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Topic: Re: Inverter/solar installation (Read 1219 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Quote from: wa_desert_rat –
Boy, you just don't mess around when it comes to working on your RV. Awesome. Thanks for the write-up and the pics. :)

Craig

Thanks Craig.  ;D

Wait till you see the inverter/solar installation.  8)

Some previews below.

And Don - I've been watching your frame repair project. That's some major work. It'll be worth it in the end. You can't buy from someone else what you put of yourself into it. It becomes a very personal thing.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #1 –
Steve,
That inverter/solar system is one sweet upgrade, nice job! Looking forward to pictures of the finished refer install...
Don

Quote from: Merle Hench –
Thanks Craig.  ;D

Wait till you see the inverter/solar installation.  8)

Some previews below.

And Don - I've been watching your frame repair project. That's some major work. It'll be worth it in the end. You can't buy from someone else what you put of yourself into it. It becomes a very personal thing.

Steve
The selected media item is not currently available.
Don & Tys
1999 U270 3602 WTFE #5402
Xtreme Stage 1 w/Headlight, Step Conversion, etc.
2009 Honda Fit Sport with Navi
Freedom is NOT "just another word for nothing left to lose"... with apologies to Kris Kristofferson

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #2 –
Thanks Don.  ;D

The most frustrating part of the inverter install was trying to find a crimper big enough to handle 4/0 cable lugs. Called every rental outlet in the book, local garages, auto electric outlets, even a few electricians. No joy. Finally decided to just buy one and get it done. Found this 16 ton hydraulic crimper on ebay for not a lot of money - works like a charm --> NEW 16 TON HYDRAULIC WIRE BATTERY TERMINAL CABLE LUG TAP CRIMPER CRIMPERS TOOL |

You can't have enough tools.  :)

Steve



1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #3 –
Nice!
The selected media item is not currently available. Dave Head & Megan Westbrook
Titusville, FL - The Great Outdoors
'98 270 buying this month
Toad is a 2018 F150 XLT

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #4 –
Now you can rent it out to get your money back!!!
Coachless, now use aircraft. 2003 Ford Travelair TC280 class C. Super shape. Just for 1 yr .
1994 Ford E350 ClassC,total renovation inside and out. Now sold.
2000 U295  36' Cummins 350 c/w Banks Stinger, Resonator upgrade,Solar, LED lites.Residential fridge with slide out pantry. Build 5674. Sold
ex 92 GV 022C ored Cummins. Sold
ex 95 GV240 cat 3116. Sold
2017 Mini cooper s & 2016 land Rover LR2 HSE  LUX.
jhaygarth@aol.com    SKP #130098
treat everyone as you would like to be.

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #5 –
Hey Steve,
Another option instead of crimping would be to solder the connection. One benefit would be a lower resistance connection.
The selected media item is not currently available.Bob & Faith Rozek
1997 U320 40'
Xtreme Remodel
2010 Scion XD

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #6 –
I've used a small hammer crimper that a friend had.  put cable in, put it on the ground or an anvil-equivalent, swat it with a 3 lb sledge.  Done.  Not so good for crimping existing cables under the rig... :))
Dave and Nancy
1999/2013 U270 36' Xtreme
Motorcade # 16774
2013 Subaru Outback
KD0NIM

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #7 –
Quote from: Dave Katsuki –
I've used a small hammer crimper that a friend had.  put cable in, put it on the ground or an anvil-equivalent, swat it with a 3 lb sledge.  Done.  Not so good for crimping existing cables under the rig... :))

Ah yes... the "percussion crimper". We are beginning to see a pattern here.....

Craig :)
1993 U225 36' Unihome GV with PACBRAKE exhaust retarder, Banks Stinger and Solar Panels.
Toad: 1999 Jeep Wrangler 2-door soft-top.

"No one has ever had to evacuate a city because the solar panels broke."

Re: Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Dave Head –
Nice!

