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Compartment doors won't close. Bolt head that holds hinge mechanism in way.

July 01, 2016, 07:36:54 pm

Hello,

I'm having trouble with a few compartment doors, or more accurately, the frames the door skins mount onto, not being lined up with the openings of the compartments.  They are all the type that open sideways underneath a slide.  If there is a way to adjust them so they line up with the openings, it's not jumping out at me. I was hoping there was a way to adjust them to fit, similar to adjusting a modern day household cabinet door.

When we got the coach about three months ago, they were a bit hard to close, but now there are two that I can't close without really forcing the issue.

There is a steel bar that is attached to the door by a bolt with an allen head cap screw (I think that's what it's called).  The head of the cap screw is too high and is hitting the opening of the compartment.  The worst one has about 3/16" of interference between the bolt head and the frame of the opening.  Also, on that door the fiberglass door "skin" hits the body of the coach (see exterior pic 2 and 3).

It appears the easy fix/hack is to replace the allen head screw/bolt with a hex head screw with a thinner head that doesn't stick up so far.  Maybe even grind off some of the top of the new bolts to make them thinner.  But that won't fix the problem of the door skin hitting the coach body.

Interior picture 1 shows one of the doors about 3" from being closed and picture 2 shows the bolt head hitting the frame of the compartment.

Any ideas?

Thanks - Joe

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Reply #1 – July 01, 2016, 10:09:34 pm

How about some pix of the entire door and hinge system?

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Reply #2 – July 01, 2016, 10:14:41 pm

Joe,
A loose bolt or screw seems like the probable cause but normally that would result in the door dropping a bit under the effects of gravity.  If I understand the issue it appears to be lifting up higher and contacting at the top!
Is there a gas spring in the mechanism?  Maybe it's pushing the door up?

If there is a gas spring I would try to remove it and manually lift/push/twist to try to identify if there is a loose connection or bolt.
If you have an identical door somewhere else on the coach you can compare the feel between the two.
Three months is not very long for the door move - this can't just be wear on the mechanism.

I think you are right about grinding down the screw; it would be a short term fix at best.  The bolt looks like a Shoulder Bolt.  I'm not aware of low profile head versions.  I'm not sure of how the base of the mechanism is attached to the frame (photo?) but using shims at the base would be a better fix and easier to reverse if you later find the true cause.

I don't know if this is any help at all.  I think you just need poke and prod it more.  At least there is no circuit board involved.

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Reply #3 – July 01, 2016, 10:43:03 pm

More pics.

Some have struts, one doesn't.  If you look at how the door is attached to the "hinge arms", two of the attach points allow adjustment to the length of the "hinge arms".  I have tried lengthening the top arm and shortening the bottom arm, but because there is the 3rd arm, adjusting the other two throws off the geometry and the door binds and either won't open all the way or will bind before getting closed.  It's always the side of the door opposite from where the hinge mechanism attaches to the compartment frame that is too high.

Thanks for taking a look.

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Reply #4 – July 01, 2016, 11:15:01 pm

Is there any adjustment where the hinge frame attaches to the bay frame? Maybe shim between the door frame at the top where it attaches to the coach frame that would lower the opposite end.

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Reply #5 – July 01, 2016, 11:35:47 pm

Yes that was going to be my thought too. This to me seems like the mounting to coach may be the trouble as the door frame and coach framework is a one piece unit .
So as the top of door is hitting the perimeter body work I would be looking at re-aligning the whole mechanism ie adjust the mounting bolts accordingly(to frame).
Just a thought.
JohnH

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Reply #6 – July 02, 2016, 01:46:18 am

The gap on the door in compartment door ext1.jpg looks like door is losing at an angle.  If I am seein the mechanism correctly, you can the lower rod end on the door mechanism in a half turn at a time and it will lower the left end of the door.  That may improve bolt head clearance also, but I am not sure.

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Reply #7 – July 02, 2016, 09:01:07 am

I would remove the third arm and adjust the door to fit the opening, then figure out a way to adjust the third arm.  I can't tell from the pictures (my computer screen is dying, looks 60's psychedelic) but it looks like everything is adjustable except the third arm, but it could be height adjustable where it attaches to the compartment ceiling.  If it isn't, then maybe a spacer or two?

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Reply #8 – July 02, 2016, 09:10:12 am

It may be a optical illusion, but looking at the second photo in the second grouping, the top bar looks like it angles upwards slightly and the mounting point at the coach looks a little tilted.  If that bar is higher at the door end than at the coach end, it could be what's causing the door to be too high when closed.

Is it possible this mount got tweaked (or loosened up) at the coach end?? 

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Reply #9 – July 02, 2016, 09:42:22 am

The paint lines don't appear to be lined up at the upper rear corner.
 It looks like there is an adjustment at the point where the arms attach to the coach. Moving the bottom one towards the bay opening frame would lower the opposite diagonal corner.  Maybe have to move both a bit.

