Woke up to a cold coach this morning with AH blowing cold air. Outside temp 41 degrees and AH not up to temp (electric element on but couldn't keep up)>
When diesel switch is turned on, the light goes off in approx 20 seconds. In those 20 seconds no pump (correction, motor insde burner case) running as usual.
What I have done so far is removed cover over AH, checked that 12 volt (13.4) is good and checked all the 12 volt fuses including for continuity, and checked top left thermostat for continuity (should be the VDC control thermostat). Edit: also checked bottom left thermostat for continiuty.
Trubleshooting AH manual SECTION 8: DIESEL-BURNER COMPONENTS/TROUBLE SHOOTING said those were first steps.
Wait for Rudy to reply but sounds like the controller to me. I always carry a spare and can switch quickly to see if that fixes the issue before going to more serious trouble shooting.
I'll be calling Rudy.
AH last serviced 2 years ago Nov 2021, but with the pump (correction, motor inside burner case) not running at all before light goes out it shouldn't be a soot or carbon issue. The controller was replaced with a rebuilt from Rudy July of 2018.
5 years out of an aluminum one is a long life.
Yep, you probably just need to get the new style. Should be better anyway.
Problem resolved. The reason the diesel would not fire was the motor inside the case of the burner assembly was not working.
Without Rudy's guidance on the phone multiple times I wouldnt have been able to disasemble the burner assembly this far. The burner has to be removed, the outer case has to come off, the coil has to come off. Multiple wires to unplug. Tests with small plug on the controller off, then switch AH on and replug the controller to check motor.
Nothing was replaced. The clutch assembly and the motor looked good, and connecting the motor directly to a 12 volt source it worked fine.
Best guess corroded connector or pinched wire.
Update Edit: Bad motor, intermittent, has dead spots depending on where it stops after last run.
Since I had it all apart I cleaned the burner and put a new fuel nozzle in.
Hit all connections inside burner case and to motor with contact cleaner.
When servicing the AH I was going to move the tempering valve both ways as oten advised. I got about 1/8 turn when the handle sheared off.
When replacing the tempering valve is all water drained from system first?
Pics from before service, and of sheared valve. Also pic of motor and clutch inside burner case.
You only need to have the fresh water turned off so that there is no pressure on the water. You don't drain the aqua hot tank.
Dan funny I had the same problem this morning, here in Oklahoma City where it got down to 30°. It wasn't too bad and the coach showing a internal temp said it was 60 so the electric element was doing a fairly decent job of keeping me warm. Once it warmed up enough I pulled everything back out and when I pulled the burner off found that the photo sensor was sooted up. I cleaned everything up pulled the burner out and everything was carbonized which I expected after replacing the wiring. Brushed it all out cleaned it up put everything together and when I fired it up nothing happened. I'm sitting there scratching my head and then I realize that maybe I should call for heat so I turned all the thermostats up and the burner came on blue white smoke for a little while and then settled down. Oh by the way I had a stripped bolt on the side facing me and had ordered a new one and replace it which was kind of fun. I used a Bosch multi-oscalating tool with a very small blade to remove the old bolt. About 8 minutes per side the boat was out I put the new one in and all was good. Sitting inside right now and it's in the high 30s going into the twenties tonight here and I'm toasty warm. Hopefully this system should last again for quite a while. One of the things I really like about working on this system is how much you learn about it. Aquahot has a really good troubleshooting algorithm. And there's always Rudy who as we all know is a wealth of info. Glad you got it figured out. My system's 23 years old so with the new wire harness installed new grommets and now a new t-bolt to hold it down, hopefully it will last for a while. Of course I put a new racor fuel filter in, and nozzle. I also replaced my bearings as one of them was bad.
Nice to be warm, no?
