Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Topic: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues (Read 2089 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #25 – June 04, 2014, 12:09:25 am

Quote from: wa_desert_rat – June 02, 2014, 04:48:17 pm

1. Panels are made up of invidividual "cells". As far as I can tell, it's pretty much a commodity market. Some panels claim better efficiency; some claim better angle of incidence, and some claim longer life. The shortest length of life I've found is still well beyond where I'll be still driving...

2. If all your inverter does is power a residential refrigerator there is little point in having a "pass through" to put it on shore power. For ac to pass through an inverter, the inverter has to be at the beginning of the circuit (or run lots of wiring to and fro) which is usually not close to the batteries. Close to the batteries is where you generall want the inverter. But if the inverter powers the whole coach then you need a pass-through of shore power. But being close to the batteries is improtant. A microwave that draws 10-Amps on AC will be sucking over 100-Amps out of a battery bank so the cables need to be big.

3. Inverters that pass through AC don't have bare wires but will accept bare wires (like a circuit breaker accepts bare wires).

Craig

FTX ORED has the batteries under the floor inside the door. About 3 1/2 feet from the fridge. Also have room under the fridge for the inverter. Behind the central vacuum.Want bare end output so I can feed into a pair of contactors or a 4 channel relay to switch from battery to shore power automatically. If I use the existing 110 outlet behind the fridge It wont matter if I'm shore power, genset or batteries. I like seamless transition, bulletproof reliability, redundancy, world class performance and fire sale pricing.
But a pass through inverter would work too...
Did not know they made such a critter. Thanks!
If you could only put the solar panels in once, & panel failure wasn't acceptable, what panels would you use?
I have very limited knowledge of solar systems, still on my learning curve.
In fact, the last time I went boondocking I wore camouflage, ate my meals from a plastic envelope & exited the aircraft at 1200 feet.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #26 – June 04, 2014, 02:58:04 am

Fred,

Couple of points.

The inverter needs to be located as near the house battery bank as you can get it, but NOT in the battery compartment itself. Wire size for the 12 VDC wires is massively larger than that required for 120 VAC.

Then run the 120 VAC output to the refrigerator.

Two ways to work the 120 VAC switching.

Some inverters have a "pass through" feature-- basically a built in ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch). When they see 120 VAC from an external source (shore power or generator) they merely "pass through" that 120 VAC. When the external source goes off, the inverter automatically starts functioning.

Or, you can use a separate ATS with external 120 VAC (from your coach main 120 VAC breaker box) being primary.

Most refrigerators prefer a true sine wave, though some will tolerate a MSW.

Brett

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #27 – June 04, 2014, 07:21:03 am

There is a 110v outlet behind the dometic in our coach that supplys 110 to it when plugged in. If you plug in a residential refrig there ... won't it run on 110v when it is available via land line or the generator or 110v from the inverter when only battery power is available?

Am I missing something here?

Roger

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #28 – June 04, 2014, 07:32:15 am

I have two 120v outlets there. One for shore power and one for inverter power.

Power to the Inverter! Â Ooooopps... Spent too much time in Berkeley back in the 70s

Which reminds me of the time I passed our lovely neighbor as I walked home for lunch in Auburn, AL --- Â War Eagle!

She said, "White man. You gonna fry yo brain walkin' in the hot sun with no hat on"

And I didn't have the presense of mind to reply, "Too late, I spent 4 years in Berkeley, that did the job already"

best, paul

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #29 – June 04, 2014, 07:53:04 am

on mine there are two 110V plugs behind refrig. Â One is shore power only (was used to run dedicated compressor in refrigerator for ice maker - only made ice when on genny or shore power) and a second which is hot on shore power or investor. Â Put in ref rig and it promptly quit when I took it off shore power.

%@$%###!!!!!!

Oh..........

And that is how I know..... :-)

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #30 – July 05, 2014, 06:47:06 pm

Residential fridge is a no brainer. 10 cu. ft. Whirlpool from Lowes (around $350) fit right into the compartment the Dometic was in with just a little trim work. Wired the outlet into the inverter and works on battery or shore power.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #31 – July 05, 2014, 06:55:53 pm

Snip: " Whirlpool from Lowes"

Can you elaborate, such as Whirlpool's model-number?

Thanks!

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 10051 (20140705) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #32 – July 05, 2014, 07:36:30 pm

I put in the samsung rf197. The best upgrade yet. Two plugs back there. One powered by the inverter one not. I did not put a second inverter in but pulled the stove and use an induction burner and pulled the propane tank.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #33 – July 05, 2014, 07:42:32 pm

Quote from: George Kuhn – July 05, 2014, 06:47:06 pm

Residential fridge is a no brainer.

Yes, but only if our Foretravel opening dimensions are all the same. How about the W, H and D on your model? Was your reefer compartment floor flat or did it have a step in it?

Brett has a good point. Laser printers and microwaves (to run at full power) need a true sine wave and while some may tolerate a MSW, there is a possibility of shortened life.

Pierce

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #34 – July 05, 2014, 08:47:57 pm

Quote from: George Kuhn – July 05, 2014, 06:47:06 pm

Residential fridge is a no brainer.....Wired the outlet into the inverter and works on battery or shore power.

George,

How did you do the wiring and the inverter set up can you post some details please. I just finished installing the new residential fridge and it turned out great. Now i need to decide on a pure sine inverter. I need to remove the original AC fridge outlet end from the AC breaker box and connect it to new inverter but the part that i have not figured out is how it will switch between shore power and DC .... a pass through inverter?

