Leaky radiator

Topic: Leaky radiator (Read 2017 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #25 – October 24, 2016, 10:02:53 pm

50-52 on 6% interstates grades? Floored fourth?

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #26 – October 25, 2016, 07:10:27 am

FT Service recommended Bars Leaks for my coach------110,000 miles ago.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #27 – October 25, 2016, 09:30:30 am

I was losing a quart every day on a trip, put in the recommended Barr's leaks (correctly, not in the overflow tank) after tightening the plate bolts.
After 5 years and 30K miles still no leaks. It stays in suspension, doesn't plate surfaces and only collects at the source of the leak.
Its a factory recommendation. If you would prefer spending $5500.00 over $30.00 have at it.
I've used Barr's Leaks for decades with no adverse issues. Alumaseal also.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #28 – October 25, 2016, 11:38:32 am

Quote from: Dave Head – October 25, 2016, 09:30:30 am

It stays in suspension, doesn't plate surfaces and only collects at the source of the leak.

I assume this would be recommended only if there is an active leak, not as a preventive measure? I would think our coolant filters would quickly remove any extra product from the system. In fact, would a filter change be required shortly after adding Bars Leak?

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #29 – October 26, 2016, 07:41:28 am

Quote from: amos.harrison – October 25, 2016, 07:10:27 am

FT Service recommended Bars Leaks for my coach------110,000 miles ago.

X2 on this comment. I was not a fan of this type product but after much research and FT saying it what they do for a minor leak such as mine I put in the recommended amount and no issues.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #30 – October 26, 2016, 08:41:59 am

X3 - two cans - all problems gone now for 7 years.....knock on wood!

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #31 – October 26, 2016, 10:35:22 am

I know you've got a Cummins, but I just thought I'd mention that Detroit Diesel, Foretravel, and Stewart & Stevenson all suggested Barrs Leak so I eventually let them put it in and it worked, completely stopping the radiator leak my coach had when I first bought it... Then the fan blade exploded and I had to recore the radiator anyway... The moral of the story being that while you're worrying about stuff that never happens something you never thought of suddenly jumps up to bite you in the butt!

...so use the Barrs Leak, do a lot of traveling, and save your time, money, and sanity for all the other stuff you never thought of

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #32 – October 26, 2016, 01:23:57 pm

We put in Bar's leak C16 in 2008 and the leak stopped. Now it has started up again.
Talked with Bar's Leak at their home office here in Mich. C16 has been discontinued. Is was a for maintenance and needed to be replenish every so often, which we didn't know or do.

They recommend "Radiator Stop Leak Tabs". 2 tabs per gallon of coolant capacity. Our U320 is 16 gallons.
Here is a link to Bar's Leak. Stop Oil Leak | Stop Engine Leak | Stop Transmission Leak | Stop Coolant Leak

The OEMs, including GM & Ford, put in the tabs at the factory.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #33 – October 27, 2016, 09:50:08 am

Had leak as others mentioned, from couple lose bolts on one end radiator. MOT tighten, still bit of drip. They suggested and put in three cans of Bars Leak, also cut out filter for a time

Seems be working in short drive and some idle time

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #34 – October 27, 2016, 04:44:11 pm

Quick question since a number of these coaches are now on their 3rd, 4th, or 5th owner...

I've been told that Bar's Leak is a one shot deal. That adding it more than once to a system can damage a system.

How can the owner of a coach tell if Bar's Leak has been added by any of the previous owners?

Chris

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #35 – October 27, 2016, 04:51:09 pm

Quote from: Numbers – October 27, 2016, 04:44:11 pm

How can the owner of a coach tell if Bar's Leak has been added by any of the previous owners?

That stuff has been around forever. The only rig I ever used it on was my '47 GMC. After that, I learned to " FIX THE PROBLEM."

