New to Foretravel...

Topic: New to Foretravel... (Read 4764 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #50 – May 11, 2014, 06:42:41 pm

Quote from: dengineer – May 11, 2014, 06:25:34 pm

Bob, we are speechless... what a concept!!!!!! such thoughts must be harnessed prior to their escaping into the realm of mush!!! Bob, we are so impressed that I will from now on start all at the end...We are so taken....our lives have been changed... ALLELU....!!!!
But wait, there is now a minor problem... we are full of it!!!! how do we clean this off?
(lol) thank you, we needed that!!!!
Tony & Lora

As a sales manager in the high line Rv biz for ten years I learned to tell every prospective customer that exact statement at some point prior to delivery. Versus "step" buying. That way when they came back two years later and I told them in the 80's it was a $100k and their trade in for the new one they now wanted I could mention I told them this would happen.

Few virgins here. Most have spent enough on in between steps to have bought the top of the line new long ago. And enjoyed it from the beginning.

Glad you see the humor in this. Hated buyers without a sense of humor. Walked a few off the lot as it was going to be an ugly experience for both them and me and Foretravel in the long run

The advise was I guess worth exactly what I charged for it to you. 500 high line motorhomes sold later what could I know?

Sorry I offended.

Bob

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #51 – May 11, 2014, 06:49:21 pm

FWIW, tony has a 4 yr old multi slide SOB with a Hydro-Hot buried in a difficult to get to location. Tows a full size pick with a bunch of tools for his retirement job all over the country but mostly west of Mississippi.

Power and warmth will be important, but his hydro hot bad experiences (multiple $$$$$$$ expensive repairs, partially due to location) have him a bit concerned re aquahot.

There are very few bad Foretravel decisions, some just better than others

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #52 – May 11, 2014, 08:32:32 pm

Bob, it never offended us in any way, to the contrary we thought it was wonderful and so true, we believe in laughing at ourselves first... it is healthy and it also allows us to think more clearly... after all in the end we have no one but us blame and everybody else to credit !!!
So, please feel free to drop in any comment any time, it will always be welcome... and appreciated...!!!
Look forward to meeting in person some time soon,
Best regards!
Tony & Lora

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #53 – May 11, 2014, 08:41:05 pm

We started looking at a 34' U270, no slide. We (I) was concerned about towing in the mountains so thought more HP would be good. Electronic engines and transmission by 2001 as I recall. Longer WB was commonly suggested for a better ride. Adding a slide adds weight and more complex systems. It also likely adds resale value. It changes basement access due to additional structure. Floor plans are different w/o slides. We really like the extra room. Interior changes in the U320 in 2001 (ceiling, AC ducting, dash) were appealing. U320 36' was only available in 2001 and 2002. Slides in 2000 versions were much harder to service (especially seals). Bedroom slides in these years cost a side window and cross ventilation for closet space. We wanted the windows.

Best fit for us, floor plan, length, appointments, engine, transmission, slide, budget at the time we were ready to buy (2011) was a 2001 36' U320, single slide.

Aqua hot is very nice.

Are we happy? Absolutely. Problems? A few but within realistic expectations. Would we do it again? Yes! What are we going to change? Headlights and the front steps. MCD front shades. Maybe full body paint ... Someday. Maybe a residential refrigerator ... Someday.

Buy what appeals to you and fits the budget. Don't forget to reserve some for what will need to be done. Get a proper inspection. Eyes wide open ... Go for it!

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #54 – May 11, 2014, 08:45:14 pm

John, as you know from our chat, the intention here is to escape winter and head for warm blooded country even if late some times... so exposure to the cold will be limited...
As it has been mentioned here the bottom line is going to be condition, livability, gut feeling and lastly we will try to get a fair deal and a reasonable price... after that the fun begins !!!
Regards,
Tony

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #55 – May 11, 2014, 11:22:15 pm

Quote from: dengineer – May 11, 2014, 08:45:14 pm

John, as you know from our chat, the intention here is to escape winter and head for warm blooded country even if late some times... so exposure to the cold will be limited...
As it has been mentioned here the bottom line is going to be condition, livability, gut feeling and lastly we will try to get a fair deal and a reasonable price... after that the fun begins !!!
Regards,
Tony

Sorry about your current aqua hot issues. What I noticed was anything other than hydronic heating dried the air in the coach too much. The lower humidity amplified the actual temperature variations even more.

Sleeping was more difficult. Too hot from the safety over run after the thermostat cuts the gas flow but cannot shut off as the furnace itself is still hot so it runs some more.

On start up the fan comes on first lowering the temperature even more then the heat comes in in case of a propane leak for fire safety I guess.

