In Dash Radio Speakers

Topic: In Dash Radio Speakers (Read 734 times) previous topic - next topic

In Dash Radio Speakers

January 02, 2017, 01:40:51 am

2003 year model U320 front radio speakers are flush mounted in the ceiling between the windshield and front cabinets. A dual roller shade is installed over the speakers. This installation appears to prevent clear sound from reaching the driver/passenger area. I would like to mount a pair of speakers under the cabinets on each side of the TV, much like the original Bose speakers for the TV sound. However, I have been unsuccessful in locating speakers for this application. I need a good quality, relatively small speaker that can be mounted securely to the underside of the cabinets on each side of the TV cabinet. Has anyone crossed this bridge before and maybe has a solution? Know where I might find such a speaker? The depth of the right cabinet is not sufficient to allow a flush mount. Thanks for any help you can give.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #1 – January 02, 2017, 07:57:39 am

How much room do you have to work with? How "visible" do you want them? Pioneer makes some decent surface mount speakers:

Amazon.com: Pioneer TS-X200 Surface Mount 3-Way Bass-Reflex Speakers:...

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Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #2 – January 02, 2017, 07:58:48 am

If you already have Bose speakers in there ,can't you use some kind splitter and wire your radio into those and use them for both?

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #3 – January 02, 2017, 08:41:50 am

You could run an audio cable to the Bose aux input and play the radio through the Bose but then you would have to have the Bose on and the remote handy. The Bose system in our 2001 uses about 4 amps of 120v power, almost as much as the res refrigerator. Doesn't the Bose have FM? Maybe AM too. Maybe just some good speakers.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #4 – January 02, 2017, 01:36:23 pm

Thanks for the replies. Chuck: I will look into the Pioneers. One ad mentioned a bracket but pictures I see of the speakers show no mounting holes for a bracket. Also noticed one installer installed them with zip ties.
Stump and Roger: Bose system is long gone.
Only have 4.5 inches of surface to work with on passenger side cabinet so hard to install a surface mount.
Somewhere out there, just the right speaker is waiting. Thanks again for the thoughts and ideas...keep them coming!

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #5 – January 02, 2017, 03:39:23 pm

Speakers made by Anthony Gallo (USA) or Orb Audio (Canada) are small spheres (4 inch diameter) with decent sound (not audiophile but good).
Bookshelf speakers which are about one cubic foot can provide audiophile sound at a much higher price (i.e. KEF LS50).

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #6 – January 02, 2017, 09:06:05 pm

Quote from: Bill B – January 02, 2017, 01:40:51 am

..................I need a good quality, relatively small speaker that can be mounted securely to the underside of the cabinets on each side of the TV cabinet. Has anyone crossed this bridge before and maybe has a solution? Know where I might find such a speaker? The depth of the right cabinet is not sufficient to allow a flush mount.......................

Hey Bill,

I've crossed that bridge and have "my" solution, but I don't know if it applies to your "wants and musts", or not. Some people are not aware of sound system quality while others can't bring themselves to tolerate poor quality systems.

One of the things that I missed in our "full timing lifestyle", is a high quality surround sound system that we left behind in our sticks 'n bricks (S&B) property.

By comparison, our original 2002 U320 FT installed BOSE Lifestyle' 50 system has been a huge disappointment. We have also had other BOSE (S&B) systems experience in the past and have been consistently disappointed with the frequent BOSE system failures, early obsolescence (only three or four years and BOSE stops all product support), lack of fine tuning ease (and, in many cases, designs that lack the basic fine tuning features) and numerous other letdowns.

Quite by accident, I discovered a high quality solution in a close friend's home, a couple of years ago. It isn't for everyone, though, as you have to really understand and love quality hi-fi as well as be willing to pay for it.

I'm currently installing a 5.1 surround sound system in our coach ("OUR" Xmas present) that (running in a temporary, scattered-around-the-coach-mode) far exceeds any sound system that I have ever heard in any coach —— ever.

The manufacturer of the components is SONOS and they excel at wireless Hi-Fi, albeit with a premium price tag:

e.g.-

1. Use as many speakers as you want, from one to a dozen or more, all in perfect sync without installation or operating hassle. Each speaker is a POWERED speaker, so each has to have 120 Vac.

