So with all the current talk of radiator core damage and oil cooler support Ive decided being paranoid or cheap not sure which will retro fit a radiator cradle similar to attached photo and a separate frame rail mounted support to isolate oil cooler support. Also the talk about transmission oil cooler failure, although rare this would be the time to upgrade oil cooler. In my personal use I feel the oil cooler is too small for my use. This logic would support upsizing for me.
So i think the 3-1279B is original and the 5-7027B is the upgrade 26.1 inches and 65lbs full
3-1279B also crosses to the 5-7102B which is 32.1 inches long IE plus 6" and 70 lbs. full . Curious if it will fit in? Will look tomorrow. Bigger is better. And if I'm building a mount anyway will accommodate bigger cooler. 23% bigger cost unknown yet
First photo show current set up,
second desired radiator support bracket cradle,
third oil cooler mount I would like to duplicate
Any input would be appreciated.
Scott
Hey Scott, since the other thread mentions that there was a redesign sometime in 2002, and my coach is a 2003, maybe yours and mine differ? What do you want pictures of so we can compare?
Scott here are more pictures of the cooler support going around the engine and picture of back cross member which the hitch is welded to and back engine mount is mounted they are all below the rad I have scratch marks on the bottom back pipe of cooler rack from rubbing somewhere put nothing on radiator bottom hope this helps they are all below rad
So I did some measuring and the 5-7102B which is 32.1 inches long will fit. The lower radiator tube will have to be removed again for the third time and lengthened 6 inches to accommodate the longer bigger cooler. Comes close to the retarder accumulator but will clear. Keith yes take a look at your cooler and if its mounted the same on the radiator we will have to talk. Also see if your tank ends are exposed to the road or covered with a plate similar to second photo in first post. Will be copy that idea with a couple additional mods to support fans. Rick thanks for the photos. Will end up being same thing only different. Oil pan is a little bigger
Scott
Here are pics of my rad and trans cooler Scott.
Kieth it looks like your tank is supported , take a picture of the back lower corner of the tank if you get a chance. Disregard, your first photo shows it with a 2" box tubing below it. Very nice. I'll probably stop by and take some more photos and look at your coach hands on to copy. Is your cooler hung from frame rails? Doesn't look to be attached to radiator like mine. Your trans cooler is way forward compared to mine. Mine is about a foot behind the retarder accumulator. You have tons of room for a bigger cooler. 👍👍
So have been in communication with Frank at Atlas and I feel the U320 up to year 2002 if they do not have a radiator support cradle and the transmission oil cooler is mounted to the radiator fan shroud are doomed to early failure. Its not if but when. The radiator itself is quite heaving and needs to be supported and in no way is capable of supporting both itself and oil cooler 65 lbs and cooling fans, not to mention fan operation and road/engine/operation vibrations. IMO. Regardless of model they are all the same radiators and need more support. I'll incorporate all at the same time after Q.
Scott
Just looked at Jim's 2002 295 and it has a real nice heavy cradle and basically a engine skid pan that the retarder is mounted in. Note it is shorter than the u320
On our 295 we have sold the cooler is hanging on a 2 tube frame bolted to frame rails. It too has a skid plate below. Plenty strong enough.
Johnh
Now I just have to know what mine looks like. Too bad it going to be a high of "-too cold to crawl under" tomorrow :o
Very strong setup for sure. Curious the U320 didn't have similar with a bigger cooler.
Here's the cooler bracket on mine Scott.
Kieth does it mount to frame rails above and how long is your oil cooler? Mine is 26 and the bigger version is 32"
The body of the cooler is 22" long, not including the hose inlet/outlet. The hanger bracket has two steel posts that are welded to the bottom of the frame rail.
Still waiting on the cost on the bigger cooler. So before we head to Q being paranoid I'm going to put a ratchet strap over the frame rail and put some upward tension to help support the cooler and take some load off the radiator. Not all of it just some. Will address when we get home. Can't catch every ball in the air. Still with all the support yours failed twice. Who know for sure.
