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Topic: Retarder brake lights (Read 1008 times) previous topic - next topic

Retarder brake lights

We recently discovered that our retarder braking lights were not working.  The relay had failed and we honestly don't know when it happened.  We are going to make it part of our checklist prior to hitting the road in the future.  The only way that we can know that the lights are working is to put in an indicator light on the dash.  Thoughts?          Bob
The selected media item is not currently available.Bob & Faith Rozek
1997 U320 40'
Xtreme Remodel
2010 Scion XD

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #1 –
The joystick for the retarder was an added accessory for our coach. The relay for the brake lights was not included, so our brake lights are not activated by application of the retarder via the joystick. I don't consider it to be a problem. Some folk want the brake lights to illuminate if the retarder is engaged via the joystick.

I expect applying the retarder via the joystick would disengage the cruise control if it activates the brake lights. That might be a way to check while under way. Your results may vary.
J D Stevens
1997 U295 CAI 36' Build #5085
2002 Subaru Outback
Motorcade 16869
Bellville, TX

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #2 –
Great idea. Run a single wire from curb-side front compartment up to dash area and use a Radio Shack LED.

We have a dash LED the comes on when retarder is active, which is better than looking down on side dash.

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #3 –
Howdy Bob and Barry, 
  I also think this is a good idea to add indicating light and will be adding to my to-do list.  @Bob, where is the relay located?
Thanks for your help, Dave A
Dave and Nancy Abel
'00 U320 36' WTFE  Build #5669
'10 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon
Livingston, TX  SKP's Fulltiming

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #4 –
Dave
On our coach the relay is located in the forward compartment on the drivers side.  Its adjacent to the brake light pressure switches.  Bob
The selected media item is not currently available.Bob & Faith Rozek
1997 U320 40'
Xtreme Remodel
2010 Scion XD

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #5 –
Quote from: flite2010 –
We recently discovered that our retarder braking lights were not working.            Bob

My sister coach has the retarder brake light operating solenoid disconnected on purpose.

Retarder works on cruise control that way.  My understanding from posts here is that the primary braking system needs brake lights but not the secondary.

Stops overruns downhill on cruise.  If the retarder is on and the lever is off the rest position.  You will feel it pull back against the coach then turn off then on again.

How much it retards is dependent on the lever position. 

Noticed the truckers to save fuel will overrun quite a bit down hills.  5-10mph sometimes.

Versus I forget down a unnoticed grade and speed.  Heaven forbid. 

Bet its simply unhooked.  Most are.  My Foretravel sales buddy mentioned the disconnect long ago. 

Or you can rehook it up.  I won't personally. 

Foretravel, as it should have been, is extremely cautious.  They got sued for selling a 37'10" motor home as a 38' long ago.  Then they called them a 38 series. 

I find the retarder is almost too strong with the brakes on flat ground.  Unless crowded traffic where an emergency stop might be required I turn mine off.

Impressive stopping once the disks get the glaze off them and a little warm up. 

DW gets irritated as I play with the brakes in Midwest towns as the speed limit rapidly drops.  Like I said the retarder and the brakes in tandem  almost too strong on flat ground and medium speeds with the lighter 97 u320. 

But incredibly safe if on and a emergency stop is needed. 

Not suggesting a non safe operation btw.  But the failure or unhook needs to be tested before fixing.

My two cents.

Just drove 3600 miles last month mostly on two lanes and tested this extensively. 

Bob



"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #6 –
Dave & Nancy,

When retarder is activated an OEM relay closes on the main breaker panel in front of co-pilot. Coaches without joy stick only activate retarder with brake pedal, which also turns on brake lights from air brake pressure switches located on front wall of street forward compartment. When joy stick is added a wire from OEM relay is run to a new relay next to air brake pressure switches, which when closed also turns on brake lights.

Putting an optional switch on dash could prevent retarder brake lights from turning off cruise control, which can be handy when going down a highway hill, as cruise would continue to drive up other side of hill.

