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Topic: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach (Read 3652 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #75 –
Tim is on his 3rd coach which still might be his last... I'm on my second for at least a few more years. I will probably end up with a 2001 42' DGFE for my last one. Starr surprised me over the 2007 Nimbus 42 at MOT - she said "I would live in that". I'm worried about the crazed finish on the 07 models. Its always something. Pluses for me are the updated dash and extended AC outlets toward the front. Minus is I still love my 95...
The selected media item is not currently available. Dave Head & Megan Westbrook
Titusville, FL - The Great Outdoors
'98 270 buying this month
Toad is a 2018 F150 XLT

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #76 –
Well said Dave.

Since my upgrades to date include (losing track of everything I have done) - new Queen sleeper replacing scissor couch, new main and bathroom flooring, dinette replacing J Lounge and reupholster pilot/copilot and valances last summer at FT. New triple hitch for future motorcycle lift. Every Xtreme mod except engine door, butI do have the one and only Xtreme exterior built in TV on a U series coach (to date).

8 new airbags and some remedial at MOT yesterday.  (interesting my engine compartment insulation is first rate still, was surprised, and Keith R. said he is not seeing fuel line problems in 2000 coaches (yet) as a matter of course.)

New Chiliwhich material on entry steps and probably new bedroom carpeting Monday at Flanigan's FT shop.

Future - Recover dash, new silver leaf electronic dash, backsplash update, extend AC ducting forward, finish LED conversion, Solar and probably remove Propane for Induction and plus battery and pilot seat upgrade.

Yeah, probably my last coach. :-). Bunks in a  42 is attractive, but ALL my upgrades less than one year depreciation if I bought a 5 year old coach. with Bunks. Plus I would have that much more $$$ tied up in a coach, not working for me in the market. (Go Amazon!).

Always threatened to sell this to Dave Head, but he may not be young enough to wait me out.  :-)

Saw Dave Metzgers Coach at MOT - yup, 36 foot single slide HOT ROD, very nice mods and impeccable maintenance. Great Paint and wonderful Cherry cabinets. Maybe re - upholster a couple of chairs to your taste (showing a bit of wear) - Andy - a PERFECT first coach and maybe becomes a lasting one.

BTW, the 2002 GV is nice, but money down on it, and two in line after with interest if that deal falls through. Did not get across street, but plan to see new facility on Monday. Very encouraging news on Mike Rodgers - they are looking for him back to work at MOT in late July August, and best news, fully recovered.

Sorry if I hijacked this thread.....
Tim Fiedler    2025 LTV Unity MBL on Order
2000 Chevy Tracker 2 Door Convertible 4WD Now lifted 4.5"
1985 Citroen 2CV6 Charleston
Murphy Rebel on wheels with 175HP Titan
Cessna P337
1980 48' Westport MY (!/4 Share)

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #77 –
Quote from: Tim Fiedler –
Nice! What airplane are you all in? Is it just you and Lucy on your travels?


This is a Cessna Conquest II 441 twin turbo. Nice plane! Cruising speed heading into the wind was 300 kt. With the wind at our tail around 370 kt. Seats seven comfortably plus two pilots. So, I brought Friends! This was during our trip to Miami, OK. Yeah, blog post coming soon!


A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #78 –
Conquest sweet turboprop - way faster than King Air - holding value VERY well. Better seats up front! And JetA cheap right now - quite an ouch for 10 yr checks and when you overhaul those turbines...

Let me know if you need a pilot....fixed wing or rotorcraft...

My favorite airplane was the twin commander (piston version) - loved the room - "as I told my partner  - "it may be slow, but it burns a lot of gas" - huge space, comfort and carry a LOT in and out of short strips (I had 2400 feet at our house where we kept it (paved of course)).
Boy, am I hijacking this thread....

Tim
Tim Fiedler    2025 LTV Unity MBL on Order
2000 Chevy Tracker 2 Door Convertible 4WD Now lifted 4.5"
1985 Citroen 2CV6 Charleston
Murphy Rebel on wheels with 175HP Titan
Cessna P337
1980 48' Westport MY (!/4 Share)

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #79 –
Absolutely LOVE shelties. Had two - they were smarter than me, that's for sure...
The selected media item is not currently available. Dave Head & Megan Westbrook
Titusville, FL - The Great Outdoors
'98 270 buying this month
Toad is a 2018 F150 XLT

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #80 –
Basically, the issue that I've extracted from this thread seems to be to shift the responsibility of training/licensing from the state or private enterprise to the manufacturer. There would be, which goes without saying, a shift in liability, if something were to go awry.
Perhaps it's Andy's background that leaves me a bit of a skeptic, but, there seems to be a bit of a reporter in search of a story, more than a newbie in search of coach.

