Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Topic: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights) (Read 1048 times) previous topic - next topic

Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

September 28, 2012, 07:08:34 am

Quote from: Neal Pillsbury – September 27, 2012, 08:02:41 pm

Quote;
We try to keep the coach light because we tow upwards of 9000 lbs in trailer plus SUV plus Goldwing.

Now that's got to be one interesting setup, how's your tow(s) arranged?

Chuck

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #1 – September 28, 2012, 11:50:47 am

Quote from: Chuck Pearson – September 28, 2012, 07:08:34 am

Now that's got to be one interesting setup, how's your tow(s) arranged?
Chuck

Chuck,

Tried them all abreast................That irritated the natives.
Tried them stacked.....................Had trouble with the Parkway overpasses.
Tried them in tandem.................That seems to be working.

Featherlite 3200#, Lexus 4500#, Goldwing 850# = 8550#
Vehicles in tandem in trailer, 6" between bike and car, 6" between car and tailgate/ramp.
If I ever get tired of the Goldwing, I'll get a Can Am "side by" and petition for entry into "Brad's Marauders" - Sounds like a TON of FUN!
G'Day,
Neal

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #2 – September 28, 2012, 07:30:39 pm

Quote from: Neal Pillsbury – September 28, 2012, 11:50:47 am

Featherlite 3200#, Lexus 4500#, Goldwing 850# = 8550#
Vehicles in tandem in trailer, 6" between bike and car, 6" between car and tailgate/ramp.
If I ever get tired of the Goldwing, I'll get a Can Am "side by" and petition for entry into "Brad's Marauders" - Sounds like a TON of FUN!
G'Day,
Neal

Neal,

Very interesting. I've been going back and forth on the tow vs trailer setup, in this case it would be a BMW Z3 + the current toy which could vary between a trials bike, dualsport or a side by side. I'd appreciate the benefit of your experience to tell me if I'm adding this up right.

Trailer advantages:
Back up ability.
Protection and security for vehicles.
Less wear and tear on vehicle suspension, body and tires. I'm thinking if you dodge a pothole with the coach you will centerpunch it with a toad.

The sole disadvantage I come up with, and it's a biggie, how do you handle a tight campground? Do you drop the trailer or just avoid non pull thru sites?

Chuck

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #3 – September 28, 2012, 09:23:37 pm

Chuck, I like the idea of the pull thru, however the last trip I stoped at a KOA in SD, towing the F150 p/u and using the 36' coach, it just barely fit within the drive thru site, so I wonder about the added length and inability to move te trailer if need to unhook. Maybe you need a HD bumper hitch on the Z3 to move it around ?
Dave M

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #4 – September 29, 2012, 01:06:54 am

Quote from: Chuck Pearson – September 28, 2012, 07:30:39 pm

Neal,

Very interesting. I've been going back and forth on the tow vs trailer setup, in this case it would be a BMW Z3 + the current toy which could vary between a trials bike, dualsport or a side by side. I'd appreciate the benefit of your experience to tell me if I'm adding this up right.

Trailer advantages:
Back up ability.
Protection and security for vehicles.
Less wear and tear on vehicle suspension, body and tires. I'm thinking if you dodge a pothole with the coach you will centerpunch it with a toad.
The sole disadvantage I come up with, and it's a biggie, how do you handle a tight campground? Do you drop the trailer or just avoid non pull thru sites?
Chuck

Chuck,
For a few years we used the coach associated with business and travelled w/o a tow car.
Then we towed Honda Odysseys and an Acura MDX, 4 wheels down, for the better part of a decade.
After retirement, we got back into touring motorcycles and I knew that I didn't want motorcycle lifts, open trailers or dollies as options. We pride ourselves with keeping our belongings in "like new" condition and that wasn't going to happen with those options and the amount of travelling that we like to do.

