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Topic: What assurance does a seller PDI give you? (Read 1390 times) previous topic - next topic

What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

As I try to help some folks, I hear PDI cited but have come to think that a PDI may mean  different things to consumers.  What assurance is a PDI?  The PDI seems at times misunderstood or perhaps misused as a selling point.  So  I asked Michelle, did she think it worthy of discussion?  She had a great analysis and response.  So here goes....

There seem two interpretations that people may apply to a PDI,

A Pre-Deliver Inspection could simply be an inspection and a report of what is/was found.  And no more.  Our Forum has at least one excellent PDI list of things you to check. 

Alternatively, a PDI could be interpreted that there was an inspection and that the seller-dealer repaired everything, i.e. thus the seller PDI it gives you significant assurance and value.  It may even be interpreted to repair things in the future for a limited time.

In my quite limited experience, I have learned that a potential buyer must understand the seller's definition of their PDI, otherwise the reliance you place may be much higher than it should.....ask the seller, what does your PDI mean (scope), what did/do you do (repairs), and what is the assurance it provides, what are the limitations? 

I hope that there is an RV standard or uniform understanding of the PDI scope and assurance but I think there is none.  What do you think... what does the PDI mean as an assurance to the buyer, or what should it mean? 

Perhaps Barry can add this to his Newbie help site in some way if you and he think it worthy to define, flesh this out and post.  Thanks for your insights, Mike. 
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #1 –
Quote from: Michael Jackie –
As I try to help some folks, I hear PDI cited but have come to think that a PDI may mean  different things to consumers.  What assurance is a PDI?  The PDI seems at times misunderstood or perhaps misused as a selling point.  So  I asked Michelle, did she think it worthy of discussion?  She had a great analysis and response.  So here goes....

There seem two interpretations that people may apply to a PDI,

A Pre-Deliver Inspection could simply be an inspection and a report of what is/was found.  And no more.  Our Forum has at least one excellent PDI list of things you to check. 

Alternatively, a PDI could be interpreted that there was an inspection and that the seller-dealer repaired everything, i.e. thus the seller PDI it gives you significant assurance and value.  It may even be interpreted to repair things in the future for a limited time.

In my quite limited experience, I have learned that a potential buyer must understand the seller's definition of their PDI, otherwise the reliance you place may be much higher than it should.....ask the seller, what does your PDI mean (scope), what did/do you do (repairs), and what is the assurance it provides, what are the limitations? 

I hope that there is an RV standard or uniform understanding of the PDI scope and assurance but I think there is none.  What do you think... what does the PDI mean as an assurance to the buyer, or what should it mean? 

Perhaps Barry can add this to his Newbie help site in some way if you and he think it worthy to define, flesh this out and post.  Thanks for your insights, Mike. 

My idea of a PDI inspection is one that I do myself or pay someone to do it before I buy the coach.
Any thing I find wrong I would expect the dealer to fix.
I would also negotiate a defined period for them to fix anything not found in the original PDI as you cant check everything in a couple of hours.
A dealers PDI is worthless to me. It is arbitrary and no way to know if everything was checked.
How many times have we heard board members buy a coach that was supposed to be checked only to find batteries that are 10 years old.
I only care about a defined warranty period backing up anything going wrong.
You have to do your own due diligence.
The selected media item is not currently available.Barry BEAM #16014
2003 U320 40' AGDS
Beamalarm, Foretravel technical help and specifications
"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve"

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #2 –
For the most part Dealer PDI doesn't mean much, I'll look myself. However when I bought my F/T the dealer brought out the shop foreman, and the mechanic and a list of all repairs they had completed. We then spent an hour going over everything inside and out and underneath, and then a test drive with the service manager, we found a few small items that where repaired when I picked up the coach the next afternoon.
Bruce, Linda, and Macy
Zoey RIP 1/20/19
1999 U295 40' build #5400
2017 silver Jeep Wrangler, 1260 watts of solar on top
Moving around the country

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #3 –
To me, a PDI is nothing more than a status report of the RV.  Like a home inspection - the inspector tells you what's wrong and give no assurances about anything.  If there's something to fix, then that's between the buyer and seller.