The fridge i installed barely utilize 190w

Thank you,
AL

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #35 – July 05, 2014, 10:47:23 pm

For the part on powering the fridge go to Beamalarm and look for "Adding a new inverter". I did this and a Double pole/double throw (DPDT) switch. Works like a charm. Just follow the steps as it say's and you will have it done.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #36 – July 06, 2014, 07:54:32 am

Ours is a Whirlpool WTR111SFAF from Lowes. We picked it because it would fit through the door. So far it seems to be working just fine. The Dometic that came from the factory died, so we went residential. I replaced the inverter at that time, too. Refrigerator and microwave are on the same outlet, and the inverter doesn't seem to like it if both are running, but it is easy enough to pull the plug on the refrigerator whenever we need the microwave.

The new refrigerator takes up less space than the old one, but is slightly taller. I took out the floor under the Dometic, removed the vacuum cleaner, and mounted the Whirlpool on the floor. We will eventually get a couple of cabinets above and beside the Whirlpool. Still working on the design.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #37 – July 06, 2014, 10:30:38 am

Quote from: John Haygarth – July 05, 2014, 10:47:23 pm

For the part on powering the fridge go to Beamalarm and look for "Adding a new inverter". I did this and a Double pole/double throw (DPDT) switch. Works like a charm. Just follow the steps as it say's and you will have it done.
JohnH

John,
I recall reading his (Adding an "Additional" Inverter) write up sometime ago. I will take a look at one more time. Last year i upgraded the "Converter" I need to figure out and add an inverter.
AL

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #38 – July 06, 2014, 11:09:14 am

This article is in the "Modification ideas" section. I used a 1000w pure sine one.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #39 – July 06, 2014, 03:27:14 pm

All this talk about second inverters makes me happy with the path my upgrade is taking.

The insurance is mostly paying for a custom Sea Freeze 14 cu. ft model running with separate 12 volt compressors for the top freezer and bottom refrigerator. Four inches of insulation should make for good efficiency. No icemaker to leak.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #40 – July 06, 2014, 03:56:05 pm

Actually Tom, that is all it is really "all talk" as actually doing it is simple!! I guess if someone else is paying for most of cost with the expensive unit you are putting in then maybe a good way to go, but we are very happy about the el cheepo unit/system we have as the main thing is "it works really well for very little outlay"
Our needs in a Refridgerator are simple " keep some food cool for a few days" then it is back to the store for more!!
This is one change in our coach that took me about 5 mins to think about after the old Dometic started acting up. Most other Mods' take a bit longer.
Like Dave M say's "whatever makes one cumfy"
Be interesting to see pictures you take while change is happening.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #41 – July 06, 2014, 04:58:33 pm

Tom,
I think the others all have older inverter setups which might not be able to support an electric refrigerator. For the newer FTs, all you would have to do is move the existing refrigerator circuit in the main electrical panel over to the inverter sub panel, which is fairly easy to do.

Even with the Dometic unit on inverter power in my FT, I have no problem running other large loads such as the microwave at the same time as the fridge.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #42 – July 06, 2014, 08:22:18 pm

Yes, behind my refrigerator are two electric outlets, one for shore power only, and one through the inverter for the icemaker. Why I prefer not using the big inverter is the 10A at 12v it uses with everything off or in standby.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #43 – July 06, 2014, 08:28:40 pm

Ours is a 2000 so no problem with the Xantrex 2500 to power it, I did the addition to SAVE power as this one is dedicated to fridge and front end and uses way less power (12v) to supply 120v to convert it. I can also switch it back to shore or 2500 if I want to by way of DPDT switch. When boondocking or just wanting to save batteries I switch it to that inverter and can run for days while solar charges. I use the microwave at same time and that comes thru the larger one. No power problems in our coach and we use all conveniences whenever we need to. We do not have to run Genset at all.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #44 – July 06, 2014, 08:38:30 pm

Quote from: Tom Lang – July 06, 2014, 08:22:18 pm

Yes, behind my refrigerator are two electric outlets, one for shore power only, and one through the inverter for the icemaker. Why I prefer not using the big inverter is the 10A at 12v it uses with everything off or in standby.

Wow,I can't believe that the inverter draws 120 watts in standby. Which inverter is this? My newer Xantrex SW2012 draws less than 30 watts(<3 amps DC) while on with no load.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #45 – July 06, 2014, 08:56:07 pm

120 watts sure a lot of heat too

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #46 – July 06, 2014, 09:15:09 pm

I doubt if the inverter alone is using 120 watts. When I get the coach back, I want to do some testing. I know the bedside Bose is using power, along with the microwave on stby, the front Bose, the old Trinitron TV on stby, the satellite receiver, the VCR, and who. Knows what else. I expect my numbers to drop when I put in a modern TV.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #47 – July 06, 2014, 10:41:25 pm

Add a couple of receptacles up front to that circuit, which it does our ours plus all the other goodies you mention.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #48 – July 07, 2014, 12:17:20 am

When I put in our residential fridge, I added another dual receptacle (split) in the fridge compartment so I can move the fridge plug between dedicated inverter (1000W pure sine), house inverter (pure sine), or straight house power (generator or shore power.) Figured that way I'd have an option for every contingency.

As it turns out, we leave the fridge connected to the dedicated inverter most of the time, since the main inverter/charger is always on when we're on shore power or generator, but the options are there just to make me feel better.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #49 – July 07, 2014, 09:10:24 am

Wyatt would have it !

I bet he would share the vampire drains with the group

Affiliate Notice