Foretravel Motorhome Forums => Foretravel Tech Talk => Topic started by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 11:07:11 am
Title: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 11:07:11 am
All,
I apologize for yet another post on how to properly winterize.
1 - I have already emptied the grey and black tanks.
2 - I have opened the cold and hot water lines at the wet bay and also at the AH. I then turned on the pump to empty the fresh tank. No water came out of the hot line in the AH, so not sure if I should be doing something else for that.
3 - In the attached pictures, there is a second pump in the wet bay. What is that pump for?
4 - I do have a washer/drier combo. Not sure how to drain that one.
5 - I do have an ice maker in the Dometic.
6 - I have purchased 8 gallons of potable antifreeze.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Rudy on September 30, 2021, 11:12:03 am
It is imperative you run fresh water antifreeze through the Aqua Hot. You can not drain or blow the water out of the Aqua Hot fresh water loops.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 11:15:55 am
It is imperative you run fresh water antifreeze through the Aqua Hot. You can not drain or blow the water out of the Aqua Hot fresh water loops.
My plan was to disconnect the IN line from the water pump and submerge that into a container of the antifreeze. Then, I'll run the pump. For the AH, do I close the valves at the AH once I see pink antifreeze coming out of both hot and cold drain lines? Should I expect both of those lines to show the pink stuff?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: oldguy on September 30, 2021, 11:20:55 am
In the picture I see a pump and the thing behind the pump is the valve for filling your fresh water tank.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 11:25:40 am
In the picture I see a pump and the thing behind the pump is the valve for filling your fresh water tank.
Excellent. So should I just turn the manual valve that connects the water pump to that valve for the fresh water tank OFF? I'm assuming that there is no need to put pink fluid into fresh tank. Or should I put some pink fluid into fresh tank?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 12:31:02 pm
In the coach manual there is a page recommending tieing the hot and cold ports of the manifold together. It also shows the removal of a cap at the bottom of the hot water side of the manifold for pumping the antifreeze in.
Do you guys do it that way or just use the pump to get the antifreeze in?
I suppose I should still connect the hot and cold lines above the manifold?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Michelle on September 30, 2021, 12:48:56 pm
For the washer/dryer, while sucking in antifreeze at the fresh water pump, have someone start the washer/dryer on a cycle that involves warm, and watch for pink stuff to appear in the drum. Cancel the cycle and run the drain/spin one. Repeat. That will flush antifreeze through the fill and drain lines of the washer. Do this last since it takes the most antifreeze.
We usually did the following as our winterizing process (easiest with 2 people):
Open low point drains (including the one for the fresh tank), faucets. Extend fresh water hose fully. Let everything drain. Close all faucets and drains, don't put hose away yet. <--- Don't forget to close ALL or you'll be buying more antifreeze :-X
Using a 2-5 gallon bucket, open at least 5 bottles of antifreeze and have within reach, pour antifreeze into bucket. Start sucking pink stuff via water pump and replenish the bucket level as you go (easier than starting and stopping water pump to move to a new gallon container.
Starting with the wet bay faucet (because it's easy to see if you forgot to close an AquaHot drain if you are by its bay), run cold tap until pink comes out, close, the run hot until pink comes out and close.
Next go through every faucet in the coach, including shower, filtered water at sink, and cycle icemaker in fridge until pink appears in ice cube openings (use paper towels to check for this. Do both hot and cold until pink stuff comes out.
Flush toilet and use spray wand (if so equipped) until pink appears. Repeat, especially if you have a VacuFlush toilet.
Flush Splendide twice.
Turn off fresh water pump.
Pour any remaining antifreeze into fresh water hose and hold up to attempt to get antifreeze into rest of hose reel. If you have enough antifreeze you can turn on the fresh water fill valve and you might get a little antifreeze through it via the gravity fill from holding the hose up high.
We would typically then open all faucets and the fresh water tank drain and leave them open for the winter. We also removed the drain screw on the utility bay faucet. We did not re-dump the grey or black tanks since they should have decent freeze protection with the antifreeze that went into them.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 01:01:13 pm
For the fresh water tank, I see that I have a powered valve on a "T" with a connection to the manual drain valve. I wonder where the switch is to turn that valve on to drain the tank. For now, I have drained as much water as possible from the fresh water tank by turning the water pump on. But, doing it that way, I may not be able to drain the tank fully.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 01:21:00 pm
Wow, Michele. Thank you very much for the detailed explanation.