Thanks Dave. Spent more time figuring out all the details than I did actually putting it together.  :)

Quote from: John Haygarth –
Now you can rent it out to get your money back!!!

Thought about that, but I learned a long time ago never to lend out books or tools. If I don't use it again in the next 6-12 months, I'll sell it and hopefully get most of my money back. Also considering getting into RV solar installs when I get to Canada. Might need that crimper again.

Quote from: flite2010 –
Hey Steve,
Another option instead of crimping would be to solder the connection. One benefit would be a lower resistance connection.

Thanks Bob, but I think I'd need an awfully big soldering gun for that size cable  ;D I'd also be concerned with how much solder gets wicked up the cable, making it impossible to bend at the ends. Welding cable is the best option, but the most expensive. Cable runs are about 5 feet total from the inverter to the batteries.

Quote from: Dave Katsuki –
I've used a small hammer crimper that a friend had.  put cable in, put it on the ground or an anvil-equivalent, swat it with a 3 lb sledge.  Done.  Not so good for crimping existing cables under the rig... :))

Hi Dave,

That was the least expensive option, but in my mind, also the least secure. With all the heating/cooling and current going through there (up to about 350 amps) I didn't want to worry about the integrity of the connections. 16 tons of crimping power on the terminal lug means those cables are not coming loose. Period.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #9 –
As this has become it's own thread, I may as well lay out what's going together here...

The inverter is a pure sine wave Magnum 2800 watt model with 125A 5 stage charger. It was optioned out with a battery monitor module, gen start module, and advanced remote. In the battery bay I added a Magnum battery combiner module to keep the start battery topped up. There is a 400 amp T class fuse on the positive line going in, and a shunt on the negative side for battery monitoring.

Note regarding the DC equipment ground - spoke to both Magnum and James T at FT to make sure I was doing that part correctly.  Based on how these coaches are wired, the DC equipment ground cable needs to be the same size as the negative cable - in this case another 4/0 cable. This cable should terminate at the common ground point on the DC bus, which in my case is behind a cover in the battery bay. Magnum supplies a connector at the ground point for #6 cable - I was told to remove the connector and just use the bolt. Only problem is - that bolt is only a 1/4 diameter. Not near big enough to connect a 3/8 battery lug. I used a tapered reamer to open up the hole in the case big enough for a 3/8 bolt.

On the AC side, a Surge Guard Power monitor was installed between the transfer switch and the main breaker panel. That will protect everything from miswired/flaky power pedestals. The remote will keep me apprised of goings on.

The existing GE breaker panel was removed. Cut a big hole in the end of the bed, framed for two new breaker panels, and covered that with 1/4 black melamine sheet with oak trim. Two Siemens 125A 10 space main breaker panels (with copper busses) were installed. 100 Amp 10-Space 20-Circuit Indoor Renovation Main Breaker Load Center Value

What's nice about these boxes is that you can install any breaker you want for the main. The first box was wired as the main panel, with a 50A main breaker. There is a 30A double pole circuit to feed the inverter, and there are four other circuits on this panel - front A/C, rear A/C, engine block heater, and the water heater (that circuit used to be connected to the converter, which is no more). The second box is for inverter (or shore/gen) powered circuits. It has a 30A main breaker (coming from the inverter), and four circuits - microwave, and bathroom, outside and inside outlets.

Getting AC power to and from the inverter proved to be a challenge. FT installs a sub floor and routes all the Romex in there when the coach goes together. There is no practical way to add more cables that way. Ended up routing 1 inch flexible conduit from the electrical comparment, through the firewall into the engine bay, and then through channels in the frame, ending up in the main cable tray and then battery compartment. From there they went through the battery bay ceiling and to the inverter. This proved to be the best way to route the data cable for the power monitor as well.

I'll get more pics to better illustrate what I'm talking about.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #10 –
With regards to the solar install, I spent several months researching and shopping. In the end, I went to AM Solar, as they have a better grasp of a mobile installation than anyone else I corresponded with.

