Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

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Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #50 – September 12, 2022, 03:06:00 pm

Did you do a really good job cleaning the radiator? It takes a good cleaner to emulsify the dirt and oil that rear radiator, rear engine coaches get in the radiator fins.

Dealerships don't always do the work they charge you for. I remember Bill Chaplin marked some parts before taking his coach to the shot. Some of the parts were not touched but were charged for.

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #51 – September 12, 2022, 05:24:13 pm

A clogged air filter would certainly cause low HP.

Consider it good Preventive Maintenance.

STRONGLY suggest you review what exactly the dealer replaced/serviced. Post it line for line and we can give you what else needs t3o be done.

CERTAINLY, with the TORSILASTIC SUSPENSION, you need to check RIDE HEIGHT. It is adjustable (raised by removing the 1/4" thick shims). This can be critical for suspension and driveline wear.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #52 – September 12, 2022, 06:45:00 pm

Good explanation for clogged air cleaner causing high EGT. Lower power as less air but much higher cylinder temps. Clogged air filter = high pyro temps? | The Diesel Stop

Quote: "OVERHEATING
In severe cases, a dirty engine air filter can cause or contribute to overheating. Like poor mileage, overheating is attributed to a rich-running engine. If your vehicle's engine air filter is clogged or otherwise dirty, less oxygen will enter the combustion chamber. As all the fuel burns in the combustion chamber, it can raise engine temperatures, potentially causing your vehicle's engine to overheat."

If you have a marginal cooling system, driving up to higher altitudes with a restricted air cleaner and especially a mechanical engine will cause higher EGTs. The radiator, radiator fan are already less efficient and there is less oxygen in the combustion chamber with more fuel so the temperature of combustion goes up. The restricted air cleaner will lessen the amount of oxygen but the injectors will still overfuel.

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #53 – September 13, 2022, 07:52:16 am

Wowwwww, thanks for all that info Pierce, extremely helpful to this old dumb ex cowboy, now shade tree mechanic. After reading your article, I can see that my clogged air filter just might be my problem with over heating. I am still gonna change out my thermostat, and I power washed the radiator as well. That's why I love this forum, cause there is a world of knowledge hiding in all the heads of the people. This is better than paying to attend a college class any old day.

Pluss the guys on here are super helpful like Wolfe10.

Thanks again Pierce.

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #54 – September 13, 2022, 11:09:13 am

Be careful power washing the radiator. I like to use a liquid cleaner on it from a spray bottle and then gently hose it off. That us usually enough but if you have quite a bit of oil and dirt in it, it may take a couple of cycles.

Thermostats and a products of combustion test is also a good idea. A light headgasket leak can be cured chemically with one of many additive available at the parts store.

My Porsche turbo has 6 cylinders but has a 7th injector so when to boost comes up, a sensor turns on a steady spray out that injector to cool the combustion. Then, I get a bit of black smoke out the exhaust. In a diesel, it would do just the opposite as far as temperature goes. A gasoline engine needs about a 14 to 1 air to fuel ratio, whether at idle or wide open throttle. A little leaner than that is good for emissions but the temperature in the combustion chamber goes up. That's why a diesel race car like the Le Mans winning Audis has such an advantage. Under a yellow flag, they can cruise around the track at lower speeds and a higher air to fuel ratio saving lots of fuel.

In a gasoline fueled aircraft, when you are at cruising altitude, you usually peak the EGT with the mixture control and then lean the mixture just above the point where the engine starts to run rough. Some may peak the EGT and then go rich until the EGT drops. Depending on a Lycoming or Continental engine, you only have a recommended 6 or 8 seconds at peak to find the EGT you are looking for. I have 10 to 1 pistons so most of the rebuilders don't recommend going to rich of peak EGT.

So, unless you have a leaking head gasket, installing a clean air cleaner may reduce the temperature in the cylinders a little and drop the temperature slightly. If the head gasket is leaking or thermostat is failing, it will continue to run hot.

An engineer on our fire dept drained the coolant from our Crown (brand) squad but forgot to refill it. Naturally, it overheated and the head gasket leaked when filled with coolant. We used a chemical head gasket additive and that totally fixed it without any further problem.

A further possibility: Quote: Blockage from the air coming out of your engine can cause overheating in the cylinders. The first thing you should do is a thorough visual inspection of the exhaust system. This should include the visible and internal elements of the exhaust piping. If you find no blockage in the exhaust piping, the next place to check for restriction is in the muffler. Ensure that you check the airflow exhaust pressure coming from the engine. If the airflow is less than the minimum amount allowed by the OEM, it means there's a blockage higher in the exhaust system."