Safety requires both functions. If this is different in certain years someone please correct me,

Noisier, dryer, wider temp swings, two zone max. No electric component for milder weather.

My unit is dry camped on a 20amp 110v 100' ten gauge ridgid extension cord and with load juggling I am able to use no fuel and heat the coach, wash clothes, run the microwave.

Four zones with the A/H.

I am sure you know about the aqua hot as a current owner just did not know if you had previous non hydronic heated coaches so as to be able to judge what the differences are.

I quit rving and the biz in the mid 90's just when the non propane systems were coming in.

Beaver started with a four zone webasto with adjustable blower fan speeds in 1991.

Very reliable. More hot water than the aqua hot btw. Unit was in the right rear compartment and easy to access.

Obviously if you don't use a furnace much your choices are different. Unlimited hot water got my wife's vote.

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #56 – May 12, 2014, 12:14:49 am

Bob, tnx for your note, it is interesting you mention the Webasto in the older Beavers, I had one and other than some minor probs it did rather well...later I had another Beaver with a Hydra... something... that one was not so hot... but bearable... then had a couple of coaches with prop and although not as versatile they were ok and finally came another Beaver and that one drove me nuts!!!!!!!! I dont want to bore you with the gory details but I am sure you have heard horror stories about that certain period and mine had me ready to shoot it!!! Anyway that is all behind now and I try not look back except for reference... as Tim said I do still have a bad taste... Presently I am actually looking forward to a good foundation Foretravel on which I can work, fix and enjoy... a simple unit with intrinsic quality...
We will try to get this settled this week I hope as you know it can be a time consuming project towards the end of the process...
Anyway thank you again for your thoughts and anything else you or anyone else may think of please share it with us, we can use all the help we can get...!!!
Tony & Lora

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #57 – May 12, 2014, 12:29:33 am

Quote from: dengineer – May 12, 2014, 12:14:49 am

Bob, tnx for your note, it is interesting you mention the Webasto in the older Beavers, I had one and other than some minor probs it did rather well...later I had another Beaver with a Hydra... something... that one was not so hot... but bearable... then had a couple of coaches with prop and although not as versatile they were ok and finally came another Beaver and that one drove me nuts!!!!!!!! I dont want to bore you with the gory details but I am sure you have heard horror stories about that certain period and mine had me ready to shoot it!!! Anyway that is all behind now and I try not look back except for reference... as Tim said I do still have a bad taste... Presently I am actually looking forward to a good foundation Foretravel on which I can work, fix and enjoy... a simple unit with intrinsic quality...
We will try to get this settled this week I hope as you know it can be a time consuming project towards the end of the process...
Anyway thank you again for your thoughts and anything else you or anyone else may think of please share it with us, we can use all the help we can get...!!!
Tony & Lora

Yes I had heard of the Monaco/beavers with issues. QC not good. The 91's and 92's were almost flawless. Small lists from new owners.

Glad you are experienced now you can maybe compare the SOB's to your Foretravel.

The older Foretravels some have here have cabinets that are veneer sheets over a frame.

Every piece machined. Looking at my 97 now the joining edges are perfect. No carpet under the cabinets. No gimp molding anywhere.

The beaver cabinets long ago were that nice but not machined. Solid heavy wood.

Foretravel came from dodge 318 chassis with one inch wide drum brake shoes. Had to be lighter then.

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #58 – May 12, 2014, 12:50:54 am

Totally agree... those were the days were quality and reliabity meant a lot, particularly in that level coaches... which is why I am now regressing in my old age...(pls note I am older not her...) and hence a Foretravel not newer than 99, (Cummins tells me that was the last year of the good engines...). in 2000 they started to introduce negative changes to their programs, in 05 they really started to derate the engines causing poorer mileage and lesser reliability...
Anyway Bob, keep the info coming, it is greatly appreciated!
I will keep you all posted on our progress...
Tony & Lora

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #59 – May 12, 2014, 09:32:56 am

Quote from: dengineer – May 12, 2014, 12:50:54 am

Totally agree... those were the days were quality and reliabity meant a lot, particularly in that level coaches... which is why I am now regressing in my old age...(pls note I am older not her...) and hence a Foretravel not newer than 99, (Cummins tells me that was the last year of the good engines...). in 2000 they started to introduce negative changes to their programs, in 05 they really started to derate the engines causing poorer mileage and lesser reliability...
Anyway Bob, keep the info coming, it is greatly appreciated!
I will keep you all posted on our progress...
Tony & Lora

The 99's I think has a bigger dash Air/heating unit and those with the ducted roof air had the run in the ceiling extended farther forward to bring more air to the dash. Our 97 is a little light on cooling in the dash area for severe desert heat. Some have used a 110 volt floor fan to move more air forward. I think the counters got two inches deeper somewhere about there. Maybe not until the slide out units although on the deeper counters.

