Dash Air Leak

Topic: Dash Air Leak (Read 1170 times) previous topic - next topic

Dash Air Leak

September 15, 2010, 09:58:35 pm

Hello Forum
I have been trying to locate a dash air coolant leak for a few days. We bought the coach at Lazy Days in May. They said they had fixed the dash air and it was working great. For about a week. We took it back to them about a month later. They worked on it for a day and replaced the high pressure line at the compressor. About a two foot section. Once again it worked fine for about three weeks this time. Yesterday I put about three and a half cans of freon in it and used a friends sniffer to look for leaks. I have not been able to find any. I was thinking of using some uv die in the system. I even called the original owner Brian Taylor in Texas to ask if he knew of any on going leaks. He said he never had any problems with it the ten years he owned it. I may give Lazy Days one last shot at it but thought I would try to locate it myself first. Any advise or tips would be much appreciated. Thanks
Mark Zettek

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #1 – September 15, 2010, 10:02:57 pm

Mark,

First, thank you for your service to our country.

Some folks on the board have previously recommended finding a Thermo King location for dash air issues. You can search the board for Thermo King to find their experiences (and I'm sure others will chime in).

Michelle

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #2 – September 15, 2010, 10:28:03 pm

Sounds like it may be in the condenser. Hard to find. Double the dye, let run for close to an hour, then check. Let us know what you find out...

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #3 – September 15, 2010, 11:01:08 pm

We had an A/C leak that took 7 years to finally fix. We put dye in the system and used a black light at night when we could best see the green florescent color from leaks. Using a portable hydraulic hose clamping device to replace a piece of hose that had a leaking fitting finally did the trick. We have had cold dash air for the last three years.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #4 – September 16, 2010, 12:13:03 am

I went to thermo king. They did a great job and found the leak. It was to the line to the condenser radiator.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #5 – September 16, 2010, 08:00:48 am

Thanks Michelle for the recognizing my service it was an honor. Thanks everyone for your responses. I will put the dye in on Monday and see what I can find. I did look up Thermo King and found one here in Jacksonville. I will keep you all posted on my results.
Regards, Mark Zettek

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #6 – September 16, 2010, 08:02:17 am

I too have been fighting with the Dash A/C leaks for seven years now. First Foretravel of TN (twice year 1), then FOT (once year 2; coach was under warrantee repair...very lazy, the tech took 5 minutes and replaced the Schrader valve at the high pressure point), then American Motor Coach (Columbus, OH, once year 3), then Cummins Bridgeway (next 4 years). Next up will be Thermo King as recommended by the members. I sure hope the Cincinnati Thermo King outfit is up to par as described by others. I'm running out of money for this repair!

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #7 – September 16, 2010, 08:14:35 am

Peter,
Most mechanics are not mechanics. They are parts replacers. Depending on the company's overhead, it is their interest to sell you every part in your system until it is completely replaced, usually starting with the most expensive parts first. They would rather do that than sell you a new one as a new one is cheaper than all the parts. and, the labor charge takes care of the parts replacer who also changes parts because he/she doesn't know how the system works or can't spell troubleshooting.

Until you find a guru (and he/she is worth his/her weight in gold), you will have to keep the wallet open to mechanics who learn on your dime, or luckily has seen your problem before.

That is what is so great about this forum. If you are lucky, someone else has skinned their knuckles before you, is willing to share, and was part of your learning curve!

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #8 – September 16, 2010, 08:26:02 am

Mike,

I'm afraid you're right about the mechanich's skills & competencies. Now, it seems being "Certified" means you took a course and got the certificate of completion...and not that you can actually apply what you've learned.

As long as repair shops can charge $100/hour for "Certified" mechanical service, they will continue to remain in the status quo. What can be done about "mechanical malpractice"?

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #9 – September 16, 2010, 08:35:49 am

I spent two weeks and a 5 cans of freon. Finally decided to change the receiver/dryer.
When I loosened the clamps the leak was quite evident. It had hid under the clamp, was a very slow leak till I loosened the lower clamp. '93 U300

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #10 – September 16, 2010, 10:08:57 am

Peter,

Learn to do it yourself!

That is why all of us are on this forum.

I look at the mechanics and think "if they were rocket scientists, they would be rocket scientists!

My philosophy is that you only have to be smarter than the thing that you are trying to fix! That is why I am not a doctor and I don't work on people, plants or animals!

