8D Battery Mishap

Topic: 8D Battery Mishap (Read 1110 times) previous topic - next topic

8D Battery Mishap

February 19, 2014, 10:20:38 pm

Today we had remarkably warm weather ( 42 degrees ) here in Northern Michigan and I thought it would be a good day to unplug the power from the coach, disconnect the batteries and leave them charged for the rest of the season. I knew after the fun we had driving home through the polar vortex a couple months ago ( some of you know what I'm talking about ) that there was going to be a need for a couple new house batteries soon.

Well, when I opened the nice triple 8D battery box that I LOVE....I found an exploded battery ( half of it's top blew right off and battery acid went flying ) and a huge mess of deteriorated fiberglass housing. I removed all 3 batteries and set the "newer" start battery and one still hanging-in-there house battery up off of the cement on some pieces of 2x4. Needless to say after I took a putty knife and about an hour scraping the messed up fiberglass off the still in place battery box, I had so many holes and rotted area that the pump sprayer I filled with rinse water was going to be of no use until I could figure out what my next step was.

That leads me to you all....I am very much interested in removing the box from inside the bay, but it is glued in place with something very strong and the only way it's going to come out is be breaking it to pieces and then scraping the cement / glue from inside the bay. I won't be comfortable until all thew acid has been rinsed and diluted from UNDER the battery box. I looked under the coach and there is a section that has a section "joint" where two pieces of the fiber under covering ( I don't know what it's called ) come together and I see some corrosion that's bubbled up. So the box must be removed at all cost.

1st question, is there something I should rinse the inside of the bay with or spray down with besides water?

2nd question, where could I find another triple box like the one I currently have?

I love it as it's very clean, finished and decorative when in place. It allows a place to rest a small tote on with my septic line, gloves and a couple other things on top of. The back is high and it angles down on the sides so you can literally slide the heavy 8D's in without having to lift up and over the top. Then, the back fits just the opposite and clamps down with 2 rubber straps. All I've seen online if double 8D battery compartments with deep bottoms and lower profile lids.

I know not what I'm going to find and know of no other place to ask questions from people who I trust with my life about these important issues. I'm totally open to forward thinking ideas and thoughts about what other options I have or things you would do that I'm not aware of. But still....I love that triple box with the slide in front.

Suggestions please and thanks in advance everyone.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #1 – February 19, 2014, 10:26:04 pm

@Carl When I bought my coach the battery box was missing. Foretravel built me a new one. They still have the molds. Sorry I don't remember how much it was. If I can find time I'll try and dig up the receipt. I'm pretty sure a call to service will get you a price much faster.

Sorry about your batteries! I'm glad you made it home in one piece though!

see ya
ken

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #2 – February 19, 2014, 10:29:10 pm

You want to wash with baking soda to clean and neutralize the acid. Carefully wash, scrub and flow water mixture to hidden places as well.

We had a cover on our older coach and also stored things on top of the lid, handy and cleaner.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #3 – February 19, 2014, 10:36:14 pm

Carl,

When we had to remove that same box out of our '92 it was held down by some 3M 5200. We were able to slip a piece of .015 piano wire behind and under it, then made 2 handles out of a broom stick and attached to each end of the wire. With this we were able to cut/saw through the glue with out destroying the fiberglass floor.

Pamela & Mike

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #4 – February 19, 2014, 10:47:27 pm

Mike is spot on about cutting the 5200. It will not release any other way, and will pull the gel coat off the fiberglass floor and tray bottom. Package warnings tell users to never use on anything that will ever need to be removed.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #5 – February 19, 2014, 10:53:16 pm

Thanks so far

I'll call FT to see what they have to say...I may not be able to afford theirs plus 2 or 3 new batteries at the same time.
I'll make sure to wash and rinse as suggested.
Piano wire and broom sticks...YIKES!! I'd assume that its the same product holding mine down, however, there are a couple worn holes through the bottom already so I may just have to chip away at it....actually I can safely break the worn / rotted sides right out and then chip away a little and then take a 4" grinder and abrasive wheel and feather the glue and bottom remains out. Then vacuum up or blow out the remains...Hmmm

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #6 – February 20, 2014, 12:00:27 am

Carl,

Sorry to hear this. BTDT. Summer 2012 one of my 8D's did the same

Pretty sure power converter was the issue and replaced with a new Power Dynamics 92 or 9300? (can't remember) and been ok since. Replaced both house batteries rather than just the one. If you have the original converter you will want to replace (big tin box mounted above the batteries).

