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Topic: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot (Read 848 times) previous topic - next topic - Topic derived from Connecting to 120v sh...

15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

The aquahot should run on electric on 15amps.

Not sure if it gets hot enough but running the bath zone on and set very low and the bay thermostat set at 50 or so I think your tank bays would be ok,  you have two heat exchangers in the bay.

Trying to figure if the 110 element is on does the bay thermostat run that part of the circuit without the bath thermostat on?
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #1 –
Quote from: Caflashbob –
Trying to figure if the 110 element is on does the bay thermostat run that part of the circuit without the bath thermostat on?

Here is a link to a recent discussion on this subject Looking to purchase FT
Pamela & Mike 97 U 320

"It's not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters."

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #2 –
Basement Bay Aqua Hot Thermostat

The bathroom thermostat and basement bay thermostat independently activate the same AH loop pump and the heat exchangers in their respective areas. Diodes in the wiring to the basement thermostat prevent any interaction.  The bathroom thermostat does not have to be on for the basement thermostat to function, engage the zone pump and heat exchangers.

These thermostats and the zone pumps are functional whether the AH is on with diesel or 120v AC or not.  The AH and all of its functions are not disabled by turning off the so called "Salesman's Switch"

If yours does not operate this way then it was mis-wired originally or the wiring has been inappropriately altered.

If you winterize your coach and do not have the AH heating you should disconnect (I added a three wire plug connection) the bay thermostat.  It has no off position and even if it is set to the lowest temp, if the temp gets lower than that the basement bay thermostat will turn on the AH zone pump and basement heat exchanger fans which of course will do no heating because the AH is cold, just use battery reserves.
Roger Engdahl and Susan Green
2001 U320 3610 #5879 (Home2) - 2014 Jeep Cherokee or 2018 F150
Hastings, MN

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #3 –
So with the dash 110 volt aquahot switch off the bay thermostat will turn the bay circuit on anyway?  So it's is not controlled by the dash power switches at all. Totally independent regardless of the aqua hot panels switch positions?

The other three zones can be fan controlled but the basement bays fans cannot be turned off no matter  what?

Mine is unaltered btw. 
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #4 –
You are making no sense.

You have a dash 110 volt aquahot switch? What is that? Where?  What dash power switches are you talking about?

What does "The other three zones can be fan controlled" mean?  The fans have no control over any zone.  There are only three coach heat zones.

The bathroom and basement wet bay are the same loop.  The same pump. The bathroom thermostat probably has an off position.  It it is on and calls for heat the pump and heat exchange fan in the bathroom will come on even if the AH is cold and it will run until you shut it off or your batteries are dead. 

The basement bay thermostat has no off position and if the basement temp goes below where it is set the zone pump will come on and the basement het exchanger fans will come on even if the AH is cold and they will run until you lower the basement thermostat setting, disconnect it or your batteries are dead.

You can turn on the engine pre-heat when the AH is cold and circulate cold coolant through the engine until you turn it off or your batteries are dead.

Roger Engdahl and Susan Green
2001 U320 3610 #5879 (Home2) - 2014 Jeep Cherokee or 2018 F150
Hastings, MN

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #5 –
So the bay fan(s) come on with all the thermostat off and the 110 volt under the counter in the off position?

And that applies when the 12 volt door switch is off?

Can't remember in  my quick look at the heat exchangers in the tank bay if they were fan forced or just natural convection?

Fan driven would be a separate system versus the heat exchanger.  So you are saying that the bay thermostat turns on the zone pump in the aquahot and the fans.

And that the off positions on all the available switches the bay thermostat will still allow the bay fans to come on as it has no off
position?

So every winter stored aqua hot coaches fans are on constantly.

"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #6 –
Yes.  The bay thermostat has no off position according to Rudy.  Mine has been set as low as it will go and I found the wet bay heat exchanger fans on at -10°.  I added a disconnect plug.

Yes.  The AH is not disabled by the Salesman switch.  You will do damage if you could cut power during a diesel cycle and interrupt the final cool down phase.

The LR, BR and Bath thermostats have off positions.  The bay thermostat does not.

The heat exchangers in the kitchen, LR, bath and basement have built in fans.  The one in the dash uses the dash blower fan.  I do not know it it has built in fans or not. Heat exchanger photos from AH below.

When temperature in the bay is below the bay thermostat setting the zone pump comes on and the fans on the two bay heat exchangers come on. 

The Aquahot switches in the coach (mine are in the kitchen) do not turn the AH on or off.  The enable heating the AH coolant with diesel or 120VAC and enable the engine preheat circulator.

The only way to disable the AH or a specific zone is to pull fuses according my discussions with Rudy.

If you have an AH and store your coach in temperatures colder than the minimum temperature setting on the bay thermostat (about zero) the zone pump and heat exchanger fans will come on.  I added a three wire disconnect plug to make getting the panel where the thermostat is located out when winterizing and to be able to disable the bay heat. 

My coach is winterized now, 9 inches of snow Tuesday, most nights are below freezing. The AH is cold, bay thermostat is disconnected.  It is below freezing this morning, coach is plugged in, my start batteries and 600 ah of LiFePO4 batteries are being maintained (independently) with only 3.5 amps from my Sterling ProCharge Ultra.  LiFePO4 batteries are at 45°
Roger Engdahl and Susan Green
2001 U320 3610 #5879 (Home2) - 2014 Jeep Cherokee or 2018 F150
Hastings, MN

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #7 –
Roger is dead right about how to organize the AH in frigid contiions with all systems turned off.

The power to the AH is always on, no switch, period.  The interior heating zones, pumps and fans, can be turned OFF at the interior thermostat.  The basement thermostat is always ON and has a lowest setting near zero.  So it will call for heat, energizing the number two pump and basement fan coil in below zero conditons.  Pulling the basement fuse or disconnecting the thermostat wire(s) will prevent it from operating.

