Article from Newsletter:
RV Travel Newsletter Issue 982 - RV Travel (https://bit.ly/38veYIR)
I spent $15000.00 before I even had mine home. Learned alot about Rv repair facilities and how they do business. The article is written well. States facts in a positive light. It is an issue that in all posts from fellow owners is mentioned as a pre buy must check!. I think its reference to both Forums is positive.
My opinion. Mark
Absolutely a good article describing the costs of a terrible design and implementation. You've got to do your homework before buying any coach and especially a Foretravel with the infamous bulkhead problem. As our coaches age, this problem will get only more widespread and severe. An aircraft manufacture would be on top of this from day one and would have contacted every owner years ago. This should have been on a recall list.
I feel so sorry for buyers with only a dream to guide them. So many people just listen to salespeople or read the glowing Craigslist ads believing all of it and wake up with a huge headache.
So, did the press exaggerate the cost? Only if you have been reading this forum and know who to contact and what to do. Otherwise, the majority will be at the mercy of shyster shops.
Pierce
Why did they put the bolt heads on the inside of the belly of the bulkhead? Last picture seems to show that.
Why wouldn't you deviate from a proven failure and just close weld the entire substructure and delete fasteners. And even more annoying why didn't they seal and paint to help prevent future issues. :headwall:
Scott
Gotta love Monday morning quarterbacking.
It's a very well built coach and not a problem unless you neglect your maintenance.
To quote an old Chinese proverb,
If "if" was a skiff, we'd all take a boat ride. Don't think it's Monday morning quarterbacking to point out all the bulkhead issues in the past, present and in the future. Yes, if you read the forum before you buy and while you own the coach you can minimize the problem but so many new owners go in blind and present owners don't because they sweep it under the carpet, don't care, don't have the resources, etc so it keeps on happening and will continue to happen in increasing numbers as the coaches age. Even if the coach is maintained, driving on treated roads in the winter will allow the chemicals to find other places to rust and corrode.
That's why I would never think about driving in the snow and keep our winter trips to the lower latitudes. People will always buy coaches from the salt states and not be aware of the potential problem. Cheap prices always attract buyers regardless of any faults.
Scott, that's what everyone is wondering. When new Fiat cars were starting to rust in a little over a year in Europe, they took a page out of the Porsche book and galvanized the body. Problem cured. So many things could have been done but were not. As you say, sealing and painting could have prevented this. What is being done today?
And in closing, how well built is it when no reinforcing structure was included in the front cap so the it flexes so much the windshields crack? I'm going to have to record all the creaks the coach makes when I turn off our driveway on to a parking area.
Pierce
Bob, our coaches are very well built even the frame design but the failure to project and correct the repeated bulkhead failures not so much. Had some of the bulkhead sub-assembly been hot dipped I think a lot of the problems could have been avoided.
FYI until a dozen or so years ago Texas was where I had to send anything over 6' to be hot dipped.
IMHO
And again we are back to why we purchased. If painted and properly sealed from the factory the cost would of been thousands more, but it would of not had bulkhead neglect issue to this degree. I have removed factory paint with a pressure washer and it is effortless when sandblasting in comparison to everything else I remove factory paint off of. So my personal complaint is from personal hands on comparison and repairs. My coach only had 53k miles when I picked it up but was neglected. Surface corrosion from damp storage. Your results may differ. I do plan to eventually use our coach in less than desirable conditions once stripped and sealed as it should of been originally IMO.
Scott
Just dropping this here
Underbelly detoriation on 2013 Mountainaire - iRV2 Forums (https://www.irv2.com/forums/f103/underbelly-detoriation-on-2013-mountainaire-520831.html)
Pierce,
Ours did the same thing, never cracked a windshield or popped one out but it sure did creak and squeak a lot. Have you tried sealing the underside of the dash to the front cap? While working on installing new cooling fans for the AC condenser, I noticed the very small gap,(crack) between the underside of the dash and the fiberglass of the front cap.
I used a tube of 3M 5200 to fill the seam after cleaning the area with a wire brush and mineral spirits, smoothed it down until it covered the joint about 1/2" on both sides. Let the coach sit for 24 hours and gave her a test drive, it made a very noticeable difference. Now there is very little squeak and no noticeable movement while turning off of the highway onto driveways or driving down the 1/4 mile long dirt road to our house.
We have been to Va. once and N.C. once this past summer and its still holding tight.
It always troubled me to see the movement in the windshield, just couldn't believe FT would let a coach leave the factory that way. I assume (careful with that word) that after 20 plus years of traveling across uneven terrain, that the bond between the dash and front cap finally gave up................
Maybe re-bonding it with fiberglass would have been a better fix? Well, if the 5200 lets go of its hold, I'll try the fiberglass next time.
