So planning on ordering a new resonator.
My options are
Jones Turbine JT5050XL under 9 pounds
Amazon.com: Jones Turbine Muffler JT5050XL Resonated: Automotive (https://www.amazon.com/Jones-Turbine-Muffler-JT5050XL-Resonated/dp/B00IFV6Z3M/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Jt5050xl&qid=1621188918&sr=8-1)
MagnaFlow 12774 Exhaust Muffler 17.6 pounds
Amazon.com: MagnaFlow 12774 Exhaust Muffler: Automotive (https://www.amazon.com/MagnaFlow-Exhaust-Products-12774-Muffler/dp/B000XQO0ZM/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=MagnaFlow+12774&qid=1621189197&s=automotive&sr=1-1)
I prefer quite over obnoxious but granted won't be were I'll ever hear it myself. Any one else have some similar recommendation to compare?
Thanks Scott
You might find some other possibilities mentioned in the thread linked below:
Current resonator opinions (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=37235)
I actually got a lot of info from that post. Search function is well used by me usually. I'm leaning towards the heavier magnaflow. Lighter always seem tinnier sounding elsewhere. I just don't want to do it twice.
Scott
A resonator may be the only replacement option. I have yet to hear one that is not loud. Many anecdotal stories of performance improvement but no quantifiable evidence. Maybe a cooler bedroom. Hold off as long as possible or go for as quiet as possible.
Well I was hoping to see a improvement on fuel economy. Roger you bring up a good point, I've got 4500 miles planned in June. I may hold off to re-establish a baseline. I'm sure I've made a improvement in regards to the fan control circuit from failed at a 100% operation and 9.6 mpg at 75 mph. 10% would be 45 gallons of fuel about.
Scott
I feel no improvement in performance but it had good power before so no disappointment as I wasn't making the change for performance..Obvious reduced heat in bedroom probably as a result of less metal to hold heat plus a resonator and exaust on each side is easy to wrap.. By physics there should be some degree of lower EGT so another plus "probably" and finally it just plain sounds better imo with zero difference in exaust sound from the drivers seat. DWMYH I won't have another coach without a resonator.
Try following a coach with a resonator or watching (listening to) one drive into a campground in the evening.
The only way to quantify a performance improvement is under identical conditions, loads, speed, wind, route. Pretty rare that that will happen.
In 120,000 miles we are averaging about 8 mpg. We did 9.8 mpg driving pur coach back from CA after we bought it, more then 11 mpg from Denver to Hastings a few years later (nice tail wind) and better than 9 coming home from TX in April (another favorable wind) and better than 16 coming into Tucson. And less than 6 in a strong OK headwind. We generally travel at 65 or less.
Your 20% more mpg especially at 75 mph is a lot especially considering that aerodynamic drag increases by 1/3 going from 65 to 75 and aerodynamic drag accounts for about 1/2 the total energy consumption.
Keep on recording your data.
Do you recall which one you installed? Reducing Bedroom heat is actually quite hi on my list of wants
Scott
Roger I just calculated miles round trip and fuel used for miles. Fill up prior and ending fill up. Yes temps and all the other factors will vary, but 4500 miles should help round it out. Yes I'll attempt to slow down and save some fuel. Almost made it to Kingman AZ from our house last time before I gave in. Baby steps
Scott
I installed the Jones 5050xl on my last coach and the coach I currently have already has the same on it. The other one I considered was the aero turbine 5050xl. Looking at the web page for both they look identical just the Jones was about half price.. the only thing I noticed was the difference in the heat in the bedroom when we stop. Yes it is louder from outside but not noticeable from the drivers seat except for when your next to a concrete barricade or in a tunnel. If we get to a campground late I try to be as quiet as I can and not sit idling. Do I like it? Yes. Would I do it again? Yes.
Keith
Jones.. The reduced bedroom heat and mattress not as hot at the end of the day is a fact in my case. I've heard many enter and leave campgrounds with resonator Roger and it just doesn't last long enough to be an issue for me. It may bother others, I've never heard it mentioned.
Could use two resonators? Two in a row or two side by side (if you knew someone who is a handy guy with a welder, Scott). Twin 5" exhaust tips. Wouldn't that be cool.
Sounds like a hard pass. Too much work to route out the right side of the coach. Here's a picture of my last exhaust spark arrestor on the Bronco.
