My coach is nearly 23 years old (2000) and as far as I know the Dometic "New Dimensions" NDR 1062 refrigerator is original to the coach. I've been fortunate in that I have not had any issues with it and it keeps everything cold. I know the day will come that it stops doing that and I think it would be better to replace it at home rather than on the road.
Before going to the expense of a replacement, should I have any expectation that it would last many more years? At the very least, I would have it professionally serviced, and install an APR (heat sensor/shut off) but don't want to put money into it if replacing it is inevitable in the near future.
Does anyone know what a suitable replacement would be for this model? Thanks
Are you interested in another absorption refrigerator? residential refrigerator?
The answer really depends on how you use your coach and how it is equipped electrically. Both have distinct advantages/disadvantages.
I have been very happy with a replacement refrigeration unit from JC Refrigeration. If the box (door, seals, etc.) are still in good shape and you want to stick with the propane option, the replacement unit is a good choice.
The Dometic fridge that was in our coach failed a year or two before we purchased it in 2008. Our U300 is a 1993 model but was made in late 1992 so the fridge lasted somewhere between 15 and 17 years. The PO said they suddenly smelled an ammonia odor and quickly exited the coach. They bought a new Tiffin after the failure so ours sat for a couple of years before we bought it. I had a new Norcold in the garage just the exact size so it fit in with only the fridge floor modification and the fire resistive backerboard . It's been working fine since 2008 so keeping fingers crossed. If and when it goes bad, we will repair it as our normal use is dry/boondock camping.
The wood area around the outside fridge access cover was rotted from moisture so a good thing to inspect before or during repair/installation.
Pierce
Hey Sven,
I immediately installed the APR when we first bought the coach about six years ago. I wanted a safety net with such an old propane unit. If you spend time on their website, you will discover that it isn't just " plug and play". Also, the owner of the company is difficult to deal with. He is a very smart man, and expects others to be as smart. The last conversation we had, regarding the unit shutting down our fridge, resulted in my turning the unit off.
We also had JC Refrigeration update our cooling system. If I remember correctly, it cost in the neighborhood of $1500 +/-
The seals on our unit always seemed to allow air in, especially in the freezer, resulting in Amy having to defrost the freezer often. She was no fun to be around on those days.
So.......we just decided to pull our unit out, RM 8212?? and I am getting the space ready for a 13.9 cf Frigidaire that will arrive July 11th. We went this route because Amy does't want to give up the big drawer under the fridge.
I have always had a fear of a fire at the fridge. We think we are making the right decision, and would recommend you consider going electric.
Just my two cents
I agree-- absorption refrigerator? You need ARP for both safety and longevity of your cooling unit.
Glen, you Think, we Know you are making the right decision. Every propane fridge with or without APR overheat shutdown, is a potential fire hazard that many are willing to risk. The only problem with electric fridges is it keeps ice cream hard all the time, which can mean all the ice cream you want.
Wonderful gift to have a safer fridge that auto defrosts. Interesting that you tried all the popular options before making the best move.
To each his own on this decision. We boondock 90% of the time so a residential all electric fridge is not practical for us without a serious battery upgrade and solar panel installation. Which I don't plan on doing unless we go to "full timers" , which we won't do because of our farm,. Ours is used for vacations and short trips on holidays.
Many may disagree but it's my opinion that if a absorption fridge is maintained and serviced properly, installation of the ARP system a plus, the risk are very low. Its more dangerous just driving the overcrowded interstates.
I have installed the ARP, the Dometic boiler protection upgrade has been done that was recommended years ago and my plans are to line the compartment with hardy board in the near future as Pierce has done.
We liked the auto switch to gas when electric wasn't available
I hated having the fridge between bedroom and exit
Was ALWAYS concerned about fire potential
Now, I'll be able to sleep better
Barry installed residential along time ago
He gave us a tour of his coach at Quartzite
Lots of choices here, for whatever works best for you.
