Foretravel Motorhome Forums => Foretravel Tech Talk => Topic started by: GleamB on August 29, 2021, 08:59:39 pm
Title: A/C recommendations
Post by: GleamB on August 29, 2021, 08:59:39 pm
I fired up the coach yesterday, and ran the AH. Then I started up the generator and fired up the A/C's. I was happy to hear them start up, but was dismayed that the front unit was blowing "hot air." These are the original units. I was interested in replacing them with the company that got bought up by Dometic, then put out of business. I should have not waited. Oh well.... I have two questions: Can the front unit be recharged? Can I do it with the same stuff you buy at Auto Zone for the car? Can MOT fix them? or......... What is the best replacement units I should consider to replace BOTH units with? I think the choices are slim, but I wanted to toss this out to the forum to see if there is a consensus. Thanks
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Pamela & Mike on August 29, 2021, 09:30:58 pm
Glenn,
First off you stated that it was blowing "hot air" now are these heat pumps? If so you may just have a bad coil on the swap over valve. If this coil fails it defaults to heat on most units. The coil is a simple $10 fix.
Mike
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 29, 2021, 09:43:53 pm
Jeff did his with Furrion ACs. AC Renovations -Furrion Chill 15K (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=41105.0)
I replaced my OEM ACs with Furrions when I painted the roof. They were on sale at Camping World. Roof Coating, New Furrion ACs (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=42506.0)
I got the interior covers with LED lighting, a few bucks more than without, next time just for the LR AC. Get the internal control connection box that lets you use a single muti-zone (up to 4 zones) thermostat. Get the multi-zone thermostat. The internal temperature sensors can be relocated to the front of the LR and to the BR. Get one of the sensor relocation harnesses, mostly to get the sensor cover. Temperature Sensor Relocation Kit for Furrion® Chill A/C Units - Castle... (https://castlewinch.com/product/tsrk/) There is one in the BR already.
The multizone thermostat will control the AH as well.
The Furrions do not have heat strips or heat pumps. I did not consider that a problem, we never used the heat pumps anyway. They do have a separate motor for the fans and for the compressor. The fans run while the AC is on, three speeds or auto. There are several operating modes, sleep mode, automatic mode (AC or heat), timers, programs.
I added a touch-less on/off/dimmer for the driver's side map light to help with lighting the thermostat.
We had other FT folks over last weekend and they thought they were quieter than the Dometics, so do we.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Jack Lewis on August 29, 2021, 10:22:42 pm
This is worthwhile video to watch clear thru for anyone that has installed a Furrion unit or anyone contemplating that. https://youtu.be/UkJGwlJ3ioU
This a recent update from the same user/tech, on other mini split options. https://youtu.be/1g2EKArdokM
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: dsd on August 29, 2021, 11:24:47 pm
I fired up the coach yesterday, and ran the AH. Then I started up the generator and fired up the A/C's. I was happy to hear them start up, but was dismayed that the front unit was blowing "hot air." These are the original units. I was interested in replacing them with the company that got bought up by Dometic, then put out of business. I should have not waited. Oh well.... I have two questions: Can the front unit be recharged? Can I do it with the same stuff you buy at Auto Zone for the car? Can MOT fix them? or......... What is the best replacement units I should consider to replace BOTH units with? I think the choices are slim, but I wanted to toss this out to the forum to see if there is a consensus. Thanks
So I had service ports brazed into both units and charged. Ice cold. Last month front ac started blowing hot air. Replaced both capacitors and works great now. Roof air mystery (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=42733.msg428640#msg428640) Old trick I learned long ago. Replace capacitors every ten years. Prevents service calls to replace them. I just loaned out my replacement sent to a neighbor and got replacements yesterday. Definitely time to change for me. Scott https://www.supplyhouse.com/Hartland-Controls-CAP-20-10-440R-20-10-MFD-Round-Dual-Motor-Run-Capacitor-370-440V https://www.supplyhouse.com/MARS-11963-108-130-MFD-Round-Start-Capacitor-330V $4.70 each Scott
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Jason on August 29, 2021, 11:28:40 pm
When I was looking for a FT, there were two coaches we were considering- one had the original units and the other had almost new Dometic Penguin 2s. The one with the originals did work but wasn't as quick to cool or as cold as the Penguins. After a few weeks of having the FT, they have worked fantastic and will freeze you out, even here in Texas summer. I'm very pleased with them. They do have the heat strip but I haven't used that yet.
