Skip to main content ↑ ↓
Topic: Winegard HD dish conversion (Read 1570 times) previous topic - next topic

Winegard HD dish conversion

While we were at Camp Foretravel in early March we had a Winegard Slimline (DirectTV) HD dish installed to replace our TracStar 360 that came as standard equipment with our 2003 coach.  The Tracstar only had one cable (DVR or TV, but not both) and did not provide HD TV.  Also we had had some problems with it in the past.  These problems were easily fixed by replacing some parts on the TracStar, but we wanted cables for both the DVR and TV as well as a better picture, so we ordered the Winegard from Camping World and had it shipped directly to FOT.  It is possible to add a second cable to the TracStar setup, but that would not have provided an HD picture and it would have meant sinking more money (about $250) into old technology.

After we ordered the Winegard we upgraded the DVR to Direct TVs latest model.  We had planned to use the one from our home, but it was too deep to fit in the electronics cabinet above the driver.  The model we had was about 12 inches deep, while the latest model is only about 10 inches (including cables).  One thing we did not expect was the big improvement in picture that the new DVR provided!  It was not HD, but it was much better than the old Direct TV receiver we had been using. 

So far the Winegard has lived up to our expectations.  Excellent HD picture on our Samsung flatscreen LED TV (see previous post).  It does take a bit longer to setup, but it is entirely automatic so that is not a problem.  And one does have to remember to stow the dish before traveling, but that has become part of our routine.  There is an optional cable that runs from the dish to someplace in the dash that automatically stows the dish when the ignition is turned on.  However, it requires 110volts and normally when we start the coach, we have disconnected from 110v.  Not very useful. 

The guys at FOT did a good job of installing the dish.  We had the holes from the TracStar fiberglassed over and although it was expensive, I'm glad we had it done.  No worries about leakage.  There is no evidence that another dish setup was ever on the roof.  The only glitch in the installation was that Winegard did not put the correct cable sealing plate in the package.  There are 5 cables that run from the dish to the inside of the coach:  one to control the dish; one for the DVR; one for the TV; and two spares in case we want to add a second DVR for the bedroom TV.  The plate supplied only allowed for three cables, not five.  But Winegard sent us the correct plate via overnight FEDEX. 

While reinstalling the electronics after the Winegard was installed I learned a lot about the Xantech IR repeater we have in the Coach.  The guys at FOT advised that the repeater is located in back of the TV (see photo).  It had never worked very well, so I found it and fixed a loose wire that caused some of the problems I was experiencing.  However, the major problem (unreliable control of the electronics) was caused by the fluorescent lights in the coach.  When they are off, it works perfectly.  With them on it works sometimes, but not always.  There is a green LED in the receiving cell that comes on when an IR signal from the remote is received.  That LED is on continuously when any of the fluorescent lights are on.  We're going to change them to LEDs soon. 

This was an expensive upgrade, but we're glad we did it.  After all, it is our home!

George


The selected media item is not currently available.
George Hatfield

  Never ever use World Line Motors of Nacogdoches for service!

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #1 –
Quote from: George Hatfield –

So far the Winegard has lived up to our expectations.  Excellent HD picture on our Samsung flatscreen LED TV (see previous post).  It does take a bit longer to setup, but it is entirely automatic so that is not a problem.  And one does have to remember to stow the dish before traveling, but that has become part of our routine.  There is an optional cable that runs from the dish to someplace in the dash that automatically stows the dish when the ignition is turned on.  However, it requires 110volts and normally when we start the coach, we have disconnected from 110v.  Not very useful. 

George,

Steve is planning to wire a reed switch in for our Trav'ler, something similar to the one on the crank-up antenna that is wired to the dash alarm/dinger.  The theory is if it is wired in series with the crank-up one, if either was up, the dash would alarm on ignition so no new holes would be needed in the roof.

Michelle
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #2 –
Several years ago I installed some infrared controls for equipment in my home. At the time, one could buy infrared sensors that were less susceptible to interference from fluorescent lights. They had a designation as being more suitable in environments with fluorescent lamps. My recollection is that they were sometimes blocked by compact fluorescent lamps when the lamps were warming up, but worked well after the fluorescent lamps were warmed up. If you don't have the special sensors installed already, you might consider trying one labeled for use in the presence of fluorescent lighting.
J D Stevens
1997 U295 CAI 36' Build #5085
2002 Subaru Outback
Motorcade 16869
Bellville, TX

