Considering a Foretravel

Topic: Considering a Foretravel (Read 2753 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #25 – September 26, 2013, 11:38:54 am

I don't know much about Manatee RV, and the internet does not seem to know much about them either, except for one very bad review. I have to admit that I do not much like RV dealerships in general, and RV salesmen even more. But reading your description of this coach has set off all kinds of red lights in my mind.

The fiberglass roof may have problems, and it may not have problems. It is perfectly normal for a fiberglass roof to have a wavey appearance and be flexable. It has to be to handle the heat and cooling stresses that it goes through.

And there should be several folders of coach manuals with the coach, including a folder with all the repair and maintenance receipts. I would want to be seeing that to see where the work had been done and what work has been done. You can not trust a salesman to tell you any of this stuff, cause when their lips move, well you know the rest. That paint job, unless documentated, could have very well been in Mexico. And fiberglass roofs are not "reskinned" with more fiberglass.

I would proceed very cautiously, and not with out a knowledgeable Foretravel inspector!!!

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #26 – September 26, 2013, 12:03:26 pm

Why was the roof reskinned, Its Fibreglass,

It takes a considerable amount of force to smash F/B to the point of reskinning the roof,

F/B is good for 25 years at least,

What else has been repaired when the roof was crushed, bent, twisted, warped,

I dont know about later models, but my 89 G/V is very solid on the roof, I have walked all over it, I want to install solar panels on it, 400 Watts of it,

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #27 – September 26, 2013, 12:13:39 pm

Quote from: P. Wyatt Sabourin – September 26, 2013, 11:09:05 am

I have a 1996 U320 with 110,000 miles. The 4060R tranny shifts perfectly almost all the time, however, once in a while, it will shift hard after the engine revs for a moment. This only happens when the tranny CPU cannot keep up to what is happening, ie on a freeway and suddenly there is a sea of brake lights in front of me, hard on the brakes to slow down, then cars speed away, I step on the gas, engine lugs , then tranny shifts down to too low a gear, engine revs and a hard shift up - now in right gear. I see this as my fault, I should have eased on the throttle and not worried about keeping up to all those cars to let the tranny find the correct gear.

Anyone else experience this hard shifting with a 4060R.

Yes, occasional clunks. Similar conditions.

Bob

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #28 – September 26, 2013, 02:39:30 pm

"That paint job, unless documentated, could have very well been in Mexico. And fiberglass roofs are not "reskinned" with more fiberglass."

That paint job definitely looks like FOT work ... but that does not mean that they did anything to the roof. Document document document. The repair records are MANDATORY. Any good owner will have reams of them. The sample you posted of the "roof" is really an interior product ... but the stuff that is actually on your roof is probably the nonskid "glass bead" additive that is used in the roof paint. It has a pebbly kind of look, but does not hold on to dust and dirt to make for easy cleaning.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #29 – September 26, 2013, 04:20:54 pm

Was back again today. The paint and roof work was done at FOT, as was cabinetry to install a 40" samsung tv and cabinetry to remove the splendide washer/dryer and replace with shelving. The big money was in paint and "armor coating on the roof". It looked an awful lot like fiberglass reinforced paneling to me. Service records are comprehensive dating back to 2010 but before that nothing at all. It had a new radiator put in for $6K total and the entire radiator assembly had to be rebuilt. The coach spent a ton of time in MIchigan according to the records and in the light of day plenty of rust was noted. As I was going through the service records (sitting in the coach with the generator and a/c running) I encountered a complaint in 2010 that the generator died of overheating. The service report said the water pump belt came off. Almost at that second the fault light came on and the generator died. Looking at the LED's the over temperature light was on.

Nobody can figure out the lights. It's the intellitec system and it's not working. The lights are all on on the panels but they don't respond. One of the guys said they worked once then didn't so only very few interior lights are working, the ones on their own switches.

Closer examination of the roof leads me to believe that there is a giant hole in the roof but the wood there is still very very firm and there is absolutely no evidence of leaks or dampness inside whatsoever. I have a lot of trouble figuring out what was done with the roof. The dealer insists it is a secondary layer and hte first layer is intact. They are going to inject epoxy between the open area and weight it.