FWIW, I put on a new Dometic on my travel trailer 5 years ago and it was a step backwards from the original unit- it wasn't as cold, didn't work as well and was loud. I was not pleased with it. I had decided I wasn't going to use Dometic again, but my experience with the ones in the FT has changed my mind.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: bogeygolfer on August 30, 2021, 09:22:06 am
As stated above - my first thought was to check and/or replace your capacitor(s). That was the fix for me recently.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Jan & Richard on August 30, 2021, 09:34:26 am
As stated above - my first thought was to check and/or replace your capacitor(s). That was the fix for me recently.
Me also. Inexpensive and easy fix. Over time I have now replaced the capacitors on both air conditioners and the generator cooling fan motor.
Richard
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 30, 2021, 09:44:51 am
Glenn's AC units have a single motor. If it is blowing air the motor is running, so probably not a capacitor although replacing them at this age is not a bad idea.
His five button Dometic thermostat will not allow the two ACs to be running in different modes. They are both on AC, the rear is cold, front is not.
Maybe it is the valve that switches from heat pump to AC. A service call and repair might work but at what cost. In general, the average owner cannot recharge them and it would require modifications for someone else to do it.
He asked about replacing them. Perhaps the best choice at 21 yrs old. Total cost to replace both of mine was $1850 including shipping and renting a lift. I sold the two working (but noisy Dometics for $500). Nice upgrade for $1350 net. Nice to sell them rather than paying a recycling fee here.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Jeff & Sandy on August 30, 2021, 10:20:27 am
Glenn's AC units have a single motor. If it is blowing air the motor is running, so probably not a capacitor although replacing them at this age is not a bad idea.
His five button Dometic thermostat will not allow the two ACs to be running in different modes. They are both on AC, the rear is cold, front is not.
Maybe it is the valve that switches from heat pump to AC. A service call and repair might work but at what cost. In general, the average owner cannot recharge them and it would require modifications for someone else to do it.
He asked about replacing them. Perhaps the best choice at 21 yrs old. Total cost to replace both of mine was $1850 including shipping and renting a lift. I sold the two working (but noisy Dometics for $500). Nice upgrade for $1350 net. Nice to sell them rather than paying a recycling fee here.
I waited too long. The Furion's are now 1K.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: craneman on August 30, 2021, 10:23:03 am
The compressor capacitor is separate from the fan motor capacitor. One capacitor 2 functions or 2 separate capacitors.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: GleamB on August 30, 2021, 11:11:20 am
Real #1 mentions replacing coil. How do I identify it? where do I buy one? Most replys mention replacing capacitors. In a previous post I was told which ones and where to buy them. I will try and locate that post. Are they the sam thing? I also remember a warning to discharge the capacitors. I watched a few You Tube posts and they cross terminals with a screwdriver. Is this correct? This is new territory to me. I will also look into the Furrions, although it might be outside my pay scale to do it myself. Especially the t stats and wiring that Roger mentions. Thanks for all the input
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Yetch on August 30, 2021, 11:28:02 am
Two years ago I replaced both old penguins with Dometic Brisk Air 2's, mainly because of the price. Buyers remorse. The fan motor on one is acting up, and will fail soon, bearing failure. Apparently, this is a common problem with these units. Both units are much more noisy than the old penguins. I guess I got what I paid for; a cheaply constructed A/C. Mike
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Twig on August 30, 2021, 11:33:42 am
Real #1 mentions replacing coil. How do I identify it? where do I buy one? Most replys mention replacing capacitors. In a previous post I was told which ones and where to buy them. I will try and locate that post. Are they the sam thing? I also remember a warning to discharge the capacitors. I watched a few You Tube posts and they cross terminals with a screwdriver. Is this correct? This is new territory to me. I will also look into the Furrions, although it might be outside my pay scale to do it myself. Especially the t stats and wiring that Roger mentions. Thanks for all the input
There are a gazillion You Tubes on RV air conditioning. I think you should start there. You Tube is your friend.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Texhub on August 30, 2021, 12:16:15 pm
Remember folk. For a low fee.. you can use utube with out commercial hassle.
