Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

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Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

May 30, 2014, 08:47:02 am

Many of you who have installed residential refrigerators or other alternative solutions have had lots of praise for them. I am considering it. It looks very appealing.

Installation is not quite like swapping a refrigerator in your house. I am interested in reports about durability of different brands in use in RVs. Do they hold up well to the mobile environment? Have you had any other problems with them?

If you remove the LP tank and add more batteries do you need a bigger inverter or a second inverter?

Residential refrigerators are might lighter duty than those years ago, also much more energy efficient. Most only have a one year warranty and have an expected life of ten years or less.

I look forward to your feedback.

Roger

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #1 – May 30, 2014, 08:53:48 am

Modern residential high end refrigerators use low voltage DC brushless variable speed motors to boost efficiency. These last forever. The downside is that the cooling fins are very very thin also to improve efficiency. How these hold up in the earthquake environment only time will tell.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #2 – May 30, 2014, 09:09:06 am

When I had MOT replace my Norcold, they recommended replacing it with another Norcold. Their reason was not enough batteries. And since the old one lasted 15 years, I went with another Norcold. And maybe MOT did not want to do the work required to convert to residential refrigerator? If I had to do it again. I would call FT and get their advice. John

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #3 – May 30, 2014, 09:12:07 am

I put the cheapest one I could find (Frigidaire, $300) in when my rv one died 3 or 4 years ago. I only put 3,000 miles on the coach a year, but the fridge runs 24/7. No problems,

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #4 – May 30, 2014, 09:33:14 am

If it's any consolation, most products are designed and tested to survive the some of the worst transportation vibration that will occur when being transported from the factory to the store to the end user. Imagine the worst riding semi-truck trailer traveling on some of the worse roads, being moved by the worst forklift driver and being moved up/down stairs by a gorilla delivery man. Granted the refrigerator is not running, might (but I doubt it) have support brackets installed just for transportation, and it's for a limited time, but our coaches ride so much better it's hard to compare the two.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #5 – May 30, 2014, 09:37:10 am

I did pull my propane and add a fourth battery. No need to change the inverter out. I could go about 8 hours before the battery addition now I can go over 10. It have two Cpaps the run and a couple iPads and phones plugged in and the fan running or the diesel on the Aquahot. I have to turn the generator on now in the morning after running the tv all night or the DVR recording at least. Time will tell how long they last but once you have it set up it is much cheaper to put a new one in then the first install.

The new cooling units are just not lasting as long so this will be a recurring issue for them too. I always make coffee in the morning and want to charge up the batteries so I run the generator. I think if you had enough solar you could get by not running it. But I went that way on my 99 and decided it was simpler and easier to run the generator. In the summer the genset is on around the clock for AC. Looking at a new inverter and batteries and alternator set up for that issue but will cross that bridge later when I need to replace the alternator.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #6 – May 30, 2014, 09:38:19 am

Quote from: John/Pat – May 30, 2014, 09:09:06 am

When I had MOT replace my Norcold, they recommended replacing it with another Norcold. Their reason was not enough batteries. And since the old one lasted 15 years, I went with another Norcold. And maybe MOT did not want to do the work required to convert to residential refrigerator? If I had to do it again. I would call FT and get their advice. John

John, I had room on my 99 34 foot 270 to rebuild the battery compartment and put in four 8ds.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #7 – May 30, 2014, 12:55:56 pm

Hi John would you have pictures of the battery addition on your 34'? John

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #8 – May 30, 2014, 07:28:35 pm

Alas, I sold it in 2005.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #9 – May 31, 2014, 04:49:16 pm

I'll be following this thread as I'm strongly considering a residential fridge myself. We installed a new Dometic "top of the line" 4 door fridge 2 years ago and it's been nothing but problems since day one. One day it works, the next no dice. The only thing stopping me from replacing it with a residential unit is the fact that I have $4k tied up in this Dometic fridge!
The fact that absorption type refrigerators have caused many a fire is a major factor to consider too.

Oh Yeah...I know that many of you that have gone to residential units have used the existing vents to ventilate the unit but I've read manufacturers literature that states that these units are not meant for locations with "extreme temperatures" such as a garage, etc. In other words, they are meant to be cooled by room temperature air. This seems to preclude the idea of venting with the outside vents. I'd like to hear thoughts on this subject.

Good luck with the fridge!