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #55 – September 13, 2022, 11:11:06 am

Did the REv verify the OE shroud is in place?

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #56 – September 13, 2022, 11:26:48 am

Just for nuthin', but have you weighed your coach when you are fully loaded? We began our Foretravel with very good friends of ours and had identical coaches. 1993 U225 36' with Cummins engines. We never had problems with overheating, and he regularly did. He added a second radiator, a thingy that sprayed water on the radiator to help cool things, and STILL had problems in high temps. He was also a fix-it guy who had every tool you can think of and a back-up. I suggested that he weigh his coach, but he didn't want to because that might mean he had to leave some stuff at home! At some point he was forced to take his coach for some repair and left a great many things behind to avoid having them "appropriated" by mechanics he did not know. Whaddya think??? No overheating! Just my 2 cents.

He still won't weigh his coach.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #57 – September 13, 2022, 12:12:05 pm

Carol,

Good seeing you put in your two bits worth! With a marginal cooling system, weight may be a factor with just thermostat temp in gentle terrain and 3 seasons but getting hot in summer. Ours is great until the outside temp goes up followed by the engine temp when the coach sees a hill. In summer, I have to drive here in the mountains with almost empty tanks to try to keep the temp below 200°. We are not full time so travel lightly loaded. Hate to think what it would be like otherwise.

The twin fans on ours eat up close to 60hp at high fan speed and climbing a grade always means high fan speed. Imagine how much additional heat the engine makes supplying the horsepower to the fan system. In essence, the hydraulic fan system cools the engine while heating the engine at the same time. What an incredibly stupid idea.

For those used to cars, a diesel does not have a throttle plate so air from the outside is unobstructed from the air intake to the intake valves or ports. No vacuum created here so cars with power brakes have a vacuum pump fitted to the engine. The foot throttle just moves the lever on the injection pump or unit injectors. With an electronic engine, the ECU controls the amount of fuel the injectors spray and how long they spray it.

If you do have marginal cooling, it will only get worse the greater the altitude you are driving at.

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #58 – September 14, 2022, 09:10:12 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – September 13, 2022, 11:11:06 am

Did the REv verify the OE shroud is in place?

Yes it is, and we'll sealed.

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #59 – September 16, 2022, 01:28:32 pm

Hey Pierçe, what kind of àdditive àre you talking about for a head gasket leak?? Jus wonderin

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #60 – September 16, 2022, 03:34:29 pm

Quote from: RevRick – September 16, 2022, 01:28:32 pm

Hey Pierçe, what kind of àdditive àre you talking about for a head gasket leak?? Jus wonderin
Rick

Go to this Amazon page and make sure to read all the reviews. Your local parts store may have the same stuff. RV cooling systems hold a lot more so need more additive.

Amazon.com : head gasket sealer

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #61 – September 16, 2022, 03:49:57 pm

Quote from: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart – September 16, 2022, 03:34:29 pm

Go to this Amazon page and make sure to read all the reviews. Your local parts store may have the same stuff. RV cooling systems hold a lot more so need more additive.

Amazon.com : head gasket sealer

Pierce

But, do not add a head gasket sealer unless you have verified that you do have a head gasket leak and that it is minor enough that the sealer is likely to fix it.

Said another way, you really need to diagnose the root cause(s) of your overheating and fix them.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #62 – September 16, 2022, 03:58:04 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – September 16, 2022, 03:49:57 pm

But, do not add a head gasket sealer unless you have verified that you do have a head gasket leak and that it is minor enough that the sealer is likely to fix it.

Said another way, you really need to diagnose the root cause(s) of your overheating and fix them.

Agree, many times a sealer has blocked heater cores and a percentage of the radiator.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #63 – September 16, 2022, 05:34:20 pm

Yes, you have to check for products of combustion in the coolant before thinking adding anything as stated in my first reply. But, that's easy to do. Most additives I've seen won't clog the radiator or heater core and designed for headgaskets not radiator leaks. They contain no solids of particulate matter. Watch the reviews on YouTube for all the sealers available.

Testing the coolant for products of combustion and getting a positive result does identify the root cause of overheating..