I ordered the SunRunner 45/4 core system - a TriStar MPPT 45 amp solar charge controller with remote, plenty of 4/2 battery cable, 60A circuit breaker, temp sensor, and all the bits needed to do a proper install. The larger combiner box was ordered as the fridge vent model is too small for #4 cable.

Before doing anything else, I cut out four pieces of cardboard the same size as the panels I'm going to use, and climbed up on the roof to lay out exactly where everything would go. Once that was finalized, I mounted the combiner box on the roof near the fridge vent, using Dicor to seal all holes. Two additional holes had to be cut for the battery cables, as this box has only four knockouts and I am planning to install four panels. Watertight connectors were used at the box and at the fridge vent, where the cable passed through, and the cables were sheathed in split loom tubing for additional protection. The box will be covered by one of the panels once installed, reducing exposure to the elements.

Cables went through the fridge vent, and were routed/tied down the back corner of the fridge bay, and through the floor into the battery bay. The TriStar controller was mounted in the battery bay behind the start battery. It may get warm, but it won't likely get hot. If temps prove to be an issue, and auxiliary temp controlled blower will be added. Still need to terminate all the battery cable ends, but waiting until the batteries are back in place to do a neat job.

Still to get are four OM-150 (150 watt) panels, but I wanted to get all the wiring done first, so I can finally get the fridge back in place.

I'll get some pics of this later today.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #11 –
Steve, good choice with AM as they do know what they do. Dave is very good on working out systems as is  Greg of course. We are very happy with the 4-150 panels and are proving down here in mexico to work fine and keep us charged up. Still not have had gen set on since leaving home Nov 11 but have plugged into 120 twice as clouds and heavy use of kitchen stuff a couple of times took us down to 75% battery and I did not want it to go lower. Very happy and may get 1 more panel and another Lifeline battery 8D in the near future to make it 4. Handy to have extra capacity.  I have the same monitor and 45mppt as you and they work well. I also put in the Trimetic TM2025 monitoring panel for quick viewing.
John
Coachless, now use aircraft. 2003 Ford Travelair TC280 class C. Super shape. Just for 1 yr .
1994 Ford E350 ClassC,total renovation inside and out. Now sold.
2000 U295  36' Cummins 350 c/w Banks Stinger, Resonator upgrade,Solar, LED lites.Residential fridge with slide out pantry. Build 5674. Sold
ex 92 GV 022C ored Cummins. Sold
ex 95 GV240 cat 3116. Sold
2017 Mini cooper s & 2016 land Rover LR2 HSE  LUX.
jhaygarth@aol.com    SKP #130098
treat everyone as you would like to be.

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #12 –
Thanks John.

Their panels cost more than the standard Kyoceras, but I clearly see why they had them made the way they did. It's good to know this system is working very well for you. I spoke to Dave for awhile, going over what I had come up with - he said it was good to go and away I went.  :)

I've added a bunch of pics below. Still in progress...

Steve

P.S. In the pic of the new breaker panels, I haven't installed the oak trim yet. Too cold right now to use the adhesive.
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #13 –
 ;D me likey! Very nice indeed. I can't wait to get to these kinds of projects (ones that don't involve grinding rusty metal!). Definetly bookmarking this thread... keep the pics coming!
Don
Quote from: Merle Hench –
Thanks John.

Their panels cost more than the standard Kyoceras, but I clearly see why they had them made the way they did. It's good to know this system is working very well for you. I spoke to Dave for awhile, going over what I had come up with - he said it was good to go and away I went.  :)

I've added a bunch of pics below. Still in progress...