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #10 – June 01, 2014, 12:58:32 am

My Bosch counter depth side by side has been in the Foreravel for 3 years now, running 7days a week and 12 months a year.
I'm in Chicago so its down to -20 in the winter and +100 in the summer.
I do still have the outside wall air vent open behind the fridge.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #11 – June 01, 2014, 02:08:32 am

So do we behind our Cold Plate fridge. Roof vent, too.

best, paul

Quote

I do still have the outside wall air vent open behind the fridge.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #12 – June 01, 2014, 11:19:12 am

I have the rear vent still but the roof one has been covered over and a regular roof vent installed. I also have a removable Pink 1" panel I can adjust in the rear vent depending on temperatures outside.
I gather as we do not live in coach, the few months a year it is running may not cause concern with heat build up, although when in Mexico for 2 months we had no problems and sun was baking down on that side every day.
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #13 – June 01, 2014, 01:01:31 pm

Quote from: Caflashbob – May 31, 2014, 07:24:22 pm

What issues have you had with the dometic?

I'm not sure where to begin except to say the temperature fluctuates wildly and that it's generally unreliable. The entire cooling unit was replaced under warranty after 1 year but doing so failed to fix anything. Dometic says it's an "installation issue" but the entire fridge has been removed and re-installed 3 different times, each time being careful to make sure all installation parameters were met or exceeded. (clearances, insulation, venting, etc) These installs were done by 2 different trusted shops and once (most recently) by myself. I added 2 12v milspec cooling fans just below the roof vent, blowing out...this has helped more than anything else but we still have issues.

My guess is that Dometic minimized the insulation on this unit (Elite 2+2) in order to maximize the space. (capacity)

We are considering replacing it with a Haier apt. size fridge/freezer and having a separate small chest freezer in the basement to use during workamping assignments, which are often long and always have shore power available.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #14 – June 01, 2014, 02:00:53 pm

Quote from: chazb11 – June 01, 2014, 01:01:31 pm

I'm not sure where to begin except to say the temperature fluctuates wildly and that it's generally unreliable. The entire cooling unit was replaced under warranty after 1 year but doing so failed to fix anything. Dometic says it's an "installation issue" but the entire fridge has been removed and re-installed 3 different times, each time being careful to make sure all installation parameters were met or exceeded. (clearances, insulation, venting, etc) These installs were done by 2 different trusted shops and once (most recently) by myself. I added 2 12v milspec cooling fans just below the roof vent, blowing out...this has helped more than anything else but we still have issues.

My guess is that Dometic minimized the insulation on this unit (Elite 2+2) in order to maximize the space. (capacity)

We are considering replacing it with a Haier apt. size fridge/freezer and having a separate small chest freezer in the basement to use during workamping assignments, which are often long and always have shore power available.

You replaced what unit? Your new unit is a 1350 series?

Appears to be taller and wider and deeper than my 7832.

Shame to have issues. It appeared to be a nice refer.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #15 – June 01, 2014, 03:45:22 pm

Quote from: Caflashbob – June 01, 2014, 02:00:53 pm

You replaced what unit? Your new unit is a 1350 series?

Appears to be taller and wider and deeper than my 7832.

Shame to have issues. It appeared to be a nice refer.

Bob> The Dometic we are having so much trouble with is model 1350WIM. It is now 2 years old and has had the entire cooling unit replaced as well as the thermostat. It continues to be somewhat problematic although it has managed to work well these past 2 months. (Probably because I've been talking about replacing it

)

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #16 – June 01, 2014, 07:55:31 pm

Quote from: chazb11 – June 01, 2014, 03:45:22 pm

Bob> The Dometic we are having so much trouble with is model 1350WIM. It is now 2 years old and has had the entire cooling unit replaced as well as the thermostat. It continues to be somewhat problematic although it has managed to work well these past 2 months. (Probably because I've been talking about replacing it )

Without a quieter gen in a box that I do not have, the household refer is a much bigger changeout than I am interested in. So far. A just replaced all three house batteries with MK 8g8d's. A fourth would not be a an easy install in a close location to the other now aged batteries. To avoid running the noisier gen as much I would need 1,000 watts of solar IMO and a probably a newer inverter although my freedom 25 works fine.

I am a dry camper for the more scenic locations. Don't like any gen running.