The transmission had no codes stored.

The frontmost bin on the driver side behind the passenger wheel wouldn't open - locked or unlocked, the handle wouldn't budge. The bins in general were hard to close, you really had to slam them and they had a very loose and old feel to them. The joey beds and drawers were in good shape.

I'm walking away and it kills me because it's such a beautiful coach. It's too much of a stretch to my budget to be comfortable with the work after. A U270 36' is for sale where I am staying at for much much less money which I will consider as well but otherwise we may go with my wife's idea of a 25' bigfoot travel trailer. I'm not looking forward to that tiny thing.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #30 – September 26, 2013, 04:22:44 pm

On older coaches, the non-skid surface on the roof at the top of the ladder often causes weakening of the fiberglass surface over time - when it yellows you are having disintegration occur. Eventually it will make a soft spot that leaks and caves in.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #31 – September 26, 2013, 04:25:58 pm

Oh I forgot to mention too, not new windows but the windows were removed and defogged by some random window company. Almost all were reinstalled wrong. One wasn't able to be opened at all no matter how much force. The plastic lock latches were broken on every window. The screws in the interior trim were dimpled looking like way too much torque was used to reinstall the windows.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #32 – September 26, 2013, 04:39:28 pm

The FRP like roof coating is from Foretravel paint shop. Get vin number and call Justin (biscuit) at the FT paint shop. I suspect he painted the coach and roof and can tell you all about any repaired damage.

James Triana is here at Grand Vention, I will ask him re light issues. Justin was here but is on way back to NAC. He showed roof coating sample today and it looked exactly like FRP.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #33 – September 26, 2013, 04:40:43 pm

That does not sound like Foretravel work

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #34 – September 26, 2013, 07:39:43 pm

We purchased a 1998 U270 from Motorhomes of Texas (MOT) in Dec last year. We never laid eyes on until mid Jan when we flew down from Maine to pick it up. Basically we bought it sight unseen. We got in on a Friday and were able to stay at the dealer over the weekend to check out the coach. We found a few things but all minor. Come Monday they fixed all gripes. On Tues afternoon we headed for Seguin, TX, about 250 miles from MOT. At around 200 miles the alternator went, we limped to our firends house and stayed thru the weekend when MOT said they could take care of us. We got back to MOT, they replaced the alt. The coach was sold where is as is" so I had to pay the bill, however they gave us a real nice discount due to us just getting the coach. At that time there was about 110,000 on the coach, we just turned 118000 two weeks ago, no other problems. Other than my own fault, had a house battrey explode because I forgot to check the water level. And that is it we will be going to Calif. next year and I have no qualms at all doing that.

Reading of the problems you have seen on the 320 I would walk, go for the U270 is is great. Just like all the folks on this forum. They know what they are talking about.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #35 – September 26, 2013, 09:47:29 pm

Patience is a virtue. Being over anxious can lead to buyers remorse and spending even more money. There always are more coaches for sale by folks who gave them good TLC. Networking and learning more about these fabulous coaches can lead to an even better choices.

So don't feel too bad about letting this one get away.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #36 – September 26, 2013, 10:09:06 pm

My brides favorite saying, "this weeks deal of a lifetime" :-)

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #37 – September 27, 2013, 07:21:56 am

I have been looking at Foretravel for a couple of months now. The coach that you are looking at is one that I was interested in. I am currently working in Afghanistan so I have not been able to look at any of the coaches in person. That particular coach was "pending" about a month ago and it was pending for 3 or 4 weeks. So, I assume the last potential buyer saw many of the things that you saw and in the end felt like it was not worth the headache. I too love the paint job on that coach. Good luck in your search.
Rory

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #38 – September 27, 2013, 07:57:31 am

That buyer couldn't arrange financing I believe. They had a deposit on it the entire time I was considering it.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #39 – September 27, 2013, 10:27:35 pm

I am pretty sure the roof coating in the picture is what Foretravel is now installing. Last year they told me that their preferred roof coating is an elastomeric coating similar to Rhino Lining. That's what the photo looks like. I chose to have Xtreme do a more traditional urethane roof coating with small non-skid particles. So far it has been great.

