Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

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Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

July 08, 2013, 02:12:17 pm

Well, finally had the 50 amp power line install finished, and plugged in the Coach for the first time since I've had it.

Good news first.

The freezer was making ice cubes within 10 hours, and the fridge side is already plenty cold. The not so good is that the A.C. part of the water heater does not appear to be working. I do have the switch turned on -- the one on the back of the heater tank. I remember there being a re-set button there, but accessing it through the cubbyhole with my hand, it appears to not push-in, as much as it moves left to right. Anyone know which position re-sets it?

The propane mode works great on the water heater, so at least I have reliable hot water. But I was hoping the A.C. mode would work when connected to shore power.

And last, I tried the Spendide 2000 W/D and was in for a surprise. It works, but when I went to initiate a wash cycle and it started filling with water, there was a major leak coming from behind the access door on the lower-right, where the lint filter/ clean out insert is. --Or -- supposed to be. It turns out a PO had removed it and there is nothing there !!.

Luckily, I caught it in time and only ended up leaking a small amount on the floor.

I'm hoping a new assembly from Splendide will take care of this, however when looking at the way it mounts, it looks like one of the "ears" on the unit that the cap uses to secure itself to -- is broken off.

Ahh...the joys of coming across all these little things a previous owner screwed up. But I'm getting there.

Oh! -- one last question. Is it necessary to have the Inverter "On" when connected to shore power?

My meters and readouts above the door, as of this morning read as:

A.C. Voltage - 115 volts
12 VDC output - 13.67
Amp Hours -189 (was - 306 last evening before plugging into shore power)
Amps .3 (with the inverter on)

Be safe out there,

Michael

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #1 – July 08, 2013, 03:10:55 pm

Question? I have 02 U295 Can I run my hot water heat on electric. I have only used LP as I did not know there is electric for heating water?

?? I always have lots of hot water but I just flip the switch by the sink and it lights. DAN

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #2 – July 08, 2013, 03:34:53 pm

Quote from: Dan J. Stansel – July 08, 2013, 03:10:55 pm

....................I have 02 U295 Can I run my hot water heat on electric..........................

Dan,
Facing aft, you should have an "ON-OFF" Hot Water Heater (electric element) switch on the foot of the bed, lower left corner. If you flip it up, it should glow red for "ON", IF you are on shore power or the generator. If you are on neither and the inverter is "ON", the light should not be lit (you don't want to heat water with batteries).
Got the switch?
We only use propane "Hot Water Heating" when dry camping and the generator isn't running.
Neal

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #3 – July 08, 2013, 03:41:00 pm

On our '97 U295, a switch for the electric water heater is on the platform for the bed. It is located near the floor a bit toward the passenger side of the forward side of the platform. Up is on. Ours illuminates when the power is available and the switch is on. The electric water heater will operate from generator power or shore power. It will not operate from the inverter.

Dan, I would expect your water heater to have an electric heating element as ours does. We seldom use propane to heat the water. The engine heats the water while driving, and we are usually hooked to shore power when stopped. The switch for propane heat is near the kitchen sink, as you described, and the switch for 120VAC is on the platform for the bed.

Mike, No, you do not need to leave the inverter on while plugged to shore power or while running the generator. The numbers you described from the readout for the charger/inverter look normal, except for Amp/Hours. I would expect it to be zero if the charging current is 0.3 A. However, the values for AH may be messed up if this is the first time the system has been on in years. My understanding is that the AH meter will eventually reach zero or CCC and reset. The numbers should make more sense after that. I'm basing my response on my experience with a Link 2000 and Freedom 25 in a '97 U295.

I think the reset on the E.C.U. for our electric water heater is a push button rather than a slide switch. However, I don't have much experience with that. The electric element could be defective. My understanding is that they will fail immediately if energized when there is not water in the tank. You should be able to test the element with a VOM. Be sure you fully understand how to disconnect the electric supply and test the element for continuity. You could be injured, killed, break something, or get the wrong answer if you don't do it right.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #4 – July 08, 2013, 04:01:59 pm

Quote from: geomm – July 08, 2013, 02:12:17 pm

.................Is it necessary to have the Inverter "On" when connected to shore power? .......

Michael,
Not necessary but we, like many, leave the inverter "ON" unless we want to intentionally conserve on battery current.
One of the prime reasons is the convenience of "non interruptible" (outlets) power when shore power is interrupted. It is a softer transition for sensitive equipment such as TV's and computer loads. We have all of our power sensitive equipment on APC UPS packs for power and surge protection, but having the Inverter instantly assume the outlet loads makes it an even more friendly environment for any sensitive devices.
I also believe in keeping electronics powered and in use for long life. Startup and shutdown cycles are considerably harder on the longevity of sensitive electronics, than just idling current is. Of course, if one is going to be away for several days or more, then an "OFF-ON" cycle is better.
Different schools of thought on this but mine comes from many years as an electronics tech., USN and commercial power plants.
Of course, the down side of having the inverter always on, is that sometimes shore power goes out and you never know it until something else clues you in, like low battery voltage or a generator "Auto Start", or a neighbor asking if you know why the power is out? We've had that happen many times.
Neal

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #5 – July 08, 2013, 05:34:31 pm

Neal makes an excellent point regarding inverters and sensitive electronics. I am aware of nothing currently in our coach that is particularly sensitive to interruptions in 120VAC power. We only turn on the inverter when we require 120VAC while not on shore power or generator.