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #4 –
FWIW - Our experience with FOT just last fall:  A 75 point "Consignors System Check" was done on the coach when it was put on consignment at FOT.  I got a copy.  If an item was not functioning properly there were not a lot of specifics about the problem.  However, I did find the corresponding service order and repair for every nonfunctional item in the service folder that the owner kept for the coach.  The previous owner just told FOT to fix every issue they found before putting the coach up for sale.  There were no major ($$$) issues to address on delivery of our coach.  That and the coach came with a 3 month warranty on the most major systems.  I'm guessing that the owner paid for that as well.  Knowing all of the above we were fairly confident in our purchase.
The selected media item is not currently available.

Mark & Mary Benko
Former coach: 2005 U295 3823
Jeep Cherokee, Honda Fit

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #5 –
Thanks so much for your responses and interest.  I want to be a help; it is hard for an inexperienced newbie to repay to the Forum in even a small way the help that many on this site have provided us. 

I worried that this PDI thing might waste your time but took the chance it might help someone.  I have seen and been through a couple of unpleasant events which I decided must be due to divergent opinions of what a PDI means to the buyer. 

Thank you for your interest and help.  You are all appreciated.  Mike
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #6 –
Quote from: Barry Beam –

A dealers PDI is worthless to me. It is arbitrary and no way to know if everything was checked.

You have to do your own due diligence.

+1

Technically, PDI means "pre delivery inspection", so by that definition it does not include the cost of fixing anything.

Most (maybe all?) RV dealers are not equipped to do a thorough inspection of the chassis, engine, and transmission.  They can check fluid levels and maybe service records if the owner provides them, but a really close look of those systems (if there is concern) is best left to a certified shop and you will find very few RV places are Cummins, Caterpillar, or Allison certified.

Also, in the end the seller or dealer is are all about closing the deal.  Getting you to sign and turn over your money.  Their incentive to find and point out issues in a "pre delivery inspection" is not high (unless they know the seller is anxious to sell and is willing to absorb the cost of repair). 

Some inexperienced folks might think PDI means everything in the coach is looked at and is proven to work well.  In all honesty, the basic systems are probably operated once to make sure they respond, but things like washer/dryers aren't likely to be cycled, calibration of tanks isn't likely to be checked/done, etc.

This could be a good topic to actually level-set for those who think a dealer PDI is more than an inspection to make sure the major systems are at least responding.  Of course the goal is not to scare folks off, but to help them understand it may be in their best interest, if they aren't experienced, to consider paying for an independent inspection.  A little additional out of pocket on the purchase could save them money in the long run.  Folks in the horse business often do a "vet check" for the same reason. 

To us, the one that the buyer does themselves, either if they are experienced enough to do it themselves or pay an independent contractor to do it for them, is the only PDI that counts.

Michelle
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #7 –
I went through a dealer's PDI when I purchased a motorhome from them quite a number of years ago.  They had a retired, part time, employee doing them.  He had "expertise" because he had been a RVer for many years.  The exercise was suppose to be like instruction on how to operate the individual parts of the motorhome.  If he found something that didn't work, it was, "go talk to your salesman" if you want it fixed.  There were other items that he said "I've never seen anything like that, don't now how it works".  Had to call the ers twice on the trip home and was stranded over the weekend by the ers in Columbus, Ohio and had to fix the coach myself to get it going.  I should have lost all faith in Camping World over that motorhome purchase right then and there!  Had I hired someone to do a pre-inspection for me, I'd have never brought that motorhome.  I did get rid of their emergency road service and switched to Coach Net.  Little did I know back then.
1994 U225
build #4514

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #8 –
From what I've seen PDI typically focuses on things like does ref work, water heater, ac units etc., very little or nothing regarding the expensive stuff, engine, tranny, suspension, steering, brake condition.  There are a couple folks who frequent this forum who are sometimes available to do a legitimate inspection.  I'd either do it myself or hire someone who knows more than me, and has experience with the brand, to do it.  All items found on PDI become negotiating points on purchase price. 