Many of the other items of concern don't sound too good but it sounds like someone spent a bunch of money on that coach. What are the problems with the windows? Sometimes just a little silicone spray will do wonders. As suggested, it might be a very good idea to have it inspected by a Foretravel pro.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #40 – September 27, 2013, 11:41:31 pm

"I am pretty sure the roof coating in the picture is what Foretravel is now installing."

I am pretty sure that the sample of pebbly white stuff in the photo comes in 4 x 8 sheets and is the same stuff we used in food prep areas and in the bathrooms of the Dairy Queen stores we built. It can be sanitized easily and kids can't write on it with ball point pens in the bathrooms ... Sharpie can be removed with solvent ... it was good stuff. But I can't see it on the roof of a motor home.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #41 – September 28, 2013, 08:15:25 am

Bin doors are any easy adjustment. The lighting has a control board under the fridge that can fix that issue or at least a place to start.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #42 – September 28, 2013, 12:01:07 pm

I calculate a minimum of $5000 and probably a more reasonable $15000 to fix the coach. Could be more if for instance rot is detected under the roof hole. I don't even know what steps you would take to help reduce the chance of mold. And if I decide to have FOT do the work I need to price in $2000 in fuel to and from. Since the worst case always happens to me I think the coach is overpriced around $13K. It's a perfectly reasonable price otherwise considering the money the owner put in. When talking price with them they said the owner wouldn't budge and had originally listed the coach at $99K.

Looking at the maintenance records, they date back only to 2010 (and only in 2010) when the current owner obtained the coach. The records look very reactive rather than proactive. It looks like he got "suckered" into doing oil and fuel filter once in 2010 but not once thereafter? He brought the coach in for generator overheat and the cummins center probably mentioned how changing the oil might be important. I didn't see anything about coolant filters or other bits. I don't see any service visit that was for maintenance only, it was always precipitated by some problem. The only visit that was proactive was to FOT for paint and cabinetry.

My main worries are the transmission and the roof. The transmission did shift funny and it had the proper fluid level and no codes though the dealer could have easily reset the codes after I left.

I studied the intellitec system. We did work with the boards under the fridge but there was nothing you could really do to them without hooking it up using the intellitec sofware. We unplugged and plugged things in, checked fuses, etc. Still the system just wouldn't respond. I think the stuck button at the entry door was to blame. It was probably locking up the communications channel. Intellitec parts are available so it's just $$.

The windows are simply overtightened and I suspect tightened unevenly. The front passenger window was not able to be opened. No amount of gorilla strength would open it. Replacing the interior frame and torquing the screws down to a sane value will probably fix them being so tight. New latches and a rivet tool fix the locks.

Basically I'm knowledgeable enough that I could buy the coach and deal with the issues and I'd be fine. With some dilligence and a lot of spending, I don't think it would be a problem child. For me the issue is that $72K is stretching the budget. Getting closer to $100K with all the work, taxes, tags, etc is really stretching it. And the wife doesn't understand spending so much money just to get problems to fix. In her mind if she spends north of $50K it better be amazing but we all know the realities of rv's, even foretravels. I have to continually remind her what they cost new. I also have to remind her why we drive BMW/Lexus and that I'm attempting to apply that philosophy to the rv. I hate that the dealer tries to hide the issues, I'd rather buy from someone who is open and honest and gives me the run down, adjusts the price appropriately and lets everyone walk away feeling like things are fair. Every rv has active issues, it's almost impossible to escape them though I'll do my best when I sell mine. I hate that they let it sit in the lot for weeks (months?) without even putting some eternabond or tape a bag over the roof hole even though this area had more rain than they've seen in many many years. It's just insane to me. Water is evil.