Good luck!

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #7 – February 20, 2014, 12:47:35 am

How can I test it to see if it was that which caused the problem of just a dead frozen battery?
If that is the problem, do I replace with the same thing or same brand and larger size?
I did purchase the little wizard deal for it a couple years ago....

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #8 – February 20, 2014, 01:03:26 am

Quote from: Carl Sandel – February 20, 2014, 12:47:35 am

How can I test it to see if it was that which caused the problem of just a dead frozen battery?
If that is the problem, do I replace with the same thing or same brand and larger size?
I did purchase the little wizard deal for it a couple years ago....

If it is the original converter charger, get rid of it asap. They tend to overcharge fully charged batteries, and are very slow to charge depleted batteries.

They make a modern three stage bolt-in replacement charger. If this has been done, all your 12 volt fuses on the unit's fuse board will be connected to the batteries and there will be no converter, just a charger. If it still has the old converter charger, some circuits will be powered by the battery and other circuits, lights, will be powered by the (dirty) converter.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #9 – February 20, 2014, 08:13:11 am

Baking soda and lots of water to neutralize. Let dry completely. Apply new layer or two of fiberglass mat. I would use West System Epoxy.

Been there, done that.

Brett

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #10 – February 20, 2014, 10:13:51 am

Actually I prefer using ammonia rather than baking soda. I would flush the area. Mix household ammonia 50/50 with water. It leaves less residue that could affect future intercoat adhesion if you are repairing the fiberglass floor. Also neutralize and penetrations in the floor after the battery box has been removed.

Apply the neutralizing liquid liberally several times and let it dry each time then rinse several times. That will allow the neutralizer to seep into all affected spaces. Do not apply any repair materials until the area is completely neutralized and dry.

If any fiberglass or insulation has been damaged in the floor it should be cut out back to good material and new insulation glued to the old insulation and fiberglassed both top and bottom. The sandwich of fiberglass and rigid foam insulation is part of the structural integrity of the body.

If it was my coach I would do a temporary repair and take it to Rance at Xtreme in NAC for permanent roper repair and I would definitely replace the old Converter with a new Smart Charger/Converter. Plus the weather in NAC is a whole lot better now than in N. Michigan.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #11 – February 20, 2014, 10:35:44 am

West System epoxy is good stuff. I have been a System Three fan for years also. See: http://www.systemthree.com/store/pc/viewcategories.asp?gclid=CIKQrcqA27wCFXBk7AodtQgAkw The important note here is the ratio of hardener to resin. It may be different brand to brand. I have found a gram scale works well for measuring accurately. The weights are slightly different but it beats guessing with paper cups.

If the weather is super cold, I combine some in a small Dixie Cup and then nuke it for no more than 10 seconds. Mixes really easily then with a popsicle type wooden stick. Use just enough to wet the cloth thoroughly and then put on another layer. Strength is in the cloth not the resin.

Don't use fiberglass mat but spend a tiny bit more for fiberglass cloth.

Buy a box of brushes (and thin gloves) from Harbor Freight to brush it on with. One box lasts a long time.

Pierce

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #12 – February 20, 2014, 10:51:08 am

Quote from: wolfe10 – February 20, 2014, 08:13:11 am

Baking soda and lots of water to neutralize. Let dry completely. Apply new layer or two of fiberglass mat. I would use West System Epoxy.
Brett

I'd repair that box also. A few layers of fiberglass mat and plain old polyester resin (same stuff the rest of the coach is built with) will fix it permanently. Roll on a coat of catalyzed gel coat and it'll look like a million bucks....which is probably about what a new box would cost.

