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Topic: Towing an Open Car Trailer (Read 991 times) previous topic - next topic

Towing an Open Car Trailer

Our little old U225 has only a 5,000 lb tow limit and if we want to put our Jeep Wrangler on a trailer our only real choice is an open trailer; preferably aluminum.

I can think of some real advantages to an open trailer but one major one is that it is a LOT easier both get out of the vehicle and to tie the vehicle down. Of course the Jeep isn't as well protected on an open trailer as it would be in an enclosed trailer but if you ever saw my Jeep you'd understand why that isn't such a big concern.

There are several FT owners who tow with an enclosed trailer but I'm wondering if there are any who tow with an open trailer and what type of trailer they use. With a 3100 lb Jeep will I have to have double axles? Is that better than a single axle assuming I can find a trailer that will do the load with a single? The Jeep is pretty short but I would not mind putting a good storage locker on the front of the trailer for camp chairs, etc.

Anyone doing this?

Craig
1993 U225 36' Unihome GV with PACBRAKE exhaust retarder, Banks Stinger and Solar Panels.
Toad: 1999 Jeep Wrangler 2-door soft-top.

"No one has ever had to evacuate a city because the solar panels broke."

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #1 –
The axles and springs can be heavier duty, So a single axle can be used,

I have the same problem, Jeep Patriot and two bikes on trailer,

I have 3 ton over Nett weight, But all my tanks are still empty, So that weight will be drastically reduced,

I have a 12 ton GVM, And they do police it here savagely, Huge fines for over weight, So wont be going there,

Open trailer should be alright, As the trailer is covered by the Bus in front, Put big rubber guards across the back of your bus to keep the dirt from flying up onto the trailer,
Cheers,
Brian,

Toys, 1989 Grand Villa, 36 foot, ORED with 300 Hp Cat. 2002 Gemini 34 foot Sailing Catamaran, 2006 Honda Super Blackbird 1100XX, 2002 ZR7 750 Kawasaki,
25 HP Chinese tractor and Backhoe,

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #2 –
We are towing on an open trailer because that is what I have available. I do have the luxury of a larger tow capacity, and my trailer is steel. Trailer and vehicle are close to 7000lb. If I were looking to buy a new setup I would go Aluminum and with two axles. Not only will two axles be more stable but also you can have 4 wheels for braking.
Tom & Patty
Build# 5832
2001 U295  36'
Motorcader # 17240

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #3 –
I have a 10,000 rated trailer and have towed our 08 Dodge diesel supercab pickup. It makes a gross weight of right at 10,000 pounds and did not have any trouble with stopping or in getting up mountains. This is not my first choice for towing as I prefer to tow the miata
previous 1984 35 ft ORED 250 HP 3208 Cat       
previous 1998 40 ft U295 CAI 325 hp Cummins
previous 2003 40 Ft u320 build #6140 450 Cummins M11.                                                         
1999 Mazda Miata
Ron, Nancy, Tipper the cat, Max The dog
1997 U 270 36 ft build number 5174 8.3 Cummins

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #4 –
Quote from: wa_desert_rat –
.................With a 3100 lb Jeep will I have to have double axles? Is that better than a single axle assuming I can find a trailer that will do the load with a single?.............................
Craig

 Some things that you may not have considered when looking for a way to use a single axle trailer:
 
    • You have a 3100 Lb. vehicle and a 17' 6", "top of the line", open car hauler (Featherlite Model 3110) goes about 1550 Lbs.  That's a GVW of 4650 Lbs.  Axles should be 10-20% greater than that to be safe and trouble free and the tires should be another 20% greater than the axle ratings for the same reason.
       
    • While one can find custom built, single, trailer axles that can handle as much as 8000 lbs, most trailer manufacturers use multiple axles if the trailer plus payload is over 3500 Lbs., or if they are concerned about having a reliable reputation. One big reason for that is tire size and cost - the specialized tires (stiffer sidewall, more ply's, higher pressure rating) needed to handle more than 2500 lb (+) each will be larger sizes with higher load capacities.  That can become very expensive to maintain when one considers that the specialized trailer tires have about  ½ the useful lifetime of coach tires.  If one can stretch coach tires to seven or more years with careful attention and good care, then the same kind of care is going to earn you something less than 4 years with your trailer tires.  So, if the trailer GVWR is light enough, a single axle is fine.  Otherwise the special trailer tires (ST Grade, 8, 10 and maybe even 12 Ply) become an expensive proposition.
       
