Roadworthiness in the USA

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Roadworthiness in the USA

December 11, 2012, 07:51:46 am

As I have no idea on USA roadworthines on vehichles, what sort of tests or examinations do they do in the USA on Buses and trucks to make sure they are safe to drive on the roads,
I have been told they dont have roadworthys in the USA,

I am sure they must have some thing, other wise they would have heaps of dangerous junk posing as cars travelling the roads there,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #1 – December 11, 2012, 08:39:01 am

Brian, Roadworthy ? Surely you jest .....
In the US there is virtually no safety standard for vehicles other than Commercial trucks and buses and even at that there is poor enforcement of the Department of Transportation rules. In the State of Georgia where I live the only inspection of a non commercial vehicle , which includes motorhomes, is an emissions test. And the emissions test does not apply to a diesel vehicle. And I am not required in Georgia to have any special license to operate a 28K MH. ( I do have a CDL ).
For many years I worked as a safety engineer in the truck and bus insurance end of the transportation business. I cannot count the number of wrecks and incidents that I investigated that were attributed to unqualified drivers and poorly maintained equipment. This was about the time of deregulation and even though I am no longer involved I don't believe that the situation has improved much. Every day you read of an incident where a Bus goes off the road, or a truck slams into a line of traffic. With the caliber of commercial drivers today I don't believe its ever going to get better. There is such a shortage of CDL drivers that it is frightening to know that drivers just out of a minimum time CDL school are on the road. And in the case of privately operated motorhomes you can do what you want with no oversight at all.
IMHO no one should be allowed behind the wheel of a vehicle ( including cars ) without a bare minimum of training, I understand that the Europeans are far ahead of us in this respect.

End of rant.

Gary B

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #2 – December 11, 2012, 09:49:36 am

Quote from: Gary Bouland – December 11, 2012, 08:39:01 am

Brian, Roadworthy ? Surely you jest .....
In the US there is virtually no safety standard for vehicles other than Commercial trucks and buses and even at that there is poor enforcement of the Department of Transportation rules. In the State of Georgia where I live the only inspection of a non commercial vehicle , which includes motorhomes, is an emissions test. And the emissions test does not apply to a diesel vehicle. And I am not required in Georgia to have any special license to operate a 28K MH. ( I do have a CDL ).
For many years I worked as a safety engineer in the truck and bus insurance end of the transportation business. I cannot count the number of wrecks and incidents that I investigated that were attributed to unqualified drivers and poorly maintained equipment. This was about the time of deregulation and even though I am no longer involved I don't believe that the situation has improved much. Every day you read of an incident where a Bus goes off the road, or a truck slams into a line of traffic. With the caliber of commercial drivers today I don't believe its ever going to get better. There is such a shortage of CDL drivers that it is frightening to know that drivers just out of a minimum time CDL school are on the road. And in the case of privately operated motorhomes you can do what you want with no oversight at all.
IMHO no one should be allowed behind the wheel of a vehicle ( including cars ) without a bare minimum of training, I understand that the Europeans are far ahead of us in this respect.

End of rant.

Gary B

Thanks for that Gary, Rant is right, WOW, I didnt know it was that bad there, I was looking at the piccys the bloke in California sent to me on the steering conversion, Just The oil leak on the steering box, it wont pass the roadworthy here,
I was going to get under and wash it, so it didnt look like it was leaking,

Looks like I might be up for a few quid when it gets here, Roadworthys on trucks, Buses, motor bikes and cars are quite stringent, If it fails a road worthy test, you get 28 days to fix it or you get the rego cancelled, and you dont drive it any where, Its then a tow away job.

Failing a roadworthy carries a 3 point penalty, and a heavy fine, Accumulate 12 points and you lose your licence to drive any thing, all licences have the same number and all on the one card, so lose one licence and you lose the lot, your walking for the prescribed time, also its a zero blood alcohol for driving any heavy vehicle,
Party the night before and you make sure your totally sober the next day before driving, or even the day after, just to be on the safe side, Compulsory 6 months suspension for drink driving, thats just a little bit, one small beer and your gone, five beers, 18 months suspension, You make sure your bloody sober here when you drive a heavy vehicle,

My RV is classified as a heavy vehicle here, and they go over heavy vehicles a lot more harshly, You also have to go over the weigh bridges if your travelling just like all the trucks and buses have to, so my RV is checked all the time for roadworthyiness, and to make sure its not over weight as well,