I'm droning on and on because I really wanted the coach but I just can't afford it if I'm being realistic. More importantly all of the problems will drive the wife to hate the coach and that would just make for a miserable experience. I'm checking out a U270 that really lines up with what I was originally after budget wise. It needs new bags and tires and probably brakes too but it's priced aggressively and the owner is knowledgeable and conscientious.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #43 – September 28, 2013, 01:09:54 pm

Good for you. To many folks buy with their heart and their eyes. Sounds like you are using clear thinking instead.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #44 – September 28, 2013, 02:54:55 pm

If looks and feels just like FRP, fiberglass reinforced panels. But it is spayed on, and Biscuit, the paint manager at FT had a sample with him at GV. Said it basically a truck bed liner product.

Seemed tough.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #45 – September 28, 2013, 03:04:40 pm

The value of a coach is shades of gray, not black and white.
In April 2010, I paid 13% of the spec sheet new price for my 1996 U320 with 90,000 miles. It had painted stripes but the interior was OEM, except the "J" part of the coach had been replaced by a cabinet. I replaced the tires and coach batteries immediately ($4000).

A 1999 U320 today is at a similar age as my coach was three years ago, however, a 42 foot sold for $55k more then a 40 foot. Also the market for used motohomes has recovered circa 10-20% since 2010.

An original 1999 U320 42 foot has market value of circa $ 70,000. Improvements will add up to 50% of what they cost, so excellent FBP or interior redecorate adds $10,000 each. Problems reduce the value. Spending money on repairs adds very little. In my opinion the coach you are describing is worth no more than $80,000.

When I was looking for a 40 foot U320 Foretravel in 2009 and 2010, I became very frustrated with owners who said they wanted to sell but were firm on prices that were 50% above market (the bottom had dropped out of the market). After watching and negotiating on coaches "for sale by owner" for a year, I gave up contacting owners and concentrated on dealers. I purchased at MOT, a U320 with little history information, because it was an estate sale. I insisted on fluid analysis on motor oil, tranny fluid, and engine coolant (most important). I would urge you to do the same because fluid analysis speaks volumes about how well the coach has been maintained.

Incidently, for months after I purchased, I noticed those same "over market priced" coaches which I attempted to buy, but with much lower prices, or consigned at dealers. Now, at three years post purchase I still see coaches which were for sale in 2010.

Are you sure you want a 42foot U320 with a tag, full body paint, and redone interior when a 40foot U320 original without a tag will sell for $20,000 less and be very serviceable and comfortable. A U295 would sell for $5k-10k less then a U320 and the major difference between a U295 and U320 is the motor/tranny. I did not look for a U295 because I wanted the M11 for the power. I also bought a 1996 because I wanted Tamboured cabinet doors and did not want Aquahot.

Do not give up on getting a Foretravel motorhome, it is the best value for your money in a used 40foot motorhome.

Just my opinion!

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #46 – September 28, 2013, 09:03:48 pm

If you know of a 1999 U320 40' nontag with desk listed for $52,900 I'd like to see it :-P Maybe I'm being off base and it's just a slow time for U320's right now. I saw the 1999 U270 today. The wife didn't like the cabinet colors. I don't think I can come to grips with the toilet not being in its own room. It certainly had the same foretravel feel as the U320 discussed in this thread.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #47 – September 28, 2013, 09:22:40 pm

Quote from: piku – September 28, 2013, 09:03:48 pm

I don't think I can come to grips with the toilet not being in its own room.

With most (all?) walk-through baths, there are pocket doors to close off the bath from the rest of the coach, so there wouldn't be a privacy issue.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #48 – September 28, 2013, 09:38:04 pm

Most U270 have oak interiors unless they were a special ordered coach. U295 and U320 usually have Walnut, unless special ordered with oak. There are lists of upgrades as you step up by number in the Unicoach series.

We have now had both the private side bath and now the walk thru bath. Benefits to both designs, but we like the huge bathroom and closets all together with the sliding double doors.

Re: Considering a Foretravel

Reply #49 – September 28, 2013, 10:08:38 pm

Give me the walk-through any day! Love all the space on the bath.

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