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #36 – October 27, 2016, 06:19:48 pm

Bar's leak recommends installing new tabs (32 in our case) every 15,000 miles.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #37 – October 28, 2016, 09:30:30 am

It's quite a job to recore one of these radiators. Unless the side radiator is a lot easier, which I doubt it is, it's gonna take two guys a full day to get the radiator out, at least a day to get the radiator recored, and then two guys another day to get the radiator back in. The best possible scenario would be to drive the coach to a radiator shop that is absolutely sure they can recore the radiator and remove the radiator there. The radiator is huge and weighs 300 pounds. Most radiator shops won't have any experience with a radiator this size, so be sure they know what they're doing before you start. It will probably cost a couple thousand dollars to recore the radiator. I doubt you can buy a replacement radiator. You'll probably have no choice but to recore your existing radiator. Foretravel's parts department would know if there's a replacement radiator available. I'm only commenting from my personal experience recoring my radiator. Your experience could be significantly different because you have a side radiator, but I sure doubt it... Personally, I'd use the Barrs Leak and see if that fixes it. Most people on this forum have never replaced a radiator in a car let alone a diesel pusher motor coach. I would sooner take advice from Foretravel or a radiator shop with experience with this size radiator.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #38 – October 28, 2016, 09:56:02 am

Foretravel owners can contact Atlas radiator in Corpus Christi (the company who built many of the radiators in our coaches) directly and they will manufacture either just a radiator, or the combination radiator with charged air cooler. Lead time can be 6-8 weeks because these will be per order builds. They will ship the radiator to wherever it is needed.

To build a radiator they need the model number of the existing radiator off of the tag/plate on the existing radiator.

There are radiator shops that deal specifically with heavy industry vehicles like transit busses, fire trucks, 18 wheelers, etc. They should be able to recore these units if the rest of the unit is still in good shape. When I called Atlas they suggested that having the existing radiator recored would be a less expensive and faster solution. They did not mention trying to use Bar's Leak or any other leak product.

Chris

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #39 – October 28, 2016, 10:00:37 am

Any "leak fixer" additive is a bandage and can catastrophically fail at any time down the road.
I had to replace two radiators in my lifetime due to ignorance of the changes in manufacture and the anti-pollution changes in our cars & trucks.
Not knowing about the higher engine operating temps since around '80, the larger radiator requirements needed to dissipate heat, the tin/solder ratio changing from 90% tin/10% solder, to 50/50 ratio, and the caustic effects on the newer solder due to the antifreeze failing because of the higher temps and the decreased resistance of the 50/50 solder mix to the acidic antifreeze.
Since then I have, unless the antifreeze is the longer life type, or I just don't know what is in the system, changed antifreeze every three years.
Radiators are costly!! And their time of failure is really bad!
Check the PH of your antifreeze.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #40 – October 28, 2016, 04:06:55 pm

FOT recommended and added 3 cans of Bars leak 3 years ago. Minor leak before, none since.

Will be at FOT in December, guess I need to find out if we need a refresher.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #41 – October 28, 2016, 09:22:25 pm

just recored the radiator on our u320 . did the work at our shop with the help of a friend who used to work in a radiator shop. (also resealed one fan motor) the core cost 1600. it was aprox . 15 hours of work to remove, take the old radiator apart , clean the tanks, drill the holes for the tanks in the new core, clean up the area and reinstall. also did some welding on the CAC. big job .total out of pocket around 2200. plus our labor, ( need two people for an hour or two also). the radiator is a one off. no truck equivalent. had the core custom made. took only 2 days from order it to getting it. great service.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #42 – October 29, 2016, 02:41:06 am

I seem to remember somebody posting about having the radiator repaired in Mexico for a VERY reasonable price.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #43 – October 29, 2016, 07:08:05 am

That --Bars stuff --- really bad ---right ?? Why would Foretravel routinely put some in each new engine when installing in in a new frame ?? This is exactly what the tech at Foretravel said when ask ( 2003 ) at the install shop . I ask the manager at Cummins Atlantic about this very thing . He stated that on each rebuild that goes out their doors has two bottles of liquid bars in in . He said , always get the engine up to operating temperature , put Bars in system , run at this temp for one hour , at 1000 RPM , change filter , deliver to customer . Theory or experience ?? Brad Metzger

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #44 – October 29, 2016, 10:59:27 am