Scott
Due to supply chain issues we are short the brackets that are used on the 5-7102B and the current lead time is around 8 week ARO. We can build a 3-1279B in 2 weeks ARO if ordered within the next couple of days.
Following are the unit prices:
3-1279B $1,947.00 plus freight
5-7102B $2,853.00 plus freight
Units are built and shipped from our Burkesville, KY plant.
Payment Terms: Credit Card (A $30.00 Processing Fee applies to all credit card transactions)
Hum seems like a lot just for preventive maintenance. Will look into building mount for what I have for awhile.$2850 is a lot to absorb . Will also check into paying cash and picking up in person.
Here are some cooler used in fishing boats for Diesel engine maybe you can contact the manufacturer for some help
prices are in Canadian dollars show cheaper in US
Started core support last night. Radiator is just under 56" long and 5" wide. on my coach it hangs down lower than everything else. Attempting to keep the departure angle the same I'm reducing the trailing 18" of the 2" x 4" 3/16 thick tube I'm using for the bottom. Its cut and the trailing end pulled closed. Ended up with about forty thousands droop and will remove before i weld closed. Will close the front end and will install a tube to accommodate access for the drain petcock. I'm planning on using conveyor belt for support pad.
You guys soft mounting these radiators into the chassis? There has to be allowance for expansion and contraction.
Hard mounting similar to foretravel in later years. This sub assembly is hard mounted to radiator mount which is isolated. All this is doing is adding supplemental support to prevent core damage from flexing and failing at tanks. Will also remount trans oil cooler to frame rails also similar to later years and other models eliminating additional loads on core currently supporting it.
So after I pulled the lower rubber radiator cover I finally have a good view of the fin condition. Looks good so far but am spreading the CAC, hydraulic cooler and Radiator to facilitate cleaning fins. Will remove all junk to improve airflow and prevent condensation damage. Nice catch IMO
Scott
Radiator with oil cooler removed. Drove 20k miles in this condition. No overheating issues, but glad I found And no it didn't happen at my house. No grass except patch in back yard. 8x20 feet
Scott
Wow, enough to make any mouse jealous!
Or is this from a previous occupant??
So those coolers are stacked pretty tight about an eighth of an inch gap between them. Don't smell any urine or poop. Used the vacuum to remove all loose materials. Used a aluminum wire brush to gently clean between fins. No fin damage thank goodness. Will spray down with water before closing, but have too much other work in the same area to soak down now. Will at the end of the day working. Supposed to have 40 mile an hour winds today so it'll dry out. This certainly could be a problem in a wet area promoting corrosion. Be like a sponge. Lot of the rock looking stuff is probably but mud dauber nest remains
I have been planning this spring to reseal my fan motors and now to reinforce my
my radiator and fans, so I'm watching what you are doing Scott. When I am doing
the fans I am planning to send out my trans cooler and have it cleaned and checked.
I am working on a driveshaft deal with Summit Racing. Was browsing their FAQ section and ran across this about radiators, found it interesting and thought I'd share.
My new radiator looks like it's been cut with a saw! (https://help.summitracing.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/4916)
Our CAC have the same reliefs. The CAC also is hung off the radiator adding even more weight
So finished install. About a 8 on the pain scale. Suspect each one would have to be a fitted unit. Added about 5/8 of a inch to the rear but is well protected now. Will address fan mount and transmission cooler at a later date. Fans will need resealing this year so I'm going back in anyway
I am looking at bracing my radiator and is it just the bottom part that need bracing or
do I need to go up to the hangers.
I bolted to bottom of the mount bracket on each end. Keiths new radiator came with a very robust mount and radiator was bolted to in sides and bottom. It also left 10 mm gap at the end of the radiator for expansion. I should of taken some pictures, didn't. See photos 3 and 4 for how I tensioned upward
Scott
I bet you could buy just the cradle/mount from Atlas Radiator, but I sure wouldn't want to do that job just to swap the mount.