Read Barry's specs

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #60 – May 12, 2014, 02:20:06 pm

Bob, for better heat and A/C performance for a long time we have been using a nice thermal curtain between the cab area and the rest of the coach... it also helps with the interior temps when stationary... The install is rather simple and if you ever decide to do it let me know and I will provide you with the info.
Tony

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #61 – May 12, 2014, 02:45:54 pm

Barry's specs from FT for 2001 U320 shows a 28,000 BTU dash air. The 1999 U320 shows a 22,000 BTU dash air. The 1997 U320 shows 17,200 BTU. Surprisingly, the 2007 Phenix shows 22,500 BTU. Some days I would like 40,000 or more.

When it is cold out and we are driving I have the Aqua Hot on in the cabin, bath and BR. It uses heat from the engine. Works well.

I have thought about a curtain of some sort behind the front seats to trap heat or cool up front. It would have to be see-through to let either of us look back out the side windows for oncoming traffic on the left when we are going down an on ramp or for traffic coming down the on ramp on our right.

Roger

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #62 – May 12, 2014, 07:23:17 pm

Heat is no problem with the AH. I just turn it on and it keeps the coach nice and toasty with just engine bypass heat. In the summer I have to say that the Dash AC works for a while then the genny comes on.

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #63 – May 12, 2014, 09:22:27 pm

Our 97 u320 during our current trip on flat ground in the Midwest at 35,500 gvwr and minimal stop and start with no gen and no deisel aqua hot and no head winds went 712 miles on 70.6 gallons at 65mph with the cruise on and trans mode on.

New replacement electronic gas tank sending unit is very accurate. Showed 5/8 of a tank left.

At 60 and no car in would think 11mpg

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #64 – May 12, 2014, 11:03:00 pm

well folks , I must say that the track and curtain if done tastefully can actually enhance the interior appearance or feel but as always it is a matter of individual taste... one thing is certain, it does work...
One new question; with the new and improved AH, lets say from a 45ºf interior temp, how long does it take to b ring up the coach up to normal, say 70ºf ? As I recall, mine would take forever... to be fair though, I don't think mine was AH , but either Hurricane or Hydra something... anyway...
We just arrived in OKC a bit ago, had dinner, going to shower so I'm not a menace to society and early in the AM we are headed for MOT... and hopefully we will find a coach...!!!
We may have to get in here tomorrow and the next day with questions since as you all know we are totally blank re Foretravels.
We want Mr Wolfe to do our inspection, but he is now out of the country... so if someone out there knows of someone else, we would appreciate the info...
Keep the info coming we need it all!
Best wishes to all...
Tony & Lora

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #65 – May 12, 2014, 11:07:17 pm

The big AH does a great job. The little one a hydro hot will work but it is smaller. I keep my barn at about 50 and it is up to room temp in about ten mins or less if I have the diesel on. Then again my propane furnace did it in about the same time too.

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #66 – May 12, 2014, 11:17:32 pm

One other item we need to learn about is this "Aero" resonator or a "straight through" exhaust... could you all please enlighten us on pros, cons etc... the pricing as I have seen here in the forums seems to be reasonable... and from what I have read there is an improvement in performance... !!???
Thanks...
Tony

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #67 – May 12, 2014, 11:52:11 pm

10 seconds, less if plugged in 110 and element on

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #68 – May 13, 2014, 06:27:52 am

The issue is that the old mufflers needed to be replaced and is not made any longer. So many of us put resonators on and a byproduct is less heat and better performance.

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #69 – May 13, 2014, 08:21:30 am

If the AquaHot is hot (diesel, 110v or from driving) 45-70° is just a few minutes. Once up to temp, it holds it very close to set point. At the end of a day driving, you have heat and hot water from engine heat. Even if you leave the AH off you will still have almost as hot water in the morning. This always amazes me. If the outside overnight temps are in the 40's, the 110v heater in the AH will provide plenty of heat and hot water. In the 30's, I turn on the diesel.

From a cold start, diesel takes about 20 minutes to full heat. 110v takes a couple hours. With diesel on you have virtually unlimited heat and hot water.

My VMSpc output on total miles and total fuel since new gives me an average of 8.0 MPG. Most miles towing. We drove from CA to MN with no tow after we bought the coach, pretty light wt, and averaged 9.6 at 65. I got nearly 11 in IA with a big tail wind one day. Wind turned 180° the next and I just barely got 7. YMMV. Everyone gets what they get. The goal is to get where you are going.

