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Topic: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed (Read 918 times) previous topic - next topic

HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

I have a problem.
The left front air bags will not make the coach come to a good travel height.
There is about 1" clearance between the left front tire and the underside of the wheel well.  The other side has about 3.5-4 inches of space.
At this point, I believe we have reached the end of our mental, printed, and other resources and could use some assistance beyond that which we have already received.

We thought that we had other WEIRD problems, and we did, which we determined were the result of low engine battery voltage. Put a charger on the battery and weird problems seemed to go away.  Travel height problem remains.

We have a copy of the HWH Repair Manual HWH Computer Controlled Leveling System 600 Series.
We have not confirmed that we have a 600 Series, maybe someone with a similar coach has confirmed that info.

We are not sitting in a perfectly level environment but we are close to level.
The Manual says on page MI91.1031 NOTE: The coach should be a the "proper ride height" before starting TROUBLESHOOTING STEPS. 

What we think we know.
The travel Height situation is isolated from the "automatic leveling system" for the most part.

We have checked the front and left rear TRAVEL SOLENOIDS connctions with a test light, and they all have 12+  volts going to them.
We have cycled the solenoids by turning the ignition switch on and off and they all emit a loud click. We know of no way to determine if they are actually opening and allowing air to pass.  In travel mode the TRAVEL SOLENOIDS ARE SUPPOSED TO ALLOW FREE TRAVEL OF AIR THROUGH THE SOLENOID VALVES.

NOTE: Currently, the coach will manually level just fine based on the indicator lights on the touch panel and also based on a bubble level on the kitchen counter.  Automatic leveling also seems to work just fine at this time.

Does anyone have a manual on diagnosing travel height problems?
It would seem that there would be a manual for "setting" travel height.
Procedure for determining that the solenoid valves are indeed working without resorting to disconnecting hoses?

Cold weather is not far away here in Michigan and I sure would like to be in a condition to LEAVE sooner rather than later.
All comments and suggestions appreciated.

BTW, regarding a phone call I made to HWH requesting assistance, I was told that a technician would be able to get back to me in about six weeks, but no guarantee.  I was also instructed to go to their website for assistance which I did immediately after the phone call, and found that the website was DOWN..
I called back and the same person answered.  I told her that the website was down. She said, "That must be connected to the telephone company tearing up some lines a while ago............................".
Life goes on, in spite of it all.
Regards,
JON TWORK KB8RSA
Full Time RVer (10+ Years) & Dedicated Boondocker
Retired, Unemployed, Homeless Transients
1996 Foretravel U270-36 w/24' Timberwolf Trailer
I firmly believe that tomorrow holds the possibility for new technologies, astounding discoveries, and a reprieve from my remaining obligations.
Welcome to WeRV2 (Under Construction)
Find Jon: Via Satellite Tracker Datastorm Users
The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #1 –
Jon,

I have sent you a e-mail detailing the HWH fix of my control box leveling problem.  They got my box on Monday, replaced two of the three boards and shipped it on Tuesday for a charge of only $126.

I got immediate knowledgeable assistance from one of the ladies that answers the phone and did not wait on phone technical support.

Good luck getting yours resolved.
Rudy Legett
2003 U320 4010 ISM 450 hp
2001 U320 4220 ISM 450 hp
1995 U320 M11 400 hp
1990 Granvilla 300 hp 3208T
Aqua Hot Service Houston and Southeast Texas

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #2 –
Jon,
In the travel mode(green travel light on) all travel solenoids are powered open and stay that way allowing the ride height controll valves too set the travel height.
So, you say the left front is only about 1 inch off the wheel well. Is that the clearance you had when you went to the travel mode or does it increase to the 1 inch clearance?
If it doesn't change at all that sounds like that travel snood isn't opening.
If it lifts the coach up that 1 inch but no higher then I Wonder if your loosing most of the air your trying to put in those air bags.
I would think that much of an air leak would be easy to hear.
If you raise the coach so all wheels are off the wheels and shut down the system will the coach stay up ?
Jd
John Duld
1995 U320C SE 40'

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #3 –
Have you tried adjusting the ride height valves, dumping, and then measuring ride height again after going into travel mode?  As I recall, the proper measurement is 8.5" between air bag plates in travel mode.
Regards,
Brett

'99 42' Foretravel Xtreme
'14 Brown Motorsports Stacker
'05 Chevy SSR
'02 BMW R1150R

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #4 –
When our ignition is turned on, top two 6-pack solenoids open which gives air bag control to the three chassis ride-height valves. The four lower 6-pack solenoids stay closed as the HWH raise & lower leveling system is not active. After a pre-set time the green 'travel' light turns on, but the HWH system does not have any way to know if the coach is in ride-height position.