Thanks Scott, somehow I missed reply 28. They are great pictures. I will build it the same
way. The tubing you used was it 5 x 2 and how thick.
3/16 box with 1/8 verticals and the ends were 1/4. Forward one was a pain to fit around my mount.
Thanks Scott, your tension bolts are a great idea. As soon as I saw the pictures of them
I saw how easy it will be to get the pressure that will be needed on the bottom of the
rad support.
Peter I still need to sort out a cooler hanger to replace hanging off the radiator. Was hoping to upsize the cooler at the same but the price is a lot. I did add a supplement temporary cargo strap around cooler to frame, but still need to make a support system that can be hung off the frame for radiator free support. Keiths 2003 is completely different with the cooler next to the retarder accumulator, mounting it much father forward.
I was out looking at the cooler and I agree it should be hung off the frame. Not an easy
thing to do. When I reseal the fan motors I'm servicing the transmission so I will have
the cooler checked out.
Absolutely agree with holding off till fan motors reseal, I'm doing the same
I bought the steel yesterday and I have the two end hangers made and got the tubing
cut. It sure makes easier following Scott as I didn't need to plan as much. I looked at
my cooler and as I have a Jake I don't think I will do anything with my cooler except have
it serviced. Still know idea how I will make the cooler hanger. When it's out being serviced
and and the fans are out of the way it may be easier.
Dang Peter you are hard to keep up with. So I was planning on hanging off the frame rails from above. So on my 2001 the retarder accumulator is ahead of the cooler. On the 2003 they are side by side having the cooler much father forward out of all the mess. I don't want to change the radiator lines to accomplish this and was going to work around the fans and main radiator to support. I'm thinking that it actually could hang off the top of the frame but that would mean only being on one side. Another idea was to saddle around the frame rail and have a couple of pinch bolts on top of it in shear, would be real strong, could do a post installation I think, but it has to shaped to clear fans and lines. Lot of stuff in that area. I really like the idea of being able to adjust to match cooler location as you are installing, IE several parts that fit together and are adjustable. I hope to be able to make a couple extra and would like them to be installable and adjustable in the field. I all to often make this stuff one off custom and would really like it to be more generic so as I can reproduce a viable mount. I'm glad you got ahead of this. Hopefully I'll be following soon. Build to fit and remove to build jig to build others? Hopefully we will come up with a viable mount.
Curious on what a shop can do to your welded cooler. Please update as you go. And pictures.
Scott
The Allison Dealer here is awesome and I was going to ask them where they send there
coolers to be checked.
Well it quit raining here so I got out this afternoon and got the tension bolt holes
tapped. Taking the outside bolts out took a while to get them out. I ended cutting about
1/8th of an inch off the side of a 3/8 drive socket and using a 1/4 drive ratchet I got them
out. Tomorrow I will pull the trans cooler and start the fan resealing. I will open a new
post for the resealing.
Took a picture of the socket I had to reshape so I could hold the 2 bolts that were
too tight to get a socket on. The bolts just needed to be held as they would spin
Took the cooler to a radiator shop this morning and got the cooler brackets made and
will wait for the cooler to get back to figure out where I will place them on the frame.
I have almost got the new rad support finished.
So I was daydreaming about this still. Was thinking a saddle hooked on top of the frame rail projecting out to center of radiator with a couple of large turnbuckles would suspend and be easily adjustable. Would need to figure out a 80-100lbs isolator similar to the radiator mounts. This wouldn't completely support cooler. Use add the needed uplift to take tension off radiator core. Have it attach to the top center of the oil cooler. Just thinking
Scott
I will post a picture of the first part of what I have made later today.
I finally got the radiator support finished. I followed Scott's design and it works great.
The cooler support I screwed up in the measurements. I have the cooler too high. The supports work great. I will fix it and
post the proper dimensions.
On the radiator supports you can see the 2 pilot holes they will end up being 3/8
for the two 3/8 bolts I will use. I will tap into the frame.