Scott
Recently installed the MagnaFlow and find the noise level about the same as the original muffler. Wish I had done it years ago.
Did a number notice more boost? Seems I recall some saw a bit, not know if matters.
Noise sensitivity of exhaust, outdoor music, tv, barking dogs, and motorcycles is in the ear of beholder. I hear some are sensitive to other activities of fellow campers.
We did not realize the exhaust noise might still be a problem as we do already avoid early morning warmups, maybe we try to arrive noon? We can try to be more selective too where park but no one has mentioned the noise as a problem, maybe they just being forgiving and we have been taking advantage of them.
we do really like the resonator reduction of coach room temps when we pull in to park from a day of 100+ degrees. That why we changed.
Mike, no increased ISM450 boost pressure, but throttle response is significantly improved. Most noticeable when cruise control is engaged...zero lag. No more puff of black smoke on takeoff either.
The increase in exhaust decibels aside, I've never had a complaint in 2+ years of running the Jones. Chipped 1/2 ton diesel pickups with the coffee can mufflers are 10 times louder.
The 40 pound weight savings are another big plus. But most of all....it's awesome to gun it in a tunnel or overpass with the driver's window down!!!
Not one single resonator regret....Woody.
This post is perfect for me as I need to repair my exhaust so it gives me lots to think about.
Woody, I do wish it is not offensive, am tempted to go back to muffler. Maybe just sell it, get trailer or nothing, or try to modify how/where we take it? Tbd. We go to one park know all, seems fine, i may check though.
I forgot, you are right, the response is noticeable. The temp reduction almost crucial to wife.
Gosh, converted it long ago...i think Dave Merzger told me too. Miss him, a help when we were new to RV.
His brother I recall told me to convert the step, great change plus MCD.
I used 178 gallons less in fuel on my cross country trip. I kept track of every gallon that went into the coach and the location. I used to add up the gallons and see the difference over20 years and three different coaches. Also I would get more boost from my turbo that I could see on the Silverleaf. It was noisier at full throttle outside but inside the coach I could not hear a change. My numbers also done with an average of 4 trips each way. I also it higher speeds on the same grade I would drive every trip. It was about 5 mph difference.
About two weeks ago, we were at a FT Rally in Vero Beach. Got the opportunity to compare the sound of my coach with the Jones XL5050 which I installed on my coach to Gary's coach with the Magnaflow. There were also several FT ISM's there with stock muffler cans...
Here's how I'd compare.. At idle, the noise level is "close", the JonesXL is definitely more "throaty, deeper", and more sound. Both are significantly loader than stock. When Gary exited the campground to the street and accelerated, not nearly as loud as me with the JonesXL! With the Jones, it's a healthy deep growl on acceleration, like a heavy Fire Engine...
No one's ever complained to me... We are very mindful about trying real hard to only idle as we move through a campground... We do turn heads when we come in... Might just be because we're a coach that many don't see often?
Have not compared mileage, boost, etc. I will tell you that two benefits we see are: the bedroom is cooler and the transmission no longer hunts and shifts between 6th and 5th gear when using cruise control on small hills. Oh, you can service the start batteries real easy now, and I think I'll build a tool crib back there for my tool boxes, lots of room,
Would I do it again- yes. Which one would I use- Magnaflow. Make sure you install a curved exhaust tip, (our stock one was straight) and don't point it towards the ground. The velocity from these resonators is greatly enhanced! You run the risk of melting paint on your toad with the straight tip...
Best Jeff
My coach already had a resonator installed and to be honest I don't know which one it is so can't help there. People have commented on how throaty and loud mind sounds. I like it. I noticed a definite difference between a stock model and mine in terms of sound.
And while saving some fuel would be nice I don't count that, I just don't have the time to track it that well. Some people are detail oriented I'm not.
I was hoping to see a savings of 45 gallons in 4500 miles. Not concerned of boost as much as temps and efficiency within time restraints. Performance and efficiencies can go hand in hand. Which resonator did you install?
Note; My muffler is in pretty good condition and with less than 55k miles. Slight surface corrosion at welds. I'll hold on to it for awhile and if we are happy with new it will be available to some one before I toss
Scott
The weight loss and the cooler bedroom are enough for me. If there is a performance gain or mileage improvement I have no idea as I didn't have a baseline to compare to. But I definitely would do it again just sooner.
Thanks for the input. Much appreciated
Scott
Scott, not trying to change this thread, but if you really want to cool down the bedroom....