Quote from: Brad Metzger – October 29, 2016, 07:08:05 am

That --Bars stuff --- really bad ---right ?? Why would Foretravel routinely put some in each new engine when installing in in a new frame ?? This is exactly what the tech at Foretravel said when ask ( 2003 ) at the install shop . I ask the manager at Cummins Atlantic about this very thing . He stated that on each rebuild that goes out their doors has two bottles of liquid bars in in . He said , always get the engine up to operating temperature , put Bars in system , run at this temp for one hour , at 1000 RPM , change filter , deliver to customer . Theory or experience ?? Brad Metzger

The radiator has a lot of brazed areas, and a lot of flanged metal to gasket to metal surface in it. Lots of possibility for leaks.
Add in the fact that there will be some flexing of the radiator in some situations, it is not surprising the companies try to "pre empt" any future problems before they might have to provide warranty work.
Have been using Barr's Leak in my vehicles for 50 years with no problems. Have found that it works or does not work within a couple of hours. Some bigger holes or cracks, or voids cannot be repaired with it.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #45 – October 29, 2016, 11:07:01 am

I forgot to mention that no diesel mechanic would do the radiator removal and installation for me, which is why I had to do it myself. I guess it's too hard and diesel mechanics only want to fix stuff that's easy. Just thought you might want to consider that in your decision making.

In all fairness, I recored my radiator in 2012 and I've driven all over the country with it since then and I don't have any Barrs Leak in it, or any other sealant, and I still have zero leakage. I'm using ordinary green Prestone antifreeze, which I believe is ethylene glycol, because that's what Detroit Diesel told me to use, with the pink additive sold at the Detroit Diesel dealer, again because that's what they told me to use and they even told me the correct dosage and how often to test it. I'm not gonna post that here cuz you've got a Cummins and Detroit Diesel owners can contact their local DD dealer for that stuff... but I'd still try to seal the leak if possible instead of recoring the radiator, and I've done both and both worked well

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #46 – October 29, 2016, 11:35:13 am

Quote

How can the owner of a coach tell if Bar's Leak has been added by any of the previous owners?

Good question. I would like to know the answer too.
Maybe contact Bar's?

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #47 – October 29, 2016, 12:29:33 pm

Quote"I seem to remember somebody posting about having the radiator repaired in Mexico for a VERY reasonable price"

That was me that mentioned the repair in Mazatlan, Mexico. We were stopping for the night on way south to see our Dentist and visited an RV park we knew some FTs were staying at for the winter . One of the owners (whose name now escapes me) that lives on Vancouver Island here in BC, was telling me his radiator had developed a big leak on his way down there so had a shop come out to see if it could be fixed in sit u. They said it needed a new/rebuilt core and took it all out. 2 guys did it right there. As there was no rush it came back later that week and installed. Total cost less than $500 Cndn! (exchanged from Pesos)
I spoke to a friend of his a year later and all seemed to be fine.
Maybe one of our FT owners on V Island can inform us if all is still well with it.
I would not hesitate to have mine done down there as I have looked at a couple of shops that repair them and they are just like ours, and very used to truck repairs as that is a big business in Mexico-Trucking. Gone are the old falling apart units as now mostly new or fairly new and they sound beautiful when moving.
JohnH

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #48 – October 29, 2016, 01:05:13 pm

We just returned from out trip and will order a new radiator/CAC from Atlas. We save about $800 going direct, but will have to wait the previously mentioned 6-8 weeks. The coach performed well through all the passes in the Northwest, but overheated on the Grapevine (ambient temp was 73), just north of LA, convincing me that the radiator needed to be changed out, not just plugged. I'm looking at doing the job at home, since I have the tools, time and inclination. The deciding factor for the home replacement was that I would be able to clean out the rust that had accumulated over the years. I'm OCD about two things: rust and oil leaks.
If anyone has experience doing this on a ISM coach, I would appreciate any advise.

Re: Leaky radiator

Reply #49 – October 29, 2016, 05:42:27 pm

Sven, a few years ago I thought I was going to need a new CAC as it had 4 good sized holes in it so I called Atlas and they told me a hew one was $1100 plus shipping. Ft said $3300 + and a 6 week wait. I decided to "fix " mine and it worked out good, still solid. Did not have a rad price but was thinking you should be more than $800 better off dealing with Atlas so wondered what the prices are now on those items?
JohnH

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