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Topic: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought (Read 725 times) previous topic - next topic

Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Well for most of this trip power has been a issue. I have a progressive industries surge protector, and both Hughes power watch dogs, one plug in, one hard wired. Only the progressive is installed at this time. The hard wired hughes went out and I got another one from them, refurbished. At my current place, power is not a issue, but sure that it will be again, so hence the autoformer. I do not want to put it outside. It is not rated as waterproof, and is not covered under warranty for water damage. Go figure. And at the price these go for the little bitty lock they supply wouldn't stop a German shepherd from chewing thru it. So I want hard wire it into the coach. I purchased the kit they have to do that. The question is where?
I think I could put it in the space under the bed where the auto transfer switches were, I would have to remove the progressive surge protector though. I might have to move the transfer switch as well. Concern is ventilation there. Not sure how hot these get but sure they heat up when doing their job. Other place would be in the engine compartment, behind the wall of the bed. I would put this so it takes care of both the shore power and generator I think, but not sure of that yet either. The progressive surge I would sell, and keep the power watchdogs. Keep the hardwired and if that craps out again, use the plug in one.
Don't know of any other place to put it. No room in wet bay, and since they don't like water.... not a good option.
If you have one, where do you keep it?  What else should I be thinking of?
Thanks
Bob
'99 U320 40 WTFE
Build #5462,
1500 Watts Solar 600 amp Victron lithium
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Hemi
Instagram bobfnbw
Retired

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #1 –
Also another thought. Should I wire it on the input side of the transfer switch, or on the output to the breaker box? This would cover both shore and generator outputs.
'99 U320 40 WTFE
Build #5462,
1500 Watts Solar 600 amp Victron lithium
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Hemi
Instagram bobfnbw
Retired

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #2 –
That question has come up before. One way protects coach from both, but leaves the transfer switch unprotected and the other leaves the risk of coach damage from generator. You make the choice.
1999 40 ft. U-320 wtfe build 5563 Chuck & Lynda's "Rollin' Inn"  2030 watts solar
prev. mh's 71 GMC 5 yrs. 73 Pace Setter 1 yr. 78 Vogue 5 yrs 81 FTX 40ft all electric 18 yrs. 1996 Monaco Signature 3 yrs.
2014 Grand Cherokee Overland
Dream as if you will live forever. Live as if you will die today.  James Dean

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #3 –
Thanks Craneman. Yeah I had read some of the old stuff, thought someone recently might have more to shead.
I called Hughes. They confirmed that I could do either shore or both. So its installed after the transfer switch and before the hughes power watchdog, the built in one. I took out the progressive which I had installed prior to leaving Texas. It worked well. Still does but the Hughes gives that bluetooth connection so....
That darn #6 guage wire is a problem still, so I cut the wire in half they give with the 50 amp install kit and used part to connect the power watchdog to the breaker panel.  I wish I had some type of plug or stem I could connect to the end of the finely stranded wire and put that in the connections of the power watch dog. Maybe just solder the ends. The wire gets everywhere, like fine hair.
Plenty of room for it since I don't have the transfer switches.
'99 U320 40 WTFE
Build #5462,
1500 Watts Solar 600 amp Victron lithium
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Hemi
Instagram bobfnbw
Retired

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #4 –
Quote from: Journey, Roam, Explore –
That darn #6 guage wire is a problem still, so I cut the wire in half......

I wish I had some type of plug or stem I could connect to the end of the finely stranded wire and put that in the connections of the power watch dog. Maybe just solder the ends. The wire gets everywhere, like fine hair.
Solder, is not a good idea.  They do make 6 gauge ferrels.
https://www.amazon.com/Ruikarhop-Wire-Ferrule-kit-292-293/dp/B082VSR685
As an Amazon Associate Foretravel Owners' Forum earns from qualifying purchases.
97 U295 40, Build #5040, 6C8.3 325 HP
Oregon Continuous Traveler
Samsung Residential #RF20HFENBSR,
Xantrex SW2012, (3)AGM8D Hse, (2)AGM Grp24 Eng, Victron BMV-712, 1800w Solar 4 LG & 2 Sunpower
Extreme Full Body Pt w/hdlmps, new furn/floor, 4 down Lexus 2004 GX470 AWD curb weight 4,740 lbs
Prev: 1990 Barth, 10L 300 2 yrs; 91&92 Monaco Signature, 10 yrs, 10L C 300 &  6C8.3 300; 1997 ForeT 6C8.3 325 since May 2017.  Employed by Guaranty RV 14+ yrs.  Former VW New Car Dlr/Service Dlr, Sales Mgr, Rv Sales, and Service Adviser from 1968-2017
"Don't criticize what you can't understand" Bob Dylan

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #5 –
Thanks Jack. Ferrel that's the word I was looking for.
'99 U320 40 WTFE
Build #5462,
1500 Watts Solar 600 amp Victron lithium
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Hemi
Instagram bobfnbw
Retired

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #6 –
What a timely discussion and helpful photos. It is on my shortlist to do this year and I was wondering if the Autoformer and Watchdog would fit there. I would appreciate an update on whether or not you think heat is an issue after being used. Great info, thanks for sharing.
Walt, Dawn, Matt & the Poodles
99 36' U320 #5515 MC #17977 "Axle"
Not All Who Wander Are Lost (not original but I like it)

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #7 –
We only use autoformer when campground voltage is a problem. By far most campgrounds have good voltage control. But when autoformer is needed we unwrap it and it can be placed in any secure location, like engine compartment or wet bay or any other bay.

