Cummins M11 ECU

Topic: Cummins M11 ECU (Read 3933 times) previous topic - next topic

Cummins M11 ECU

May 27, 2017, 02:07:01 am

On our maiden voyage in the 320 this morning we left our homebase in Baytown, TX headed Northwest to Waco, TX for the Holiday weekend. Just north of Hearne the stop engine light began to cycle on and off then came on steadily so I pulled over while observing all gauges and parameters were in check, I shut the engine down for a few minutes and the light remained off so I restarted the engine and preceded for about five miles when the engine alarm came on again and began losing power and missing violently along with some nice blue and white smoke. After getting pulled over I shut it down. I called for roadside assistance and a Mechanic arrived 3 hours later with a laptop and Cummins Insite. I had 8 fault codes that all registered at the same time and engine speed. he checked the 10 amp fuses that feed the ECU and found one that had blown. He replaced and it blew again so he disconnected the ECU connectors and the fuse held. Diagnosis Dead ECU! I called for a tow and 7 hours and 600.00 later I arrived at Stewart and Stevenson in Waco, I will try to have ECU rebuilt if possible. Luckily my wife was a couple of hours behind us in her car so she picked up my daughter and BeeGee our bird! During our 10 plus hours brokedown in the boondocks not one RVer or car stopped to offer assistance. A State Trooper offered to assist while the tow truck driver did his thing. My first RV outing has been quite memorable to say the least. And I will as always will stop to offer assistance to RVer's broke down. rw

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #1 – May 27, 2017, 05:44:41 am

Wow what a maiden trip

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #2 – May 27, 2017, 07:25:44 am

What year is the coach?

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #3 – May 27, 2017, 07:44:30 am

Ur next trip will be better. Many times I come upon a broke down RV. Almost all the time they have assistance so as a shade tree mechanic I can not help. I read these forums and there is questions concerning issues. Many issues are general problems with some caused by human error. Foretravel does build a lot of coaches,
As their price point is above most of our desires. We need a low end coach without all the bells and whistles. High end coaches just have lot to maintain. I find that all coaches no matter what brand have to be repaired. ECU is not the end but the beginning of a lot of fun. Don't let one issue destroy ur vision.

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #4 – May 27, 2017, 07:50:37 am

Please add your coach information to your signature.

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #5 – May 27, 2017, 09:04:46 am

Midwest ECM repair in Colorado can fix it

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #6 – May 27, 2017, 10:24:30 am

Doing a search on the Forum, it seems ecu or ecm are one and the same and failures are rare. Also in that search there was mention of ecm failure caused by a wiring problem. I am not familiar with the Cummins ecm's but in automotive I have found most ecm failures were caused by wires or sensor failures. I hope that your case is different but would hate to see a rebuilt ecu go down right after being rebuilt.

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #7 – May 27, 2017, 10:57:23 am

Craneman has a good answer for the ECU failure. Sensor failure/connections or alternator spikes are the probable culprit. With aircraft radios, it's estimated voltage spikes are responsible for 75% of the failures. Over voltage is also not a good thing. That's one of the reasons I have the twin digital voltmeters right in front of me while driving.

Clean connections at the batteries and checking alternator wiring at the connectors are a good thing to do before a trip. Never hurts to pull an alternator and have your local electrical shop throw a set of brushes and bearings in. Less than $100 is cheap insurance. When brushes get worn down and start making intermittent contact is when rapid voltage spikes can happen.

Pierce

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #8 – May 27, 2017, 11:21:26 am

Sorry for your aggravation, hard way to start your adventure.
Lots of wisdom in previous posts about finding source of spikes Happily, it was not internal engine issues! Welcome

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #9 – May 27, 2017, 11:56:15 am

Not that this has any relevance to your issue but the cam position sensor on all m11's fail over time,

Oil gets inside and kills the two internal pickups.

Inexpensive part

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #10 – May 27, 2017, 07:21:20 pm

It can only get better.. you will make it through and after your first success it will bE a distant memory

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #11 – May 27, 2017, 08:01:43 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2kkA5MZ_JU

This man discusses problems with ECU issues and may have some insight to avoid other problems in the future.

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #12 – May 27, 2017, 08:21:47 pm

Does not sound like a cheap repair. Good video once he gets around to the subject. I wonder if a Bosch pump conversion for the M11 is available like the 8.3 Cummins?

Does say a lot for the old days with mechanical engines.

Pierce

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #13 – May 27, 2017, 08:54:53 pm

We have an ISC 350 and had what was thought to be ECU(M) major problems and had it replaced while on the road at a Cummins shop. It cost $1700.00 but that did not solve the problem so I had them put old one back but not before checking the pins on connectors. Turns out that 3 of the pins had broken and was causing the voltage issues. Our coach was switching on or off the throttle control and gave us a wild ride in rush hour traffic. Replacing those faulty pins sorted all the problems out and saved buying a new one. maybe you have similar issues.
JohnH

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #14 – May 28, 2017, 10:32:34 am

Sorry you are having such a time.