Who expects to be trained to ride a bike, captain a boat, pilot a plane, or drive a car at the point of sale? I'm confident that unofficially a sales manager would find a way to provide some level of familiarity and confidence to a newbie, but to expect them then to allow the liability to be shifted to them without an insurance carrier, could be a major misstep.

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #81 –
Quote from: JuanHappicampa –
Basically, the issue that I've extracted from this thread seems to be to shift the responsibility of training/licensing from the state or private enterprise to the manufacturer. There would be, which goes without saying, a shift in liability, if something were to go awry.
Perhaps it's Andy's background that leaves me a bit of a skeptic, but, there seems to be a bit of a reporter in search of a story, more than a newbie in search of coach.

Who expects to be trained to ride a bike, captain a boat, pilot a plane, or drive a car at the point of sale? I'm confident that unofficially a sales manager would find a way to provide some level of familiarity and confidence to a newbie, but to expect them then to allow the liability to be shifted to them without an insurance carrier, could be a major misstep.


Yes and No. I have a long background as a reporter, but there's no mystery agenda on my part as I'm truly seeking to do something I've wanted to do for decades...explore the motorhome lifestyle. Here's a 20 year old video that shows I've been interested in this for quite some time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT2vrMvol5g

I'll add that the comparisons you provided (pilot a plane or driving a car) require licenses and pilots have to jump through hoops to maintain a license. In my State a Class A motorhome only requires a drivers license.

Not trying to sound like a reporter or become argumentative, but when you think about it, there's lobbying groups that fight for the motorhome companies, but I don't know of any that represent the motorhome owner. While that's an entirely different discussion, I'll be happy to give my two-cents in the appropriate thread.

Personally, I would like to find a better way to learn to handle a coach other than just having a day or two of training during delivery. I made quite a few phone calls and and logged some air miles in my quest and have found some willing instructors. So far I have four days of lessons under my belt. So, I'm making progress!

I'll make a guess and say that the seasoned coach owners would take comfort in knowing that new coach drivers underwent some sort of organized training and possibly a field test before getting behind the wheel and sharing the roadways with others.
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #82 –
Andy,

Thank you for sharing your coach journey via your blog, videos and posts here in the forum.

I see many echos of our multiple trips down this path, which we are currently cycling through again.

In the two videos I have watched (Foretravel and Newell) and the accompanying posts, I observe a high degree of interest and enthusiasm over components, finishes, floor plans, etc. In my experience and observations, these are typical of early-exposure buyers in the RV/coach world. We shared many of these same reactions our first time through the cycle.

However, there are very important differences in the quality of materials, construction methods, engineering decisions and resulting product durability, longevity and safety that lie underneath the seductive glitz of modern high-end coaches and top-of-the-line mass-produced RVs. 

I encourage you to educate your viewers on the handling, ride and safety differences provided by the fundamental engineering and materials differences in the coaches in your video / blog post series. That includes between the products from each manufacturer such as Foretravel IH45 vs Foretravel Realm FS6, between the high-end coach manufacturers themselves and, especially, between this tier of products and those from the high-volume RV manufacturers.

In particular, there are significant safety and handling differences between a semi-monocoque chassis and a run-of-the-mill "box on two frame rails" product.

For more than a few of us, the chassis is why we're here owning, shopping for, or researching the non-FS6 Foretravels.

The reasons are important and, IMO, would be of interest to your audience.

My apologies if these factors were covered in content you have posted that I have not yet seen.

Thanks again for creating the content and sharing the story of your quest.

Doug
Doug & Steph Hackney
Researching Foretravel
44 countries - most by motorcycle
2007 Fuso 4x4 / Bigfoot expedition vehicle (sold)

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #83 –
Quote from: dhackney –

However, there are very important differences in the quality of materials, construction methods, engineering decisions and resulting product durability, longevity and safety that lie underneath the seductive glitz of modern high-end coaches and top-of-the-line mass-produced RVs. 