I also did the Dynamat insulation. I removed the stock heat blanket, fully lined everything with Dynamat, then put the stock blankets back on. On the inside, I removed all the carpet and black mat, lined the entire bedroom floor and bed pedestal with the Dynamat, then put in new pad and carpet.
The difference is noise is really good, but the heat difference is amazing. We get no noticeable heat from the engine compartment any more. Glad we did it.
The above is from a different thread.
Mark I had previously added extra insulation when I removed the carpet and installed vinyl planking. Added a inch to the inside of the coach and a inch under the mattress. I will eventually work my way into the engine compartment but not till the end of summer. Took off today June ,July, August. Yes more insulation is always a plus in my world. Just can't catch every ball since I purchase our coach. So much to do! So I ordered a 30" magnaflow XL. It will arrive on the 20th so will start that project then and hopefully will have other projects completed. We depart near June 1st when DW is out of school. Fourdaysoff Jim has some extra 5" bends and should be able to salvage enough to do a decent install.
Scott
Scott will the 30 inch muffler be quit a bit quieter than the 20 inch muffler.
Peter
Actually laughed out loud. I have no clue, but it's 50% larger. I have between the current muffler and the Crome tailpipe 40+" so there is enough room possibly with a small off set in the rear. Will know more once it's in my hand. Was really trying to hold off doing it but twice across the states is being incentive to get it done. I like the price of the Jones xl but I've kinda learned over the years you get what you pay for. It's also double the weight, maybe it will last longer?
Scott
Scott, am anxious to hear your results. I would change out the "barrel" in a heartbeat if I knew I could find something to stay relatively quiet. I have been in parks when rigs with the resonators have pulled out and they are for sure noticeable. I want the extra performance but not the extra noise even if I can't hear it from the drivers seat.
Safe travels and good luck on your trip !
Just order a 30 inch Magnafow this morning.
Sho
Should of waited couple of days till I figure out how much of a pain it will be
Scott
So got home and box was on porch. Beat up a bit. One small ding in the side of the muffler and a end flange bent, but fixable. I look inside and to my surprise my 5 inch muffler is necked down to 4 inches for the length of the muffler then back up to 5 to exit. Thought I had bought a five inch muffler. Not what I thought I had purchased at all. Does anyone who purchased the Jones know what the inside pass threw diameter is? Curious if it is necked down also. It certainly will make it quieter but concerned about the additional back pressure.this is a 35% restriction.
Scott
Hey Scott, just as an FYI, in my former life I did a bit of work with high performance diesels in the pickup market. We were able to make 800+rwhp through 4" exhaust, so I doubt it's going to cost you power.
Scott does it look as some of the exhaust gas could go around the center of the muffler. I think I read something about that.
I warned about this fact in two previous "resonator" threads, but I guess you didn't get the memo. Sorry about that.
Resonator (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=40135.msg397118#msg397118) (Reply #2)
Current resonator opinions (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=37235.msg357224#msg357224) (Reply #36)
I agree with Keith (above). Try measuring the O.D. of your exhaust pipe where it exits the turbo. If it is 4" then the 4" core on the Magnaflow won't matter.
Okay I agree that it is equal or bigger than the turbo restrictions itself. I also know the convergent and divergent cones will dynamically change the airflow speeds and disrupt noise transmission making it quieter. I'm also confident that it will flow better than the current muffler. I also know it is in my possession and the Jones XL arrival will happen when I'm in Michigan, thus being worthless to me for this trip. It's going on next couple of days. Chuck yes you made clear representation of what I discovered. Seems like I've been too busy chopping, no time to sharpen my axe. :facepalm: Peter this picture makes it look tapered , it is a straight 4 inch inside. Keith thanks for the help. Couple weeks it will all be behind me.
Scott
Thanks for the picture, I see what I will be getting.
So in researching Keith seems to be correct. The temperature post the turbo has had a lot of energy extracted mechanically and is rapidly cooling. In cooling it is shrinking and you could actually have a convergent cone all the way to exit point and still have the same flow resistance. Still rapping my head about all of it and pushing forward with install. I'm sure I'm my own worst enemy. Also was told at he same time that a EGT would be beneficial on the long pulls pre turbo to help self regulate right foot issues. Higher rpm, lower power setting will help. Never ending
Scott
Scott, pre-turbo vs post-turbo EGT can vary dramatically. When we used to test this, we could see from nothing (at low boost/drive pressures) to as much as 400*F temp differences. This is why my EGT thermocouple is in the exhaust manifold...where the quick transient heat measurement will be...between the engine and the cork (turbo). The higher the drive to boost pressure ratio, the larger the difference in EGT measurements generally.
