So, I get major stupid points today.
Started filling the fresh water tank, got a phone call from work and the tank ended up overfilling and probably overflowing for 10 to 15 minutes before I realized I forgot it, Water ran mostly out of the overflow, but definitely seeped into rear bulkhead. I saw dripping where the fiberglass meets the rear in from to the rear wheels, and around the 4 plastic plugs at the rear of the bulkhead. I removed all 4 of the plugs. Nothing gushed out, but there were (and are) some slow drips so obviously a good bit of water get in there. Bays look dry.
So, I am in a bit of a panic knowing how detrimental that is to the bulkhead. I'm not in a place where I can take things apart or remove the fiberglass, so best I can do is hope it dries out without major damage. Other than leaving the plugs out for a few days and putting them back in and sealing them up before we hit the road again, is there anything else I can do to mitigate?
Bulkhead has been inspected twice and no issues. I'm hoping I haven't just made a very expensive mistake.
Having access to a shop vacuum will pull water out and low pressure caused by vacuum will cause water to evaporate faster. Prevention is the answer to the age old question. Tape the end to make a better seal into structure and let it run.
Scott
I'm spit balling here with no experience, but could you remove a few of the rolok bolts and raise the front of the coach?
Roloks are not at the lowest point-- they are in the middle of the box beam.
If there is water there, you have 3/4"+ of water in the basement sandwich.
If water is up that high time to separate the FG bottom and air dry. See Elliott's picture he posted today. If opened that much, would allow water out, fan or hair dryer to help evaporate it.
We can figure out how to reattach the skin together ;)
Here's the post Brett is referring to: Bulkhead Skin Adhesive (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=44238.msg447593)
Edit: I think you just answered the question I had in my thread too ^.^d
The bigger thing is exposure over time. If your bulkhead was inspected and deemed good. Then a temp wetting should not lead to the coach falling apart. Just as driving your car to the coast from Az. Won't result in sea air damage.
But if the coaches belly is frequently wet or you and your car live on the coast. That makes a huge difference.
Hoovering up any water is a good idea as the capillary action can draw out hidden water. And ignore all potential interruptions and never walk away while filling.
Joe, remove the fresh water tank overflow hose from the fitting at the bulkhead. Insert a 90 degree elbow and add hose to go down and through the floor to 2 inches below the belly. Now all overflow will drain onto the ground.
My fresh water tank sloshes out water when nearly full, so you may be wetting the bulkhead each time you drive with a nearly full fresh water tank,
But the "Gotya" is that once water gets into the basement sandwich, it can't get out. So is STAYS wet.
As someone PM'ed me, if you have ever had Roloks replaced with through bolts, you will have waterproof "plugs" in the FG about 2" in from the bulkhead. Remove and check for water. Not sure they offer enough access to actually dry if you find water but a quick check.
My coach has the automatic shutoff which is really nice. Might consider a retrofit.
OR, for those KISS Theory among us, a simple fail safe ball valve.
Reroute fresh water tank overflow:
Foretravel Motorhome Tanks: Fresh Water Overflow Relocation | All Things... (http://www.allthingsforetravel.com/2020/02/18/tanks-fresh-water-overflow-relocation/)
Brett these are the plugs I removed that I saw a bit of dripping around. There are 4 of them, evenly spaced end-to-end. When I pulled them, no water gushed out, just a few drips. I cant find any evidence if water pooling in there, but it surely got wet. There are a couple of gaps where the edge of the fiberglass where it attached to the bulkhead just behind the wheels. Was some drips out of there as well. I pulled back the fiberglass in those areas a bit, although damp, no water ran out. It looks like I may have dodged the bullet this time although I'm sure the bit of moisture in there is no good.
Yeah, I have that on my mod list because of all the posts here about overflow. We've never filled the tank past 80% (until today) because of that. This one just moved up to the top of the list!
Guys. you are the greatest! Thanks for the suggestions.
Scott, I never would have though of the shop vac. Thank you! I did what you suggested in each of the "plug" holes; sealed up around the nozzle with tape and ran the vac in suction for 20 minutes in each hole. I'd say I got about 1 1/2 ounces of water out of all 4 holes combined, so that certainly helped. After that, I put the vac in reverse an blew warm air into each hole to dry it out and then all along the fiberglass edge to dry that area out as well. Everything feels dry to touch and no water I can see or feel. I'm going to do the same in the morning.
Thanks again. I feel a bit better, but still need to get some "airhead" medicine.
Joe, do you have an electric solenoid fill valve? But no automatic shut off?
Then see Water Fill Valve Auto Shut-off (https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=32334.msg289041#msg289041)
No Electronic Valve on the U270, Roger. I have to manually turn a valve that reroutes the fresh water flow from the faucets to the fresh water tank.
Joe,
Glad there isn't much water in there. But, keep drying it, as even with no water, 100% humidity in contact with untreated steel is not conducive to box beam long life.
+1 on the overflow to the ground - did that 8 years ago, lets just say it has come in handy.....
Rudy has it. Just put in an overflow. I installed a direct fill plus filter and put a black line on the tank about 3 inches down from the top. I watch it with a flashlight. I have overfilled the tank several times in the past. When we bought the coach, we used the under bathroom sink valve and filled it until it overflowed. It's not the end of the world as it will evaporate, especially if driven. The coaches driven in snow or otherwise treated road are the ones that pay the price most of the time. Long term leaks in the wet bay can turn into a disaster.