Just a community helpfulness hint.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 30, 2021, 02:18:23 pm
I will also look into the Furrions, although it might be outside my pay scale to do it myself. Especially the t stats and wiring that Roger mentions. Thanks for all the input
Glenn, these are pretty easy to hookup. 3 wires for 120v, 2 wires for 12v, 2 wires for heat, a 2 wire thermostat wire (stiffer solid copper wire) and one remote sensor extension kit ($39) or just get a Dometic sensor cover and paint it, ($19).
We can walk you through it. Hardest part was getting them on the roof, I rented a hand cranked material lift, made it easy.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Barry & Cindy on August 30, 2021, 02:48:29 pm
RE: For a low fee you can use YouTube without commercial hassle.
FYI
SmartTubeNext app is an ad-free YouTube application that seems to be working very well on Fire TV Stick and Android TV Box.
You don't need the tutorial if you have TROYPOINT App with Rapid App Installer as this app is included.
TROYPOINT App with Rapid App Installer (https://click.convertkit-mail.com/gku5l9g5pt5h8omp9h5/wnh2hghrogozm5a7/aHR0cHM6Ly90cm95cG9pbnQuY29tL3JhaQ==)
Title: Re: A/C recommendations - Capacitor Identification
Post by: WBates on August 30, 2021, 05:03:08 pm
If still interested in identifying your caps, this is what I did when replacing them. 1. With ALL coach AC power OFF, remove the rooftop AC cover and remove the metal cover plate opposite the compressor. Should have 2 to 4 sheet metal screws holding the sheet metal panel on to the enclosure. Photo below. 2. Once the panel cover is removed, look for two vertically mounted cylinders (one small and one a little bigger with wires connected on top). Photo below. 3. Before proceeding further, take a picture of the capacitor wiring connections and note capacitor top markings. Photo below. 4. I have discharged the capacitors by using a a glove and insulated screwdriver (just to be safe) but have found that if you leave all power disconnected for a few minutes, the capacitor is pretty much already discharged. Should you use a screwdriver just make sure you short across all leads on each cap. 5. Once you are comfortable that the capacitors are discharged and you have pictures of the wiring, you can disconnect the wires (needle nose plyers) on each cap. Tape each cap wires into there respective bundles and remove the caps. Once removed the capacitor MFD and identifying part numbers will be stamped on each capacitor. Notes: You can view the cap labeling without disconnecting cap wiring. If concerned about crossing the wiring when replacing, remove one cap at a time. (photos below). I ordered my caps off amazon. Caps of the same MFD and voltage labeling are equivalent regardless of brand.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Michelle on August 30, 2021, 05:59:21 pm
First off you stated that it was blowing "hot air" now are these heat pumps? If so you may just have a bad coil on the swap over valve. If this coil fails it defaults to heat on most units. The coil is a simple $10 fix.
Mike
I agree with Mike - if these are heatpumps and especially if they were last run on heat, it could just be the reversing valve coil.