I had a similar problem a couple years ago after I already had my lift pump replaced, all new fuel lines, etc. Coach died on me, no warning, just stopped. I managed to get it started again, found a pull off and changed fuel filter and checked everything I could think of. Started up fine, hit the road, 15 minutes later check engine light came on and loss of power. Nothing showing on VMS-PC as abnormal, was at my wits end. We went into Cummins Coach Care in West Chester, Ohio. They took it back and while they were checking I researched myself and thought it must be the main CAPS fuel pump. 1.5 hours later the service manager came out and said the problem is shorts in the wiring from the ECM to the fuel pump. The cure is to take apart the wiring harness, find each short, cut it out , splice in new wire, wrap it all up and test. 3 hours labor and they took it out for a test- ran fine. With Cummins Power Club card my bill was under $600.

That was 2 years ago and everything is still running fine. Don't jump on replacing expensive parts. Let a tech who knows what they are doing work for you........................

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #15 – May 28, 2017, 10:09:11 pm

I don't have statistics or studies, but I keep lots of equipment running. I can say this....if the damn thing lasted 10+ years already, chances are it isn't the ECM...it's probably a sensor, connector, or wiring. ECM/module failures usually are well known (because they occur often in a certain model) or fail pretty early earn (infant mortality).

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #16 – July 03, 2017, 09:14:14 pm

UPDATE M11 Cummins: After waiting several weeks and many phone calls to the mechanic (CrossTex) who had the Tow Truck Driver drop off our U320 at Stewart and Stevenson in Waco, Texas whom of which does not work on Cummins Engines only Detroit, I had to take matters into my own hands. I had gone back to the RV and removed the ECM and dropped it off at the Mechanics house on Sunday two days after the original breakdown. He wanted to send it off to have it rebuilt, which I agreed with. A week later I called and he still had not had time to send it UPS yet, but promised to do so the following Monday. Two weeks in he won't return my calls, but sends a text saying the ECM is not repairable. I ask him to check on the RV for us since he lives less than 2 miles from S&S and drives by it several times a day. He says he does not have time but it is still there and looks fine from a distance? At this point I have decided to repair it myself and proceed to order the ECM from Heavy Duty Powertrain, Inc. After speaking to Art and Terry they recommended also replacing the Sensor Wiring Harness, Fuel Injector Wiring Harness, Fuel Shut off Solenoid and Engine Position Sensor since all of these are prone to cause issues with ECM on M11 Celect engines. I agreed and purchased the items as well as one Fuel Injector. Totaling up a bill of $4000.00. I will hopefully get a core refund on the ECM of $600.00. HDP needed the axle ratio, Tire size and Alison information to program the ECM. Of course this was in the RV in Waco! So a quick phone call to FT took care of that. My father in law and I arrived in Waco late Thursday night. I had no idea what to expect when I went to check on the RV. Had it been broken into?, did I have any fuel left? much less any batteries etc. I had worried myself sick over the previous 5 weeks about it. Remarkably everything was still intact! Early Friday we hit it hard first removing the turbo inlet pipe then the valve cover then unplugging and checking each of the fuel injectors for resistance. They all were within 5 percent of each other, which was a good thing. If I had encountered a shorted injector I would have had to stop at that point and have the RV towed to Diesel Power Supply Co of Waco because I did not have a barring over tool reset the rocker arms and Jake Brake assembly. I already had contacted them ahead of time in case I ran into problems. Those folks are super friendly and will gladly work on Cummins RV's. Then I removed the old injector harness which is made in two parts, one piece is mounts under the valve cover the other mates to it from the rear of the cylinder head. These are held together with a single Torx screw. Then I installed new injector harness and routed towards ECM location. After that I reinstalled Valve cover with new gasket which gave a me a place to lay facedown on a pillow, making it much more comfortable to work if that is possible on a diesel pusher! Next I unfastened the ECM cooling plate for two reasons to first to remove sensor the harness which runs behind it and this will also allow access to remove Fuel Shutoff Solenoid. After replacing Fuel Solenoid (a royal pain) I moved onto removing the old sensor harness. I installed new Sensor Harness reconnecting all sensors and double checking all connections. Next was to mount ECM and connect the three harnesses.1. Injector, 2. Sensor and 3. OEM. Last I replaced engine position sensor which is easily accessible from the back of the coach. After triple checking all connections, wire loom straps etc. we were ready to fire it up. Of course the batteries were at 11.4 volts so the engine would barely turn over. Attaching my shop Battery charger for thirty minutes she kicked right off. But, I had a stop engine light on the dash. Now what! I had purchased a Nexiq USB Driver on eBay for $234.00 from China two weeks prior but I did not have InSite Loaded on my Laptop. (My Roadside Mechanic was supposed to show up with his InSite loaded laptop, but sent a text stating he would be out of town until Wednesday and wished me luck) I quickly found a copy from Germany on EBay and uploaded it for $99.00. It took a good hour or so to get the program loaded and working some what at best. When I attempted to hook up to the ECM I immediately got a stop engine light on the dash and my heart skipped a few beats and then all of the lights cleared up. The engine sounded and ran very smooth. I asked my Father in Law if was feeling lucky enough to go for test drive around the parking lot and he agreed. We made 10 loops around the lot and then headed out north I-35 towards Dallas. We drove 35 miles and turned around came back stopping at Flying J adding a $100.00 worth of fuel. Returned the RV to S&S lot and went back to the hotel for the evening and left Waco at 0630 Sunday morning back to Baytown, TX without a hitch. While purchasing this RV I had asked the previous owner if there was anything that needed attention or he would recommend doing to the coach to which he replied the main awning would need replacing in a couple seasons that was it. He just had the Cruise Control repaired at Southern Plains Cummins in Houston with no other problems. Looking back now I had noticed white smoke coming from the exhaust really bad the week after picking it up . It was at night and I had hooked my 24' racecar trailer (My Daughter Races Junior Dragsters) I headed out on North Main Street here in town and happened to look in my side mirror only to see a cloud of white smoke which I in turn thought was my trailer brakes locking up so I immediately whip into Food Town parking lot and have my daughter watch as I slowly drive around the lot looking for any sign of the brakes locking up. She tells me it is coming out of the tailpipe of the RV. She hops in and we head out to Evadale Dragstrip north of Beaumont,TX without any issues. I do notice that as I am driving into the parking area at the track white smoke is pouring out as I barely give it any throttle. After returning home I start it and I only see white smoke to about 1000 rpm then it clears up. The Kicker is while I was broke down waiting on the tow truck on our way to Waco the girls had left me behind to take of the tow situation. With nothing else better to do I start going through the paperwork and receipts of the RV and find the invoice where the previous owner had the cruise control repaired (two weeks prior to me buying it) for $650.00 at Southern Plains and the invoice also states he wanted them to check the engine for EXCESSIVE WHITE SMOKE! Seriously Folks! Southern Plains stated on the invoice that the customer needed the RV sooner than expected and instructed them not to diagnose the White Smoke Issue! What else can I say folks. Lol, I will meet up with seller next week to pickup my Title and I will let you know how that goes. The bottom line is I coulda Shoulda woulda had the RV checked out beforehand and I own up to it. On a scale of one to ten I would rate job as a 9.0 only because it took us 10 hours in 98 degree heat in a parking lot and is very difficult to remove and replace the wiring harnesses and ECM on a Diesel Pusher with such limited access and the fact that you will almost certainly need InSite if your replacement ECM it throws any codes or dash lights. Luckily I am a Retired Locomotive Electrician. I would have gladly paid the roadside mechanic to do the work me. The main thing is our U320 is back home and we look forward to many miles ahead in her. I will next have the fluids changed and maybe we can finally go RVing and actually hook up to some utilities.