So is the cooler now free and clear of the radiator? Yes there are many variables and that is why I was thinking if you could adjust in place it could be tuned for the installation. I originally thought of the rigid mount but now thinking just added support if that makes sense and leave attached to radiator support. That is why I mentioned needing it's own vibration dampener similar to the radiator two. Mine was going to be two Bronco body mounts I'm swapping out for new. Looks similar.
I wasn't going to use and mount but maybe I will make up something. When I took the
cooler in the guy there said they don't make them like them anymore. He said the cooler
should be more efficient.
Still working on the cooler support. It's a lot of weight and off balanced from just hanging
from the frame.
I thought I had the cooler support all done but I need a little more room for the hoses.
The radiator isn't parallel with the frame so the front support needs to be one inch longer
than the rear. 24.5 inches for the front one and 23.5 inches for the rear. So I will make
the front one longer. The piece I made to go over the frame works really well and it made
it easier to drill the pilot holes threw the support into the frame. I tapped 3/8th holes in the
frame. The frame is 3 inches wide. The return line from the steering needs to be twisted up
and I need to get a JIC elbow to make it work. I have had too make changes the way it was going.
I found the isolators at Princes Auto. When I had it together today I am pleased as to how
it will work. The picture of the tool works great for the hydraulic fitting and it's a tool I got
from my Dad. The last picture is the rad support with the belting back in place.
Sorry I forgot the pictures
They still sell the old ford wrench. Think I have them sized from 8 inches to 16 inches. Made by Diamond now i think. Mount looks good. Still think I want to incorporate being able to adjust both ends to achieve preload during installation. Isolators look good. 👍👍
That's a horrible location for drilling and taping 3/8 plate. That new Milwaukee impactor is the only way to cut those threads. Soft enough on low not to break a 10/32 tap and last week cut a fine thread 5/8 thread and it was the saving grace. Dont know how i lived without it all these years. Tap holding sockets are also a must have now also.
Impact Driver,Pistol Grip,18VDC - - Amazon.com (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07CZRYLQS?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_GSDHBXMDEBQT37KFMH6W)
Amazon.com: Lisle 70500 Tap Socket Set : Tools & Home Improvement (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0002SRFOE?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_Y4ZXA4YCJ2WC19TDVDQQ)
Scott
I had to use a angle drill and I did it old school. I drive a nut onto the tap and used a
3/8th ratchet. It definitely was awkward. Those are nice tools.
Got the new hanger made today and I should have it in tomorrow. That is a picture
of the fitting I used.
Late to this post. I'm surprised that a larger coolant oil cooler is needed. I had a lot of overheating problems with the radiator (rotted out) and they affected the transmission temps. When I replaced the radiator, I changed out the trans cooler as well, since it looked pretty rusty. After removing it, I cut it in two and found that the housing (tube) was pretty thick and not at all affected by the rust. I'm attaching a photo of my radiator (with cooler attached) that I took before installing it. The other photos show what the inside of the transmission cooler look like from an end and side port for those who haven't seen it. With the new radiator and new fan controller the temps have stayed within the normal range.
Well it's all back together except for two hose clamps, which I will buy spring clamps for.,
then all the clamps will be heavy duty. The channel iron I uses is 2 inch and 3/16th thick
and 24 and 23 inches long is perfect. If I did the job again it would take 1/4 of the time.
Figuring out how to do it and changing what I was doing took a lot of work. Using mount
a 11/2 thick puts the cooler in the same place it was before. The first picture is were I welded
the pipe as it had been worn quite a bit. It's hard to get a good picture of the finished job.
All that need is get some oil for the hydraulic and fill antifreeze and fill the transmission as
I did a service on it too.
Got a better picture laying the camera on the ground.
That helps couldn't get my head around the first pics.
I serviced the transmission and today finally I got the coach started and got all the fluids
up to snuff. It's been a long 2 months not doing anything. Tried out the AC that I had repaired
last year and it's blowing cold air. After I fixed it I never used it as it never got hot again.
Thanks for this thread. I took this idea and ran with it during my radiator replacement.