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Topic: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner (Read 1214 times) previous topic - next topic

Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

For years, we kept our start battery bank charged with a custom diode device.  Last year we tried two different battery combiners that use voltage controlled solenoids.  But today we installed Trik-L-Start, which uses diodes to keep our start batteries charged.

Each type of start battery combiner has advantages and disadvantages so there is not one perfect solution.  Popular solutions we tested include boost switch, Trik-L-Start, Magnum ME-SBC, Blue Sea ACR 7610 and a custom diode device.  We think that the poplular Trik-L-Start (Ultra TRIK-L-START Starting Battery Charger/Maintainer ) may be the best solution and it is easy to install, inexpensive and automatic.

Trik-L-Start is a reversal of my previous posting on the Magnum combiner.  http://www.foreforums.com/index.php?topic=13003.msg70046#msg70046 We put switch on the house battery wire so we can easily turn off the Trik-L-Start, which we connected to our isolator battery  terminals.

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #1 –
Nice, Why I went with the seperate small charger for the chassis/engine batteries, it is a reliable 800 mil water proof, that stays on all the time, use same circuit as the engine water jacket heater, has two LED lites to indicate the story.
Why I do not like the Trick-L-Start or what ever, I feel it can cover up a pending issue.
We all do what fits out head.
Just my DA opinion
Dave M

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #2 –
A dedicated small charger just for the start battery bank may have a disadvantage if the start batteries are sealed GEL or AGM.

Sealed batteries can be damaged if charged at too high a voltage for the temperature of the battery. High tech smart chargers control the charge & float voltalges and also lower the voltages when batteries are warm and increase the voltages when batteries are cool. Most small inexpensive chargers have one or two pre-set charging voltages and are not temperature compensated.

Wet batteries will evaporate water when batteries are overcharged, which can be replenished. AGM & GEL are a type of sealed battery where the cell is under pressure and fluids cannot be replaced if lost. AGM can handle a higher voltage than GEL.

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #3 –
We use a Battery Tender Power Tender Plus 5A charger for the chassis batteries in the U295. It is a staged smart charger. Stages include bulk, absorption, and float. It includes temperature compensation for ambient temperature. I mounted the unit inside the coach where I can see the LED indicators. That thwarts the ambient temperature compensation mechanism, but provides a convenient location to monitor the LED indicators. Battery Basics - Batterytender.com

I have used a Battery Tender Plus 1.25A charger for the AGM battery in my Goldwing motorcycle, which stays parked most of the time. The original battery is still working fine after six years. I added another Battery Tender for the other motorcycle right after I replaced the OEM battery in it. The replacement battery is still fine after about two years.
J D Stevens
1997 U295 CAI 36' Build #5085
2002 Subaru Outback
Motorcade 16869
Bellville, TX

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #4 –
Barry, I have 3 Grp 31 Cranking Batteries Lead Acid, so relax, I am safe,  Thanks for the warning for the uninformed.
Dave M

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #5 –
So let me be the first to restart this discussion - why not just turn on the boost switch?
1996 U270
Build #4846

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #6 –
Quote from: Gayland Baasch –
So let me be the first to restart this discussion - why not just turn on the boost switch?
                    I was wondering the same thing. Is there any reason NOT to do this? My batteries are all gel cell (house & start) so I would assume the factory charger would be fine to keep them up to snuff..... or is there something I am missing?

            Dean
Dean & Deirdre

2012 Arctic Fox 22GQ
Was 2003 U270

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #7 –
Quote from: Dean & Dee –
                    I was wondering the same thing. Is there any reason NOT to do this? My batteries are all gel cell (house & start) so I would assume the factory charger would be fine to keep them up to snuff..... or is there something I am missing?

            Dean
I like the Trik l Charge because it is automatic and I never have to think about turning the Boost switch OFF.

"Don't forget to turn the switch "OFF" if you are going to dry camp and NOT be plugged into shore power or have the generator running. The reason for this is that you could discharge the coach AND engine batteries simultaneously with enough 12-volt components operating."

A good practice and habit would be if your batteries have been in a low-state of charge. due to "dry camping" or heavy use, without being plugged into shore power or with the generator running. It is important to plug the coach into shore power or turn the generator on and let it run for several hours. This is due to the fact the alternator for the engine is not really a "battery-charger," and it can actually harm the batteries and alternator if you begin to get underway with batteries in a low state of charge. Simply by supplying AC power with the boost switch in the "ON" position. it will help to increase the charge-level of both the coach and engine batteries. Boost Switch
The selected media item is not currently available.Barry BEAM #16014
2003 U320 40' AGDS
Beamalarm, Foretravel technical help and specifications
"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve"

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #8 –
Boost switch is one of the best ways to charge start battery bank.

Until the time your charger turns off from a breaker trip or other fault, then your best way can become your worst way.