We replaced our OEM absorption cooling unit with a JC refrigeration system and added an ARP for piece of mind. This worked ok but we were constantly thinking and worrying about it. If that side of the coach was in the sun the fridge struggled to stay cold, often hovering around 50F.
In the back of our minds we always thought about the fire risk and we just got tired of dealing with it.
A year ago we switched to residential and have never looked back. We have 20% more capacity in the freezer and fridge in the same footprint. It's been a year and it's been perfect. We don't boondock much but can go 8-10 hours with having to fire up the generator. We run it on our two 8D AGM batteries on a separate, small inverter.
I genuinely think the ARP is great. Wish I was smart enough to keep it working. Although "it" is a great idea, unless you can speak his language and understand his theory of programming it the hours of attempting to learn "it" just piss me off. I got way too many other things I want to do or need to do. A simple level switch would meet my needs and eventually I'll build one. Out of level and it shuts down, simple as that. Or install his unit preprogrammed would also be fine. Till then "it" is unusable to me. Think I'm more disappointed with myself than his mouse trap. :headwall:
Scott
Scott,
Totally agree. I have spoken with him about three times. The last conversation got a little testy. He asked me where I bought HIS unit. He, apparently, didn't like the answer, which was from one of his distributors, if I remember......or him??!!?
He stopped communicating with me, even as I was on the phone with him, following his instructions. It should be MUCH simpler.
Great concept, though.
My ARP never worked right.
I purchased an ARP for the original Dometic unit, worked as advertised. Fast forward to 2016, new JC cooling unit, ARP older version will not work on Amish Cooling unit, due to higher start up temp spike. Purchased a new updated version from the owner in Quartzsite. Can not get it work correctly, it will shut the fridge off but will not let it restart. Paul is not much help, and his web site is hard to navigate
If we park for lunch, photo, store, etc and the coach is more than a tiny bit off level, we shut down the fridge on the way out.
I'm sure others here viewed the photo of the failure of the accessory safety unit tat failed to work destroying a coach. Wish I had saved the image.
Pierce
I put in a residential fridge right after I bought this coach and I boondock 99 percent of
the time. I had a Norcold in the last coach and that was enough for me. The Dometic fridge
in this coach worked fine in fact my son has it in a off grid cabin an it works great. I like the
fact that the fridge works great off level.
As many know, we installed a Samsung 18cu. residential and have never looked back. Also, sold our old Dometic, as it was still working. There are many out there that are potential buyers for these. When we boondock, I just fire up the gen, as it needs to be exercised anyway! We don't worry about the coach being out of level, the fridge works and keeps everything cold. A huge shout out to Chris Lang for his help installing the new unit and his wonderful craftsmanship on the trim, etc.
Very similar story except during JC replacement one of the control buttons got damaged and sent for repair. Never been able to get it to work since. Would cringe at the thought of calling Paul. Glad I'm not the only one to have issues. It's a great idea when it works
Justin, I agree that propane fridge is much easier to work with if one boondocks a lot. When we stayed at Quartzsite for a couple of weeks, we ran gen from about 5p to 9p to charge batteries. Then shut all 110 loads off with power strips so almost everything had no power.
With our two 8D GEL batteries, we only use the main 2000 watt inverter for all appliances, including 120v 10 cu ft Whirlpool fridge. Left inverter on for fridge and in morning ran gen again for couple hours.
Did this sequence for each day and it took some discipline, and if we had a propane fridge, it would a lot different.
BTW, Whirlpool fridge (cost about $300) has been working without a hitch for 12 years.
For those of us that are new. What is ARP and how do I tell if I have/need one?
My Dometic RM4804 works great on 12v and 110v but I'm having issues with running on Propane. Do not have hot water either so it may be a propane problem. Found the Hot water heater today and got the Shower working again. Head seemed plugged up.
Want to Solve your Dometic & Norcold Cooling and Safety Issues? (http://www.arprv.com/)
Have an absorption refrigerator, IMO you need one.