The single front chassis ride-height valve attempts to level coach front to back by raising and lowering the four front air bags as a group. Each of the two rear chassis ride-height valves attempts to level coach left to right by raising and lowering the two left or two right rear air bags.

Chassis ride-height valves are not part of the HWH system and when coach is in ride height control both front wheel wells should be at approximately the same height when coach is settled on a level surface. If sitting on non-level ground one tire can be closer to body.

Two rear chassis ride-height valves will adjust coach side to side. But if only one front tire is too close and all other three tire positions are correct, ride-height valve adjustments will probably not fix the problem. I suggest driving coach and parking on a level spot, with engine running for a while so coach can level out, and then measure tire space. HWH Travel Mode

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Barry & Cindy –
After a pre-set time the green 'travel' light turns on, but the HWH system does not have any way to know if the coach is in ride-height position.
On our coach, it appears to me that the travel light turns on when the brake/suspension system pressure reaches about 70 psi. If pressure is above that value, the travel light illuminates immediately. All other information that Barry presented agrees with my understanding and experience. Indeed the travel light indicates that the system is in travel mode and has enough pressure to operate, but does not indicate that the coach is at travel height on all corners.

On our last steering alignment, Wayne reported that the travel solenoid/valve for the left front was not working properly and he replaced it. I don't know what was the mode of failure or the specific symptom. I had not noticed any problems.
J D Stevens
1997 U295 CAI 36' Build #5085
2002 Subaru Outback
Motorcade 16869
Bellville, TX

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #6 –
If and when I get this all figured out and start to do repairs (like this afternoon) I may need to order new solenoid valves on Monday.
Is there a best price source for these valves?
Do they come as an assembly with valve and solenoid or in separate pieces.
I could see where the valve or solenoid might be bad but, probably not both at once.
I figure I better order a spare or two also. The coach is 17 years old and I have not had an HWH problem before.
Its warming up outside a little so I better get at it.
Regards,
JON TWORK KB8RSA
Full Time RVer (10+ Years) & Dedicated Boondocker
Retired, Unemployed, Homeless Transients
1996 Foretravel U270-36 w/24' Timberwolf Trailer
I firmly believe that tomorrow holds the possibility for new technologies, astounding discoveries, and a reprieve from my remaining obligations.
Welcome to WeRV2 (Under Construction)
Find Jon: Via Satellite Tracker Datastorm Users
The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #7 –
In reading the HWH REPAIR MANUAL FOR THE HWH COMPUTER-CONTROLLED LEVELING SYSTEM 600 SERIES
I note that on pages MP75.4515 (which I assume is showing the FRONT manifold), and MP75.4520 (assumed to be rear manifold) the front manifold shows TWO pressure switches and the rear shows ONE pressure switch.

What is the detailed function(s) of these pressure switches?

Regards,
JON TWORK KB8RSA
Full Time RVer (10+ Years) & Dedicated Boondocker
Retired, Unemployed, Homeless Transients
1996 Foretravel U270-36 w/24' Timberwolf Trailer
I firmly believe that tomorrow holds the possibility for new technologies, astounding discoveries, and a reprieve from my remaining obligations.
Welcome to WeRV2 (Under Construction)
Find Jon: Via Satellite Tracker Datastorm Users
The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Jon Twork –
In reading the HWH REPAIR MANUAL FOR THE HWH COMPUTER-CONTROLLED LEVELING SYSTEM 600 SERIES
I note that on pages MP75.4515 (which I assume is showing the FRONT manifold), and MP75.4520 (assumed to be rear manifold) the front manifold shows TWO pressure switches and the rear shows ONE pressure switch.
What is the detailed function(s) of these pressure switches?
Regards,
HWH Pressure Switch Descriptions Attached
HWH Pressure Switch Arrangements
The selected media item is not currently available.Barry BEAM #16014
2003 U320 40' AGDS
Beamalarm, Foretravel technical help and specifications
"Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve"