Then use a 50-amp extension cable instead of coach shore power cable to the autoformer and then plug the shore cable into the autoformer. All connections are out of weather an under locked space. Also have a short stubby shore cable to use when autoformer is inside near our coach Smartplug inlet and the long shore cable is not needed.

Why 'wear out' autoformer when electric is within limits. The little surge protection built into autoformers is not worth using the autoformer, which only passes current without any boost. Autoformers are not durable commercial products. And they are not isolating transformers.

We have used our autoformer about 5 times and not at all on most years. But when it is hot out and voltage is low, autoformer is invaluable and really makes something out of nothing, with the penalty of lower max amps, but we never use any where near 100 amps max from a shore pedestal. If we are in a low voltage situation, we would manage loads and probably not use more than half, maybe about 50 amps out of the 100 amps available at one time.

I see no need to protect from low voltage from generator. Autoformer only has a small range of low voltages that can be boosted. When our gen voltage regulator goes out, voltages are usually higher. Autoformer does not correct for high voltages.

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #8 –
I would not recommend permanently mounting the auto former. We have used ours on a 30 amp service with a dog bone. The EMS caught an over voltage situation on day three. Apparently the park power grid adjusted and corrected the voltage drop. The only way to make it work was to either bypass the EMS which is not safe or unplug the auto former. Of course, if you don't connect to 30 amp it would not be an issue.
2002 U270 34' Build 5953
Cummings ISL400HP
3410 Floor Plan
Longview, TX

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #9 –
I agree with not permanently mounting the autoformer which is why I didn't. I put in plugs on each end so it can be disconnected. But in the last 2 months, this is the only park where voltage has not been a issue. Steady 120 volts. And since it can be mounted downstream from the generator no reason not to.
Barry I always limit my current through the Victron Multi Control. With load sharing on I don't have to pull that amount of amps that I might surge to, and lessen the chance of tripping a breaker. I don't want to lug that thing around, its heavy. So a permanent place for it to be, just have to unplug it, it fine with me. Also I have not seen on the internet much about them going bad just being plugged in. I hear alot about them going bad due to being exposed to rain.
Heat I don't think will be a issue there, but will monitor it to see. There is space for heat to expand into, and if it becomes a issue I will put it in the engine space and use one of my 50 amp cords between it and the plug. I could cut a hole in the wood and turn the outlet around. Time will tell.
'99 U320 40 WTFE
Build #5462,
1500 Watts Solar 600 amp Victron lithium
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland Hemi
Instagram bobfnbw
Retired

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #10 –
The hughes I saw opened up  at hughes in so cal was big coils of copper wire heavily potted in a resin.  Hard to fail.  At least to be a danger.  My EMS is wired in after the ATS in the bed pedestal.  As I have a power cord reel turned sideways in the compartment where the std cord reel was along with the hose reel I removed there was a spot behind the cord reel to install the autoformer.  I used the Hughes bypass cord to be able to wire around the autoformer if desired.

Obviously this only works if you remove the factory reels and eliminate the hose one.

No contact rings in the Glendinning  fixed that potential issue permanently. 

So I ended up with a no contact ring ,current technology,  marine grade power in and out cord reel and had a space to install the Hughes where, for whatever reason, that can be bypassed in the compartment and the Progressive Industry EMS wired after an updated ATS. 

Fixed the ATS, fixed the contact ring cord reel issue, fixed the over and under voltage with the EMS. 

Lost the water cord reel which was a non critical thing for me as I run off the tank normally.

"Look at the bigger picture" was my idea.

Only so much space, So  I turned the cablemaster sideways so it cord goes through the compartment wall into the area where the tank valves are at the top in front so the cable deploys to the rear and then down through the drain hose opening. 

RVCM-7 - Glendinning Products

An old buddy had scrounged the reel from a Monaco dynasty repair brand new at the time so that lowered the cost. 

If pictures are needed they may have been posted here a while ago by me?
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4
 

Re: Hughes autoformer installation advice sought

Reply #11 –
I have a project and parts waiting on a cooler day to install a manual transfer switch to back feed my house off the generator using the same power cord as I do to feed shore power.

I will also likely permanently hardwire the autoformer on another manual transfer switch to be able to simply turn  switch and boost the power or bypass it all together.

Of course, I would still turn off all loads before swapping any switches.
 
2002 U270 34' Build 5953
Cummings ISL400HP
3410 Floor Plan
Longview, TX