Traffic Authority here are Zealots, They keep looking till they find some thing they can book you for,

I just hope the PO maintained his vehicle prior to selling it to me, There is only so much you can see from piccys,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #3 – December 11, 2012, 10:12:29 am

Traffic and Vehicle safety have been a thorn in my a.. for years and I guess that I should have mellowed by this time in my life.
I like your methods, sure would be nice if the US could have the guts to enforce the laws they already have and really do prevention instead of reacting after an incident.
I am sure that there are professionals from the transportation business here that have some opinions about the laxity of US laws.
Gary B

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #4 – December 11, 2012, 10:31:40 am

Our roads are really bad, so it was cheaper to make the vehicles safer then fix the roads, It didnt cost the Govt any thing, this was all at the owners expense,
We did have massive pile ups years ago, head ons with trucks and buses, killing a lot of people in the one accident, so they had to do some thing about it,

When enough people get killed, they are forced to do some thing about it, I think we have some of the toughest laws in the world in regards to car safety,
Cars from over seas bought second hand, they just wont register here as the wont Pass the OZ ADR's for vehicles.
I am not sure yet, But I may have to put an exhaust on my bus that goes above the roof line at the rear, New law that just came in,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #5 – December 11, 2012, 01:27:26 pm

I could go on for hours about the hundreds of reasons for road conditions and the fatality rate but will limit the length and boar

factor.

Fuel here is less expensive than other industrial nations for several reasons. In Europe, road tax sends the price per gallon to $9 with some less developed countries like Turkey paying $10 for one gallon. While my in depth experience is mostly in Germany, much of it applies to the other northern European countries.

Road construction is different with a 20 to 30 year bonding requirement for highway construction. This rules out the mom and pop companies with only mega companies able to get the required bond. This also means highways that are almost a foot thicker with the latest autobahns so glass smooth, you think something is wrong with the speedometer at 120 mph. The road taxes also pay for video coverage of every inch with large traffic control centers that can post overhead speed limits for EACH LANE as traffic conditions warrant. On the weekends, medical helicopters fly over the autobahn for quick evacuation to trauma centers located every few kilometers.

While Germany has no toll road or bridges, other countries like France do collect fairly hefty tolls on the super highways.

Could we build superhighways like Europe? Possibly, but we would need really high road taxes to fund it and with our population density and the economic realities of today, it's probably not feasible. Before reunification, Germany was 1000 square miles smaller than Oregon and now is just a bit larger than New Mexico so with 83 million people, has the right population per square mile to make all this possible.

Unlike here, the Europeans pay the same registration fee each year for their cars, the amount dependent on engine displacement (size) with the cost per one hundred cubic centimeters rising at an exponential rate above 1.7 liters in countries like Italy. A huge middle class and a high average income make car sales brisk in the northern countries. Salting the roads also limits the life of cars in many areas with bi-annual inspections relegating many cars to the junk yard or sales to the southern countries. In other words, NO one drives a beater in the north. Of interest, the value added tax (VAT) from new car sales to restaurants prices is 19% BUT if you buy anything used, there is NO tax.

Alcohol influence while driving penalties are very severe (like Nevada) and once you lose your driver's license, you can't even drive to work. DMV will call work to see how "Wolfgang" arrived. With excellent public transportation and lots of taxis, it's not a problem that it would be in a lot of locations here. There are frequent sobriety check points at night and many even do a quick tread depth check on the tires. In some countries like Hungary, if the meter even moves, you are off to jail and the car is impounded.

In short, owning and driving a Foretravel would be an expensive luxury across the pond. While they have great roads, etc., we have the scenery, national parks and WEATHER that they can only dream about.

Pierce

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #6 – December 11, 2012, 02:22:49 pm

Brian,
The reality is that the safety and inspection requirements of vehicles vary from state to state here in the U.S. and some states are quite strict and far from "virtually no safety standard for vehicles other than Commercial trucks and buses". Some states have lax requirements and some have strict requirements. In Massachusetts if your personal automobile or RV fails any safety check you are not legally allowed to drive the car.
Here is an excerpt from the MA FAQ's regarding a failed safety check.