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #9 –
Jon,
The rear pressure switch is installed by HWH and is to warn of low airpressure in the system.
The 10 psi switches on the front manifold were installed by Foretravel.
When leveling (auto or manual) when a front wheel contacts the wheel well and the suspension bottoms out the switch on that side detects the air pressure loss because the weight is off the air bags and it takes power off the other side dump valve to stop the other side from continuing down and twisting the coach.
John Duld
1995 U320C SE 40'

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #10 –
JD, I believe you are correct that a specific psi needs to be reached for HWH to turn on travel light. Still without HWH being sure coach has reached travel ride-height.

And a leaking left front side HWH dump solenoid, while in travel mode, could drain front ride-height air pressure, causing Jon's lower left front side. Normally in travel mode, the HWH dump solenoid should be sealed closed, but dirt or something else on the solenoid valve stem could cause the problem. Jon could remove and clean the solenoid and O-rings. We purchased a couple of sets of HWH solenoid O-rings to carry for emergency.

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #11 –
Quote from: Barry Beam –
HWH Pressure Switch Descriptions Attached
Excellent reference sheet. Answered several of my questions and concerns.  Things are much clearer now.
Thanks...
JON TWORK KB8RSA
Full Time RVer (10+ Years) & Dedicated Boondocker
Retired, Unemployed, Homeless Transients
1996 Foretravel U270-36 w/24' Timberwolf Trailer
I firmly believe that tomorrow holds the possibility for new technologies, astounding discoveries, and a reprieve from my remaining obligations.
Welcome to WeRV2 (Under Construction)
Find Jon: Via Satellite Tracker Datastorm Users
The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.
 

Re: HWH Travel Height Suspection Fail -1996 U270 - Knowledge and info needed

Reply #12 –
Thanks to all who contributed and commented on my very confusing ride height situation.
I had not previously spent a lot of time learning about the system due to its reliability.
I have not had a component failure in 14 years.
However,
The last few days have shown how VULNERABLE I actually am when on the road or off in the boonies living off grid.  If a ride height component fails, you are mostly dead in the water, so to speak.  You are probably NOT going anywhere until it is fixed.

Our Problem:
We verified a lot of stuff that was unrelated to the ride height problem and tested a lot of the connections at all of the solenoids (only really needed the top ones, front and back) and verified voltages were present.
Checked for air leaks and whatever other things we could think of to do with our limited experience.

Nothing seemed to work and we were frustrated and decided to move the coach to a more level location where the front wheels at least would be at the same height.  It took a lot of jockying around the area to get to the where the cement apron was for the front end.  When we got there, the leveling problem seemed to go away.  Backed out to the road and found a fairly level spot and then measured.  Ride height specs were within 1/2".  Decided to drive to the local dump station for a badly needed dump.  No problems there and back.  No problem at this point that we can discern.  Will be ordering spare parts today to have with me on the trip to the southwest.

In my previously over concerned mental state, I had apparently overlooked some of the resources on the HWH site, such as their on line service school.  I now plan to complete all of those requirements and take the tests and anything else I can to to prepare myself for when and if I am dead in the water.

I also believe that I will re-route myself this fall to go by the HWH Corp. location in Moscow, IA and see what additional info I can obtain to improve my HWH bag of tricks. 

The system seemed overly complex when I started working with it.  It is now becomming a doable thing.

Many thanks again to all who participated in my plight.

Regards,
JON TWORK KB8RSA
Full Time RVer (10+ Years) & Dedicated Boondocker
Retired, Unemployed, Homeless Transients
1996 Foretravel U270-36 w/24' Timberwolf Trailer
I firmly believe that tomorrow holds the possibility for new technologies, astounding discoveries, and a reprieve from my remaining obligations.
Welcome to WeRV2 (Under Construction)
Find Jon: Via Satellite Tracker Datastorm Users
The Second Amendment is in place in case they ignore the others.