    • Tire failures are  the greatest nuisance item with trailers.  To be safe, you MUST have pressure sensors.  Because the axles and tires will be running close to their design limits, don't think that you won't because you WILL have blowouts, even when you use the Cadillac of tires and provide them constant kid glove treatment (don't scuff any curbs with them either).  This isn't your standard utility trailer setup where you can air them up once a year and ignore them thereafter.
       
    • When you have a flat tire on a tandem trailer, you will hopefully get a good warning and get stopped without much damage to the trailer.  When you have the blowout on a single axle trailer, loaded near its axle's maximum rating and near the tire's maximum rating,  I'm sure that you will wish that you hadn't made that single axle decision, even if your pressure sensing system functions perfectly.
       
    • Controlling the load center of gravity and tongue weight on a single axle trailer is much more difficult to accomplish than on a tandem axle trailer.  For the brainiacs, one way is to weigh your payload, all four corners, and then calculate where to place the load center of gravity on a given trailer.  One way or another, if you want to stay safe and be reasonably trouble free, you have to get the weight on each trailer tire and the tongue within the ratings of your trailer and your tow vehicle.  Then install chocks on the trailer and you will be able load it the same way each time. 
       
    • Another way is to give the information to a decent trailer manufacturer and he will place the axle,  on a custom built trailer, that gives you the weight distribution and tongue weight you desire.  If you plan to buy a used single axle trailer, you should always try your vehicle on the trailer, getting the trailer plus payload weighed, including tongue weight,  before you put any money into it.  You may find that you have to find a trailer that is quite a bit longer than you think you need, just to get the tongue weight into the ballpark.  A tandem trailer is much more forgiving and if you can't load forward facing, you may be able to bring the four trailer tire weights into range by loading the payload backwards.
       
    • Go with an 8' 6" wide trailer rather than an 8' or narrower trailer.  It is highly important to be able to see the trailer tires and fenders in your rear views.
       
    • When looking at trailers, check the axle load rating and also the tire max load rating. The trailer will have a federally-required sticker on the left front corner.  It gives the axle Gross Axle Weight Rating (GAWR) and total trailer weight rating (GVWR).  Each tire has its max load rating embossed on the sidewall.  Ideally the axle(s) will be able to carry the GVWR with at least 20% room to spare, and the tires will exceed the max axle rating by another 20%.  But less than "top of the line" trailer manufacturers tend to go cheap in that regard.  One doesn't often find over-rated axles or tires, except in "Cream of the Crop Manufacturers".  If the trailer fender wells have room, you may be able to add higher rated tires later and that would help in both trailer reliability and tire life.
Just some things to think about.
Neal
 
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Neal (& Brenda) Pillsbury
'02 U320 SPEC, 4200, DGFE, Build #5984
'04 Gold Wing
'07 Featherlite 24'
'14 Jeep Grand Cherokee Summit
MC #14494
Exeter, NH & LaBelle FL
Quality makes the Heart Soar long after Price is Forgotten

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #5 –
Craig,

I have to agree with just about everything Neal has to say. I have pulled aircraft coast to coast several times, towed a 3300 lb. stock car, etc. Single axles are very convenient to move by hand, lighter, etc. but have that big flaw, the blow out. With a SUV or car, you can see the trailer immediately behind. With a big RV, the trailer is not as wide as the RV and hidden in your mirrors. Even though we have rear monitors now, no one constantly watches the trailer. I had a VW Rabbit as a toad behind my Buffalo bus and going through Reno, I got a flat. Finally a trucker came up next to me and pointed behind. A couple hundred cars must have gone by before that but when I stopped, the tire was gone and the aluminum wheel was eaten away almost to the point of dragging the corner of the car on the pavement.

I built my tandem stock car trailer with a couple of diamond plate channels and custom drop axles so the axles were almost on the pavement. Wheels had a bit of toe in also. Just far enough off the ground so a flat would not scrape them. No springs but I had radials with a little flex. I could find a low spot to load/unload without having any tilt built in. A long tongue made it rock stable at any speed and I could not even induce it to start swaying.