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #11 – September 16, 2010, 10:28:41 am

Peter & Beth, Have them put in dye and YOU guys check for leaks with a black light when it is dark. Look from rear to front and back. Check as often as you need. Service techs don't have time to be thorough as your experiences support. Learning to add a can of R134a will also keep you going for years if your leak is small.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #12 – September 16, 2010, 11:07:19 am

Okay, I got ya! So, help me along. The system compressor is currently cycling on/off, so I know the high/low pressure switch is okay, but the coolant is low. To add R134a, then, I add this at the low pressure line? How do I identify the correct line to add the refrigerant? Where is the sight glass where I can see if bubbles are in the system (I don't know the part name)?

p.s. Dye was input in 2009 and the under dash evaporator was rebuilt as a new replacment is not available.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #13 – September 16, 2010, 06:45:34 pm

I would be veeeeerrrry careful with the AC systems esp if you do not know much about them.
ALWAYS wear safety glasses,you are dealing with high pressures and freezing chemicals.
Somethings are best left to the pros like ThermoKing.
Another safety item.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #14 – September 17, 2010, 08:31:33 pm

Everyone,
Here is an update on my dash A/C leak. Yesterday I had time to top off the freon and add some dye. It took over six cans to get it cooling good. And today it is not cooling at all. Big leak. Tonight I went out with the UV light and found two leaks. One where Lazy Days did the repair work splicing a new hose section into the high side at the compressor. And one at the fitting where the line attaches to the expansion valve in the dash. I think the expansion valve leak might just need a new o ring. The other one will have to go back to Lazy Days for warranty since I dont have the equipment to crimp on a new line. Its amazing how that dye jumps out at you at night under that UV light. Thanks everyone for all the advice and support.

Regards, Mark Zettek

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #15 – September 17, 2010, 09:42:59 pm

I know you want to get Lazy Days to fix their problem, but most shops do not have the proper crimp capability. It takes a portable hydraulic crimper with the correct die and fittings to do the job, sometimes found at hydraulic hose shops. You may end up with a continuing problem, especially if they mess up the long hose to the front.

By the way, in case Lazy Days will evacuate and repair at their cost, you would be good to replace the expansion valve o-ring before giving the crimp problem to them.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #16 – September 17, 2010, 09:52:09 pm

Barry,
That is a good idea. It will be easy to replace the o-rings in the expansion valve myself. It is very easy to get to. Thanks for your insight.

Mark

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #17 – September 17, 2010, 10:41:34 pm

Mark,
I do not know what part of the country you are in but here in Houston there is at least one shop, Cool Flow, that specializes in making A/C hoses. He has all the correct crimping dies as well as silver solder for the soldered connections. All sorts of people use him including the Mercedes dealership.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #18 – September 18, 2010, 12:45:10 am

The problem I had was not to have a good hose made up, where they use a shop floor mounted press to make hose end crimps. All shops that make up hoses have presses for making strong crimps.

I needed to make a splice in the engine compartment to an existing hose where we could not bring our hose to the shop. Most shops use manual crimpers for portable operation. I found a guy that had a portable hydraulic crimper with the correct die that he could bring into our engine compartment. I think most shops don't have such a tool, so it takes effort to find a shop with one. Previous manual crimp leaked and had to be cut out, which shortens the hose going to the front. We have to keep the long hose to the front intact to prevent running a new long hose up to the dash.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #19 – September 18, 2010, 08:59:06 pm

Thanks for the input John but I live in Jacksonville Florida so I will have to see what I can do locally.

Barry I will question Lazy Days about the proper tooling and see what they say. The last repair was crimped in the engine bay also. It looks good but I am unsure what type of crimping tool they used. I will keep you posted.

Regards , Mark

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #20 – September 19, 2010, 12:32:03 pm

I don't know which A/C unit the rest of you have, but here are the folks who designed and supplied the dash a/c system for Foretravel for my '94 U 225 - http://www.evanstempcon.com/index.php. Their service centers are suppose to be outstanding. Their web site also offers a excellent trouble shooting section in the Technical Support link. I have heard nothing but good things about these people and their service centers. One of the emergency transport (ambulance) companies locally could find no one to fix the A/C in one of their units until they happened upon one of Evans Temp Con service centers. Said that they were very reasonable also, much cheaper than what they had spent at other A/C and truck garages that could not get it to work.

Re: Dash Air Leak

Reply #21 – October 06, 2010, 11:34:47 pm

Here is an update on my dash a/c leak problem. I put dye in the system as suggested. Went out at night with a UV light and found what I thought was the leak. Since it was under warranty we took it back to Lazydays in Tampa. Told the tech where I thought the leak was. Tech said the first day that he found a leak at the compressor low side line fitting. He replaced the o-ring and recharged. The next day it had leaked out. Next day they replaced a shrader valve on the high side line and recharged. The next day it had leaked out. Finally the next time he repaired the crimped line on the high side and it worked great for two days until we started driving for an hour and it stopped cooling. Got out to look and found that the tech had layed the new high side hose section across the turbo charger and it melted a hole in the line. So we turned around and headed back to Lazydays. They put a new section in and recharged it. It looks like after 6 repairs they finally got it right. I did verify that they used a hydraulic crimping tool to repair the line. It has been working for a couple of days now. We leave to head home tomorrow after being here a little more than a week. They have paid for our camp site at Rally Park since we have been here so it has not been too much of an inconvenience. I am just glad that it appears to be finally fixed. Thanks everyone for the great troubleshooting advice.
Regards, Mark

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