It is a wonderful idea that is constantly checking the boiler temperature. If the unit is operated out of level and not in motion the condensed fluid will get trapped in the coils and not return to the boiler. Once this happens the boiler temperature will skyrocket and boiler will fail/burst and discharge the cooling fluid onto the burner and cause a fire. Very preventable. ARP shuts off burner and prevents this. But is difficult for some like me to correctly set up. Outstanding product when it works. Good example would be a blow out tire and you pull off the road and coach is out of level then catches fridge on fire while your dealing with the tire forgetting to shut the fridge OFF.
Fridge Defend by ARP Protects your Dometic or Norcold (https://www.arprv.com/products.php)
Scott
Our Norcold will safely operate 3 degrees off level front to back and 6 degrees side to side like in a case of a flat tire. To me, a 3 degree down in the back would make it hard to sleep and 6 degrees side to side is leaning over pretty far. So, just pushing the control shuts it down when we leave it for lunch if parked on a street that has an incline. Naturally, if you had a flat, and pulled off the road, the last thing on your mind would be shutting down the fridge. I like the idea of a mercury switch that would cut off the 12V supply to the fridge logic board. I wonder how the board would do if the 12V was frequently interrupted as on traveling on a rough road? Perhaps the switch would be damped enough that momentary movement would not effect it.
Pierce
When we park for short periods such as a lunch stop or a rest area, I always hit the "auto level" and it's rare that it flashes "excess level" . This only takes a couple of minutes and I try to make it a habit.
It's always interesting to see where conversations lead. I was hoping to find someone that replaced their refrigerator that was similar to mine with another that of the same type. I would get an identical replacement but they no longer make my model.
With my mid entry set up, I don't have the option of putting in a wider unit. I like the option of having propane back up to AC and the 10 cu ft. has worked well for us. I'm not looking for an upgrade or something very different, just something newer that would fit in the same space.
Norcold's Polar series is 10 cubic feet and fits in the cutout for an 8 cu/ft Dometic. Ours came without the fridge as like I said above, I had a new Norcold on our garage floor. The floor needed to be flat for the Norcold so I had to modify that plus the fire proofing I did in past posts. It fits perfectly and has black door that go well with the dark wood. Polar NA10LX - The 10 cubic-foot refrigerator that fits in an 8-foot cutout (https://norcold.com/product/norcold-polar-na10lx-rv-refrigerator/)
Pierce
Thanks Pierce, I will take a look at this one. It has an identical layout as my current one and looks like it would fit but doesn't seem as "upscale" despite the price. Hard to "wrap my head around" the prices of these units.
Look around for discounts. I just looked at PPL's site and they have redefined inflation. At those prices, you could put in a residential, fill the roof with solar panels and install mini splits taking the roof airs completely off the coach. Still would have $ left over. How can an RV side by side cost over $6K?
My son's HVAC is not cooling as well as it used to in Sacramento. The estimate was $18,000 to replace the outside unit. I'm going to help them install mini splits.
I just looked on ebay. No deals there for new fridges. If ours fails, we will go residential. I can't justify that much $$$.
Pierce
OK
Sorry if we already discussed this, but I can"t seem to find the response to a question I have.
I will be receiving our refrigerator this coming week. I had asked if I needed to enclose the side and roof vents. There are mixed responses to this, it seems, dependent on whether or not I drive in cold weather ( we don't).
I had to pull out the rigid insulation, due to mold/mildew.
QUESTION:
Should I reinstall some rigid insulation to help keep out heat when the sun is on that side of the coach?
Those of you who installed residential refrigerators must have an opinion.
Thanks.
We put a residential fridge in at MOT a year ago. They left the roof vent open and sealed the side wall vent. They did not add insulation.
Converting to electric is on my todo list, but my microwave replacement has a higher priority.