We used to have a DirecTV receiver that preferred to have power ALL the time. I installed a small dedicated inverter wired directly to the house batteries for that unit. The DirecTV unit was not connected to the "normal" 120VAC service in the coach. The dedicated inverter hooked to the house batteries served a purpose similar to that of a UPS.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #6 – July 09, 2013, 07:55:04 am

I suspect that the transition from shore/generator to inverter power is not as smooth as you think.
I had a dedicated circuit from the Trace (Heart) inverter to the flybridge on my boat where I ran
a Dell small form factor desktop as my navigation machine.

The inverter was smart enough (?) that it fed shore/generator power when available and inverted battery power when not.
You would think that is a GOOD thing. $:-\$

I had to be very careful when starting out in the morning from anchor.
I would fire up the generator to power the windless and haul the anchor and then shut it off.
About half the time the time it took for the automatic transfer switch inside the inverter to go from generator to batteries was long enough that the computer reset. I had to make sure I didn't need the autopilot for a little time just in case.

I suspect that there are still momentary power loses due to transfer switch timings.
YMMV

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #7 – July 09, 2013, 08:12:25 am

Tks I never knew you could have electric hot water heater. Always assumed LP was it. I have been burning up LP for several years. Wow what an idea/ Electric hot water heater. I should have known better. DAN

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #8 – July 09, 2013, 01:15:33 pm

Quote from: Dan J. Stansel – July 09, 2013, 08:12:25 am

Tks I never knew you could have electric hot water heater. Always assumed LP was it. I have been burning up LP for several years. Wow what an idea/ Electric hot water heater. I should have known better. DAN

Some are wired differently but most can run the electric and lp at the same time. Faster recovery.

Bob

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #9 – July 09, 2013, 06:25:11 pm

Quote from: Caflashbob – July 09, 2013, 01:15:33 pm

Some are wired differently but most can run the electric and lp at the same time. Faster recovery.

I think I recall having to reset a thermal cutout breaker for the electric after using electric and propane together for fast heat. It could have been a faulty thermal breaker, or faulty memory making up a story about something that never happened.

Anyway, I reserve propane water heating for those times when we are not hooked to shore power and not running the big engine. When we are rolling down the road, our water heater gets plenty hot from the engine coolant loop that heats the fresh water. We have never experienced a problem with slow recovery in any mode.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #10 – July 09, 2013, 07:29:01 pm

Gary O helps steer me right, once again. I had noticed the switch on the heater itself, and even the one at the foot of the bed (drivers side) for the block heater. I HAD NOT noticed the one on the bed on the passenger side for the water heater. So -- powered that up, and it illuminated just fine. The test was an overnight with the propane burner off.
And this morning I had very hot water. So -- it looks like all three heating options are working just fine. Whew! -- I didn't want to pull that heater out again.

Next question.

When connected to shore power can you charge all the batteries if you have the boost switch on? I know that is the case if you are running the Gen-set, and I normally do that with the boost switch on. Just not sure about when on a shore cord. I've read here about owners keeping their batteries up over long periods when on a A.C. feed, but does that mean all of them are getting a charge from the Heart-Freedom inverter/charger? I have the black square one.

I'm showing 13.68 VDC on the meter above the door with one A/C unit running (if that makes any difference) Strange that overnight my amp hours meter only dropped from -189 to -180. I would have expected more progress than that in bringing the batteries to a full charge after two days on shore power.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #11 – July 09, 2013, 10:17:37 pm

Quote from: geomm – July 09, 2013, 07:29:01 pm

When connected to shore power can you charge all the batteries if you have the boost switch on? ... I've read here about owners keeping their batteries up over long periods when on a A.C. feed, but does that mean all of them are getting a charge from the Heart-Freedom inverter/charger? I have the black square one.

I'm showing 13.68 VDC on the meter above the door with one A/C unit running (if that makes any difference) Strange that overnight my amp hours meter only dropped from -189 to -180. I would have expected more progress than that in bringing the batteries to a full charge after two days on shore power.