So, my recommendation for what it's worth, is to go with a tandem trailer with a spare tire attached. A little more weight but a lot of peace of mind.

Pierce
Pierce and Gaylie Stewart
'93 U300/36 WTBI
Detroit 6V-92TA Jake
1140 watts on the roof
SBFD (ret)

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #6 –
 A single axel trailer for something as heavy as a jeep will only bring you heart ache.. I've towed open trailers all over the country. Most of the time with some sort of a race car. The fellas are correct you will have tire issues. I've found tire pressure monitors to be a nuisance. Just check your pressure often and have a spare and jack always with you. Also if you buy cheap tires that's what your going to get.

I've been thinking about a tow dolly. Anybody ever put a vehicle on a dolly with the rear wheels on the dolly? The reason for this is I don't want to disconnect my drive shaft. In my head it just seems wrong but if I think about it, why not?
Andy 1989 U300 40'

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #7 –
With the drive wheels on a dolly, the front end that has a toe in setting will have more toe in effectively when towed backwards, meaning more tire wear if you tow much,  OK for a rescue, but not recommended for routine, due to excessive tire wear.

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #8 –
Since most trailers come with 3500lb axles - and one axle would not be enough for a 3100lb car plus almost any trailer (especially if there was anything in the car), a single-axle trailer is out. Plus all the other reasons, which all make good sense.

Still kicking around how to do this. I appreciate all the thoughtful responses.

Craig
1993 U225 36' Unihome GV with PACBRAKE exhaust retarder, Banks Stinger and Solar Panels.
Toad: 1999 Jeep Wrangler 2-door soft-top.

"No one has ever had to evacuate a city because the solar panels broke."

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #9 –
That's why Dave M is a super hero! Thank you Sir.. Might end up with another trailer myself..
Andy 1989 U300 40'

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #10 –
Quote from: wa_desert_rat –
Our little old U225 has only a 5,000 lb tow limit
Craig,
Where are you getting that from?  I think you have a GVWR of 22,500 lbs and a GCWR of 24,000 lbs, just like I do.  What does your coach weigh when ready to roll out for a trip? I know I don't have much wiggle room hauling a 2600 lbs toad.
1994 U225
build #4514

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #11 –
I flat tow a 1998 Suzuki X90 and for short distances, as per Suzuki instructions, transfer case in neutral, auto in park, steering unlocked, and manual front wheel hubs unlocked. This means the rear tires rotating spins the rear drive shaft, transfer case gears, front drive shaft and front half shafts. Front tires spin freely and odometer clicks the kilometers.

andyr
For long distances with my Suzuki X90, I disconnect the drive shaft at the rear differential. I ground off the extra threads on the four bolts to be removed and painted one bolt hole so it always goes back together with the same phasing (may not be required). I jack up the rear passenger side for more clearance and it takes less then 10 minutes. This means that only the rear differential is spinning. In case you wonder, yes I have replaced the driveshaft in the rain at Port Angeles, WA when returning from California - a rude awakening after 90F days in California.

I used to have a Tow Dolly and it was good with FWD cars but it was a nuisance at the camp ground and at home.It required about twice as much time to connect the dolly and the car as to connect the toad. I did attempt to back the rear wheels of my 1984 Toyota Supra onto the dolly, but it was too low to the ground to load or to tow.

wa_desert_rat
What about hitch weight?
With a 3500lb axle on a trailer, there must be about 500lb on the hitch for it to tow with stability. Therefore, total trailer load is 4000lb (not 3500lb), and if the trailer weights 900lb, a 3100lb car could be hauled safely with a quality single axle trailer.  Sorry, one more thing to ponder!






Wyatt
96 U320 40 WTFE, build 4943
84 Toyota Supra towd
2015 Jeep Wrangler towd
Victoria, BC, Canada

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #12 –
Craig,

Not saying it's a smart thing to do but I did see a U300 pulling a long construction trailer with a Case 580C on top plus construction equipment. Couldn't believe my eyes. Can't imagine what it weighted but very heavy. Hope he had brakes on the trailer and didn't have to make any uphill starts.