So it came down to the choice of a trailer. Featherlite was one of only 2 or 3 that met my weight and strength criteria and also had the advantage of the highest resale value if I wanted to back out of my decision (there are many good reasons that the NASCAR circuit loves these Featherlites, as well as the professional car haulers).
One knows that the trailer is there and the coach behaves more sedately, but is still no slouch. I just turn everything down a notch, when the trailer is along.
Here's some (+'s) and (-'s) that you may not have thought of:
Beyond the obvious clean, secure, protected contents and easy travel cleanup:
1. The coach handles as though it is much longer. The suspension becomes even more mellow and stable and the linear stability becomes rock steady. A 36' coach becomes an actual 60' coach!
2. The ability to "back up at will" is extremely liberating in that one is able to navigate tighter areas without fear of having to free a bound up hitch and release the toad in an ever so slightly misjudged tight area.
3. The trailer is the same width as the coach and it is easily visible (including all four tires and the marker lights at night) at all times in the side mirrors.
4. The fully proportional braking system (I use a Tekonsha P3 and the Featherlite uses 4 wheel electric disc brakes) is infinitely tunable and very effective in both manual and fully automatic modes, with or without use of the coach retarder.
5. The trailer can be parked and unhooked in two minutes, if necessary, and I have the SUV set up to tow it, when needed. Hookup is just as fast, once one becomes proficient.
Disadvantages:
1. One doesn't have to but travelling runs much more smoothly if you call ahead and weed out the non-friendly overnight accommodations. With a Woodalls, the RV Park Reviews app. and a few phone calls, we seldom have any difficulty or unexpected challenges. Really only one poor experience in over six years of use of the trailer. We usually don't even mention the trailer. We just say we prefer a pull through but what do they have for 60' or greater, Big Rig sites.
2. One must have a 50 amp extension cord that is as long as your trailer, or you are eventually going to be inconvenienced. Same with water. Sewer sometimes (maybe 30 to 40% of the time) becomes a "when you arrive/or when you depart/or use the dump station". I only carry one high quality, 10' sewer hose.
3. For a car to ride safely and well, it needs to ride on its own suspension. The bike won't tear out the "D" rings, but a car will! DO NOT TIE DOWN A CAR DOWN BY ITS FRAME! Therefore, tie downs need to be "strap baskets" that cage over the tires or I just use straps that cinch though the spokes of the 4 wheels and ratchet to the Featherlite 4 "D" rings mounted IN THE TRAILER FLOOR to the trailer frame. So of the four above, that's the first one that I consider to be an actual "option imposition" disadvantage. Mostly because you need to think ahead and load the car when it is clean and dry, if you don't want to roll around in the mud and the wet. The other thing is that this takes a little more than twice as long to accomplish the four straps as it does to simply hook up a tow bar, a braking system and verify hookup for 4 wheels down towing.
4. The SECOND significant disadvantage is having to crawl in and out of the driver's window to access or egress the car. The door will only open 2 " and it's easier to go in and out of the window than to crawl over the driver's seat and out the hatchback (plus the DW generally has STUFF in the car anyway).
5. The only other significant disadvantage is the need to select and maintain good tires. The trailer is being pushed to near its weight rating as well, so good tires are mandatory. And they deteriorate even more quickly than coach tires. I use the "Michelins" of trailer tires:
Carlisle Radial Trail, ST235/85R16
ST = Special Trailer
(for Trailer Service Only)

DO NOT TRY TO USE LT (Light Truck) Rated Tires
Canadian mfg

LR F = 12 Ply
Tread: 3 Polyester, 2 Steel, 1 Nylon
Sidewall: 2 Polyester
Max Single, 3960 Lbs. @ 95psig Cold (I run mine at 90 psig)

I learned early on that trailer tires are expensive, safely last only four years, and need to be cared for as well or even more carefully than coach tires.
There's probably more that I should mention, but these are the things that come readily to mind.
After 6(+) years and around 50K(+) miles, of trailer use, I wouldn't go back, at least while we're still riding the Goldwing and still limber enough to crawl in a out of that driver's window. Plus it's great to be able to select and protect any vehicle(s) I want (they don't have to be 4 wheels down compatible) as our transportation.
Hope this is of some good use to you.
Best wishes,
Neal

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #5 – September 29, 2012, 09:02:13 am

Neal, that was a great and very informative post, and I applaud your effort in posting it. It is relevant to me for I too am weighing the pros and cons of trailering both a car and motorcycle.