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Reply #10 – July 02, 2016, 10:58:45 am

Some good points from all. The top "fixed" arm is there to keep the door in a fixed parallel plane to coach and does not do anything else ( in my mind).
As Roger said the top and bottom screws look like they adjust the "tilt" angle of door and may be needing adjustment. There will be a point of adjustment were you go one way too much and it has a reverse effect, so a careful adjusting of both is needed. As a reference I would put a level on the coach opening (door opening) and get that level, then put it on door and make it read the same, without moving screws too much ,then move door to almost closed position and see how it looks. Adjust as required..
JohnH

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Reply #11 – July 02, 2016, 01:24:28 pm

@ craneman:  It's starting to look like that is the way to do it.  But, I have basically tried that by adjusting the rod ends longer on the top and shorter on the bottom where they attach to the door and then the door binds because the third arm isn't attached in the correct place after the adjustment and the third arm is not adjustable. Perhaps elongating the holes in the third arms mounting bracket would allow me to adjust it.

@ Steve:  The door on the right in the photo is the one that doesn't close.  The one on the left closes, but is cocked quite a bit so the right side is low.  Four of the five doors on the passenger side are like that.

@ T-man:  I think you and Craneman are on the right track.

@ Michelle:  The third arm does head up a bit, but that's because the door is up a bit.  The third arm is floppy up and down wise, it goes where the door goes.  I don't think the door has been tweaked since so many of them are cocked the same way, but it's possible.  I don't see signs of things being forced though.

@ Roger:  The bolts you pointed at are what the latches on the right side of the door attach to, they don't adjust anything unfortunately.  The only adjustment where the hinge assembly attaches to the coach is sliding up and down and both the top and bottom attach points move in unison.  They were all the way down to start with.  I haven't touched them.

@ John:  You are right about the third arm.

I think the fix is to shim the upper attach point at the coach and then elongate the mounting holes in the third arm bracket so it can be moved.  Before I do that I'm going to confirm the idea with MOT.

Thanks all for your time and input.  I was hoping there was some adjustment available that I wasn't seeing.

Joe

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Reply #12 – July 02, 2016, 01:50:04 pm

As it came from Factory working correctly and I am sure did so for a long time I feel that you should not need to elongate any holes as this system must have been well worked out before installing in a lot of coaches. There HAS to be a simple reason for it and it is looking right at you I am sure. Finding it from 3k miles and never having looked at that design is a tad tough- sorry to say. It is only mechanics.
Now a stupid question, is the door panel fractionally loose on the framework??
JohnH

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Reply #13 – July 02, 2016, 02:51:54 pm

@ John:  Thanks for the comments.  I think you're right about it being lined up in the past and I just haven't figured out what has changed.  I will take a fresh look at the whole system.  I don't know if this is a clue or not, but all four doors on the passenger side with this hinge system are cocked so the right side is lower than the left.  Even the one door that swings opens to the left (the other three open to the right).  Three of the four doors on the drivers side also are cocked so the right side is lower than the left.  Frustrating that I can't figure out what I'm missing.

The door panel is not loose on the framework.  Even if I took the door panel off, the mounting bolt on the door end of the third arm would still interfere with the compartment frame.  I have thought of shifting the door panel on the framework on a couple doors that are very crooked but still close okay.  That way they would line up with the main body and adjacent doors and look better, but the door panels are riveted to the framework, so not an easy adjustment.

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Reply #14 – July 02, 2016, 03:51:25 pm

You frame has a twist in it !!!! Have you hit a real bad section of road lately ( I mean a pothole or?)
How is your entry door, is it equal all around???
How is the airbag levelling, can you lit the front up(or rear) and does this make a change in door position??
I still think any adjustment will have to be on the frame mechanism for each bay door and the mounting to coach.
JohnH

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Reply #15 – July 02, 2016, 04:47:48 pm

We haven't hit any serious pot holes or anything else since we left Nacogdoches.  A couple of good bumps, but nothing that would twist the frame, in my opinion.  That doesn't mean is hasn't happened in the past.  The doors were out of alignment when we bought it.  The entry door is fine as far as even gap around it goes.  It does require too much force, in my opinion, to close it fully.  It takes a reasonable amount of force to close it to the first latch, but excessive force to close it to the second latch.

I'm out of time right now, but tomorrow I will try your idea of adjusting the height of the rig and see if that impacts the fit of the compartment doors.

Thanks - Joe

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Reply #16 – July 02, 2016, 07:18:53 pm

OK I was not aware that it was in this condition when you bought it and maybe it should have been a condition of sale to have them fix it.
John

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Reply #17 – July 05, 2016, 08:39:53 am

Being this coach had this issue when you bought it. Could it be possible a previous owner made a right hand turn too sharp comeing out of a driveway, causing the right rear wheels to maybe go into a ditch or a gully causing the chassis to tweak some?
If it was just one door I could see being a hinge ,But multiple doors out of whack makes me think something structural shifted.jmo

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