It looks like the repair kit for the tempering valve won't include a fix for the sheared off adjustmant knob: Watts 1/2 in. to 3/4 in. Repair Kit for Lead-Free Tempering Valve - Amazon.com (https://www.amazon.com/Watts-Repair-Lead-Free-Tempering-Valve/dp/B00OPFEE8K/ref=asc_df_B00OPFEE8K/?ie=UTF8&tag=foreforums-20)
So I think I will order the entire valve, then transfer the parts: https://www.grainger.com/product/WATTS-Mixing-Valve-LF70A-26X141?opr=ILOF
https://www.zoro.com/watts-mixing-valve-lead-free-brass-12-lf70a-f/i/G4531082/?gclid=f997618785fb13be6bb304e678982767&gclsrc=3p.ds&msclkid=f997618785fb13be6bb304e678982767&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=ml_all_dyn_na_ssc_Bing%20core&utm_term=4585788126739859&utm_content=Core
And I may not actually fix it until next time it needs service, just have the parts on hand. Current inside water temp is good at both sinks and at shower.
That's what I did, bought the whole valve then swapped out the internal parts. Easy peazy!
Dave
You mentioned the "new style" controller. Can you explain please. I have the black controller and have seen the silver ones. Also heard the silver one is solid state which I don't know.
Attached pic of my controller
Peter you have the short lived replacement before Aqua Hot began making their own. The new ones are supposed to be trouble free. The aluminum ones had capacitors that failed frequently. I bought mine from Rudy.
Aqua Hot Webasto Controller — Hydronic Heating Warehouse (https://hydronicheatingwarehouse.com/products/aqua-hot-webasto-controller-wpe-300-901)
Ok craneman. Is the unit any good?
No problems so far and last I checked Rudy hadn't had any failures of the new one. It comes with instructions explaining the reason the light doesn't come on immediately. It checks all the components and if all is good the light comes on.
Peter I had one of these( Still have it) and I was so proud when I found it but it only lasted about a year-- I finally figured out what to do to my old one and repaired it it's been working since been a couple of years
Chris
I purchased the new controller from Rudy when we were in Yellowstone NP a few years ago! Knock on my head, it is still good to go! No issues! Then Chris fixed me up with the new and improved version of the silver one and I have it as a standby! Thank you again Chris!
Update: Problem still exists. Intermittent.
Temporary solution with outer metal cover off of the AH:
When it fails due to motor inside burner case not starting up.: when diesel switch inside the coach is first turned on, use a rubber mallet and tap on outer plastic burner case to break the motor inside the case loose and it starts running (has to be within 20 seconds or so). Can pull the smaller plug on the controller case and then plug it back in to re-start the 20 second (approx) window of tapping on the case.
Motor has flat spot now. AH will fire and motor works fine until motor stops on dead spot, which is not every time. Then tapping on case moves motor enough to restart.
Permanent solution: Need new motor, just ordered it from Rudy. Since I will have to dis-assemble outer case to replace the motor, I also ordered new clutches to replace at the same time. I figure time and heat may have degraded the clutches even though they looked fine when I had it apart 2 days ago.
It was a steep learning curve over the past 2 days, since I had never even serviced the AH myself before with new nozzle and cleaning combustion deposits (I had hired it out before).
Rudy walked me through troubleshooting via phone, and I searched hundreds of old forum posts. I now have a much better understanding of the system. I did cut and pastes from old forum posts to compile a bunch of information in a word document on the AH systems and troubleshooting.
Rudy is a amazing asset for the Foretravel community.
While you got it apart you may consider replacing the bearings to...
Keith
Good thing I did expedited shipping ($$). Can no longer get motor inside case to turn/start by tapping (banging) on burner case. Dead in water for diesel burn.
Low 39 tonight, 37 tomorrow night. Both ACs have heat pumps and we have two ceramic electric heaters, so we will be fine until parts arrive.
Here's a pic of the grey controller that I got from Rudy last year. I had (still have for possible backup) the black box.
Run the pump and get water from your storage tank. Should be warmer then shore water.
I second the bearing replacement since you are pulling it out and it's easy to replace them. Removing the cover can be a bit of an issue. You might want to also purchase the o-ring that goes around and seals.
The cover is a type of plastic and could be easily broken. I used a very small flat screwdriver to help release it from the aluminum housing. If you're wiring harness is in rough shape like mine was you might want to think about also replacing that while you're at it although you could just splice new wires in.
I purchased the whole rebuild kit from eBay john carillo I think it was, and the wiring harness from another ebayer. Fun times no?
Yeah those heat pumps don't do anything below 45°. I'm really glad I got my aqua Hot repair before I got on the road as I was going to wait till I got to quartzsite to do it. It went down to 33 degrees last night here I don't think I would have been too happy with that choice.