Winterize the fresh water coil in the AH.  Check the freezing temp of fresh water antifreeze and AH coolant antifreeze for a temp below the ambient temp the coach is sitting in.  In my neck of the woods, 15 degrees F would be fine.  In Wyoming, better than -30 degrees F would be needed.

Hope this helps
Rudy Legett
2003 U320 4010 ISM 450 hp
2001 U320 4220 ISM 450 hp
1995 U320 M11 400 hp
1990 Granvilla 300 hp 3208T
Aqua Hot Service Houston and Southeast Texas

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #8 –
So a 12 volt consuming system that has no off switch.  Wonder how many owners knew of this? 

So the refers AND the aquahot bay zone pump and it's fans are wired direct to battery. 

Cold here is way above freezing normally

I suppose their thought was that if you had any heating on in the coach that the tank bay would be safe from freezing.

Good to know. 

I have adjusted the thermostat to lower power consumption and/or to increase the fresh tanks water temp to create hotter water at the outlets before. 





"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #9 –
The reason for no switch is owners will turn off the power to the burner while it is firing and very hot.  No 3 minute cool down period will allow the swirler to melt.  Now the cost of repaire starts to climb.  So, since there is no cure for stupid, no switch.
Rudy Legett
2003 U320 4010 ISM 450 hp
2001 U320 4220 ISM 450 hp
1995 U320 M11 400 hp
1990 Granvilla 300 hp 3208T
Aqua Hot Service Houston and Southeast Texas

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #10 –
Ah very good.  So the cool down cycle is the reason why the unit is direct wired.  Separately the non off bay zone is to protect the tanks.

I do not remember if these things were in the owners manual?
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #11 –
Is my understanding correct?

As long as there is 120 V Ac power either from shore or from the generator and the switch 120 V AC in the kitchen is in the on position and the diesel switch is in the off position, the electrical heating element (1650 W) will heat the fluid circulation system when the room thermostats call for heat or hot water faucet is on.

Amount of heat is limited by the capacity of the element.

I could therefore store the coach in an unheated garage connected to shore power and set the thermostat to say 40 deg F. At freezing temperatures this would cost  me approximately $ 1 a day in electricity at an assumed on-time of 25%.  (And much more if electricity fails and I am not properly winterized.)

I learned that the 12 V circulation pumps will come on regardless of the availability of shore power. In my coach they are model PLX-809-200, and I could not find any power rating for these. Does anyone know the W rating?

Whatever that may be (from the looks of it 100 W) one has to either maintain battery charge, or if no electrical power is available during winter storage, pull the fuse on the circulation pumps.

Greetings

Klaus



The world is not interested in the storms you encountered, but whether or not you brought in the ship.
Raul Armesto

2003 U 320 4020 Unit 6145

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #12 –
Quote from: kepeters –
In my coach they are model PLX-809-200, and I could not find any power rating for these. Does anyone know the W rating?

13w

Mike
Pamela & Mike 97 U 320

"It's not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters."

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #13 –
Klaus that's my understanding also.  The zone 2 circuit runs through the bathroom heat exchangers then down to the tank bays.

With the bath thermostat off their would be no demand turning the zone pump on or its fans for the bath.

The bay would use most of the 110 volt elements capacity and some additional power for the bay fans.

Pretty good engineering to avoid damage to the burner from not allowing the 3 minute cool down cycle and to help keep the tankage areas from freezing.

Even if the element was off their would be a certain amount of latent heat in the aqua hot tank that would be used as a last resort for heating the tank bays.

Like a power failure overnight not noticed while sleeping and/or a cold snap occurred.

Roger noted that the system retained 120 degree heat for many hours after its heating  sources are shutdown

"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #14 –
At 13 W as Mike states the pump uses about 170 Amp hours a week.

Regards
Klaus
The world is not interested in the storms you encountered, but whether or not you brought in the ship.
Raul Armesto

2003 U 320 4020 Unit 6145

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #15 –
13-14 watts is about right.  The specs say 1.1 amp. 

Klaus, turning on the 120 VAC switch (12 VDC) closes a relay to enable heating with 120 VAC.  You will hear it cluck. It is under the kitchen drawers in my coach in a gray metal box.  With this switch on you will be heating the AH coolant whether or not the thermostats are on.

Heating with 120 VAC and diesel can happen at the same time and depending on the outside temps and heating demand if the electric can keep up the diesel will not come on.

Winterize if there is any chance of freezing and you are not living in the coach. If it is about 30 degrees out and you set the LR thermostat to 40 degrees, and basement to 35 degrees and the Bath and BR thermostats are off  your 120 VAC heater will be on more than 50% of the time.

The heat exchangers in our coach (2001) use fractions of an amp.  Older models might use more.  All can be fitted with speed controls.  Slowing down the fans makes them quieter and run longer.  the result is a more uniform heat distribution and more comfort.  Add an override switch to the big dash blower fan too so that it does not come on when the LR calls for heat.  doing that reduces noise a lot, reduces on/off cycling, improves heat distribution and uniformity and adds comfort.
Roger Engdahl and Susan Green
2001 U320 3610 #5879 (Home2) - 2014 Jeep Cherokee or 2018 F150
Hastings, MN

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #16 –
Off-topic posts have been deleted.  This is a technical topic, not "Fire Ring" (or "what I did 30 years ago")

Please stick to the subject - 15 amp 120V shore power to run aquahot in a Foretravel
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320
 

Re: 15 amp 120v shore power to run aquahot

Reply #17 –
Thanks Michelle
Larry Warren
1996  U320 36' SBID "Lola" sold 2020
Build #4970
Motorcade #18318