I won't be going with a Dometic/Norcold product any more. I bought a new 2 way fridge for my travel trailer and within a couple of years with minimal use, the seals went bad. They do not sell just the seal, you have to get the entire door, which means instead of $30-50 it's $250-$300. I am not interested in repeating this mistake and is another reason for me to convert to a residential. My no frills Sears fridge has been relegated to the garage, but was bought new in 2006 and still running strong.
@Pierce & Gaylie Stewart - last year I was getting quotes for HVAC in my shop, all were very high, almost 13K and I still had to have an electrician to hook it up, so add another grand. Wife finally found a highly rated one who could do it all for $6600 out the door for a 5 ton Carrier. They are out there, you just gotta find them.
Jason,
My son's neighbor came over and gave him the number of an independent one man operation. He charged the system and replaced the motor for $1K.
Several different 12V compressor fridges brands are out there. They all seem to cost within a penny of $1500. The compressors are high efficiency and draw very little juice so they will easily run all night without flattening the battery. Dometic, Furrion, Norcold Polar are some of the new 12V compressor fridges. With solar, they should replace a propane fridge without needing much more battery capacity and they don't need an inverter to operate.
Thanks,
Pierce
On the back wall (or side of the coach) Yes we installed new insulation. The sides of the cabinet No we left that out for heat to escape. We left both the back vent and roof vent open to dissipate heat along with the exhaust fans form the old fridge.
Mike
i did the same with my 10 cf Fridge .
When when installing a residential refrigerator, and insulating the refrigerator bay, the insulation should not touch the refrigerator.
If it touches, there is a risk of moving the midpoint temperature to a point outside of the refrigerator box, such that, the box exterior drops below the local dew point, causing condensation and making a mess, and increasing the refrigeration load.
I pulled all the side insulation to give the fridge more breathing room and as I blocked off
the old vents the insulation isn't needed any more.
I recently posted the details of my residential fridge install. As Old Guy, I removed a layer of insulation from sides to create airflow around sides, blocked off back and top vents and have gaps at top and bottom for airflow that circulates from the interior. On my 10.1 Magic Chef the coils are in the side wall. The installation manual for your fridge will specify minimum air space for sides, top, back and bottom. They vary from model to model. If the manual stipulated air space you are pushing your luck to install it like an absorption unit with insulation flush to sides. At least that's my amateur opinion after much study and pondering. We operate in a lot of temperature extremes - in the last year from 7 to 115 F.
When I installed our Bosch side by side, I removed the top vent and left the side vent but added a bug screen to the inside. It allows me to service the refrigerator water lines ( drain for winterizing) and allow heat to escape. I added a top vent over the refrigerator.
The refrigerator is very well sealed in its compartment and I do not have coils on the back of the unit.
Real McCoy, how did you "block off" the vents?
And one more question.....I have two outlets for the fridge.....one says ice maker. Which am I plugging into??
Find out which one is hooked up to the inverter. Unplug the coach from power and turn
on the inverter and which ever one has power to it is the one to use.
I took some of the salvaged thin fiberglass lining the fridge cabinet and cut it to fit over the top fridge opening after removing cover. Just used duct tape. My solar comes down through side of fridge vent using a pair of gland nuts. Reattached vent cover. Didn't bother to insulate.
Took some of salvaged insulation and cut it down into strips and then took aluminum tape and taped it in place for side vent. Every thing is reversible if it doesn't work out as I hope.
I also believe you will find your ice maker outlet is tied to your inverter. If you have a pure sine wave inverter that would be an easy way to get up and running. As suggested, unplug from shore power, turn on inverter and check for 110V at outlet. My wiring diagram shows ice maker circuit coming from inverter.
Has anyone converted a norcold absorption to 12 volt a compressor and does that compare to a residential fridge as far as power consumption?
Our 98 norcold looks absolutely brand new. Not cleaned up but new! Works perfectly but I'm afraid of fire.
Coach has 1200 hours on it. Generator has 700. It's not been used!
I guess my take is to either use an absorption refrigerator with a Fridge Defend on it OR if going to electric, to get a residential.