Roger

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #70 – May 13, 2014, 11:05:41 am

Quote from: dengineer – May 12, 2014, 12:14:49 am

Bob, tnx for your note, it is interesting you mention the Webasto in the older Beavers, I had one and other than some minor probs it did rather well...later I had another Beaver with a Hydra... something... that one was not so hot... but bearable... then had a couple of coaches with prop and although not as versatile they were ok and finally came another Beaver and that one drove me nuts!!!!!!!! I dont want to bore you with the gory details but I am sure you have heard horror stories about that certain period and mine had me ready to shoot it!!! Anyway that is all behind now and I try not look back except for reference... as Tim said I do still have a bad taste... Presently I am actually looking forward to a good foundation Foretravel on which I can work, fix and enjoy... a simple unit with intrinsic quality...
We will try to get this settled this week I hope as you know it can be a time consuming project towards the end of the process...
Anyway thank you again for your thoughts and anything else you or anyone else may think of please share it with us, we can use all the help we can get...!!!
Tony & Lora

Hey Tony,
Sounds like you're intimately familiar with technology (good & bad) & have a realistic perspective towards repair & re-engineering the unreliable...
If you come up with any unique & novel solutions PLEASE post them. I'm rebuilding/restoring an older unit & my typical conundrum is the choice between older "no frills" technology that does work or upgrading to something with nice features based on newer technology that may not be as "abuse tolerant" as I do need.

@ Roger
I thought the AH ran on propane? Or is it able to source heat from 110V, LPG & engine? Can it work as a block heater to aid in cold starting?

Remember peeps, snow is bad!
God told Noah to build a boat. Didn't say nuthin' about skis, snowshoes, a sled or snowmen.
Just sayin'....

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #71 – May 13, 2014, 11:16:52 am

AH in Foretravels fueled by diesel. Also has limited 110 heat, and when engine is running uses engine heat.

AH also can pre- heat your engine, plus endless hot water.

Also creates 3 zone plus bay heat.

AH requires about $150 in annual maintenance , uses .5 GPH when burning. Allows longer boondocking in cold weather since a full tank of diesel will last a wet long time in cold weather.

You pay your money and make your choices !

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #72 – May 13, 2014, 03:36:27 pm

We decided to replace our original muffler with an Aero resonator, even though it was working just fine, with no cracks or any other problems. Figured Aero would not sound much louder, not cost a whole lot and maybe it could be a good change.

We have been towing a 4,200 lb 2002 Jeep Grand Cherokee for 10 years and in 2011, changed to a 5,600 lb 2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee. We were concerned that the extra weight could be a problem for our coach (with original muffler). Found we were aware the new Jeep was back there, so the extra weight was felt. In 2012 we swapped the original muffler for a 5" Aero AT5050 resonator. With the Aero installed we had back the old feeling of power that we had when towing our older lighter Jeep. We are sure the Aero was a positive upgrade for us. I guess that anything that helps the engine breath in or out easier is a good idea.

Aero is a very popular flow-through resonator and has no glass pack. We figured that 5" would give us the most improvement, even though our turbo has a 4" exhaust pipe. There are no disadvantages that we can see.

Below are several write-ups on Aero changes. The first link is our installation.
Exhaust System Replacement - 1997 U270

http://www.beamalarm.com/Documents/replacing_the_muffler_with_a_resonator.ht ml
Exhaust System Replacement - 2003 U320

Removing Muffler

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #73 – May 13, 2014, 10:15:46 pm

Quote from: Tim Fiedler – May 13, 2014, 11:16:52 am

AH in Foretravels fueled by diesel. Also has limited 110 heat, and when engine is running uses engine heat.

AH also can pre- heat your engine, plus endless hot water.

Also creates 3 zone plus bay heat.

AH requires about $150 in annual maintenance , uses .5 GPH when burning. Allows longer boondocking in cold weather since a full tank of diesel will last a wet long time in cold weather.

You pay your money and make your choices !

A boiler setup. Probably has a lot of similarities with a residential boiler. $150 gets you "do the regular service please" or "I need the part pack for an annual service"?
Is it worth buying the filters, nozzle & electrodes to service it yourself?
Or does it require one or more astronomically expensive tools?

Re: New to Foretravel...

Reply #74 – May 13, 2014, 11:06:51 pm

Fred, unless there are major issues like fuel pump or elect board problems a basic service kit is not that hard to do if a person has any mechanical skills. Generally, the hardest part is just working on the unit itself.

Richard B

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