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #17 – July 03, 2017, 10:12:40 pm

Think this one was hard to work on,, you havent seen other brands lol... You cant get in them and the bed doesnt lift( you do realize the bed lifts up so you can work from above? ..Anyways I am glad you handled it and are moving forward.. She is a keeper!

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #18 – July 03, 2017, 10:26:57 pm

My diesel expertise is limited but most of these engines have never been driven hard. Babied by the terrified owners..every one.

The rings may need seating still at 170k miles.

Truckers reported that kind of miles on m11's to finally seat everything.

My personal thought if it were mine would be to put std DeloLE oil of something Dino based to get some friction in the cylinders to seat the rings.

Unless it's coolant loss which would show very soon or the compression is down IMHO.

That being said the rack needs running at 100k miles and injectors set.

Cam position sensor fails on these. Erratic firing at idle if you walk behind the coach with the engine running.

You can hear the misfires.

The other update is the ambient air pressure sensor update.

Both external and not expensive. Rack run, sensors updated, air filter changed. Thinner oil to reseat things.

Muffler may be plugged internally as the steel part rusts.

XL5050 is noisier and much less back pressure.

Reduction in back pressure will help seat the rings

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #19 – July 04, 2017, 12:26:25 pm

Quote from: rwbaytown – July 03, 2017, 09:14:14 pm

I will hopefully get a core refund on the ECM of $600.00.

Did you ever get your ECM back from one of the top mechanics in the country?

Good luck,

Trent

Re: Cummins M11 ECU

Reply #20 – July 05, 2017, 06:28:41 am

Here is the link to the Pictures. M11 Celect by Robert Walters | Photobucket

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