1 - My Splendide is not currently working. The controls turn on but its motor seems caput. It just won't turn. I was planning to fix it next year. Now, I wonder if there is another way of winterizing it in this case.
2 - So what do I need to do special for the AH. Should I treat it just like any other faucet? Cold line first, then hot until pink comes out. What is that instruction in the manual about opening the AH antifreeze port on top it supposed to do?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Jack Lewis on September 30, 2021, 02:53:32 pm
Cucotx, For Slendide information, parts and support call the distributor, Westland: 1-800-356-0766
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on September 30, 2021, 03:38:41 pm
I think I know the required steps to winterize. Now I need to find a hose to connect to the pump inlet to drop into a bucket full of rose wine.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Michelle on September 30, 2021, 06:47:22 pm
For the fresh water tank, I see that I have a powered valve on a "T" with a connection to the manual drain valve. I wonder where the switch is to turn that valve on to drain the tank. For now, I have drained as much water as possible from the fresh water tank by turning the water pump on. But, doing it that way, I may not be able to drain the tank fully.
That's your fresh tank level sensor. It's a pressure transducer, not a powered valve. You have identical ones behind the utility bay back wall for black and grey tanks.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Michelle on September 30, 2021, 06:53:09 pm
Wow, Michele. Thank you very much for the detailed explanation.
1 - My Splendide is not currently working. The controls turn on but its motor seems caput. It just won't turn. I was planning to fix it next year. Now, I wonder if there is another way of winterizing it in this case.
There are 2 fill valves, hot and cold, that you could shut off - look in the back of the cabinet above it, possibly accessible by removing a box built around them. You could turn them off then winterize everything else, but any water trapped in the fill hoses could freeze, split the fill hoses, then leak when things thaw back up. It's not a lot of water, but enough to damage plywood...
Of course you could shut those 2 valves, pull the washer out, disconnect the hoses from the machine, then drain them into a bucket. That would leave just the water that might be in the washer itself.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: oldguy on September 30, 2021, 07:34:42 pm
Here is a gizmo that you can instal before the pump to make sucking the pink antifreeze into the system easy. It came with the coach and I never installed it as use my coach all winter so I never winterize it and keep the coach heated.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on September 30, 2021, 07:54:59 pm
For the fresh water tank, I see that I have a powered valve on a "T" with a connection to the manual drain valve. I wonder where the switch is to turn that valve on to drain the tank. For now, I have drained as much water as possible from the fresh water tank by turning the water pump on. But, doing it that way, I may not be able to drain the tank fully.
You don't need to do this with an AquaHot, you do need to fill it with antifreeze as well as all of the other lines valves, faucets, shower, toilet, drain traps. Bypass the under sink filter and remove the filter and run pink stuff through the drinking water faucet.
If you are anywhere where freezing temperatures can occur while your coach is in storage you would spend $20 and an hour to winterize it. Assuming the power would be on to prevent a freeze up is risky, ask many in Texas last winter.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on October 01, 2021, 12:37:15 pm
A successful trip to Depot.
The inlet pipe to the water pump is 1/2" PEX. I cut it and put a 1/2" "T" inline with it. To the "T", I connected a 1/2" ball valve, which then connects to the existing coach plumbing. To the other side of the "T" I added a 1/2" PEX to 3/4" faucet male valve. A short water hose goes from the 3/4" connection to the 5 gallon bucket full of wine. See picture.
I turned the ball valve off to isolate that side of the coach's plumbing. It works great. I have used all 8 gallons of wine that I had. I need to buy some more to get the fresh water hose and reel done. I also need to see if I can do something for the Splendide, as per Michele's recommendations.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on October 01, 2021, 12:42:53 pm
Bypass the under sink filter and remove the filter and run pink stuff through the drinking water faucet.
I forgot that filter. I do plan to change it next year. Should I just let if fill up with the pink stuff and not bother to do more plumbing to bypass it?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: cucotx on October 01, 2021, 12:46:01 pm
You don't need to do this with an AquaHot, you do need to fill it with antifreeze
Roger, I see pink juice coming out of both the hot and cold drains for the AH. Is that all that I should do to protect it?
Also, I would like to exercise the diesel and AH at least once per month, as per Rudy's recommendation. Is it okay to run the furnace in the AH on diesel with the pink stuff in it?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Rudy on October 01, 2021, 04:29:17 pm
Run the burner for one heating cycle once per month year round, period. The burner does not care what is in the freshwater loop. But keeping fresh diesel on the nozzle keeps people like me out of your pocket servicing the burner because the nozzle no longer puts out a very fine mist spray pattern.