You can start your collection with a PLAYBAR, so that you can hear your TV no matter where in the coach you are and your surround sound system will be well on its way.

The SONOS PLAYBAR will connect anything that is connected to your HDTV - whether it's your xbox, bluray player, or Apple TV. And, it will stream anything you have on your Smartphone e.g. - iTunes, Pandora, Spotify, etc.

Or you can start your system with a single, small, PLAY:1 speaker. The SONOS Play:1 speaker is considered to be the "starter" speaker. Once I tried it, I became completely hooked on the SONOS brand. This small speaker packs a big punch despite its size and delivers crisp sound. It can easily fit anywhere, for example, under your front overhead cabinets, without being an eye sore, thanks to its compact size (4.5" in width).

From the Play:1, the SONOS Components become larger, more expensive and have more depth/Bass; PLAY:3, PLAY:5, PLAYBAR, SUBWOOFER, etc.

Thanks to how easy it is to sync SONOS speakers you can build your collection, hassle free, over time, once your budget, musts or wants expand.

2. Expand sound into different areas of the coach, outside the coach or even up to 100 feet away, into adjacent buildings (no waterPROOF speakers, though, so be aware of that).

3. Besides digital optical TV sound (so zero hum and polarity hassle), you can stream music through any or all of the SONOS speakers - Any single SONOS speaker (connected to your router) automatically establishes a SONOS proprietary Wi-Fi network, so you're not running down your phone battery AND you are not limited by a weak Wi-Fi network. If you prefer to stream music from your Android, iPhone, iPad, tablet or computer (Windows OR Apple), that's all automatic setup and operation too!

4. All of the SONOS speakers have state of the art wireless technology, meaning you don't have to worry about re-buffering music lapses due to a weak signal.

5. Stream your iTunes library, Pandora, Spotify, podcasts, or anything else you have on your phone straight to your SONOS system. You change the songs from your phone or computer, no matter where you are (within 50 feet or so of the coach). I refuse to put Adobe Flash and Java on the Macbook Pro and my big iMac Desktop, so we only use our iPhones and iPad for control (The SONOS control app is a free download app. on iTunes, but it requires Adobe Flash and Java to operate, a bad compromise I agree to on the iPhone and iPad but won't make on the Macs)

6. Add the SONOS Subwoofer and it makes your coach into an impressive IMAX home theater, albeit a facsimile DTS.

7. SONOS doesn't support 7.1 DTS surround sound, which many audiophiles would find fault with, but I don't find lacking at all in a coach environment. What is more important to me is that the very first SONOS component remains serviced and useable today and the operating system is periodically updated by SONOS. So, the components actually become BETTER with age, vs. the model of say, BOSE, with a 3 to 5 year obsolescence market strategy. Interestingly, each and ALL of the SONOS speakers don't breakup at volumes that would drive a sane person well away from the coach, yet they are even more faithful at low "campground" levels.

So anyway, that's my 2 cents worth, after many hours of research and listening to various systems in commercial as well as different home environments.

Sorry I got so carried away, but can you tell? I really like these components and the ease with which you can put together a really fine system. While I started out with one ($150) speaker, when all is said and done, our 5.1 system will be about 1.7 coach bucks, which is well less than one quarter the cost of several coach systems that I have listened to and researched (that can't begin to compare to ours in terms of the physical quality of the individual components, the phonetic quality and consistency of the tonal quality of the speakers, the surround sound/multiple area ease of installation, the versatility of inputs and music sources (infinite), the compact footprint and how well it fits (visually) into the coach interior).