Massachusetts RMV - Inspections FAQs

"I failed. Now what?
First of all, DON'T PANIC! It's not the end of the world! It is important to note that the purpose of our inspection program is to ensure public safety, which includes YOU. With nearly 5,000,000 registered vehicles in Massachusetts, common sense dictates that roadway safety requires safely operating vehicles. We hope we can count on your cooperation, and want you to know that we are here to help if you need it. We're just a phone call away. There are two categories of inspection failures: If the problem is a safety related issue (brakes, horn, tires, etc.) You must have the problem fixed immediately. You are not allowed to drive the vehicle or motorcycle until the safety issue(s) are resolved. Click the link if your vehicle fails and the problem is emissions related. If you failed for an emissions related problem, the inspector is required to provide you with an Emissions Failure Brochure. These brochures are available free of charge at all Official Massachusetts Inspection Stations."

Another excerpt,
"Will a vehicle with a small crack in a tail light or missing reflector pass inspection?
No, the regulation clearly states that all lenses and reflectors must be intact, clean, unobstructed, and free from cracks. The use of adhesive tape to repair lenses is prohibited. If the lens has been repaired with an epoxy and is sealed from any water intrusion, it should pass"

Also in MA all vehicles over 26K lbs must go to an inspection station certified to inspect heavy vehicles. I know there are several other states that do this but you can research that on your own if you want and not all owners of RV's comply because they think the police ignore RV's when it comes to inspection,safety,etc. So do some research into what the actual inspection requirements are for the state from which your coach is coming from. It may provide an insight as to what may or may not have been checked. No guarantee that the inspector was competent or the owner/operator was diligent in his maintenance but at least you will have an idea of what was supposed to be done and checked.
Good luck with your new coach,
Rick

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #7 – December 11, 2012, 05:27:07 pm

I don't want to be misunderstood, there are many expert drivers on the road.. but they are outnumbered by those that are not. Even among friends that have MH's I have some who should have hung up the keys a long time ago. The key to accident prevention in my opinion is strict and uniform enforcement across the US, and a comprehensive safety inspection of ALL vehicles would go a long way towards this goal. It makes no sense to me that I can drive anything I want to with a Georgia Drivers license as long as it is not engaged in commerce, while in some states you have to pass a CDL type test to drive a MH. ? DUH,
And even dumber is that I can drive a piece of junk from Georgia to any other state and because of reciprocity laws can probably get by with it.

OK I'll shut up, I did not mean to start a long thread.
Gary B

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #8 – December 11, 2012, 11:05:27 pm

Thank you to all who have responded to my query,

On your advice I looked up the DMV in Texas where my Bus came from, The PO lived there, I think, I bought it from an RV dealer there, and the PO was a local, But I could be wrong,

As I was an overseas buyer, it was as-is and no warranty, But it would have all that was required if I was in Texas and buying it personally,

From what I have read, The Texas DMV have a compulsory yearly inspection on motor homes, Covering steering, brakes, lights and emissions, Etc,

But some one on here from Texas could tell me what the inspection really entailed, As they would have first hand knowledge of the test,

whether it is all smoke and mirrors or it is actually a real and valid inspection,

When the Bloke doing my conversion told me they dont have roadworthys in the USA like they do in OZ, I died in the Butt, As I know I would be up for a lot of money to get a roadworthy here, If it hadnt been maintained regularly, some thing I just dont have the knowledge on,

The Bloke doing the conversion is an ex Aussie and has a dealers licence in California and Queensland, Australia as well, so he does know what he is talking about,

He said he would check out my bus concerning the roadorthyness of it for OZ roads, But I havent heard back from him as yet,

Even so, It is a great bus, and I love it, I cant wait to get it here and Drool over it, and take it for a drive, Even if it costs me a bundle for the roadworthy, It will still be a cheap bus, far cheaper and better quality than any thing I can buy or make myself here,
Diesel is $1-50 per litre here,

The bus does 10 miles per gallon at 75 MPH. Our gallons are bigger than yours, so the mileage for the bus, means its even cheaper to run,

We have a 100 KPH limit Australia wide on heavy vehicles, So it should work out even cheaper at the lower speeds,

Cheers,
Brian,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #9 – December 11, 2012, 11:31:19 pm

Quote from: MR B2 – December 11, 2012, 11:05:27 pm

From what I have read, The Texas DMV have a compulsory yearly inspection on motor homes, Covering steering, brakes, lights and emissions, Etc,

But some one on here from Texas could tell me what the inspection really entailed, As they would have first hand knowledge of the test,

Brian,

On a diesel motorhome, there is no emissions test in Texas. The annual safety inspection is lights, horn, wipers, tires (tread depth), and brakes. It generally takes 5 minutes and costs around $16-20.