I do not know what you mean by hot and cold drains for the heater. There is cold freshwater in and tempered hot water out. Once any one hot water faucet has pink freshwater antifreeze coming out of it, the heater is winterized.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Roger & Susan in Home2 on October 01, 2021, 05:08:14 pm
This gets written up every fall. It is not a mystery. Just read and follow the instructions. I have done this on every Rv we have owned since 1974. I forgot the FT service faucet the first year we did the coach. $50 each for the two cartridges.
I usually hook up a low pressure (20-20 psi) air line to the fill hose and blow out as much water as possible from everything including the fresh tank and incoming hose, it can freeze too. When nothing but air comes out of everything then start the pink stuff process.
Waste tanks should be empty. Fresh tank should be empty. Close the valve between the fresh tank and pump. Open and drain every cold and hot line. Connect a hose to the bucket of pink stuff so that it goes through the pump strainer and pump. Turn on the pump. Open each valve or faucet, hot or cold, one at a time till pink comes out everywhere. Then do everyone again.
You should get pink stuff out of every drain valve, every faucet, hot and cold, the shower, hot and cold, the service faucet, hot and cold, the toilet, the ice maker if you have one and it it is connected, the washer/dryer, the drinking water faucet. And add a couple cups to every drain to fill the traps. The toilet should be filled above the flapper.
I do not have an ice maker connected nor do I have a W/D so do what those with them suggest. If you have a hot water recirculation loop be sure to do that but try to get very little pink stuff into the fresh tank. It is potable but tastes horrible.
In a coach with AH it takes 5-6 gallons and about an hour with a few times experience. If you freeze a faucet cartridge it can cost $50. If you don't catch the leak it causes or one from a frozen and broken line maybe thousands and lots of time.
Do as Rudy says, run the AH diesel once a month. Run the generator once a month for about a half hour.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Res777 on October 01, 2021, 05:43:38 pm
For the washer/dryer, while sucking in antifreeze at the fresh water pump, have someone start the washer/dryer on a cycle that involves warm, and watch for pink stuff to appear in the drum. Cancel the cycle and run the drain/spin one. Repeat. That will flush antifreeze through the fill and drain lines of the washer. Do this last since it takes the most antifreeze.
We usually did the following as our winterizing process (easiest with 2 people):
Open low point drains (including the one for the fresh tank), faucets. Extend fresh water hose fully. Let everything drain. Close all faucets and drains, don't put hose away yet. <--- Don't forget to close ALL or you'll be buying more antifreeze :-X
Using a 2-5 gallon bucket, open at least 5 bottles of antifreeze and have within reach, pour antifreeze into bucket. Start sucking pink stuff via water pump and replenish the bucket level as you go (easier than starting and stopping water pump to move to a new gallon container.
Starting with the wet bay faucet (because it's easy to see if you forgot to close an AquaHot drain if you are by its bay), run cold tap until pink comes out, close, the run hot until pink comes out and close.
Next go through every faucet in the coach, including shower, filtered water at sink, and cycle icemaker in fridge until pink appears in ice cube openings (use paper towels to check for this. Do both hot and cold until pink stuff comes out.
Flush toilet and use spray wand (if so equipped) until pink appears. Repeat, especially if you have a VacuFlush toilet.
Flush Splendide twice.
Turn off fresh water pump.
Pour any remaining antifreeze into fresh water hose and hold up to attempt to get antifreeze into rest of hose reel. If you have enough antifreeze you can turn on the fresh water fill valve and you might get a little antifreeze through it via the gravity fill from holding the hose up high.
We would typically then open all faucets and the fresh water tank drain and leave them open for the winter. We also removed the drain screw on the utility bay faucet. We did not re-dump the grey or black tanks since they should have decent freeze protection with the antifreeze that went into them.
How do you cycle the ice maker? By turning it off and then on again?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: rbark on October 01, 2021, 06:45:33 pm
On our Samsung residential side by side there's a small button on the bottom of the ice tray mechanism. Hard to see but you can feel it and hear the gears moving when it's pushed in.
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: Michelle on October 01, 2021, 07:34:07 pm
On our Samsung residential side by side there's a small button on the bottom of the ice tray mechanism. Hard to see but you can feel it and hear the gears moving when it's pushed in.
So when it goes through a cycle. Does it try and fill the tray with water that is already full?
Title: Re: Winterizing - First time confusion
Post by: rbark on October 02, 2021, 12:02:56 am
It will dump the ice cubes then fill the cups with new water to freeze.