It depends on your camping style, we do a lot of boon docking in areas where solar and generator use is very limited. For us the best option was the absorption refrigerator with the ARP protective device installed and fire box protection in the fridge area with metal or hardyboard installed.
I'm more concerned about a engine fire now than a refrigerator fire.
Everyone has different needs and opinions.
DWMYH.
^.^d
For me to the absorption refrigerator makes sense. Yes if they're operated out of level (and) they're not protected to overheat they have potential to be a fire hazard. However if you operate within level while parked/stationary and were to buy a fridge defend and install this should resolve any fire issues. Also no issues while driving and operating at the same time. I did replace my cooling unit with a new Amish unit and the fridge defend must be set accordingly. It has worked flawless, and I trust it. I will disclose that programming it is a PITA. But worth the aggravation IMO.
Scott
Spend a half day with a helper and line the compartment with Hardie Backerboard. Include the compartment ceiling. Chance to clean up the compartment and change outlets to 20 amp with metal boxes. They grab the prongs better. See old posts for how to do it. We have a Norcold and love it.
Pierce
I'm going through the same decision with my new GV. If you're a boondocker, going to a residential fridge increases the need for solar panels & batteries substantially. From a cost/benefit perspective I think absorption makes the most sense.. it's not even close really. BUT, now that my wife has had a full residential fridge in the U320 it's a tougher sell...for me too to be honest
I think in the long term the cost/benefit ratio (when everything is included—such as the much larger storage capacity and frost-free convenience) shows that residential is the way to go. At least it definitely has for us!
Pierce brings up some good points to fight a fire that has started, but the ARP prevents the possibility of a dry boiler tank and High burner temps. If you're going to line your compartment ensure your flue/chimney goes beyond the roof line. I also think a simple level switch would also reduce the boiler from being starved of refrigerant, but would not shut it down if for some reason it did over heat. I even ordered a bunch of mercury switches to make up a level switch. Just buy the fridge defend and dont worry
Norcold recommends that their refrigerators operate within 3 degrees off level side-to-side and 6 degrees off level front-to-back. We shut ours off if parked for lunch or at a view point and the coach is not fairly level.
If a part of the piping fails and allows they hydrogen gas to escape, there is a possibility of fire. There are small automatic extinguishers that may put the fire out but in several photos from RV websites, these did fail and the coach burned. There is not much hydrogen so any flame is very limited in duration and intensity. Backerboard is resistant to a welding torch so not much of a possibility of the flame/heat getting through it. See YouTube demos of tests.
When installing the backerboard, any debris can be cleaned up and the wood right below the outside access door can be checked and replaced if necessary. Ours was rotted so I replaced it. GVs have lots of thin laun/lauan all around the fridge so are prime for fires.
Pierce
Elliot, X2 with Justin, For OUR lifestyle the absorption fridge is fine with the ARP and my wallet is much heavier. I'll be long dead before I would ever break even with the expense of solar etc. Jim.
So I agree they should not be operated out of level!!! I just select the auto level almost every stop and dont worry about it because the coach is leveled. If it's not within its range I generally dont park there anyway with the exception of its storage area and put ramps under the front tire to assist in getting back in the level range.
BUT I would like to bring to attention, its not premeditated stops that concern me. What worries me is if you have a blow out, and have stopped out of level, first priority is to Turn the fridge off before the ARP gets the opportunity to do its job, and. At that moment you're distracted with other issues.
IMO.
Scott
This is a GREAT video on how to change a cooling unit in a Dometic Fridge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlVOjiT9beU
Well, My Dometic RM 4804 Died on my last trip to SoCal. 27 years old, so it is about time. caught a whiff of ammonia and shut it down. Luckily I had a small compressor fridge/freezer with me so i did not loose much. I want to keep the fridge an am looking for an Amish rebuilt cooling unit. Am not having much luck. JC refrigeration's site is being rebuilt and Cooling Unit Warehouse does not seem to have any listed. Any other suggestions? TIA
I searched google and ebay and came up with nothing. Good luck. If you decide to go new, I'm real happy with my Norcold N811.