Started/finished install today of the 30 inch magnaflow. Needed the one 90 deg tube I got form fourdaysoff Jim (Thank You) and reused everything else I needed. So I did not touch the flex pipe and was able to pull the 45deg tube out of the muffler. Installed the 45 to the new 90 on opposing ends. 45 goes into flex. Cleaned the tailpipe and rotated in counterclockwise so as exhaust does not blow up dust in driveway any more. The resonator was not designed for clamps to I welded it to the tubes. FYI the old exhaust is quite heavy. I used a floor jack and a block of wood. Once on the ground it was a pain just to drag out. Actually used my forklift once out to put on work bench so I could fight with the pipes and removed, however I didn't use the in the end. Built a new mount out of 2" 1/4 strap and utilized the original rearward mount. Also added a four inch section to the end for the original tailpipe and put a little offset to help cleat the condenser. Will roll a stainless heat shield hand attach in the future.. sound acceptable to me so far. Anyone need/want a good stock muffler PM me and we'll make arrangements to get it to you.
Scott
DSD
You could try this??
Exhaust Pipe Heat Shield Insulation - Heatshield Products (https://www.heatshieldproducts.com/automotive/exhaust-heat-shield)
I could but I have at home about 200 lbs of stainless sheets. I'll just cut and roll one about the size of the resonator and make some standoffs and just hose clamp it on. Almost welded some nuts to the resonator for mounts. Would be relatively easy to remove and do that still. Will address when we get back from Michigan in a couple of weeks.
Scott
EGT should be measured as close to the exhaust port as possible. Best would be to have a probe in the exhaust manifold for each cylinder. All cylinders will not have the same EGT. This is exactly what is done in aircraft.
Photo shows the EGT for all 4 cylinders in our aircraft. Note that I'm 150 rpm over redline. 1343° F is the hottest cylinder. You can see #3 has the highest EGT while #2 has the highest cylinder head temperature.
Pierce
I'm comfortable just having the average going into turbo. On the list when I get back. Will be going on Interstate 70 thru Colorado and will keep the rpms up and power reduced till I can see what's going on. Use on my daily driver. Power back on the pulls and wait longer for temps to drop stopping for fuel typically.
Scott
Wish the price was less. Good looking stuff.
Scott
My Resonator arrived today, one day earlier than they said it would. Scott when I saw you welded in
extensions I wondered how you could get away welding with steel rod and now I know why, the end
pieces are steel so there is no sense using stainless pipe and elbows.
I thought about replacing but mine are like brand new. Next time for sure. Stainless welds to mild steel without issue.
Scott
I don't think it would make any sense using stainless pipe when the ends of the resonator are mild steel.
The stainless pipe won't corrode and will be much easier to remove from a steel fitting down the road. Stainless pipe probably has not gone up as much as steel products. I got sticker shock a couple of weeks ago for a length of .125 wall 1"x2" that normally costs me about $23 was $77. Most Euro cars today have all stainless exhaust systems including the exhaust manifolds. They last forever.
Pierce
Went out last night and terrorized my neighborhood. It is louder but I feel it is very acceptable in regards to noise. You can hear a little bit of turbo whin but all in all happy. I'll put a couple thousand miles on it next week so will have a better feel for it. No difference inside that I can tell driving. Peter mine was stainless and the rest of it mild steel. Welds will corrode first. Pierce The last steel I bought was crazy expensive but nothing like you mentioned. Glad I purchased all the shock tower steel before the price went crazy again.
Scott
Scott, I used the Jones 50/50XL and the only time I notice it is on a bridge with concrete sides and I am in passing lane
You will like it --mine seems to spool up a little faster but, it may just be my imagination!!!
Chris
I removed the old exhaust today and I am ever glad I have cutting torch.
Monday I will go out and buy a 90 and 45 degree elbow and some other
stuff.
IMO was quite surprised. Sprayed with Kroil for several days cold and everything came right off. Minimal corrosion and all clamps reusable. All pipe with a little persuasion came apart. I did cut the Crome tailpipe off four inches ahead of were it attacked then remove short section separately by collapsing the inner pipe. Never needed torch, but it was near by just in case.