I encourage you to educate your viewers on the handling, ride and safety differences provided by the fundamental engineering and materials differences in the coaches in your video / blog post series.


Very Good Point Doug! Thank You!

I'm in the "I don't know what I don't know" stage and once I gain first hand information, I do hope to share it with others. I will say that I'm attempting to focus my search on the brands that are putting as much emphasis on quality and safety as possible. However, in this day and age, it appears that so many people are comparing models on a "bang for the buck" basis and not focusing on the quality of materials and they methods they are assembled.

Now, don't get me started on the subject of the mysterious MSRP issues and expected discounts as that's a very confusing topic.

At this very moment, I'm attempting to learn more about the Realm. As we know, there's little if any information about this model online at this point. So, if anyone has input, I'm all ears!
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #84 –
Quote from: TheGadgetGuru –

At this very moment, I'm attempting to learn more about the Realm. As we know, there's little if any information about this model online at this point. So, if anyone has input, I'm all ears!


We have looked at them several times in our visits to MHSRV to look at several coach brands, including last Saturday and today.  What questions might we have answers to?
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #85 –
Quote from: Michelle –
We have looked at them several times in our visits to MHSRV to look at several coach brands, including last Saturday and today.  What questions might we have answers to?

Thanks Michelle,

Starting with the basics, I've read the specs and it states the passive rear axle provides for a 7% reduction in turn radius, but there's no mention of the actual radius footage nor the front wheel cut.

On paper, the Realm seems like a great coach and now that Newmar has shifted away from the K3GT chassis, it seems that Foretravel has it all to themselves and that could be a very good thing for the Realm in the future.

The bunk floor plan may work for me and I hope to make it back to Nac in the near future to check out the closet space and to give it a closer look.

I'll ask what you thought of it when you went hands on with the Realm?
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #86 –
Quote from: TheGadgetGuru –
I'll ask what you thought of it when you went hands on with the Realm?


The floorplan that we liked best when the slides were open was a problem when slides were closed.  Half-bath door hit the kitchen counter and you couldn't get any further back in the coach with the slides in (pocket door wouldn't open).  There was significantly less overhead cabinet storage space than other coaches on a K3-based chassis (although the windows were larger) because there were no overhead cabinets in the front half of the coach.  The pantry space was good, the fridge was one of the narrowest residential fridges we have seen in use.  There was a pull-out section of the lower kitchen cabinetry that seemed very wobbly compared to a similar implementation in Newmar and Entegra.  There was no soap or filtered water dispenser at the kitchen sink.  The rear bath was the most nicely done we have seen, but the step up was a strange height - almost too low to notice it was there (I tripped both going up and down on several occasions.  We found it extremely odd that the engine access hatch was grouted in place, including the bolts (no handles).  You would have to saw out the grout to get to the top of the engine.  Soft finishes were some of the nicest we've seen; tile patterns were too busy for our taste.  There were significant blind spots in the cockpit due to the A and B pillars and a black-out design on the lower, leading edge of the driver's side window that really bothered us.  Uncomfortable placement of the engine brake switches for Steve (seat all the way back, switches were still too far back), really problematic for me (seat moved significantly forward).  The Comfort Drive knob was on the left side - intuitive for left handers, not so much for us righties.  Lack of shoulder belts for driver and passenger is a DQ on any coach for us but that's a personal choice.  Exterior bay heights are the best in the biz by about 1 to 1 1/2 inches) as a result of the K3GT, but front full-cross Joey bed is much narrower than other brands and the clearance below the center rails was no greater than a non-GT K3, possibly less due to equipment mounted there).  There appears to be a sealing issue with the bay gaskets as there was evidence of streaking on the backside of several bay doors and one carpeted bay floor was so soaking wet you saw droplets splash up when you tapped it (two others were wet but not as much).  Leveling jacks hung down lower in the stowed position (by several inches) than those on the other K3-equipped chassis we looked at.  Be aware that you can get a passive turning tag on a K3 (Newmar Essex, King Aire, 2017 Entegra Cornerstone).  Both Newmar and Entegra add additional chassis bracing (Newmar STAR, Entegra X-bridge) that approach the K3GT (likely why King Aire is now on K3 - just using Newmar STAR), just the bay heights will be an inch or so less high (as will the coach).  If you are sensitive to such things, we picked up on some issues with the paint striping - irregular in places e.g. curves weren't smooth, some "jaggies" in the edges, etc.  There is no screen door, a very limited number of windows actually open.  It still has the Fore slides - truly flush on the exterior; the mechanism is different than that in our 2003.  Lots of Silverleaf sensors, etc. throughout with a lot of integration.  We did not look at basic engine maintenance serviceability since we couldn't figure out how to get the rear bay door open.  Other Spartan K3 chassis we have looked at have had very good accessibility to chassis batteries, fuel filters, DEF tank, air dryer, governor, etc.