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #3 –
Quote from: George Hatfield –
While reinstalling the electronics after the Winegard was installed I learned a lot about the Xantech IR repeater we have in the Coach.  The guys at FOT advised that the repeater is located in back of the TV (see photo).  It had never worked very well, so I found it and fixed a loose wire that caused some of the problems I was experiencing.  However, the major problem (unreliable control of the electronics) was caused by the fluorescent lights in the coach.  When they are off, it works perfectly.  With them on it works sometimes, but not always.  There is a green LED in the receiving cell that comes on when an IR signal from the remote is received.  That LED is on continuously when any of the fluorescent lights are on.  We're going to change them to LEDs soon.
We also have this issue in our coach when the fluorescent lights (certain ones) are on ... I just finished diagnosing this problem (thinking it was IR from the florescent lights) but it turned out to be some of the ballasts making the coach 12V 'dirty'

To prove this I used a 120 to 12V power brick to power the Xantech block and then the eyes worked great even with all the lights on ... but change ti back to use the house 12V (with the fluorescent lights on) and they would not work, the eye would just stay green. 

I keep meaning to pick up some clip on ferrite chokes at radio shack to see if that will fix the issue, if not I'll just stay with the 12V AC adapter.
2000 / 36' / U320 / WTFE
WildEBeest / "Striving to put right what once went wrong"

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #4 –
Steve.... thanks for the info.  Tell me about these ferrite chokes.  Is this something I can clip onto the 12V lines?  Are there different sizes?

George
The selected media item is not currently available.
George Hatfield

  Never ever use World Line Motors of Nacogdoches for service!

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #5 –
You can find those ferrite chokes all over the place, notably on computer cables.  They are the lumps / bumps towards the end of the cable, notably on the keyboard, mouse, usb and video cables.  Their goal in life is to reduce EMI (electromagnetic interference) and RFI (radio-frequency interference).

For the most part they are clip on devices and they do come in different sizes so they fit on different sized round and flat cables.  They also come in different materials so you can tune them to various frequency ranges so you suppress the noise and not the signal.  In this case there is no signal anyway, its just all noise superimposed on the powerline.  You can take a clip on choke and wrap a smaller diameter cable though it several times (like a toroid) so it fits better and should improve the suppression.

Radio Shack sells several in the 3-4 dollar range so I thought they would be worth a try.  Not sure what frequency noise is on the DC line to know if they will be effective or not.
2000 / 36' / U320 / WTFE
WildEBeest / "Striving to put right what once went wrong"

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #6 –
Gosh, it is sad to read of all your troubles with the HD dish upgrade

Upon buying my FT at FOT last June I had them upgrade the TV with HD flat TV and the Travl'er dish -

FOT had the dish, Direct TV control box and everything else in stock - all I had to do was go buy the TV and BlueRay.

Everything has worked perfectly from day one - there were no additional holes from the old system to be sealed up and there was an older dish on coach upon purchase.

I've had such excellent service/work from the FOT staff, find we're quiet spoiled by it.

Do hope you get your voltage issue resolved. Maybe calling FOT might help.

Keep us posted as to results
Virginia Cunningham
Motorcader # 16992
'99 U320 40'
'06 Black Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Crew Cab

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #7 –
Quote from: Virginia, Jim & Ms Cricket –
Gosh, it is sad to read of all your troubles with the HD dish upgrade

I've had such excellent service/work from the FOT staff, find we're quiet spoiled by it.

Do hope you get your voltage issue resolved. Maybe calling FOT might help.

I'm not sure who this post is addressed to - George had his upgrade done at FOT and they are the ones who explained the problem with the IR receiver and fluorescent lights.  Someone else who had similar work done was also advised by FOT of the sensitivity of the IR receiver. 

Ours has done it the entire 7 years we've owned the coach, even before our upgrade, back when it was FT-original.  We initially accepted that it was the known sensitivity to the fluorescent lights, but Steve decided to delve into it further and see if he couldn't solve it (we engineers are like that  ;) ).  After running a few experiments where we blocked the IR receiver from "seeing" the fluorescent lights yet still having the problem, Steve suspected it was noise on the 12V supply when the fluorescent lights were on.  He was then able to prove this by providing an independent 12V source for the IR receiver and having the receiver operate perfectly, even with the fluorescents on.  The quest is now to filter the noise on the 12V that normally supplies the IR receiver.  That's where the chokes come in - they're something we've used before in other electronic applications.  All we have to do is find one that works (they are frequency-range-specific and we don't have a spectrum analyzer handy  ;) ) and it hasn't been a high priority. 