The reversing valve basically reverses the flow of refrigerant, so that the same system can both heat and cool. The valves are known to go bad at times.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: GleamB on August 30, 2021, 08:56:47 pm
Very helpful, Walt I have a question regarding Furrion. When I priced them out on Amazon, there was an inert that said there was a newer version. The first was FACR 15SA-PS
The other was FACR15SA-PS-AM
Does ANYONE know what the difference is? Which is better? Thanks
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Beeman on August 30, 2021, 10:01:50 pm
Hi Glen, Not sure what the differences are with the model numbers. Did several searches, can't come up with anything concrete.
One suggestion, give etrailer.com a call. That's where I purchased the Furrion system I installed. The website still shows less price than Amazon. Their tech support answered many of my questions plus got me into contact with the Furrion Level 2 support for the deeper technical questions. They might be able to shed some light into the model differences you are seeing w/Amazon, if any.
Best, Jeff
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: hdff on August 31, 2021, 08:52:39 pm
I was at a rv repair shop the other day, a large shop that also has a mobile service too. The subject of air conditioners came up and I ask him about the Furrions. His reply was " I haven't seen their air conditioners yet but everything else I've seen that Furrion makes is junk", so I'm curious to see a long term review on them before I need some new ones. I know Dometics get a bad wrap but they have cooled a many of coaches.I hope to hear good reviews in the future from those that made the switch.
Keith
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: oldmattb on August 31, 2021, 10:01:20 pm
His reply was " I haven't seen their air conditioners yet but everything else I've seen that Furrion makes is junk", so I'm curious to see a long term review on them before I need some new ones.
I don't have an answer, but I have a question to add. Do the Furrions hold up well for continuous use?
I am considering new ACs for out coach - just started thinking about it. Our typical use is maybe 40 hours in a year. We travel mostly in cool weather. On the other hand, we have had a guest. The ACs ran 24 hours a day, with 105+ daytime highs for a solid month recently.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: craneman on August 31, 2021, 10:18:16 pm
I just swapped out a 13.5k Penguin II for a 15K Penguin II today, never had a problem with it. The PO replaced the originals with 13.5's before I bought the coach. Part of my project removing the Kool O Matic and installing a Fantastic Fan. One of the ones on the '81 gave up recently after 40 years of use. It had been running 24 hours a day for a couple of months. Unfortunately the one I removed from the '99 will not work on the '81 because of 12 volt and thermostat issues. So bought a stand alone Penguin for it.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 31, 2021, 10:35:39 pm
So this repair guy has no direct experience with Furrion ACs. Hard to take that as a serious evaluation. Lots of reviews going back a couple years. You have to take into account the reviewer on most.
So we had our old Dometic ACs for 20+ years and sold them for $500 when we took them off. Now we have 2 new Furrions, 2 motor, quieter AC units with significantly more control and more cooling capacity for about $1300 net.
Furrions have a 2 yr warranty, same as Dometic. We are hoping for a long service life, no reason not to.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on August 31, 2021, 10:37:22 pm
Gee, Craneman has a crane!
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: craneman on September 01, 2021, 12:22:12 am
Comes in handy sometimes for A/C's and PTL Engineering door seals. Other than that just sits in the yard.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 01, 2021, 10:26:44 am
Changing ACs is not an insignificant project. Lots of bucks to have someone else do it, time and effort if you do it yourself. And the cost of ACs covers a wide range. Do your homework, read reviews, talk to folks who have done the work and have experience using different ACs. Do you really need (or want) heat pumps or heat strips? The only hard part about doing it yourself is safely getting the ACs on the roof and the old ones off. Then choose and do.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: craneman on September 01, 2021, 10:58:15 am
Took less than one hour for me to change them out by myself., but I do have the crane advantage. The PTL door on my Monaco needed it too. The coach will get new door seals this winter. Taking pictures of the inside wiring and wiring up took most of my time.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: hdff on September 01, 2021, 03:38:31 pm
So this repair guy has no direct experience with Furrion ACs. Hard to take that as a serious evaluation. Lots of reviews going back a couple years. You have to take into account the reviewer on most.