Also, check your oil dipstick for signs of coolant in the oil. The oil will usually have a gray color to it.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=head+gasket+sealer

Pierce

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #64 – September 17, 2022, 05:14:44 am

Well lo and behold my BIG air filter arrived today, so will put that in today or Sunday afternoon. Would like to make a 150 mile run up to the VA in Prescott Tuesday. Thermostat on back order, should get it next week for sure.

When I check the oil I will look carefully to see if has any water in it. There sure are a lot of diff kinds of head gasket sealer. I will read the reviews, but I would trust any info from someone on this forum a lot better than any reviews on Amazon.

Y'all have a safe and blessed weekend

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #65 – September 17, 2022, 10:57:28 am

You can also check for combustion pressure/ leak into coolant, by topping the coolant with the cap off to the rim and watch for bubbles. Bubbles bad .

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #66 – September 18, 2022, 04:38:15 am

Quote from: wolfe10 – September 12, 2022, 05:24:13 pm

A clogged air filter would certainly cause low HP.

Consider it good Preventive Maintenance.

STRONGLY suggest you review what exactly the dealer replaced/serviced. Post it line for line and we can give you what else needs t3o be done.

CERTAINLY, with the TORSILASTIC SUSPENSION, you need to check RIDE HEIGHT. It is adjustable (raised by removing the 1/4" thick shims). This can be critical for suspension and driveline wear.

You know Brett I would love for the coach to ride higher, is there a way for me to adjust it?

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #67 – September 18, 2022, 04:40:20 am

Quote from: Protech Racing – September 17, 2022, 10:57:28 am

You can also check for combustion pressure/ leak into coolant, by topping the coolant with the cap off to the rim and watch for bubbles. Bubbles bad .

That's a good idea Mike, thanks for the suggestion.

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #68 – September 18, 2022, 08:12:29 am

Quote from: RevRick – September 18, 2022, 04:38:15 am

You know Brett I would love for the coach to ride higher, is there a way for me to adjust it?

Of course (if you have ride height shims left).

Park on level pavement, jacks up/stowed.

There is a horizontal area behind each wheel position that forms the top of the wheel well. Measure from there to the ground. Record the readings at each wheel position. It will be the only area that measures somewhere between 30 and 33". Tell us.

Then at the front and back of each wheel positions are the long bolts that hold the torsilastic shackles. Count the number of those 1/4" thick shims at each wheel position (should be the same number in front of and behind each wheel position). Tell us.

Then we can go from there.

I have done the adjustment many, many times with hand tools only.

But, please post your results in A NEW TOPIC so we can keep it separate from this overheating discussion.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #69 – September 19, 2022, 06:43:11 am

Ok, installed the new air filter, checked the oil. Oil looks really good and clean, radiator is up into the neck with clean and a green cooler. There is a surge bottle and it is empty, will fill it with antifreeze :tomorrow and take for a ride into Quartzite to check the temperature!

This item is mounted to the side of radiator, does anyone know what it?

Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #70 – September 19, 2022, 07:30:56 am

Quote from: RevRick – September 19, 2022, 06:43:11 am

This item is mounted to the side of radiator, does anyone know what it?

Rick,

Your pic. didn't load so try again as there are several things that it could be on a 240.

Mike

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #71 – September 19, 2022, 03:00:07 pm

Here it is, finally loaded

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #72 – September 19, 2022, 03:08:56 pm

Hydraulic reservoir.

Should have a sticker on it saying what fluid. Likely (please verify) Delo 400 15-40.

Again, strongly suggest you have someone knowledgeable go through your coach with you. Could save some very expensive repairs.

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #73 – September 20, 2022, 04:03:32 am

"Again, strongly suggest you have someone knowledgeable go through your coach with you. Could save some very expensive repairs.
More...1 Likes"

Thanks once again Brett, I'm not sure what the hydraulic fluid is for.

I live where it is 130 miles to Yuma, 142 miles to PHX, and 114 to Lake Havasu, so I have no one to walk through my coach with me. I apologize for so many questions. I'm just gonna park this coach down by the horse stalls, and then This Winter I will go down to the Foretravel incampment South of Quartzsite and find out more.

Thanks Brett and everyone else that were so thoughtful to help this OLD DUMB Cowboy, I really appreciate your suggestions and input.

God Bless Y'all
Rick

Re: Overheating 1992 U240 with Cat 3208

Reply #74 – September 20, 2022, 07:32:40 am

The hydraulic reservoir is likely for your power steering.

Someone with first hand experience with the Caterpillar 3208 could direct you to the pump and you could follow the line from reservoir to pump then forward from the pump.

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