Chuck
"Not so  long ago we were a nation of risk takers, riding five million pounds of  thrust straight into space."  Joe Gresh
Chuck Pearson
1996 U295
2018 Can Am X3 TurboRS

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #9 –
After reading your responses, detailed and helpful, I think this was a pretty good topic to introduce and emphasized what I had experienced and what I was seeing with some buyers.

How do we make folks aware of this?  It is current today, we are reading it.  But is there a way to tag this on the Forum?  (I guess if a newbie, new owner to be, does a search of PDI, they will get to this thread.)  I hope someone can find a way to move this from the concern stage to a reference herein for potential buyers.  I think I might do a literature search.  Could this be an article for a magazine, has it been?  Maybe.  Have a blessed weekend, Mike
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #10 –
As a wannabe, I read most of the forums and in doing so I run across acronyms that most outsiders are not familiar with.
Has anyone posted as a "Sticky" or link a list of frequently used acronyms and their meanings.
I was reading PatC post and they used "ers ". What does that mean?

Thanks

Don
Don

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #11 –
Don, I am very new to this but enthusiastic.  I read Pat to be saying that he contacted "Emergency road service".  You can purchase such an insurance through several sources, such as an insurance company where you buy an Rv or Good Sam.  Mike
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #12 –
ERS...emergency road service...Best known for Good Sam members.

Peter
Peter & Beth Martin
No Forrest? What have you done?
MC# 15890 until Dec 2016; FMCA #F329677
Cincinnati, OH

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #13 –
My literature research to date.  The February 2012 FMCA magazine has a brief letter response regarding what a PDI means.  However it cites an RV standard, NFPA 1192 and I  find that that covers fire and system safety.  If FMCA gives me permission to post their PDI letter response, I will do so but in the meantime you can read it on their web site.  It says similar to what we are saying, buyer beware and hire help to do the PDI.  Newbies however are probably seeing this too late, they may join FMCA or such after buying.  So I want to change the dealers!  Yeah, I know...good luck with that.  Mike
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #14 –
Quote from: Donmystic1 –

I was reading PatC post and they used "ers ". What does that mean?
Emergency Road Service.  At the time I had the ERS that Camping World sold.  They left me hanging.  But today I have CoachNet and am very pleased with them. Excellent outfit.
1994 U225
build #4514

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #15 –
Quote from: Michael Jackie –
You can purchase such an insurance through several sources, such as an insurance company where you buy an Rv or Good Sam.  Mike
Basically CoachNet, Good Sam, AAA and Road America.  the insurance companies usually contract through one of those 4 providers.  They will provide a tow for you, contact a road service truck to come to your location, change a tire.  Things like that.  In my book, CoachNet is tops.    They even provide Concierge Service.  You need to read the contract and most importantly reviews of their services.  AAA does not provide towing for RVs in many parts of the country.
1994 U225
build #4514
 

Re: What assurance does a seller PDI give you?

Reply #16 –
This was coverage from FMCA magazine, February 2012:

"A PDI checklist is used by the professionals to inspect and test all the systems and components on any motorhome prior to the sale. Even if you must pay for this service yourself, at least you'll know the true condition of that motorhome. If you buy from an established dealer, they will perform the PDI service as part of the purchase. Even in this case, it's not a bad idea to have a PDI performed by an independent inspector you hire who would have your best interests in mind. You also should make sure that the PDI — from the dealer or someone you pay for the service — is performed by an individual or service team that has technical expertise with the motorhome's house systems, chassis, and drive train. Always retain copies of any and all PDI forms you receive.

All RVs should be constructed to the standards of NFPA 1192, and a PDI will confirm the safety and status of the major systems and components. PDI checklists can be quite comprehensive, as they should be. Any discrepancies found during the PDI can then become bargaining chips for price negotiation or could outright negate the sale between private parties, in some cases. Use it to your advantage."

I hope some variation of this language is captured in the Forum as a reference for Newbie use, or others.  I have seen misunderstanding on this be very important, financially and to the enjoyment or disappointment of buying a motorhome.  Mike
Mike
2001 U320 4010 Build 5878 (Gus)
Wrangle Unlimited Toad
Nacogdoches