I too ride a Goldwing. I hate the thought of trailering my Wing, but my wife is not able to ride as far as she once was. (That, and the little fur kids, is the main reason for the Foretravel) Also, her sister will be traveling with us much of the time, so that means a car is necessary. I've been wondering if it would be feasable to tow both a car and my Goldwing. Your post tells me it is possible. I'll file it in my memory banks for future reference. It will have to be for future reference involving my next Foretravel, as my present rig is incapable of towing that much weight.

Thanks,
Glen

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #6 – September 29, 2012, 09:04:07 am

We met a guy at FOT who pulls a custom 24' trailer full of toys. He carries a gasoline powered dolly that will move the trailer even if it is loaded.

Thanks for the excellent description and list of considerations, Neal.

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #7 – September 29, 2012, 10:10:24 am

Thanks,
Glad to be of some small help.
I know that I had a thousand and one questions, while I was trying to decide.
I also found that I fretted over many inconsequential things (like campground lot availability and small campground navigation) as well as failed to discover some things that have the most impact (like how important and specialized trailer tire selection turns out to be, if you want to have a "trouble-free" trailering experience).
Neal

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #8 – September 29, 2012, 10:29:20 am

Thanks Neil, I appreciate you supplying a reasoned solution to a vexing question. I've been going back and forth on the towing issue and your response makes the decision process far more clear.

Chuck

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #9 – September 29, 2012, 10:34:26 am

Curious - they don't make a Featherlite with some type of side door for easier access to a towed?

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #10 – September 29, 2012, 12:33:51 pm

Quote from: Mark Benko – September 29, 2012, 10:34:26 am

Curious - they don't make a Featherlite with some type of side door for easier access to a towed?

Mark,
The problem with side doors is that on 102" wide trailers, the doors must swing above the tire fenderwells of the trailer.
Light weight/light duty trailers have smaller diameter wheels that extend less into the interior space of the trailer or the trailers ride higher off the ground, both of which are not desireable for reliable driving, strength and heavy service.
My interior fenderwells are 7.5" wide X 15" high X 6.5 feet long. They are great for standing on to get into the car but allow only about 3" space on either side of a full size vehicle.
If one has a vehicle with a raised suspension and/or "high water sneakers" that will allow the door to clear the fenderwells, then one has to have a taller interior trailer (mine is 6.5'). That involves custom design/fabrication, more structural materials, more weight, less carrying capacity, more frontal area, other inefficiencies. It is most cost effective and a much higher resale market pool if one stays with the smallest standard design that will work for your particular application. Being a KISS principle person, I stayed away from side door concepts - too many negatives for me.
Thanks for the interest,
Neal

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #11 – September 29, 2012, 03:10:19 pm

Neal - thanks for the great explanation and pic. That makes alot of sense. I'm sure that will help everyone who is considering a trailer.

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Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

September 28, 2012, 07:08:34 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #1 – September 28, 2012, 11:50:47 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #2 – September 28, 2012, 07:30:39 pm

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #3 – September 28, 2012, 09:23:37 pm

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #4 – September 29, 2012, 01:06:54 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #5 – September 29, 2012, 09:02:13 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #6 – September 29, 2012, 09:04:07 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #7 – September 29, 2012, 10:10:24 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #8 – September 29, 2012, 10:29:20 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #9 – September 29, 2012, 10:34:26 am

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #10 – September 29, 2012, 12:33:51 pm

Re: Neal's towing setup (was Re: Actual Weights VS Placard Weights)

Reply #11 – September 29, 2012, 03:10:19 pm

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