So we had our old Dometic ACs for 20+ years and sold them for $500 when we took them off. Now we have 2 new Furrions, 2 motor, quieter AC units with significantly more control and more cooling capacity for about $1300 net.
Furrions have a 2 yr warranty, same as Dometic. We are hoping for a long service life, no reason not to.
I hope to hear all positive reviews on them in the future so when I need to replace mine I'll have another option. And I know Roger has all the details on how to get the job done. And now I know where there's a crane to get them up on the roof. Life is good!
Keith
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Chris m lang on September 01, 2021, 10:19:58 pm
Are the furrrions ducted or direct blow--I would like to keep the ducted system Chris
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Beeman on September 01, 2021, 10:51:34 pm
This is worthwhile video to watch clear thru for anyone that has installed a Furrion unit or anyone contemplating that. https://youtu.be/UkJGwlJ3ioU
This was a good video. I like Jared Gillis and his many RV videos. When I was searching for a replacement AC, this video helped, however opened many more questions for me...
My two cents- I initially wasn't impressed with the Furrion AC, based in part by the video. "Technical information" conversations with Furrion 1st level of support was sparse at best. It made me ask more questions and dig deeper. I had some feedback from a couple owners who "had Furrion AC's installed". In both cases after speaking to the owners, it was clear to me that the problem was not the Furrion product. In one case, a poor "professional install". Another install, simply bad product choice. So, when my front Dometic quit, and the rear was getting louder and more vibration, I had to make a move. My first choice was the easy-out, get two new Dometic Penquin's. Unfortunately, these were hard, if not impossible to get...
I finally got a hold of the correct person, (Engineer) at Furrion who answered all my questions and concerns. This person knew the Dometic's and explained the control differences between Dometic and Furrion. After hearing this, I knew these would retrofit easily to our Foretravels.
We've had both our AC's working hard now for almost 11 months. No issues, cools real nice, strong air velocity! Aquahot integration is very easy. We were plugged into 120v 15 amp plug for 2 months at one of our kids house, ran one AC every night using the Victron assist settings. Dialed back maximum amps to 13 amps, let the Victron borrow from the battery bank on startup. Works flawlessly.
We really like the DRY setting, especially this summer, as we've been in constant rainy weather.
As far as future features as Jarred spoke about. I believe there will be minimal field enhancements to the product, (heat pump, heat strips). Just my opinion...
The Furrion digital thermostat works well, not sure I'd ever down-grade to analog, but they provide the connections if you want to experiment. Running new wires might be a problem for us...
A couple of simple upgrades that Roger spoke of are easy and make the comfort levels much better. I like having the bedroom sensor! My only complaint is I wish the digital thermostat was back-lit. But Roger came up with a nice work-around there too.
Ii was hoping I could wait until a decent "Inverter Technology" rooftop AC was available here in the US, however I needed a replacements ASAP.
I'd recommend the 15.5k units, just my opinion.
Anyone need any questions if you are considering the product, just PM me, I'll share further details.
PS - Craneman's Crane would have been a great time saver! :P
Jeff
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Beeman on September 01, 2021, 10:52:52 pm
They are set up to work with duct systems.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: GleamB on September 05, 2021, 04:18:38 pm
I just read about GE a/c units. Although the heat pump isn't an issue to me, the 15k unit seems to come with one. What I find to be most interesting is that these are made by Haier, which is a name I have come across in the past, and are now part of GE. Not to stir the pot....but does anyone know about these units. They are being used on new production RV's. I want to consider all my options. Thanks
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 07, 2021, 09:28:55 am
Couple of points. The Vid guy talks about running the Furion from a 2000 watt inverter.. That could open up the possibility of driving with the gen set off , AC running. Mygen set uses .75 GPH. The net cost would not change much. But the propane would last longer . . I have 2 alternators and it would be easy to swap the outputs to the batteries, driving the house bats and the inverter from the large alternator . MY 2000 watt pure sign wave currently :) only drives my little resi fridge at 60 watts max and the computer/tv outlet.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Elliott on September 07, 2021, 10:08:10 am
That could open up the possibility of driving with the gen set off , AC running. Mygen set uses .75 GPH.
