Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #25 – July 29, 2021, 03:20:38 pm Quote from: Bob & Sue – July 29, 2021, 11:51:02 amRoger.... since when do you worry about cost 🙂Now Bob, I do consider cost but cost is only part of decisions ... labor, parts and performance come into it too. I was familiar with this type of system and for the tow bar, braking setup and breakaway setup it was less than half what a tow bar and coach brake air driven system would have cost plus whatever it costs to get it installed.I liked the mechanical simplicity of the ReadyBrute, very easy to connect and reliable. And I didn't have to modify the air brake system.Sort of like the two big projects for the summer, replacing roof top ACs and painting the roof. Doing the roof painting alone saved more than $3K based on the price I got at Xtreme. And maybe $1K doing the ACs. Some of that will go to pay MOT or FT to replace my fuel lines in November. And I will have money left over.The more you can do yourself the better. What those tasks are is changing as I get older as they do for most of us. Quote Selected 3 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #26 – July 29, 2021, 05:24:52 pm We have a Blue Ox base plate and tow bars. This is the second towed for us, and each needed a base plate. You will have that expense every time you change toweds. We went with the InvisiBrake. Our coach doesn't have a retarder, just a Jake brake.As Roger said, the more work you can do yourself the less money you will spend. Of course, if you end up spending it at the doctor's office or in the hospital you haven't really saved anything. Like Roger, the things that I do myself vs the things I pay someone else to do is changing. Quote Selected 2 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #27 – July 29, 2021, 08:11:01 pm I'm totally pleased with my AirForce One. Used on two cars, my Acura MDX and Jeep Grand Cherokee. Over 70,000 miles. Quote Selected 2 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #28 – July 29, 2021, 10:17:40 pm Ditto on the AirForceOne Quote Selected 1 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #29 – July 30, 2021, 01:02:02 am AF One, blue ox baseplate, blue ox 10K steel tow bar, diode based ttow lights.2021 Jeep Grand Cherokee Quote Selected 1 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #30 – July 30, 2021, 07:47:44 am AF1, Demco towbar/baseplate and factory flat-tow harness on our 2020 Wrangler. Quote Selected 1 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #31 – July 30, 2021, 07:53:28 am We use the M&G braking system and have no issues, the coach was piped for it when we got it...Keith Quote Selected 2 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #32 – August 01, 2021, 01:29:38 pm Yes, Ready Brake works with the retarder. There is a LED for the dash that comes on when the surge pressure actuates the towed brakes. The cable between the towbar and the car's connection needs to be adjusted carefully. Too loose or too tight is critical though not difficut to do. Jim2002 U320 Quote Selected 1 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #33 – August 01, 2021, 03:49:49 pm I would like to throw my 02.$ in on NOT using a base plate that would bolt the tow bar directly to the ARB bumper with a alternate method, I had that setup fail between Tok, Alaska and Anchorage, the road was in bad shape from frost heaves and had some serious dips and definitely contributed to the failure, but I was sure surprised to see my Jeep Liberty in the passenger mirror when I was trying to pull off in a pullout and felt it hit the back of the coach! the 2.5"X 5" back plate pulled thru the bumper leaving a hole in the ARB bumper both the side's of the bumper had cracked welds all over the place, all the tow bar pieces came from Blue OX and where not homemade they held up great, the bumper is was what failed, Just make sure the bumper is strong enough, ARB bumpers are good products and I was sure surprised it failed like it did. I was surprised once I returned home and repaired the bumper that the Blue OX baseplate bolted up with the ARB bumper installed, you just have to install the base plate first then the bumper at least on a 06 Jeep Liberty. Safe Travels. Mike Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #34 – August 01, 2021, 04:22:36 pm Quote from: zmpm01 – August 01, 2021, 03:49:49 pmI would like to throw my 02.$ in on NOT using a base plate that would bolt the tow bar directly to the ARB bumper with a alternate method, I had that setup fail between Tok, Alaska and Anchorage, the road was in bad shape from frost heaves and had some serious dips and definitely contributed to the failure, but I was sure surprised to see my Jeep Liberty in the passenger mirror when I was trying to pull off in a pullout and felt it hit the back of the coach! the 2.5"X 5" back plate pulled thru the bumper leaving a hole in the ARB bumper both the side's of the bumper had cracked welds all over the place, all the tow bar pieces came from Blue OX and where not homemade they held up great, the bumper is was what failed, Just make sure the bumper is strong enough, ARB bumpers are good products and I was sure surprised it failed like it did. I was surprised once I returned home and repaired the bumper that the Blue OX baseplate bolted up with the ARB bumper installed, you just have to install the base plate first then the bumper at least on a 06 Jeep Liberty. Safe Travels. MikeWow, that is amazing. ARBs are pretty stout. Not as strong as some but definitely good. There are some eyelets on there that it looks like I can get reinforced and some thick heavy duty ones fab'd up. At least that is my current thought but still mulling over this. I could also go with a beefier bumper but that requires swapping it out. Decisions.... Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #35 – August 01, 2021, 07:08:55 pm On my new to me 2018 Realm I cannot locate the air port at the rear of the coach. I thought Spartan put an air port on the front and back of the chassis for several years (at least on the K3 chassis built for Newmar). I am looking to install Air Force One on my toad but do not want to tap into air lines on the coach. It seems a rear air port would make installing the AF1 easier. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #36 – August 01, 2021, 07:45:21 pm Spartan did make a ping tank optional (Safe Haul). It came out in 2018. First I see it mentioned for a Realm is 2019.Basically, it's an AF1-type ping tank and connection at the rear. No different than the coach side of an AF1.Air connection at the front would be spec'd separately by the coach builder. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #37 – August 03, 2021, 10:33:32 am We agree that a simple tow brake system is good and prefer RVi - Flat Towing Product for Your RV Adventures Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #38 – August 03, 2021, 07:49:20 pm We have used the RV-i system for years until recently. Now we have the M&G, since we have settled on a towed vehicle. We like both systems, but the RV-i has the advantage of ease of transfer between towed vehicles; whereas the M&G is a more permanent installation. If anyone is interested in purchasing our RV-i system, please send us a PM (private message).We can discuss in detail. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #39 – August 08, 2021, 10:17:35 pm For those with the invisibrake, does it come on when the retarder is used? I've read conflicting evidence regarding therapeutic lights and it. Some say they won't come on for the first 2 notches, others said it's always. Which is it? Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #40 – August 09, 2021, 12:52:08 am Quote from: movingman – August 08, 2021, 10:17:35 pmFor those with the invisibrake, does it come on when the retarder is used? I've read conflicting evidence regarding therapeutic lights and it. Some say they won't come on for the first 2 notches, others said it's always. Which is it?For an answer to this I would call Roadmaster at 1-800-669-9690 or email them at info@roadmasterinc.com Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #41 – August 09, 2021, 02:20:47 am What is InvisiBrake?InvisiBrake is a fully-automatic supplemental braking system that uses the electrical connections already in place on your towed vehicle (the towed vehicle's electrical harness) to brake when you brake the motorhome — the same electrical signal that activates the towed vehicle's brake lights also activates InvisiBrake.Copied from there websitehttps://www.roadmasterinc.com/products/braking/invisibrake/index.htmlSo if brake light are on its active. Your retarder activates the brake light normally, there is a work around to separate the two redundant brake pressure switches and use the second one to activate the controller and it will not see a brake signal back feed from the retarder. Diode. Both switches still operate brake lights and are still redundant, just the signal can't back feed your controller during retarder useScott Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #42 – August 09, 2021, 10:09:33 am We use a Brake Buddy. We have had it for about 25 years, through four motorhomes and five towds. It has been repaired a few times, and the cost and time has always been reasonable. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #43 – August 09, 2021, 08:52:10 pm One thing about the InvisiBrake is it will shut off after 15 seconds and reset for next use. If the Retarder activates your brake lights, it should activate your Towd Brakes (for 15 seconds) and then release.I have it installed in my Jeep and can say that I have never put much thought into it. There is an indicator light on the Coach dash that lights when the Towd brakes are activated.Next time out, I will have to check it out. I have had it now for two years and several thousand miles with no issues. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #44 – August 09, 2021, 10:27:56 pm Thanks. I am still looking into them, getting close though. I also like the brakemaster, being that it is hydraulic and come on with the brakes pushed. And could be transferred from car to car easily, at least the inside piece could. Any experience with that? I saw Jack has used it successfully. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #45 – August 10, 2021, 10:38:52 am Depends on the year of your coach and if it has air brakes. My 2006 turns on the brake lights when the retarder comes on. Older coaches do not do this. The GOVERMENT requirements changed about the time my coach was built. The Retarder is considered a brake so brake light has to come on. You probably DO NOT WANT your toad brakes to come on every time you take your foot off the gas! Good way to grind down your TOAD brakes. You have two choices. Reverse engineer the brake system. Generate a signal that is active only when the brake petal is pressed. Run A wire all the way to the rear of the coach to activate the Toad Brakes or put an Air over Hydraulic system on your Toad. That is what the Air Force 1 and some others do.If you do it right it is a toss up on which makes sense.Only downside or Air Force 1 is if you have a Pickup and want to tow the Jeep behind the motor home or the pickup Airforce 1 is probably not what you want.I have a 4x4 pickup and a Jeep. The Jeep is the toad behind the Motorhome. The pickup is used when going hunting without the Motorhome.I have a Demco brake system that uses the brake lights. It came with the Jeep I purchased. It was never fully installed the owner passed before he finished. If anyone is interested I would sell it. You would need some vacuum lines. Since it was a install in progress I do not have all the incidentals. I do have the major parts and instructions. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #46 – August 10, 2021, 11:20:52 am Sounds like you got a plethora of answers already so I'll just add what I have. That is the Air Force One system with a Roadmaster base plate and the 10,000 lb tow bar. I also put in some brake light kit that runs off of the coach instead of the towed battery. So far that system has been perfect. There's an a little LED light strip that goes on the mirror of the toad and you can see it in your rear view camera when you break that light coming on and braking the towed it works for me just fine. The only issue I have is with my tow bar and it's not the tow bars fault but the bike rack and Roadmaster defender cover that I use from the previous owner to prevent road debris from jumping up and hitting the Jeep. It doesn't allow the tow bar to be conveniently folded back and secured. I have a new bike rack delivered and I'll pick it up in a few weeks and hoping that will change my setup a bit. That set up adds a few extra feet to my rig.If you do a search on the Air Force One you'll find my install notes as well as pictures. Cutting into the air braking system of the coach to install the Air Force One was not difficult to do physically but was a little hard to do mentally. I overthought it, since I knew that if I messed things up it would be more work to fix than I cared to do. Also was new with the coach, still trying to figure things out, but I did it and if I could do it so could you.Either way a toad breaking system is necessary not only by law but by common Sense. Even though the coach has enough breaking power to stop my Jeep as well it's prudent to have a good system. And the nice thing about the Air Force One is once you make your connections to the Jeep that's all you have to do for that part anyway.Good luck in your decision.Bob Quote Selected 2 Likes
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #47 – August 10, 2021, 07:45:43 pm Why not consider a simple RViBrake type of system. There are plenty of things to do for starting every trip and adding another may be a better choice than permanently installing a complex system that may over time need servicing & repairs.Always a good idea to run a wire in the tow cable to keep tow vehicle under charge.And preventing tow brake to always operate with retarder is probably easy to accomplish, as many have done.The major reason to have a tow braking system is to be regulation compliant to avoid considered a contributor to not your fault accident. They also help panic stop a motorhome. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #48 – August 10, 2021, 07:53:02 pm We also use RVI Brake. It's easy to use and easy to store when not being used.Our toad is a 2003 CRV. Quote Selected
Re: What towd braking sytsem would you go with? Reply #49 – August 18, 2021, 04:10:44 pm I have narrowed it down. I have spoken to eTrailer, Blue Ox and Roadmaster. I'd like to run this by you to see if I am missing anything, just thinking out loud. Also, links are to eTrailer but that does not mean that I will get them from there. Baseplate- Not a traditional baseplate, but some D ring adapters. This is what is going to determine which towbar I get. Since I am going to hook up to an aftermarket bumper on my toad, there are 2 options. Quite a price difference between the two, but the Blue Ox does look substantially beefier. I will have my fab shop add some D rings to my bumper so either will fit 1- Roadmaster- https://www.etrailer.com/Base-Plates/Roadmaster/RM-035-1.html 2- Blue Ox - https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories-and-Parts/Blue-Ox/BX88358.htmlTowbar-Will go with either of these, 10K each: 1- Roadmaster Blackhawk All terrain 2 https://www.etrailer.com/Tow-Bar/Roadmaster/RM-422.html Safety chains are not included, I would have to purchase those separately 2- Blue Ox https://www.etrailer.com/Tow-Bar/Blue-Ox/BX7420.html Safety chains includedThat is the simple stuff. BrakingFor braking, I am going to go with the Roadmaster Brakemaster https://www.etrailer.com/Tow-Bar-Braking-Systems/Roadmaster/RM-9160.html Since I will use 2-3 vehicles, having something that can move easily is important. This is powered by our coach's air brakes, so the retarder will not come on like an electric system. Additionally, it has a brake away should something really bad happen Roadmaster suggest getting their Combo Kit https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories-and-Parts/Roadmaster/RM-9243-3.html This has the air hose and some electric connections including diodes amongst other things. However, I have decided I want to use external lights, the magnetic type that use the flat-4. They'll fit great on my rear aftermarket bumper. Brake lights come on my toad without the key, turn signals and running lights do not. The external lights are easy to move not to mention I do not want to splice into my vehicle's harness. I do not think I need this kit. I do need the air hose though https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories-and-Parts/Roadmaster/RM-146-7.html I would get a 6 way to 4 flat adapter to power the lights. Roadmaster also said I would need https://www.etrailer.com/Tow-Bar-Braking-Systems/Roadmaster/RM-88400.html which is to alert the led light that came from the Brakemaster that I applied brakes. But since I am using the 4 flat, I don't think I need this?Does this sound correct? Is there anything I am missing for flat towing? Quote Selected
Topic: What towd braking sytsem would you go with?