[fixed quoting - Michelle]
These motor coach's are 20 years and older there are not to many vehicles out there if they are not look after that last 20 years. people look after there roofs with seal and washing and waxing but they don't look after the underbelly keep the wet bays dry look for leaking pipes and tanks. Washing the underbelly paint,under coat or store them properly in a vent place park them in the grass for months at a time. they are high end coach the manufacturer does not want them to last 20 to 50 years they like to sell coaches it's up to the owner to look after them your house wouldn't last 20 years or more without any up keeping and maintenance some people are luck they don't have to travel in bad road conditions but those that like to to go south in the winter for a few months try to plan to drive on dry days if possible but if you can't don't expect it to last without maintenance and wash after get out of bad condition if you didn't look after your car it won't last , lots of people don't keep there cars more than a few years so they don't have problems I to had bulkhead problems it was a $7000 dollar job and I did it myself now I keep a close eye on it and I seal it and paint it every fall and keep a good eye out for leaking water in the wet bay
I wonder why we don't hear of similar problems with Newell coaches as they are basically the same design, a bridge truss with an axle as each end ?
Are there as many of them that are old and around do they have a form like this form to talk about these thing I do think they should be aluminum frame but it would increase the cost of building them where do you draw the line it should be improved but like I said they won't you to buy newer ones every so many years so they can stay in Business.
Yes. A very friendly bunch who share (with us) many of the same mechanical challenges. Well worth a visit!
Newell Gurus (http://newellgurus.com)
Chuck,
Thanks for the link, not a surprise really though I'd never bother checking out Newell coaches other than admiring the odd old one. When I read about lower rust and cracks it made sense, makes me glad that I was already committed to finding an ORED when I went looking for a pusher. Always thought that they looked slick running down the road.
"Fortunately, not all RVs and coaches have inherent design or structural problems, but for those that do," the writer must not have had many RV's, some of them are so badly designed that the wood framing is deteriorating before the owner has used it for one season. Many brands have slide outs with cheap pulley systems that snap cables and rip the pulley wheels from the framing. Numerous larger class C's are over built for the chassis springs that start to bow after a few years. Travel trailers are no longer all built with Dexter axels and the imported axels and Chinese made tires are an accident or breakdown waiting to happen.
Our Foretravels may not be perfect, but they are a great machine, for a unit this old they have held up to a lot of time and wear, they have good systems that are repairable which is more than you can say about a new TV.
I am sorry the buyer got stuck with the bulkhead issue, research before buying is a must, glad that Chris steered him to a good repair facility.
While most generic RVs are poorly built, the writer was pointing out the major fault in a top tier motorhome. Most all coaches will have a number of weak spots, some minor and some major. I hope prospective buyers will take note of the deficiency and make sure they inspect for the problem before they buy. The same for existing Foretravel owners who may not be forum members. Buying a new commercial bus conversion is one way of minimizing but not eliminating problems but for quite a bit more money.
Pierce
[off-topic tariff commentary deleted as it is beyond the scope of the forum - Michelle]
Irish sums it up pretty well spot on imo.
20k for that repair is insane. I paid someone to do mine and it was a lot of work, lots of the basement floor structure torn out and replaced, done in less than a week with one fabricator and one helper. Total cost under 5k. I had to help them with a few of the issues (they didnt know how to pull things back together to re-bolt) so I showed up with chain and binders and we literaly went from the front to rear axle and pulled the RV back together. All in all using a heavy truck shop paid off big time, expert fabricators with a high volume low budget mentality saved me a lot of cash. Years later and a lot of miles everything is good.
Did my bulkhead for 7,000 Canadian with the fuel line it a big job but the cost is in labour it was bad like you said a weld and a helper a go fabrication shop can do the job with some Research you can do it in week or less you can have the frame on the ground in a day and rebuild what's damage in about a day then prime paint and reinstall
The culprit for the water intrusion is the fresh water tank overflow. Water runs straight down the backside of the rear bulkhead. It leaches in between the big angle iron and into the basement floor rear connection.
People think its salt spray etc. After I rebuilt mine I am fully confident it started from the fresh water overflow...Damn 20k maybe I should start a bulkhead rebuild service..I think I could do it for...$19 ,k :-*
We own a 1986 FEGas Grand Villa on a P 30 GM chassis. 33 SBI... are these bulkhead issues related to the Foretravel chassis and are not prevalent on NON FT chassis ?
Using the medium GM truck chassis and building a 33' coach on top... would this lead to other bulkhead issues related to the Cab area and or the rear past the axles ?
Bulkheads are not on any Foretravel "built on chassis" vehicles-- be they gas or diesel. Said another way it is only on "uni-body-construction"