Years ago, I saw a VW bug pulling a 20 foot travel trailer. Couldn't believe that one either.

Pierce

Pierce
Pierce and Gaylie Stewart
'93 U300/36 WTBI
Detroit 6V-92TA Jake
1140 watts on the roof
SBFD (ret)

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #13 –
Quote from: PatC –
Craig,
Where are you getting that from?  I think you have a GVWR of 22,500 lbs and a GCWR of 24,000 lbs, just like I do.  What does your coach weigh when ready to roll out for a trip? I know I don't have much wiggle room hauling a 2600 lbs toad.

I got that 5,000 tow capacity somewhere... can't remember where. Since we just weekend camp we do things like travel with only 1/4 tank of water and empty black/gray tanks. We do not habitually keep the fuel tank full... but fuel it as necessary at the beginning of a long trip and then usually top it off (depending on what the price is and whether we can get to the cheaper price on what we have). In other words, if the price of fuel is $4.09 (which it is right now) I will check on fuel at our destination. Often it's $3.79 so I make sure I have enough to get there plus reserve, then buy full fuel where it is cheapest.

We don't keep lots of clothes or food in the rig. I do have some tools but no more than about 100 lbs of them just aft of the entrance door.

I haven't weighed the rig prior to a trip but I probably should. It's not easy getting it out of where we keep it when I'm alone... having the DW watching the stern helps considerably (at least 5 "K" turns to get out and then a long drive down a narrow driveway - Gary B. knows that it's like).

So... in short... I dunno. :D

Craig
1993 U225 36' Unihome GV with PACBRAKE exhaust retarder, Banks Stinger and Solar Panels.
Toad: 1999 Jeep Wrangler 2-door soft-top.

"No one has ever had to evacuate a city because the solar panels broke."

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #14 –
Did somebody already ask?........why don't you just tow the jeep?
1994 U280, Build 4490
Deming, NM.

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #15 –
Quote from: Twig –
Did somebody already ask?........why don't you just tow the jeep?

The Jeep is lifted and has 33" tires which I suspect makes the RV work harder to tow it and reduces fuel mileage quite a bit (25%). I could buy different tires but we live near an ORV (Off Road Vehicle) park with sand dunes that is fun to drive in so I'm thinking through some alternatives. :)

Craig
1993 U225 36' Unihome GV with PACBRAKE exhaust retarder, Banks Stinger and Solar Panels.
Toad: 1999 Jeep Wrangler 2-door soft-top.

"No one has ever had to evacuate a city because the solar panels broke."

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #16 –
Bet it doesn't reduce fuel mileage with the bigger tires more than a tiny bit even with a wider tire. The increased weight of a trailer/jeep will drop the mileage more than your jeep tires.

Pierce
Pierce and Gaylie Stewart
'93 U300/36 WTBI
Detroit 6V-92TA Jake
1140 watts on the roof
SBFD (ret)
 

Re: Towing an Open Car Trailer

Reply #17 –
Quote from: Twig –
Did somebody already ask?........why don't you just tow the jeep?

There are a few reasons I have for preferring a trailer.  One reason is to reduce wear on expensive off road tires and the drivetrain.  Another is to have the ability to back up.  When flat towing, you don't have much ability to control the jeep when backing up.  With a trailer, you don't have to be as selective when fueling up, or pulling into shopping centers, campgrounds, National Park/Monument parking lots. etc. because you can always back up.  Another is if the jeep is damaged while off-roading, as long as you can drag it onto the trailer, you can at least get it home. 

Of course there are advantages to flat towing; Less hitch weight, less total weight, better miles per gallon, don't have to worry about storing the trailer at home or while camping, one less item to purchase, register, and maintain, and it's faster to connect/disconnect a flat tow setup than a trailer (just due to having to load and secure the jeep on the trailer.)  But say you just want to drop the jeep at the entrance to Black Canyon of the Gunnison Nat'l Park and drive the coach through the park, just disconnecting a trailer and hooking that back up may be faster than a flat tow setup. 

All depends on your situation.

Jennifer
2003 36' U295 (# 6070)
Thousand Oaks, CA