Bob

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #17 – June 01, 2014, 08:06:02 pm

Bob, you can just install a smaller Inv under the bed area for the fridge if you whent with a residential. Not need solar just a dedicated inv' 800 watts Pure sine, as they use a lot less standby power when both running and not in use than the big one will. 3 8ds should keep you going fine till engine runs for charging
JohnH

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #18 – June 01, 2014, 08:49:51 pm

What about a small little honda 2000.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #19 – June 01, 2014, 09:20:17 pm

Am told by the audio bright bulbs, every time you change the noise 90 Degrees it is reduced 3 db. so with that you can build a very quiet box, problem it might require a trailer to haul it around.
With many years playing bus coach games, I have only once came across a extreme quiet diesel generator, only way you could detect its running was feel the exhaust. It took up 3/4 of one entire bay, yes nice stuff.
A side note, if your concerned by the noise of a muffled generator running, you are most likely not enjoying the Aqua Hot either, mine is quiet, but I can hear it about the same as the generator.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #20 – June 01, 2014, 10:49:32 pm

A small Honda 2000 watt generator is indeed quiet. I thought about that option but they only put out 8 amps into 12 volts. Using a good battery charger you might be able to get 10 or 12 amps into the batteries. And then you need to have a gasoline supply. You would have to run 10 hours a day or more to keep up with the refrigerator.

A 24 cu ft side by side Samsung refrig uses about 1600 watts per day (based on the energy usage estimates.) if you get one without the stuff in the door, less. If my math is right that is about 150 amp hrs each day, more than one might expect from solar.

How many amp-hrs does the Dometic use while on Gas? It must use some 120v and some 12v.

We like to boondock as well. Is seems pretty hard to do without at least a couple hrs on generator use each day.

What has been residential refrig users experience regarding power usage?

I figure if the big LP tank is out I will add at least two more 8D batteries.

Thanks for the feedback.

Roger

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #21 – June 02, 2014, 09:47:17 am

Quote from: Home2fromHastings – June 01, 2014, 10:49:32 pm

A small Honda 2000 watt generator is indeed quiet. I thought about that option but they only put out 8 amps into 12 volts.

Roger

Roger,

The 12 Volt battery charger function on it is indeed limited but seems like 13A continuous at 120 V ought to power a pretty good external battery charger. I've thought about it also as my lead acid batteries don't come near to utilizing the full output of the 10KW diesel geneset.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #22 – June 02, 2014, 10:15:34 am

I carry an external battery charger too. Why is simple, some times you need it. Jumped James stallings jeep once and you can use it in situations with low voltage. Plug it in and connect it to your batteries and it will charge them and no risk to the coach. I do it when I would stay at family with no plug. They do have 110 but not enough Amos but this works great. It will bulk charge and then float.

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #23 – June 02, 2014, 12:53:53 pm

I'm planning on switching to a residential fridge. But I also want to set up my power supply to automatically switch from battery to shore power. If I run my power feed through a couple of contactors I can take some runtime& heat load off the inverter. My questions are:
Is there an inverter on the market with bare end output wires for external connections?
How big an inverter is big enough a small fridge? (To lazy to do the math myself right now)
What brand of solar cells are the most reliable?

Re: Residential Refrigerators, Durability or Other Issues

Reply #24 – June 02, 2014, 04:48:17 pm

Quote from: fredlewers – June 02, 2014, 12:53:53 pm

I'm planning on switching to a residential fridge. But I also want to set up my power supply to automatically switch from battery to shore power. If I run my power feed through a couple of contactors I can take some runtime& heat load off the inverter. My questions are:
Is there an inverter on the market with bare end output wires for external connections?
How big an inverter is big enough a small fridge? (To lazy to do the math myself right now)
What brand of solar cells are the most reliable?

1. Panels are made up of invidividual "cells". As far as I can tell, it's pretty much a commodity market. Some panels claim better efficiency; some claim better angle of incidence, and some claim longer life. The shortest length of life I've found is still well beyond where I'll be still driving...

2. If all your inverter does is power a residential refrigerator there is little point in having a "pass through" to put it on shore power. For ac to pass through an inverter, the inverter has to be at the beginning of the circuit (or run lots of wiring to and fro) which is usually not close to the batteries. Close to the batteries is where you generall want the inverter. But if the inverter powers the whole coach then you need a pass-through of shore power. But being close to the batteries is improtant. A microwave that draws 10-Amps on AC will be sucking over 100-Amps out of a battery bank so the cables need to be big.

3. Inverters that pass through AC don't have bare wires but will accept bare wires (like a circuit breaker accepts bare wires).

Craig

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