I express shipped motor and clutches from Rudy, they will be here tomorrow. I did not order the bearings.
To save time tomorrow, today I disassembled case and motor. Spun the clutch to upper burner with motor removed, bearings (and fuel pump with it) seem smooth and stable.
I tested the motor multiple times on my Jeep battery. Runs smooth when it runs, but definetly intermittent flat spots where it will not start without pushing the clutch a little to break it loose.
Since I had the outer case and motor off a few days ago, disassembly was quick and easy this time. Serviced everything while apart (carbon deposits, fuel nozzle).
Murphy struck while all this is going on. AH 110 volt electric element is burned out. Have 110 volt power right at the element, so breaker, switch, and thermostats are ok calling for heat at element. AH is dead cold. No diesel heat, no electric element heat.
Warm enough for heat pumps and we have 2 small ceramic heaters. Should be up and running on diesel tomorrow, and Rudy will ship a electric element to me.
That's pretty tough, Dan. Hope you get it worked out.
Brenda and I are in Gallup, 8 degrees- burning diesel in our unit. When they work, they are great.
Thanks to Rudy's patience on phone calls educating me, and sending parts (motor and clutches so far), we are back in business with diesel burner on the Aqua Hot.
The new motor is the silver one.
A new electric element is in route, I ordered a 1.5" socket on Amazon, have a impact wrench I can borrow, have 4 5 gallon buckets and a fluid transfer pump in hand.
TEKTON 1/2 Inch Drive x 1-1/2 Inch Deep 6-Point Impact Socket | SID23038:... (https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-6-Point-Impact-Socket-SID23038/dp/B08DK16BQX/ref=sr_1_5?crid=3JMPBLTSOG3CD&keywords=1.5%2Binch%2Bsocket&qid=1701226725&sprefix=1.5%2Binch%2Bsocket%2Caps%2C554&sr=8-5&th=1)
I'll post pics when I do the electric element - probably next week.
I also have on order a new mixing valve to transfer the guts to mine - handle sheared off during service. If I have any energy and time left after the electric element I will tackle that as well. If not it can wait unti next burner service.
https://www.zoro.com/watts-mixing-valve-lead-free-brass-12-lf70a-f/i/G4531082/?q=G4531082
I am considering not putting the outer metal covers back over the aquahot, and placing them in my storage shed.
Any pros and cons to doing that?
For myself, not putting the left side cover on has decreased the heat around the controller ( I still have the black plastic ...will be changing it out to the Aqua hot brand one that is solid state) and at the same time provides heat to the Aqua hot bay in My Canadian winter environment. The heat of the AH adds significant heat to the bay so I do not have to add electric heaters
I run with mine removed. I think it helps in keeping the bay warmer in cold weather also.
My covers are off to let the heat out from around the control unit and to make it easy to check a fuse or any other service.
Dan, as you have time, turn the control unit upside down to put the plugs facing down. Any moisture will run off of the box, not down into the box.
Dan; on your mixing valve, you can just replace the guts and be good to go. I did mine when I had the burner assy off for service. Easy to get to then! Glad to hear you were fixed up by Rudy! He is the best and gives so much to this forum of his time and expertise! That is what makes this forum so great, friends helping friends!
I wish I had access like you do. Not so easy on mine.
Changed mixing valve and electric element in the AH today.
https://www.zoro.com/watts-mixing-valve-lead-free-brass-12-lf70a-f/i/G4531082/?q=G4531082
Swapped the "guts of the mixing valve. Pic of old and new temper valve. Different design but works fine. Getting the old one off was difficult. Vice grips as tight as I could make them, and beating on it with a hammer was required.
Old electric element was fried. Pic of element.
Used Rudy's advice on the element. Shallow drain pan under the coach, liquid transfer pump to move coolant to 5 gallon buckets as it filled (15 to 16 gallons total). Impact gun to break old element loose (1.5 inch socket. 1/2 inch drive) (then use ratchet to remove and replace).
Socket: TEKTON 1/2 Inch Drive x 1-1/2 Inch Deep 6-Point Impact Socket | SID23038:... (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08DK16BQX?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)