HTH,
Neal

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #7 – January 04, 2017, 12:20:51 pm

To play devil's advocate on the Sonos speaker suggestion... Last week I just sold my collection of three Sonos speakers and wireless bridge (Sonos Play:1 and two Sonos Play:5's) because I was not satisfied with several aspects of the Sonos. Objective information to digest:

1) The sound quality is excellent, no problems there. Really great.
2) Sonos speakers have no sleep mode, no low power mode - and draw power at all times even when receiving no audio signal. The only way to turn their power draw off is to unplug or turn off the outlet. For boondocking, this is a big inconvenience.
3) Sonos speakers have no bluetooth. To use the wireless, you must have a wireless router /home network installed in the coach, or plug the audio source directly to the speaker via cable, which defeats some of the wireless purpose. Also an additional necessary power draw.
4) The Sonos App must be used on your cellphone (or computer) to activate the wireless functionality. Unfortunately, the app has an extremely slow response compared to other music apps - and switching sources has to be done via the cellphone App.

Subjectively, I find it quite inconvenient because I use 4 or 5 different audio sources - and I am always switching between cellphone music, TV audio, computer audio, coach stereo audio, etc - and it takes 30-60 seconds to grab your phone, open the Sonos App, wait for it to load, select the appropriate speakers, and select the new audio source. There aren't any buttons on the speakers that perform the same functions - and I expect a more seamless transition given the price tag.

Again, subjectively: For the high price tag - if you aren't going to use the wireless functionality, you can find the same quality for much less money. I was SO EXCITED about Sonos when I first saw/heard one and purchased my first Sonos speaker less than a month later. It is such a great concept - playing different audio sources on different speakers at the same time - but the execution leaves a lot of be desired in terms of user-friendliness and compatibility.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #8 – January 05, 2017, 12:48:25 am

James,

Thanks for your thoughtful comments. You raise a number of points that I have come across with sales personnel and other SONOS owners. Let me give you some thoughts and I hope that they will help clarify questions that others may have in considering these (expensive) systems:

The sound quality is excellent, no problems there. Really great.
Agree

2) Sonos speakers have no sleep mode, no low power mode - and draw power at all times even when receiving no audio signal. The only way to turn their power draw off is to unplug or turn off the outlet. For boondocking, this is a big inconvenience.
There is an easy work around to get rid of those few milliamps of quiescent state current draw by idle, "boondocking" SONOS speakers. Install stepping relays to control the AC to the speakers. On a U320 there are Bose speakers in each of the locations where I have placed SONOS components (but that wiring would be missing on a U270). So, after removing each of the Bose components on a U295 or U320, the wires are already there to use a single master toggle switch to pulse a stepping relay at each SONOS speaker location, thereby easily turning off all of the SONOS components, if there is boondocking parasitic current draw concern.

3) Sonos speakers have no bluetooth. To use the wireless, you must have a wireless router /home network installed in the coach, or plug the audio source directly to the speaker via cable, which defeats some of the wireless purpose. Also an additional necessary power draw.
Correct, but most "extended use" and full timers have already established reliable means of internet access and have WiFi routers onboard. We personally use a Verizon MiFi Jetpack and a Comcast router setup. These are powered off inverter outlets that go dead when the big Xantrex inverter is powered off (so, one switch boondocking conservation mode — that would also work for the SONOS components, if so inclined), so no boondock concern there.

4) The Sonos App must be used on your cellphone (or computer) to activate the wireless functionality. Unfortunately, the app has an extremely slow response compared to other music apps - and switching sources has to be done via the cellphone App.
Not sure why your setup was slow. Ours feels instantaneous from the TV remote/iPhone/iPad/Macbook Pro/ iMac desktop/ or Apple TV control apps. The difference could be that our "starter block" was the SONOS Playbar which includes instantaneous synchronization between the TV digital optical and WiFi audio streams, adjustable lip sync capability for the TV, TV speech clarity adjust-abilities. The Playbar, though, requires a $99 SONOS Boost module to keep the separate, proprietary SONOS WiFi network (and 5.1 surround sound system) synchronized and stumble free (big buffer and strong WiFi field). Maybe that is the reason for the more "instantaneous" feel. But in terms of ease of use, what a difference in terms of improved convenience, being able to control the whole system, an infinite number of music sources, multiple rooms and areas, various music sources in different areas, through any and all of those devices. And when the phone or doorbell rings, one can quickly pause/restart streaming as well as quickly lower or raise the volume of the WHOLE system from local controls on ANY speaker, ANYWHERE in the system (as well as from any of the aforementioned control devices).