I agree. Call JC or email them. They were always quick to respond. Myron and JR were super nice.
The trip to Shipshewana is just a bonus. Make sure to leave time for the flea market, shopping, eating pretzels, dutch apple pie, and "Amish Crack" at Rise and Roll.
The Dutch Aire system is intriguing if you don't dry camp, or want to take up Solar Cells and Batteries as a hobby.
JCRefrigeration manufactures new cooling units, so why not give them a call and see what the lead time is for a new one, installed by them?
I've included a photo of "the inside you don't see," and that loop sticking up is located inside the divider wall in the freezer compartment, and it does make a difference keeping frozen stuff frozen in the summertime. But then again so does the separate cooling unit for the ice maker.
Dometic 12V Hvac Cooling Unit Archives - JC Refrigeration (https://jc-refrigeration.com/product-category/dometic-units/dometic-12v-hvac-cooling-unit/)
Solar is not that expensive. We spent $1400 on ours and the same system today will cost the same. Plus, you don't have to worry about getting home if you lose alternator, wake up with flat batteries. On our latest trip, very few campers ran generators and kept it short when they did. Nice to get up in the morning and have it quiet.
Our Norcold works great. I'm taking an old Japanese absorption fridge from the 1970's to the dump that still works. After a week of the only propane use for cooking, our propane gauge is still on the same place as when we arrived thanks to solar.
Pierce
Looks like that is a 12c compressor fridge. I cannot find anyone that has a cooling unit for the 4804. too old they say. Looking at the RM 2862, RM 3962, and the NDR 1062 IM. Would like an ice-maker and 3way, but don't need a 9cuft as it is just me.
Ideas/recommendations? BTW, I only have the original converter. have not put in an inverter yet.
Not sure there are any RIGHT/WRONG answers.
If you don't do much dry camping, an PSW inverter and residential refrigerator are about the same price as a replacement absorption refrigerator.
That is an option. I have my batt pack to install and am researching the best inverter for the config of the pack. It will give me at least 1KAh in a 300lb package. I would prefer a 3 way but I hear they don't make them anymore that will fit my space. I don't NEED a large fridge, but would rather not have to try blocking openings or building shelves. I would like an Ice maker, but can live with just a freezer area :) One thing I don't know yet is if the area behind the ice maker is open or a step up to the bottom of the fridge itself.
Our 1993 probably has the same fridge enclosure. To fit the Norcold, I had to make a flat bottom for it to sit on as the bottom for the Dometic was not flat and now with the flat bottom, the floor is several more inches below the outside vent door.
The twin electrical outets are next to the outside vent and are prone to corrosion. I changed ours to 20 amp as they are more HD construction compared to the 15 amp. The wood right below the vent door had dry rot so was replaced.
Pierce
We replaced our OEM Dometic fridge with this.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Magic-Chef-10-1-cu-ft-Top-Freezer-Refrigerator-in-Black-HMDR1000BE/302245062
We added a separate, dedicated inverter. The 'floor' had to be lowered one inch. Other than that it fit perfectly, no woodworking required. We are thrilled with the difference. The fridge and freezer are always the same temp. The capacity is much larger than what we had.
No regrets, other than waiting so long to make the change. We can go about 8 hours on our batteries (2 8D's) before we fire up the engine, generator or plug in. We don't boondock so it works for us.
Thanks, I'll be looking at the space behind the Ice maker compressor to see if it is open. The way space is utilized on this coach it would not surprise me if that space were occupied by something I don't want to remove :( lol I will be checking for dry rot and electrical corrosion. Thanks
Nice. No icemaker, but only pulls 1.4A at 110v. A small inverter would run it fine :) good price and other that an inch deeper looks like it would fit(assuming there is no step or it is removable). Thanks