Depending on county, if you have a gasoline vehicle in Texas you may also need to have emissions done during your inspection (and it may be for all counties now, years ago it was only in certain ones).

Michelle

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #10 – December 11, 2012, 11:46:51 pm

Roadworthy here for a RV takes 3 hours Minimum and costs $330-00 plus parts and labour if any thing needs doing,

It certainly isnt a cursory look, They put it up on the hoist and go through every thing,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #11 – December 12, 2012, 01:07:19 am

Actually, there are all kinds of requirements a vehicle must meet before being approved to be sold to the public. TestProcedures | National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). But few of these thing have anything to do with roadworthiness. If they did, the General Motors P-3O chassis would have never been permitted for a platform for motor homes. Same for some of the Ford gas chassis.

Both the popular Chevy and Ford gas platforms have handling problems when it comes to roadworthiness. All one has to do is search for the many modifications that are made on these chassis in a attempt to make them more roadworthy. I think of the many owners white knuckling it down the highway and it scares the heck out of me when I meet another motorhome. I've driven many heavy vehicles over the years and there are only two that leave lasting bad memories. The first one was a "rebuilt" Freightliner Class 8 tractor that had been in a very bad accident and bounced "front right corner to rear left corner" while going down the road, and the other was a 1994 Allegro on a P32 chassis. Both these vehicles were candidates for very serious accidents caused by handling problems. Driving both demanded ones full time attention. Doing anything else while driving them was extremely dangerous!! I say that having hauled two trailers grossing 135,000 pounds and having hauled gasoline, Jet A, JP8, kerosene, diesel fuel, and 360 degree HOT liquid asphalt and having logged well over a million safe driving miles.

Now I find my 1994 Foretravel U225 with Velvet Ride Torsilastic Suspension a joy to drive, actually fun. And its safey record actually is outstanding!!! And it handles just as well as anything I have ever driven on air suspensions. And its ride actually comes close to some air suspensions I have driven.

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #12 – December 12, 2012, 01:17:35 am

Quote from: MR B2 – December 11, 2012, 11:46:51 pm

Roadworthy here for a RV takes 3 hours Minimum and costs $330-00 plus parts and labour if any thing needs doing,

It certainly isnt a cursory look, They put it up on the hoist and go through every thing,

Brian,
You must remember that we consist of 50 little independent states that all share sovereignty with the federal government and all have their own constitution, legislature, judiciary, executive branch and capital city. So we do have some states that require yearly safety inspections similiar to what you describe. And there are others that require no safety inspections. The federal government only requires safety inspections on interstate commercial vehicles which fall under both federal and home state requirements.

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #13 – December 12, 2012, 06:11:39 pm

Is there a published "Roadworthy" guideline available? It might give us some insight into what you're looking at. Brakes, of course, but you want them optimal anyway....obvious leaks which you wouldn't want either and lights that work. Other than that it's hard to see where you would have a problem. I'd suggest taking some time to really clean all the mechanical areas before taking it in for inspection, it'll make a big difference in how the inspector perceives the vehicle.

The Texas inspection is pretty cursory, they check that all lights work, tires are ok, windshields don't have cracks that would obstruct vision and so forth. No road test or emissions test for motorhomes.

Chuck

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #14 – December 12, 2012, 06:52:23 pm

(off-topic) - Chuck: sent you a PM.

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #15 – December 12, 2012, 07:12:07 pm

Here you go, This is the gist of it, But there is a certificate that also gets filled in by a licenced roadworthy inspector and gets sent to Vicroads with the appropiate fees,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #16 – December 12, 2012, 09:33:14 pm

Let's see/// last Texas inspection was something like "It'll be $12.50 on one check and $5.00 on another. Here, put this on your windshield" so that's how I am sure I've got a safe coach because my windshield sticker says so!

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #17 – December 12, 2012, 10:46:27 pm

Read it. Sounds like you may(?) need to pipe your exhaust up, possibly installl some non slip to the floor pedals. Don't think you'll have any problem with brake performance, these things stop amazingly well. Guess they'll mike the rotors for thickness. They're pretty tough on windshield standards as far as chips and cracks, that'd be something to have dealt with prior to shipping if possible. As far as compliance of the motorhome portion inside to Au standards hard to say but any inspector looking at the general quality of installations like electrical and appliances for instance should be favorably impressed. It does state that no vehicle has to meet standards that exceed those in place when the vehicle was built which is significant because it says to me they don't expect you to make a new vehicle out of an old one. Might need to replace lenses on clearance lights if they're faded. Stains around gaskets and hoses are ok as are oil/grease as long as it's not dripping. All in all doesn't sound too bad, really, just try not to get Atilla the Hun for an inspector. I betcha you'll be ok.

