Aqua-Hot replacement.

Topic: Aqua-Hot replacement. (Read 3145 times) previous topic - next topic

Aqua-Hot replacement.

November 26, 2016, 06:45:23 pm

Last month after 4 years of nursing a slow coolant tank leak on my Aqua Hot I decided it was time to replace it.... The option of rebuilding the dinosaur 431 for around $6,000 plus labor and shipping did not feel like the smart thing to do.... especially after learning rebuilding a Aqua Hot is only inspecting and replacing the none working parts, not like rebuilding a car engine where the wearing parts are replaced. Bottom line I would still have a unit 20 years old with unknown hours and still have the ongoing Webasto / Aqua-hot high maintenance / high cost issues. I had two issues with a new Aqua-Hot. One the cost is in the area of $10,000 plus labor and shipping and I would still have a maintenance hungry Webasto burner.... and the high cost of parts.

Long story short I went back to my marine background when I was very happy with a ITR Oasis and talked to Randy at ITR in Vancouver WA.

I went with a new ITR Oasis NE-S a 85,000 Btu unit that will be announced this week at the RVIA show. Cost was $6,029 for the unit (with a 30% discount I did not ask for.) 12 hrs labor @ $110.00 to install at their Vancouver WA shop and less then $250.00 in additional parts. Being a out of state resident I was sales tax exempt.

Bottom line I have a new 85,000 BTU heater with continuous hot water at 3 gals a min and a burner designed for continuous use and simple annual maintenance. I love being able to enjoy the shower for as long as I want and still have heat in the coach.... With the sale of my Aqua Hot salvage parts I should be in the unit somewhere around $6,500.00 net, Thats only 3 coach bucks more then my headlights........

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #1 – November 26, 2016, 07:13:40 pm

Looks great Ted! Did you get the optional eng heat setup?

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #2 – November 26, 2016, 07:14:49 pm

Ted- Thanks for posting that info. I'm still in the hunt for a solution to my Primus hydronic system, that uses propane burners. I think my early 95 (built 11/94) was one of a half dozen coaches with a Primus, a Swedish word that means "Yeah, we no longer in business supporting nothing." (Danish accent is mine.)

Rudy has a work around with the Wabasto system, but I fell back with sticker shock. My Atwood Air Command does well in Texas winters, but I'd like to utilize the existing factory plumbing. After looking at the ITR brochure, I spotted this: "It is designed for easy replacement of existing heaters."

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #3 – November 26, 2016, 08:29:29 pm

Quote from: rbark – November 26, 2016, 07:13:40 pm

Looks great Ted! Did you get the optional eng heat setup?

Yes engine heat was included....

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #4 – November 26, 2016, 08:35:52 pm

Quote from: Ted H – November 26, 2016, 06:45:23 pm

I went with a new ITR Oasis NE-S a 85,000 Btu unit that will be announced this week at the RVIA show.

IIRC, Newmar installs Oasis as their hydronic heating system. Will be interesting to study the specs on the new 85 KBTU offering....

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #5 – November 26, 2016, 08:39:20 pm

Quote from: Old Knucklehead – November 26, 2016, 07:14:49 pm

Ted- Thanks for posting that info. I'm still in the hunt for a solution to my Primus hydronic system, that uses propane burners. I think my early 95 (built 11/94) was one of a half dozen coaches with a Primus, a Swedish word that means "Yeah, we no longer in business supporting nothing." (Danish accent is mine.)

Rudy has a work around with the Wabasto system, but I fell back with sticker shock. My Atwood Air Command does well in Texas winters, but I'd like to utilize the existing factory plumbing. After looking at the ITR brochure, I spotted this: "It is designed for easy replacement of existing heaters."

Paul I surprised at how easy the swap was.. the time consuming part was getting the old unit out.. getting the rear mounting bolts out of the old Aqua Hot unit was a learning curve for the tech's Randy said now that they know how they could cut 2 hrs from the install.. ..all the wiring is plug and play....