Yes, life in geek-dom  :))

Michelle
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Virginia, Jim & Ms Cricket –
Gosh, it is sad to read of all your troubles with the HD dish upgrade

The problems with the IR repeater had nothing to do with the upgrade of the dish.  And I have no complaints about the job done by FOT on the upgrade.  It works perfectly and so does the IR repeater if I leave the fluorescent lights off.

The selected media item is not currently available.
George Hatfield

  Never ever use World Line Motors of Nacogdoches for service!

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #9 –
I put in a wireless HF control like the nes coaches and don't worry about the eye any longer.
2025 Wanderbox Outpost 32 on F600 Expedition Motorhome
2015 Born Free Royal Splendor on Ford 550 nonslide version  for sale
Former Coaches  covering. 360,000 miles
1999 34 U270
2000 36 U320
2001 42' double slide U320
2018 Jeep Rubicon

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #10 –
Like George, we also are very happy with our new Winegard DirecTV HD satellite antenna.

We did install the optional accessory cable that automatically stows our antenna anytime the ignition is turned on.  Since we have several 110-volt needs, even when we drive, we leave our inverter switched on all the time, which keeps power to Winegard control box. As long as box is on, it will automatically stow when ignition is turned on.  This cable is easy to install our ourself.

Since it was not extra work, we also ran all four coax cables into motorhome.  We have had a standard definition DirecTV DVR for many years and this year we also purchased ($200) a DirecTV HR24-500 HD DVR.  Each DVR uses two coax cables, and since we had four cables, we kept the SD DVR so we could finish watching what we had previously recorded.  Now we realize that with two DVRs we have the capacity to record three programs and watch anything else, or record four programs, which has helped out in the few times we wanted to record more than two shows at the same time.

There is an adapter, which we did not install, to record two different programs on a DVR with just one cable from the antenna. 

We found with the larger open dish, we could still receive satellite signals 500 miles north of the border in Fort McMurray Alberta, so the antenna has advantages over smaller open dishes and domed antennas.  But we can not watch in-motion with an open dish.

Several years ago we installed a Niles IR repeater system that works pretty well and was easy to install.  http://www.nilesaudio.com/docs/productSheets/Series20IR_Cutsheet.pdf

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #11 –
Just bumping an older topic since I've made some updates in our coach. 

I tried the passive ferrite chokes on the 12V power to the IR control block.  This did cut down on the IR eye glowing for all but one of the fluorescent lights.  The one remaining light however would just light up the IR eye like you were pressing on a remote directly in front of the eye.

Next up I went to my junk box and pulled out a constant voltage filter, this would accept a Vin of 11-15V and output a constant 12V.  It was a filter from a 12V cigarette lighter adapter that powered an automotive LCD screen.  It was basically a small circuit board with an inductor and a couple of caps and resistors.  Nothing special but a more active filter than the passive chokes.

I took the 12V that was powering the IR block and used as the input to this filter and the output I put back to the IR block.  The result was ... tada ... no more glowing eye, and in fact the entire system is more responsive than ever (the passive chokes are still in place as well, on the output side of the active filter). 

Now turn on all the fluorescent lights you want, no problems at all :)  So that's my final proof that it was not, in our case, stray IR from the lights but noise on the 12V power line from the fluorescent ballasts.  Oh the noise is on the 12V not the ground for the curious.

I'll try and find a source for the filter so others can give it a try, sorry I only had one in the "pile".
2000 / 36' / U320 / WTFE
WildEBeest / "Striving to put right what once went wrong"

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #12 –
So when are you going to start selling "antiglow kits?"  Put me down for a couple!  Thanks for the info.
The selected media item is not currently available.
George Hatfield

  Never ever use World Line Motors of Nacogdoches for service!

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #13 –
If anyone out there can interpet Steve's post and put in language that us dummies could understand I'll buy them a case of beer.  :D

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #14 –
Quote from: Gary Bouland –
If anyone out there can interpet Steve's post and put in language that us dummies could understand I'll buy them a case of beer.  :D

He said his TV Remotes are working now.
I'll take "Bud" :P 
The selected media item is not currently available.Barry BEAM #16014
2003 U320 40' AGDS
Beamalarm, Foretravel technical help and specifications
"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve"

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #15 –
OK Barry, I'll accept that, Bud it is the next time we see you. :D
 

Re: Winegard HD dish conversion

Reply #16 –
Quote from: Barry Beam –

He said his TV Remotes are working now.
I'll take "Bud" :P 

 :o

At the minimum, Shiner Bock.  But Steve's a homebrewer - we don't drink that commercial stuff  :))

Yup - the remotes work, even snappier than before, and even with all the fluorescent lights on.

M
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320