Pierce
If you are plugged into power I would run vacuum longer if possible. It's not a fast process and more time under a vacuum the better. I know this may sound crazy but vacuum outlet blowing air could actually create more problems by causing separation. 1 PSI on one square foot area is a 144 lbs of pressure. Vacuum cleaner won't produce damaging vacuum, but may reach several psi when used as a blower. Pitching coach to one side to help drain may also help. All is fair if it helps dry it out. Park it In my driveway. 30 mph winds and it was in the low 90s today
is there a way to make some vent holes on the bottom of the skin to facilitate air flow.
there has to be a simpler way to allow the vapor there to escape.
wondering if no one has done this or if they done it what was learned from it.
did it accelerate rusting process
just wondering
Prevention is a better path than reaction. Yes venting moisture out is always needed once its in. But byproduct of this would be saturation any time its driven threw water and repeating having to remove it. The structure has not been primed so I would think they meant for it to stay dry, never ever getting wet. Dry it out seal it up. Perform all work based upon never repeating repairs. This is a failure of a poor design maintained poorly by us. Once having this issue having a desiccated dryer installed within the cavity would be a great idea. Then you could see water content. Marine application?
It's the implementation of the design, not the design itself. It could have been galvanized or primed and painted and proper fasteners installed instead of Roloks, a fastener designed for a much different application. Foretravels were created with a wonderful vision that is immediately apparent when you step into the coach. So many systems are well thought out and implemented such as the cabinetry, 12V electrical system, etc. It's too bad others in the team dropped the ball on other aspects of the coach., especially when they come back to tarnish the reputation of the product.
So, it's not the responsibility of the new coach owner to be aware of areas where the factory skimped in building the coach. Can you imagine picking the coach up with a disclaimer attached to the rest of the paperwork or placarded inside a closet door? "Don't overfill the water tank or damage may occur" or "constantly watch the wet bay as any leaks may result in a costly repair?" This is where a forum like ours is so important so present owners as well as prospective owners can identify problem areas and prevent or at least minimize any build issues.
Sometimes I'm reminded of the old adage, "beauty is only skin deep." Most of the time I'm happy to work on it and then enjoy our mobile cabin in great locations.
Pierce
Pierce corrosion prevention in a sealed area is a non issue. Literally nothing is needed. Failure being unforgiving. Beauty is only skin deep but ugly is to the bone. As the repair shop says Pay me now or pay me later
I have seen this statement quite a few times over the years, but at least in the case of our 99' U270, this isn't true. The basement framing in our coach has red oxide primer. When I initially peeled off the bottom skin, I thought all of the reddish color was the result of rust (of which there was plenty under the wet bay). After extensive cleaning of the metal, I realized that there was a uniform coating of a primer of some kind underneath the glue and surface rust. You couldn't tell in the area under the wet bay because there was so much rust there, but forward under the cargo bay, it was pretty obvious once I scraped off the glue. I suspect the tubing was pre primed before assembly, rather than after the tubing was welded together, otherwise I think it would have been more effective at preventing rust... just my speculation though.
Don
I agree that the cargo bay framework, all the framework for that matter, should have been primed and painted or rust proofed in some manner. I don't believe the freshwater overflow was an "oversight" tho' . Engineers most likely considered it being no different as far as water penetration is concerned than driving in the rain. I won't get on a soapbox here but if the area is properly sealed the freshwater overflow location will cause no more of an issue than driving on wet roads.
Maintain vigilance, keep water out of the Bay Area, best we can do.
I drilled a couple of small holes into the bay floor and inserted fish tank air tubing. If/when I think I've done something to allow water into the subfloor, I run an aquarium air pump for several days or weeks to dry it out. Not as good as keeping the water out in the 1st place, but better than doing nothing to remove it. And it's very easy.
So on the subject of filling the water tank and getting sidetracked. Who hasn't done that.
Our tank with the direct fill upgrade takes about 15 min if nearly empty and depending on the source pressure.... So, I set the timer on my phone if I'm not going to stand there and watch. Then I can go ahead and multitask.
With the stock waterfill connection it was much worse taking as long as 45 min to fill. Forgot more than once in that scenario so I had to use the timer.
I still use the original overflow but did install a gate valve to prevent spillage when full of water and traveling. Although I never close that gate valve 100% , I sometimes have it at 90% closed.
AND ,I regularly undercoat that bulkhead seam for all the obvious water reasons.
We have a big filter on the direct fill so it takes almost 20 minutes if empty with typical campground pressure. Because of all the mountains, we travel almost empty so fill at the campsite. I'm too ADHD so it sit and watch it fill so it does not overflow. The stock valve does take 45 minutes.
Pierce
That's why I fixed the overflow hose so it went below the bottom of the coach. Now I
don't have to worry about it.
Peter.
Do you still treat the bulkhead seam for those unplanned miles driving in the rain ?
I live in the Pacific Northwest so diving the the rain happens a lot. I also ski so how
the bulkheads were done doesn't please me. If I ever have to do them they would
be treated and sealed so water couldn't get to them.