Scott.
20 minutes with a angle grinder and a razor wheel and the monster muffler hit the floor!!
It's amazing the damage that can be done with one of these tools
Chris
Got it together today. I bought a stainless steel 45 degree elbow for the tail
pipe and I'm in the process of polishing it. It will outlast everything. It is top
quality stainless not like the muffler. I haven't locked the tail pipe in so I can
take it off to finish polishing it. Tomorrow I will repair the fiberglass as it is
broken at the bottom of the tail pipe.
Sorry I forgot the pictures in the last post
Oldguy,
Looks like a nice clean installation. Do you have another hanger between the resonator and the end of the tail pipe? If not, that tail pipe could move around quite a bit going down the road. Might have been the cause of your fiberglass damage around the exit hole?
I made up a tail pipe hanger using a turnbuckle. Allows adjustment of tail pipe position in exit hole. Later on (after photo was taken) I added a second turnbuckle at 90 degree angle for more precise control.
I reused the original rear hanger and was also concerned about triangulation but so far it has not moved from original set point. But my forward mount is triangulated and that may help. I did utilize the muffler rubber rear mount. Yours looks real nice. DW was unable to notice any decibel issues and although it is louder is seems more than acceptable to me. Note I do like silent running everything. Couldn't notice any performance improvements and my Bluefire computer says I'm getting 1583 mpg and have a range of 308,685 miles. I kinda think it might be off a bit. Just keeps reminding me to spend some money with Roger. BUT the bedroom it is noticeable cooler and that was my primary concern. We actually sleep in the bed two nights. Warm initially but too tired to care.
Scott
I don't think the pipe caused the brake in the bottom of the fiber glass. It is a break
not worn. I have just used the hanger where it was at the back and triangulation might
be a good idea.
Also you may want to drill a drain hole for water at the low point in the system. Jim.
This is how I got the stainless tail pipe that sticks out polished.
This the job finished.
I turned the tail pipe outward so it doesn't blow up as much dust. Made a noticeable difference in my unfinished driveway
Looks good. So how loud is the Jake brake with the resonator?
Scott
When I did my exhaust upgrade, I used two Jones' XLs inline. It was either one XL and a steel pipe to do the job, or two stainless steel XLs for $10 more to make the connections to the tailpiece. Of course, I have no comparisons about the sound. Too many grenades and mines, and later jet engines for me to hear properly anyway. So it all sounds good to me. Wish I had converted years ago, just for the cooler bedroom and access to other things in the area where the muffler used to be. And I will always thank my patient and practical youngest sister for wrapping the complete exhaust system and installing a turbo cover.
Coming up the hill east bound out of Albuquerque with some concrete wall on my side last Thursday and I could hear turbo whistle over the mellow bellow from the resonator, temp was near 100 so I was pulling about 2000 to 2100 rpm at about half throttle and in probably 4th gear all the way up with coolant temp at 190. There were a couple rigs on the shoulder that were probably trying to pull the hill flat on the floor.. little Cummins sounded sweet and was working very nicely for a small horse. The low tone noises of a rig pulling and working is worth every cent paid for the resonator for me.
That and a EGT gauge is all I had left to do to compleat my exhaust.
I was actually surprised that is wasn't that much louder IMO but I do have 40 years around planes. Never heard anything in the tunnels that were noticeable. Probably don't need the egt but I do enjoy seeing what's going on and do like seeing a compleat cool down before shutdown. Now to build some additional storage for parts and 🧰 tool box.
Scott
I bought the coach home this morning towing the Sidekick and 8 percent grade
4th gear in the traffic the Jake was almost holding so added a touch of retarder, 1st
stage. I kind of like the sound of the Jake and going down that grade I manually
shifted it down to 4th gear. I really like having the choice of how I use the Jake.
If I had to blow a hose I guess this was a good place. This is the first time towing
the toad with this coach. Don't even feel it.
Ouch! Get well. Even with eye patch your knowledge is still valuable to all!.
Mark
If possible. Turbo blanket part brand. I too have U270 with 8.3.
Mark
Towing a Sidekick with your U320 this is not surprising. Be like a gnat on a horse's back. :thumbsup:
What hose did you loose?
Scott
It was the hydraulic hose out of the pump, maybe a 1 inch hose, used a
11/4 wrench.