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #7 –
Howdy Barry and Cindy,
  Thanks for the great and detailed explanation.  You guys are a wealth of knowledge.  I've often wondered whether the brake lights were working with the retarder activated.  Occasionally, Nancy will be following me in the towed and we will check out the retarder/brake light operation.  By adding the auxiliary light connected to the relay, as Bob has suggested, will be a quick/easy way to check for brake light operation.
Hope all is well, ttyl, Dave and Nancy A
Dave and Nancy Abel
'00 U320 36' WTFE  Build #5669
'10 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon
Livingston, TX  SKP's Fulltiming

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #8 –
On my coach the brake lights come on with the retarder operation.  I like it that way as it stops the dozing driver from running into the back of me.

Keith
Keith, Joyce & Smokey the Australian Cattle Dog
1995 U320 SE Extreme 40' WTBI Build # 4780, with a Honda CR-V hopefully still following behind.
Motorcade # 17030
FMCA # F422159

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #9 –
When one applies the brakes, does the retarder also come on? 

Yesterday we went down the "Cabbage Hill" outside of Pendleton, OR.  This is about six miles of a 6% grade.  I tried to stay in the 40s speedwise and in 4th gear to keep the revs up for additional cooling of the transmission fluid.  I used the brakes sparingly and mainly when the temp of the retarder neared 260 degrees.  When I did apply the brakes, the retarder temp increased which indicated to me that when I applied the brakes the retarder was also applied.  True?

The selected media item is not currently available.
George Hatfield

  Never ever use World Line Motors of Nacogdoches for service!

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #10 –
Quote from: George Hatfield –
When one applies the brakes, does the retarder also come on? 
If the "RETARD" switch is on, yes. If the "RETARD" switch is off, no. Ours has a light that indicates when the retarder is active. We normally leave the switch on. With brakes applied, the switch lights until the speed drops below 10 mph.

If the "RETARD" rocker switch does not light when the retarder is active, the bulb may be defective.
J D Stevens
1997 U295 CAI 36' Build #5085
2002 Subaru Outback
Motorcade 16869
Bellville, TX

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #11 –
Quote from: George Hatfield –
When one applies the brakes, does the retarder also come on? 

Yesterday we went down the "Cabbage Hill" outside of Pendleton, OR.  This is about six miles of a 6% grade.  I tried to stay in the 40s speedwise and in 4th gear to keep the revs up for additional cooling of the transmission fluid.  I used the brakes sparingly and mainly when the temp of the retarder neared 260 degrees.  When I did apply the brakes, the retarder temp increased which indicated to me that when I applied the brakes the retarder was also applied.  True?

On our coach the retarder operation is controlled by a switch on the side panel. If that switch is "on" then the retarder is activated when the brakes are applied, or when the joystick is moved. If that switch is "off" then then the retarder is not activated when the brakes are applied.
David and Carolyn Osborn
1995 U320C SE 40' Build 4726 Feb 1995
FMCA 147762
Motorcade 17186

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #12 –
Unless you turn the retarder off, yes...
The selected media item is not currently available. Dave Head & Megan Westbrook
Titusville, FL - The Great Outdoors
'98 270 buying this month
Toad is a 2018 F150 XLT

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #13 –
Quote from: Dave and Nancy Abel –
I've often wondered whether the brake lights were working with the retarder activated.  By adding the auxiliary light connected to the relay, as Bob has suggested, will be a quick/easy way to check for brake light operation.

On our side dash a lamp comes on when retard is active. I just connected a pair of wires from the side lamp to a new small LED in the front dash that can be seen while driving. Now we know if retard is working without looking down. This new LED does not tell us brake lights are coming on with brakes or retard.

Don't drill a hole in front dash if it has electro luminescent lighting.

Wiring a pair of wires to the air brake pressure switches in the left front bay to the dash will always light a LED when brakes lights are powered.
 

Re: Retarder brake lights

Reply #14 –
Quote from: George Hatfield –
When one applies the brakes, does the retarder also come on? 

George, joy stick has 6 levels of retard, brake pedal has 3 levels of retard depending how lightly the brake pedal is pressed.

260 degrees is not so bad considering it is saving your brakes for a backup in case of retarder failure. When tranny fluid gets too how Allison will automatically reduce level of retard. Use your retarder instead of the brakes.

Retard indicator light comes on when retard is active, with brake pedal or joy stick. Touch brakes and look at light to see if your retarder comes on with brakes.