Chuck

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #18 – December 12, 2012, 11:41:09 pm

Quote from: lgshoup – December 12, 2012, 09:33:14 pm

Let's see/// last Texas inspection was something like "It'll be $12.50 on one check and $5.00 on another. Here, put this on your windshield" so that's how I am sure I've got a safe coach because my windshield sticker says so!

Now that is scary. But you are covered, the sticker proves it,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #19 – December 12, 2012, 11:55:56 pm

Quote from: Chuck Pearson – December 12, 2012, 10:46:27 pm

Read it. Sounds like you may(?) need to pipe your exhaust up, possibly installl some non slip to the floor pedals. Don't think you'll have any problem with brake performance, these things stop amazingly well. Guess they'll mike the rotors for thickness. They're pretty tough on windshield standards as far as chips and cracks, that'd be something to have dealt with prior to shipping if possible. As far as compliance of the motorhome portion inside to Au standards hard to say but any inspector looking at the general quality of installations like electrical and appliances for instance should be favorably impressed. It does state that no vehicle has to meet standards that exceed those in place when the vehicle was built which is significant because it says to me they don't expect you to make a new vehicle out of an old one. Might need to replace lenses on clearance lights if they're faded. Stains around gaskets and hoses are ok as are oil/grease as long as it's not dripping. All in all doesn't sound too bad, really, just try not to get Atilla the Hun for an inspector. I betcha you'll be ok.

Chuck

The rubbers for the pedals will be a sure thing, But I did read that Buses were exempt from the exhaust extension, see what happens on that one, but it will have to be out the right hand side of the bus, or the rear,
All the lights are being done there, Left to right offset, or visa versa,
I will check out what the windscreen is like, good idea to have to changed there, as they arent any here to fit,

Electrics and gas lines are all being done there,

Attila the Hun, I worked across the road from Vicroads years ago, A low loader pulled up and dropped a Boom Lift off in front of the site, Had to be driven 50 feet to be on the site, Vicroads officer walked over and booked the operator for operating an unregistered vehicle, $600-00 fine, Very nice man, NOT,
I was lucky it was not me, They had got it for me to do the top outside floors,

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #20 – December 13, 2012, 04:36:35 pm

The test in OZ sounds a lot like the dreaded "MoT" test back home in the UK. There a Class A is a "Motor Caravan" and is a class IV vehicle. Has to be tested when 3 years old. They really go through it as well. Won't even allow body damage. Last time they tested my car they even checked headlight aim.

While I think that vehicle safety testing is a good idea here in the US we desperately need a proper driving test. I had to take the complete test last year as my license could not be found in their computer! The "written" test is on computer. I sat down at the only empty terminal out of about ten. I got up a few minuets later and ALL the rest of the people were still staring in puzzlement at the screen. I got 100%. Not boasting but if you don't know what a octagonal red sign means then you should not be behind the wheel. Now Illinois is going to give licenses to illegal immigrants. As I am a legal immigrant you don't want to know my opinion on THAT one!!!!

Keith

Re: Roadworthiness in the USA

Reply #21 – December 13, 2012, 06:23:12 pm

Quote from: Keith and Joyce – December 13, 2012, 04:36:35 pm

The test in OZ sounds a lot like the dreaded "MoT" test back home in the UK. There a Class A is a "Motor Caravan" and is a class IV vehicle. Has to be tested when 3 years old. They really go through it as well. Won't even allow body damage. Last time they tested my car they even checked headlight aim.

Pennsylvania does not allow any rust or body rot as part of their safety inspection. Here in NYS, there is both a car/light truck safety inspection (NYS DMV - (Brochure) New York State Vehicle Safety/Emissions Inspection Program and a Emissions Inspection where they hook up to your obdii plug and send the info directly to DMV at the state capital. Heavy vehicles ( my U225 is just below the heavy vehicle requirement) have additional requirements for the safety and emissions testing. Here is the a copy of the price scale for the various inspections: NYVIP: View DMV Message. The shops complain because they don't make money on it, so they make sure that they find something wrong.

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