Yes, you can charge the chassis battery along with the house batteries by turning on the boost switch when on shore power. If the boost switch is not on, the chassis battery is not being charged unless there have been modifications from the original wiring. I use a 5A Battery Tender to maintain the chassis batteries while on shore power. It is plugged into a 120VAC outlet at the foot of the bed, where I can watch the LED indicators and plug/unplug it as appropriate. Other folk use Trik-L-Start, relays, switches, boost switch, or other arrangements.

My guess on the AH reading would go as follows:

You charged the batteries with a charger other than the Freedom 25 and Link 2000 unit. Or you may have replaced the batteries while the Link 2000 showed them as being discharged. The batteries are charged up and drawing only about 0.3 A to maintain them. The Link 2000 sees they are only receiving 0.3 A, and calculates replaced AH based on that. That amounts to about 7 AH per 24 hour period. After AH reading makes it to 0, the values should start making sense based on discharge/charge from the on board equipment. It looks like it may take about 27 days for the system to become normal.

My "guess" may be worth what you paid for it!

Also, there may be a way to reset the AH reading, but I haven't pulled out the manual and looked for it. Watch the AH meter and see if it changes by +6 to +9 AH per day under current conditions.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #12 – July 09, 2013, 11:44:58 pm

I have a 94/U225, Its inverter should have on/off?
On our first trip, when we were connected to 50amp service this pass weekend there was a constant humming, would that be the inverter?
I predict any trip we take with it this year will be to where there is a 50amp service available, so if I am using generator or a shore 50amp service, then I can for the most part keep the inverter turned off correct? I am getting ready to install two new LED TV's. Originally i was planning to just use the 120 outlet but I think I will get small dedicated inverters for them and use the "cigarette lighter 12v connections that are available by the TV locations. What do you think?
Thank you,
AL

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #13 – July 10, 2013, 12:14:51 am

Quote from: propman – July 09, 2013, 11:44:58 pm

I have a 94/U225, Its inverter should have on/off?
On our first trip, when we were connected to 50amp service this pass weekend there was a constant humming, would that be the inverter?
I predict any trip we take with it this year will be to where there is a 50amp service available, so if I am using generator or a shore 50amp service, then I can for the most part keep the inverter turned off correct? I am getting ready to install two new LED TV's. Originally i was planning to just use the 120 outlet but I think I will get small dedicated inverters for them and use the "cigarette lighter 12v connections that are available by the TV locations. What do you think?
Thank you,
AL

I'll take a stab at providing some info based on my old 1990 U280. If someone has your similar 1994 coach, maybe they can be more specific to you.

My 1990 had no "off" for the 110/12 volt converter which is likely what you hear buzzing. My inverter was a separate entity, a box in the basement behind the 110 volt air compressor. My 1990 had a push button inside the coach to turn the inverter on or off as well as a switch to choose from energizing the microwave or TV/outlets.

Yes on your TV plans...but also check what TV you buy. I bought a cheap ($128 at Amazon), 19" Sceptre LED/LCD TV/DVD for the rear, and while it comes with a 110 volt transformer, it turns out the TV itself actually runs on 12 VDC. I think that is gonna allow me to change the wiring to 12 volts and not worry about leaving my inverter on at night.

Later coaches, or modified coaches, have combination units for the inverter/converter jobs,,,and they don't have the hum. While my 1990 used a Magnatek Converter (that hummed when plugged in), my 2002 has a Prosine 2.0 that does both jobs much more effectively (and expensively).

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #14 – July 10, 2013, 12:21:19 am

Oh. I see you have a Link 2000??? No experience with that here, but I did stumble on a manual for it that talks about resetting/synchronizing current reading... http://www.xantrex.com/documents/Discontinued-Products/Link2000-445-0198-98-01_rev-1%28Vendor%29.pdf

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #15 – July 11, 2013, 10:39:44 am

Thank you Brad.

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #16 – July 11, 2013, 02:21:46 pm

Quote from: propman – July 11, 2013, 10:39:44 am

Thank you Brad.

You are entirely welcome. I owe a lot to folks here from over the years, so I try to contribute info whenever I can.

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Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

July 08, 2013, 02:12:17 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #1 – July 08, 2013, 03:10:55 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #2 – July 08, 2013, 03:34:53 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #3 – July 08, 2013, 03:41:00 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #4 – July 08, 2013, 04:01:59 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #5 – July 08, 2013, 05:34:31 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #6 – July 09, 2013, 07:55:04 am

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #7 – July 09, 2013, 08:12:25 am

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #8 – July 09, 2013, 01:15:33 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #9 – July 09, 2013, 06:25:11 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #10 – July 09, 2013, 07:29:01 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #11 – July 09, 2013, 10:17:37 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #12 – July 09, 2013, 11:44:58 pm

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #13 – July 10, 2013, 12:14:51 am

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #14 – July 10, 2013, 12:21:19 am

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #15 – July 11, 2013, 10:39:44 am

Re: Revealings after the first time hook-up to shore power

Reply #16 – July 11, 2013, 02:21:46 pm

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