Steve

P.S. In the pic of the new breaker panels, I haven't installed the oak trim yet. Too cold right now to use the adhesive.
The selected media item is not currently available.
Don & Tys
1999 U270 3602 WTFE #5402
Xtreme Stage 1 w/Headlight, Step Conversion, etc.
2009 Honda Fit Sport with Navi
Freedom is NOT "just another word for nothing left to lose"... with apologies to Kris Kristofferson

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #14 –
Finally have something new to report - we have inversion!  :)

The biggest hassle of all was running AC power to and from the inverter - no way to route it in the subfloor - it required conduit run through the firewall into the engine bay, down the frame rail then into the center cable tray into the battery bay, then up through the floor to the inverter. But it is finally all connected and working. Finished.

Battery connections are getting very busy, with the inverter, solar charge controller, and two temp sensors connected now. Finished.

Fridge is in place, but the install isn't quite done. In back I bolted it down with brackets through the shelf into the support frame. In front I'm fabricating a lower aluminum cover plate which will fasten to the fridge legs. More on that when it's done in the "residential fridge" thread. Good access to the condensate tray through the outside access door. Almost finished.

There was a sizable arc when the last (negative) battery cable was connected. Magnum warns of this - it is the capacitors inside the unit charging up. It stays off by default until activated. You can turn it on/off via a pushbutton switch in the back of the unit or via the remote.

The advanced remote has an awful lot of programmable parameters in there, and lots of info on power used and other data. It even lists the temperature of the inverter transformer and transistors.

I checked all the circuits for AC power with a trouble light and by turning on the fridge and microwave. All good. Interesting note - the microwave/convection range fan, on low speed, draws the same amount of power from the inverter as the fridge - 11 amps (@ 12 volts).

Finishing the solar side is down to installing the four panels (ordering them this week), connecting them to the combiner box, and switching on the solar charge controller. More to come.

It was a good day. No sparks, no flames, no explosions - everything worked.  :)

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #15 –
Well, finally, the solar install is completed. Panels went on yesterday and wiring was routed and terminated today. It was a warm, sunny day, right up until the last panel's wiring was being terminated. Then it suddenly got dark and cloudy. Figures... my 600 watts of panels were generating about 70 watts.  ::) Panel placement was largely dictated by the desire to be able to access everything on the roof. They could have been packed together more, but I wouldn't be able to get to everything.

As my roof was coated it was decided to forego adhesive and use the stainless screws supplied in the AM Solar panel kit. Dicor sealant was applied to seal all the holes. As it oozed out everywhere, I have no concerns about leaks. The wiring similarly had to be secured with screws, and as such, I wanted to avoid drilling into the frames of the vent openings, etc. So while it's not all that pretty, it is secured, sealed, and it works. Once the breaker was switched on, everything worked correctly.

One item of note - the combiner box, which had been mounted a few weeks earlier, had about a 1/2 inch of water in it when opened to terminate the panels. Can only conlcude this was condensate, as the box is sealed. Two 1/8 holes were drilled in the upper part of the box facing the back to provide some ventilation. The terminal blocks were removed and cleaned, and once everything was terminated and checked, liquid electrical tape was applied to everything to seal the connections. I'll be checking the box again to see if condensate builds up again.

The sun came out for a couple of minutes, and the TriStar recorded a peak of 406 watts with the panels flat on the roof. Will see how this pans out, as I'll be boondocking pretty soon.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #16 –
Sweet! ^.^d You sure have come a long way on this coach! Maybe we will EGT to her at Quartzite  next year... Surely, ours will be ready by then! :-\
Don
The selected media item is not currently available.
Don & Tys
1999 U270 3602 WTFE #5402
Xtreme Stage 1 w/Headlight, Step Conversion, etc.
2009 Honda Fit Sport with Navi
Freedom is NOT "just another word for nothing left to lose"... with apologies to Kris Kristofferson
 

Re: Inverter/solar installation

Reply #17 –
 :)) :)) :))

You'll get there Don. And it'll be worth it in the end.

But one does get weary with the workload...

Got the generator back in and bolted down as well yesterday. The bolt-in factory installation has been converted to a slide out. Just need to finish connecting everything. Next week the desk goes in and I can start putting together my micro studio.

Steve
1991 U225 Grand Villa