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #6 – November 26, 2016, 08:53:49 pm

Quote from: Michelle – November 26, 2016, 08:35:52 pm

IIRC, Newmar installs Oasis as their hydronic heating system. Will be interesting to study the specs on the new 85 KBTU offering....

Michelle,
It was interesting to be the fly on the wall for a day and a half at ITR's new shop... The support tech did not have a office yet and his desk was out in the shop so it was not hard to overhear the phone conversions the tech was having with incoming support calls... I came away with a very good feeling that they could walk me through just about any issue.. also the control panel is a small touch screen that will give you fault codes..

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #7 – November 27, 2016, 04:37:16 pm

Quote from: Old Knucklehead – November 26, 2016, 07:14:49 pm

Ted- Thanks for posting that info. I'm still in the hunt for a solution to my Primus hydronic system, that uses propane burners. I think my early 95 (built 11/94) was one of a half dozen coaches with a Primus, a Swedish word that means "Yeah, we no longer in business supporting nothing." (Danish accent is mine.)

Rudy has a work around with the Wabasto system, but I fell back with sticker shock. My Atwood Air Command does well in Texas winters, but I'd like to utilize the existing factory plumbing. After looking at the ITR brochure, I spotted this: "It is designed for easy replacement of existing heaters."

I also have the Primus, I'm curious what issues you are having with that system.
Lots of good info at the Bluebird Forum.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #8 – November 27, 2016, 06:06:25 pm

It seems to have two zones. How did they wire yours?

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #9 – November 27, 2016, 09:16:09 pm

Quote from: Caflashbob – November 27, 2016, 06:06:25 pm

It seems to have two zones. How did they wire yours?

Bob,
We tend to confuse zones with circulating pumps...... The Aqua Hot had 3 circulating pumps and 4 thermostat controlled heat exchanger zones... (not counting engine heat). One pump supplies the living room and kitchen. One pump supplies the bathroom and wet bay loop. The 3ed supplies the bedroom loop. The Oasis NE has 2 circulating pumps and 5 thermostat controlled heat exchanger zones.. (not counting engine heat pump). To get to 2 loops they tied the bathroom, wet bay and bedroom heat exchangers into one loop. I still have 4 thermostat controlled zones same as before. As a side note: one supply and return hose loop to the rear of the coach has been eliminated thus eliminating the heat loss of one loop.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #10 – November 28, 2016, 11:00:30 pm

Should be interesting in your long term experience,

Some models of newer Foretravels used the oasis. The newest is-45 i noticed uses the aquahot.

Yours seemed to be designed for the ability to run two showers at three gallon per minute.

Has a 60 degree temp increase versus the aqua hots 55. Bigger loops.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #11 – November 29, 2016, 12:14:43 am

Quote from: Lon and Cheryl – November 27, 2016, 04:37:16 pm

I also have the Primus, I'm curious what issues you are having with that system.
Lots of good info at the Bluebird Forum.

Lon,

Our Primus came with no PO info and a dead controller card. Dusty InOp Sytem. My search led me to believe that the system was a BETA Tape recorder. I rolled it into MOT a while back and they lost interest. I chased a few ideas from the Bluebird Forum (great source) and showed my Sad Sack to Rudy, who is the Man. He has a solution that would work, but...

My gut says cut the Primus burners and install an Oasis with new diesel lines. I suspect i can use the plumbing and others' pumps. If I ditch the Primus system burners, they are yours for "first refusal" since you encouraged me to go for this coach about two years ago. Deep discount!! This has been a Fun coach for us and we love this forum! Thanks. P

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #12 – November 29, 2016, 01:51:41 am

Quote from: Old Knucklehead – November 29, 2016, 12:14:43 am

Lon,

Our Primus came with no PO info and a dead controller card. Dusty InOp Sytem. My search led me to believe that the system was a BETA Tape recorder. I rolled it into MOT a while back and they lost interest. I chased a few ideas from the Bluebird Forum (great source) and showed my Sad Sack to Rudy, who is the Man. He has a solution that would work, but...