Subjectively, I find it quite inconvenient because I use 4 or 5 different audio sources - and I am always switching between cellphone music, TV audio, computer audio, coach stereo audio, etc - and it takes 30-60 seconds to grab your phone, open the Sonos App, wait for it to load, select the appropriate speakers, and select the new audio source. There aren't any buttons on the speakers that perform the same functions - and I expect a more seamless transition given the price tag.
By using the Playbar as the first building block, the TV and all of it's inputs (which number in the dozens on our Smart TV) are automatically and instantaneously selected as the SONOS System default input, if the TV is ON. Turn the TV OFF and the SONOS system moves to whatever input(s) the last used smart phone, tablet, computer had selected as SONOS System input(s). So in its simplest state, with one Smart TV remote and one Smartphone, a person has practically infinite input source possibilities that default instantaneously to and from the chosen TV ON/OFF operation.

Again, subjectively: For the high price tag - if you aren't going to use the wireless functionality, you can find the same quality for much less money. I was SO EXCITED about Sonos when I first saw/heard one and purchased my first Sonos speaker less than a month later. It is such a great concept - playing different audio sources on different speakers at the same time - but the execution leaves a lot of be desired in terms of user-friendliness and compatibility.
The sophistication of the SONOS wireless connectivity is lost on some and I agree, if it isn't important, then by all means one should not pay a premium for it. There are many other features (physical component construction quality, firmware and software enhancements that increase system value with age -- instead of planned obsolescence, setup and operating app's sophistication, component "family" compatibility and exquisite consistency, etc.), just to mention a few, that set SONOS apart (and above) their competition.

Curiously, when I was researching and listening to commercial as well as personal systems, I found a lot of misunderstanding amongst sales personnel as well as owners. So I guess it's rather like a Foretravel, where the beasts ARE complicated enough that often the sophistication eludes people for some (or all) time.

Anyway, hope this helps. Certainly the premium price shouldn't be considered unless the features are important to you and you need the sophistication and quality to be satisfied — kinda like our "FT Earth Rovers".
Neal

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #9 – January 05, 2017, 07:26:30 am

We are a dealer of Sonos. We first learned of them from a customer that had a friend and wanted them in his home. We then looked into them and became a dealer.

When I read the part about no sleep mode. I thought they did. I went to my phone app and it does have sleep mode.

They also have a feature called alarms that you can set up to wake up to music or have it come on at certain times.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #10 – January 05, 2017, 07:46:32 am

Neal,

I think if you give it some time, and as components get added to your system, you'll begin see what I am talking about from a usability standpoint. Right now your Playbar is hard-wired through your TV, so you are getting a lot of additional convenience by not needing to access the wireless functionality needed to use the other Sonos products.

None of your usability points were incorrect either - I was equally as enthusiastic about Sonos and sang their praises constantly two years ago. But let me give you two examples that are consistent with my entire experience with Sonos.

1) I use Spotify as my music service of choice. If I want to listen to Spotify through my Sonos speakers, I need to either plug my phone/ipad/etc directly into the Sonos via cable, or spring $9.99/month for a Spotify premium account. What kind of a speaker company forces you to subscribe to 3rd party services to use the wireless speaker functionality you paid for? That's bad business. Sonos does not allow you to use your phone's built in music player, or any other music/TV/video playing app to stream wirelessly - you must open up that service provider within the Sonos App itself.

Help me understand the stepping relay in the U320. There is a dedicated AC outlet/wiring for each Bose speaker, controlled by a master switch? That's fantastic. Are there 5-ish independent outlets or do you need to cut the AC plug off each Sonos speaker and wire them in?

2) With a master power switch, each independent speaker takes 30-45 seconds to power up the firmware and connect to your router upon receiving power. Because you have to use the Sonos App (and the Sonos App won't work until your speakers are fully connected), add in another 30 seconds after that's over to open up the Sonos App, select the correct source, select the correct music service, and find the song you want, and then you finally have music.