I am doing that with my old dometic and an Easy Start. So far it's the cat's meow.
Roof AC while driving, no generator. (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=43115.msg433503;topicseen#new)
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 07, 2021, 10:25:28 am
What's the Seer rating of your unit? Rough math says about 10 ? It would work so easy with a 19 seer FWIW my roof is 2.5 in thick and the Furrion calls for 3 or more . Wont fit with out some mods .
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Elliott on September 07, 2021, 12:46:32 pm
What's the Seer rating of your unit? Rough math says about 10 ?
I honestly don't know, I couldn't even find the model number on the front one (the rear one is newer). It's old and likely nearing end of life so I'm thankful you guys are doing all this investigation on the Furrions
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 07, 2021, 01:03:45 pm
Furrions needs a 3 in thick roof . Mine is 2.5
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: John44 on September 07, 2021, 04:34:05 pm
If possible wait and go to Quartzite,Furion and Dometic will be there,will have the latest and may even install.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Ralph on September 08, 2021, 07:00:25 pm
"Furrions needs a 3 in thick roof . Mine is 2.5"
The Furrions will work on the "thin roof" coaches, you just have to modify a couple of things. My roof is 2" and I had to cut 1" off the air divider that mounts to the mounting frame for proper fit. Also there is not room to run the 115VAC wiring in the top of the control box as designed, I ran mine in the side. Other than these two things (and the challenge of running thermostat and 12VDC wiring that didn't exist previously), I experienced no other problems.
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Ldillow on September 09, 2021, 10:16:08 am
Recpro has another option. I installed two and they come with wireless remote controllers. Coach has been in the shop since I had them installed, but they look like they will work great!
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 09, 2021, 12:43:43 pm
REcpro is 65 DB . and 2500$ for 12 V . Might be SEER 14-15 . Not noted on the spec sheet but "20000BTU compressor rating". Sounds suspect for me .
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 09, 2021, 12:45:01 pm
Recpro has another option. I installed two and they come with wireless remote controllers. Coach has been in the shop since I had them installed, but they look like they will work great!
I hope that you like them . Please tell more about them when you get some time on them, Thanks,MM
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Ldillow on September 09, 2021, 04:42:37 pm
I got the 15k heat pump version. 1200 each
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Protech Racing on September 09, 2021, 04:45:23 pm
What parts # ? voltage? Thanks. MM
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: TMPeace on July 09, 2024, 05:52:59 pm
I know this is an old post, but Mike do you happen to have a part number for the coil you mentioned. Mine is blowing hot air, like the heat pump is on, and I heard a chattering sound on our last trip at the coil you mentioned. Thanks, Tracy
Part number if anyone else needs is:
DOMETIC 3310714005 PENGUIN REVERSING VALVE SOLENOID COIL HARNESS They have gone up in price some.
as always THANKS to everyone on this Forum, Ya'll are AWESOME!!!!!
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: TMPeace on July 25, 2024, 11:46:52 pm
Forum to the rescue again!!!! ^.^d ^.^d $63.67 is much better than a total unit replacement. Thanks again to all who contribute and keep this great community running!! Tracy
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: red tractor on July 26, 2024, 08:15:50 pm
What was the part number?
Title: Re: A/C recommendations
Post by: Dennis H on July 27, 2024, 11:25:45 pm
I just read about GE a/c units. Although the heat pump isn't an issue to me, the 15k unit seems to come with one. What I find to be most interesting is that these are made by Haier, which is a name I have come across in the past, and are now part of GE. Not to stir the pot....but does anyone know about these units. They are being used on new production RV's. I want to consider all my options. Thanks
Actually Haier, a Chinese company, now one of the largest appliance manufacturers in the world, owns GE appliances.