My gut says cut the Primus burners and install an Oasis with new diesel lines. I suspect i can use the plumbing and others' pumps. If I ditch the Primus system burners, they are yours for "first refusal" since you encouraged me to go for this coach about two years ago. Deep discount!! This has been a Fun coach for us and we love this forum! Thanks. P

Did you try Dupree for the parts you need?
If you ditch the system I would love to have your removed parts, let me know the details when that time comes. THANKS!

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #13 – November 29, 2016, 09:46:20 am

Hey Ted, my 07 Phenix was built with the Oasis. Almost 10 years later no problems at all! I have done all the required maintenance, nozzle replacement etc. which is very easy to do.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #14 – December 13, 2016, 12:42:06 pm

I am curious to know and understand if there is an advantage/difference to install this Oasis unit as opposed to a Tankless heater.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #15 – December 13, 2016, 04:38:15 pm

Quote from: tjdnc – December 13, 2016, 12:42:06 pm

I am curious to know and understand if there is an advantage/difference to install this Oasis unit as opposed to a Tankless heater.

This is for heat as well, not just hot water.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #16 – December 13, 2016, 06:25:04 pm

I have primus also very little maint. Quiet doesnt use much propane. Underbays floors walls nice and warm. Parts are very hard to find. I agree the bluebird forum great place for help. The worst thing is boiler location left rear compartment gets very dirty.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #17 – December 14, 2016, 01:28:32 am

Quote from: joeszeidel – December 13, 2016, 06:25:04 pm

I have primus also very little maint. Quiet doesnt use much propane. Underbays floors walls nice and warm. Parts are very hard to find. I agree the bluebird forum great place for help. The worst thing is boiler location left rear compartment gets very dirty.

I agree about boiler location, dirty (from road grime) but easy for maintenance.
Always curious about the Primus and build number, what is your coaches birth number?

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #18 – December 14, 2016, 06:21:08 am

Lon, build number 4558 April 94.

Re: Aqua-Hot replacement.

Reply #19 – December 14, 2016, 12:35:11 pm

As our coaches age, the cost of maintenance and replacement for Aqua-Hot/Webasto becomes a larger and larger percentage of the coach's total value. Webasto is a German company located just west of Munich and supplies diesel heaters to Europe for vans, trucks, buses, RVs, etc. As with all imports, their U.S. distributors many not carry all of the legacy parts and may charge a premium over the price in Europe even if they are available.

I worked on our diesel fired boiler at home as well as diesel fired heaters in Mercedes vans. There are many components in a diesel fired heater that can cause the unit to not operate satisfactorily. Propane fired heaters are much more trouble free with home water heaters frequently not requiring any maintenance until the tanks rust through. RV tank or tankless heaters are easily troubleshooted with parts quickly available.

Asian propane tankless heaters are available for $100-$500 on ebay. They could be a very low cost alternative to someone with DIY skills. tankless | eBay

A tankless Girard/Atwood RV water heater with a external heat exchanger could supply heat to the coach as well as warming the engine. $500 to $1000. Girard Tankless LP Propane RV Water Heater - 9.98

A failure of a diesel fired heater in winter could be very serious in many parts of the U.S. with days or even weeks until service and parts are available. Naturally, VERY expensive. Many owners (like me) will install an unvented propane heater for emergency or everyday heating. No unvented heater is approved for RV use. Aside from the CO and asphyxia risk, there are other health concerns. Hopefully, I will not forget to crack a window a bit with ours.

Older coaches will see more, not less failures as the years go by. Time, not necessarily miles or amount of use is the culprit here.

If a member is aware of others who may have made the conversion, it would be great to provide a link. No sense reinventing the wheel.

Pierce

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