When my 1-year old son is starting to look teary-eyed, and I need to get Old McDonald Had A Farm playing ASAP, a 1+ minute wait means I am playing with fire, and it feels like an eternity. To me: not acceptable given the price tag. If I really need to avoid the floodgates, I just end up just playing the through my cellphone, where I can get Old McDonald cranking in about 3 seconds. Or through an Amazon Tap which takes about 5 seconds. Or through the coach dash stereo Bluetooth which takes about 10 seconds.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #11 – January 05, 2017, 07:54:25 am

Quote from: turbojack – January 05, 2017, 07:26:30 am

I went to my phone app and it does have sleep mode.

Sonos Power Consumption When Idle

Here are the Idle Power draw values (sleep mode) from the Sonos website. A standard surround sound setup with two Play:1's, two Play:5's, a Playbar, and a Bridge will cost you 31 Watts continuously while in sleep mode.

Using the current of 14.5 cents per kilowatt hour average in Maryland, a surround sound Sonos setup costs about $40/year just to keep plugged in idle mode, without ever playing music. That is not insignificant. Even more-so when you consider the power-conscious approach of many motorhome users.

A comparable Bose Soundlink III will draw 0.7 Watts while in idle mode. It's a difference worth considering.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #12 – January 05, 2017, 09:36:37 am

We have a Bose Sound Link Mini (II), small, inexpensive (relatively) battery powered for a long time, wired or wireless connections, portable. We use it with every device in the coach. It is a great alternative to bigger sound bars, more complex and more expensive sytems. You are not going to get the big theater train running you down from behind effect nut are adequately entertained when we want to be. I looked at Sonos stuff, way too complicated, expensive and power hungry for what I wanted. Check them out. Oh and it works with an Echo or Echo Dot.

Amazon.com: Bose SoundLink Mini Bluetooth Speaker II (Carbon): Home Audio &...

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Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #13 – January 05, 2017, 09:47:34 am

Quote from: Roger & Susan in Home2 – January 05, 2017, 09:36:37 am

We have a Bose Sound Link Mini (II)

Very Cool - thanx for posting! I have not kept up with that "category" of speakers - they are making great technological strides!

I learn something new from this Forum almost every time I visit.

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #14 – January 05, 2017, 10:00:45 am

Quote from: Roger & Susan in Home2 – January 05, 2017, 09:36:37 am

Oh and it works with an Echo or Echo Dot.

Sometimes I feel I made the wrong choice to get an amazon tap instead of an amazon echo dot - the automatic link to any bluetooth enabled speaker is such a great feature!

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #15 – January 05, 2017, 11:38:17 am

Here is a link for anyone interested in speakers and amps etc...I have used them for years when replacing speakers in cabinets and a bluetooth set-up for my garage and shop tv/stereo. They are a quality outfit with a good range of items from entry level to high end.
They have a good tech line to help get what you need.

John
Wireless & Bluetooth Speakers in the Home Audio / Video Department at Parts...

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #16 – January 05, 2017, 11:41:04 am

Link please.

Foretravel Owners' Forum For owners and Fans of Foretravel Motorcoaches September 13, 2025 ...

In Dash Radio Speakers

January 02, 2017, 01:40:51 am

Re: In Dash Radio Speakers

Reply #1 – January 02, 2017, 07:57:39 am

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Reply #2 – January 02, 2017, 07:58:48 am

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Reply #3 – January 02, 2017, 08:41:50 am

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Reply #4 – January 02, 2017, 01:36:23 pm

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Reply #5 – January 02, 2017, 03:39:23 pm

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Reply #6 – January 02, 2017, 09:06:05 pm

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Reply #7 – January 04, 2017, 12:20:51 pm

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Reply #8 – January 05, 2017, 12:48:25 am

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Reply #9 – January 05, 2017, 07:26:30 am

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Reply #10 – January 05, 2017, 07:46:32 am

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Reply #11 – January 05, 2017, 07:54:25 am

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Reply #12 – January 05, 2017, 09:36:37 am

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Reply #13 – January 05, 2017, 09:47:34 am

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Reply #14 – January 05, 2017, 10:00:45 am

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Reply #15 – January 05, 2017, 11:38:17 am

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Reply #16 – January 05, 2017, 11:41:04 am

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