Definitely want to hunt down any acid incursions to structure underneath and neutralize them. A coat of rust neutralizer and paint on those metal components would be a good idea.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #13 – February 20, 2014, 11:10:22 am

Batteries do not explode because it is Tuesday or too cold, over charging will provide plenty gas fumes setting up the Perfect condition, just provide a tinny spark

Do not loose track of WHY it exploded, VERY simple, battery was gassing and a SPARK sure does the trick, BIG BANG !! Then you do the clean up.
More convenient to keep up and pay attention, costs less too.
FWIW
Dave M

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #14 – February 20, 2014, 11:21:23 am

I would make certain that the box containing the batteries was vented exceptionally well. FT must have installed vents, I would make sure there is nothing blocking the vents.

Roland

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #15 – February 20, 2014, 12:24:48 pm

Quote from: Roland Begin – February 20, 2014, 11:21:23 am

I would make certain that the box containing the batteries was vented exceptionally well. FT must have installed vents, I would make sure there is nothing blocking the vents.

Roland

And remember what you are venting, hydrogen gas. It rises, just like the Hindenberg. And that's not all it does just like the Hindenberg.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #16 – February 20, 2014, 12:27:57 pm

If the box is glued down with 3M 5200 there are few options for removing it. It will soften with a heat gun. If you can get in there you could try cutting into the 5200 with a multi tool, heating the box floor and slowly wedging it up. An alternative is to use a Sawzall with a 12" blade to cut through the stuff. A hacksaw blade in a handle will work but will be hard work.

FWIW

Keith

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #17 – February 20, 2014, 12:32:40 pm

No need to remove it-- you can do the FG repair with it in place.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #18 – February 20, 2014, 02:12:58 pm

When a battery sees too high a voltage for too long, not only does it produce lots of hydrogen but the water in the cells boils off and the level gets lower and lower leaving space for even more hydrogen. An explosion on the outside of the case instantly becomes an explosion on the inside of the battery spraying battery parts and acid everywhere. A good reason to upgrade to a "smart" charger with programable voltage and temperature probes.

Anytime you use a external battery charger, make sure to unplug it from 120V before removing the clip leads to the terminals. No spark that way.

Pierce

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #19 – February 20, 2014, 04:02:03 pm

I hate to say "I told you so", but if you're gonna leave your coach plugged-in to shore power, you better check it at a minimum once a week. By that I mean check the voltages...PLEASE!

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #20 – February 20, 2014, 06:39:29 pm

If it is any consolation, FT seemed to use those "3-battery" boxes for a very long time so availability shouldn't be too hard. My 1990 had the identical 3 battery box as does my 2002 U270. Only difference is that my 2002 has a wooden 2x2 frame where the third battery would go (for a U320, I think?), as my starting batteries (3 Optima Yellows) are on the other side, back near the motor itself.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #21 – February 21, 2014, 12:34:58 am

I have a few comments and also questions I want to post and ask on this topic. I have them written down and will get them on as soon as I can gather my thoughts. I sure do appreciate all of your comments and helpful info.

Re: 8D Battery Mishap

Reply #22 – February 21, 2014, 10:52:10 am

My 1991 U300 makes a much higher voltage from the alternator than it does from the charger. I have the Leece Neville alternator which was a retrofit. It's possible your battery overcharged while you were driving down the highway. It definitely IS POSSIBLE for a completely discharged battery to freeze and crack when the temperature is cold enough. I've had that happen before with a car battery. If the battery froze and cracked the acid would probably be on the bottom of the battery tray only. If the battery exploded there would probably be acid everywhere and it might have ignited the other batteries, especially if they were being overcharged at the same time, which would probably have been the case... Just thought someone should speak up in defense of your charger in case it's being falsely accused.

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