Both house & start battery banks could drain down to a point the engine won't start.

The intent of every combiner is allow start battery bank to be charged, without the possibility of accidental discharging.

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #9 –
Maybe it was brought up sometime or other on this forum. But it seems to me that a diode installed in line with the starting battery and the boost switch circuit would allow the starting battery to be charged with the boost switch on but prevent discharge into the coach battery bank. Would have to check the wiring diagram to determine where to install the diode but seems to me it should work.

Roland
1993 U280 4341
2010 Jeep Liberty
The Pied Pipers

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #10 –
Roland, Diode would prevent discharging the start battery. In fact, Trik-L-Start used diodes, along with current limiting.

Keep in mind the diode would prevent boost switch to be used to help start generator when house batteries are weak.

And when boost switch is used to help start engine, hundreds of amps flow from house batteries and the diode would have to pass this current.

Trik-L-Start and boost switch complement each other, but should not be used to replace each other.

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #11 –
                   I have a "Battery Minder" Batteryminders Specials | BatteryMinders.com  that I had bought for my previous coach and have been using periodically on my FT start batteries.

                      This discussion got me thinking about the fact that this charger has a desulpating feature that I was not sure would be okay for my gel cells.  According to the Battery Minder website it is not.

                  I guess I am going to have to go the Trik-L-Start route. Glad this topic came up.

          Dean
Dean & Deirdre

2012 Arctic Fox 22GQ
Was 2003 U270

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #12 –
Dean as long as you can adjust the charging voltage and the desulfation feature can be turned off your charger should be OK. Often the desulfation feature can be auto or manual.

Roland
1993 U280 4341
2010 Jeep Liberty
The Pied Pipers

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #13 –
Quote from: Roland Begin –
Dean as long as you can adjust the charging voltage and the desulfation feature can be turned off your charger should be OK. Often the desulfation feature can be auto or manual.

Roland
            Roland according to their website info. it specifically states "Not for use with Gel or aircraft batteries"   
            Not sure it would do damage but considering that I cannot hardwire it to the coach along with the above disclaimer I would feel better using the Trik-L-Start or flipping on the boost switch. I have the start batteries disconnected right now but would prefer to keep them charged up with the temps heading down.
                Those dang batteries are too expensive to replace very often. :-(

                Dean
Dean & Deirdre

2012 Arctic Fox 22GQ
Was 2003 U270

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #15 –
In July I had to replace both house batteries that came with the coach with interstate workaholics (wet cell).  They were 6 years old and not maintained properly by the previous owner. The progressive dynamics 9160A charger that came with the coach did not have the charge wizard so I added one per advice from Dave Head.  In August I had to replace two of the three starting batteries with Optima blue tops (AGM) that also came with coach and I also added a trik-L-start to keep them charged up automatically from the house batteries.  I also replaced the boost solenoid (cole hersee 200 amp) as recommended by Pierce Stewart. I keep the coach plugged in to a 30 amp service at the storage facility and a 20 amp when parked in my driveway.

I check the voltages weekly at the batteries and everything seems to be working very well so far.

Jerry



 
The selected media item is not currently available.
Jerry and Cindy Maddux
1993 U300/36WTBI DD6v92TA
build 4271  "Miss Lou"
1995 suzuki sidekick 4x4 toad
Gulfport, Ms

"Pride of Ownership"
 

Re: Trik-L-Start start-battery charging combiner

Reply #16 –
One thing to mention is that if you have gel cell house batteries which are charged at a maximum of 14.2v (Trojan Battery recommends 13.9v) and flooded cell or AGM starting batteries the Trik-L-Start may not supply sufficient voltage to bring them up to full charge and will never desulphate them.  Lead acid batteries need higher charge voltages.  Optima recommends voltages up to 15v. for the spiral wound Red Tops, which I have, and Trojan 14.7v for parallel plates.  Not a concern if you drive the coach occasionally as the alternator will produce the higher voltage.  It is a good idea to measure the voltage at the starting batteries as there may be a voltage drop from long wire runs if the wrong wire gauge is used as well as losses caused by diodes in the system.  If you suffer from weak starting batteries after sitting for a while with just the Trik-L-Start in use you may want to do that.  Remember that the colder the battery electrolyte the higher the charge voltage needed.  Desulphation of AGM and flooded cell batteries is also needed to prevent stratification of the electrolyte as well as to remove the effect of sulphation of the plates.

There is a lot more to batteries than meet the eye but keep them fully charged and desulphate the flooded cell and AGM ones occasionally with a good charger and all will be well.

Keith
Keith, Joyce & Smokey the Australian Cattle Dog
1995 U320 SE Extreme 40' WTBI Build # 4780, with a Honda CR-V hopefully still following behind.
Motorcade # 17030
FMCA # F422159