ETA Steve also pointed out a couple of things he noticed - the cross-bracing of the storage bays in the  K3GT is welded just at the corners of the brace tubes since they terminate in the corners of the bay framing (so weld area securing the brace tubes was not that large).  He wasn't as impressed as he was with the Newmar STAR fabrication.  There were some smaller gauge split loom wiring runs meandering along the bottom of at least one of the storage bays, which was an odd place for them given they could be damaged easily.  The bay door mechanism intruded into the storage space several inches.  We couldn't get a couple of the bay doors open because they seemed hung up on something, not sure if it could be due to the door mechanism or not..  The dash panel was far better supported than in other recent Foretravels we have been in.  You could press on it and it wouldn't give; others have had significant flex in them.  The dash covering felt like a soft ultraleather-like material and would be questionable against abrasions, a dropped screwdriver, and pet toe nails.  Another comment on the soft finishes on window surrounds, the quality of the workmanship was absolutely the best we have seen.
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #87 –
Michelle,

Could you be a bit more specific?

Yeah, just kidding!

Wow! Wonderful information.

Thank You.
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #88 –
Quote from: TheGadgetGuru –
At this very moment, I'm attempting to learn more about the Realm. As we know, there's little if any information about this model online at this point. So, if anyone has input, I'm all ears!

Andy,
 
In late 2014, I toured the Foretravel factory. At the time they had an IH-45 and a Realm on the assembly line in very near the same stage of building. Most of the under the floor systems were installed and possibly the rough floor.
 
The differences were striking. I am not able to buy a new version of either, but the IH-45 was so much more impressive than the realm, that when I can afford a used one, the Realm will not even be a consideration. I don't remember any specific examples at the moment, but that was my impression at the time.
 
Trent
Trent and Jean Eyler
2000  U295  4003  WTFE  ISC  350
Build#5603 MC#17385

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #89 –
Andy, excuse me if my post seemed cynical, it wasn't intended to be. I was just responding to the emphasis placed on instruction.

As a gadget guy, of course you'd be attracted to the cutting edge of the RV industry. Building a 2017 Foretravel IH would be closely  equivalent to having your own Consumer Electronics Show on wheels.  ;)

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #90 –
Quote from: JuanHappicampa link=msg=231425 date=14622143  Building a 2017 Foretravel IH would be closely  equivalent to having your own Consumer Electronics Show on wheels.  ;) [/quote

So?  If one wants to be the "master of their domain" and have slides, I could consult on how to insert this little item on board.
1993 U-240 "La Villa Grande"..CAT 3116 w/ Pacbrake PRXB...Allison 3060 6-speed..
Previous: 1983 Airstream 310 turbo diesel, 1979 Airstream 280 turbo diesel
                                      Build # 4297
                                      PNW natives
                      Home base:  'Cactus Hug' (Ajo, Arizona)
                        DW Judy & Chet the wonder dog
                        Full-Timers 'Sailing the asphalt sea'

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #91 –
Quote from: JuanHappicampa –
Andy, excuse me if my post seemed cynical, it wasn't intended to be. I was just responding to the emphasis placed on instruction.

As a gadget guy, of course you'd be attracted to the cutting edge of the RV industry. Building a 2017 Foretravel IH would be closely  equivalent to having your own Consumer Electronics Show on wheels.  ;)


Agreed. However, there's some noteworthy technology innovations in a variety of coaches starting to surface on even lower priced coaches these days. While I haven't researched it as of yet, I'm to understand the Entegra Vega system is notworthy. I hope to get a demo of that one in the near future.

However, with some of the tech, if it's not well thought out or properly executed, sometimes it's easier to just reach a few feet and flip the light switch or adjust the volume!
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #92 –
Quote from: mike leary –
[quote author=JuanHappicampa link=msg=231425 date=14622143  Building a 2017 Foretravel IH would be closely  equivalent to having your own Consumer Electronics Show on wheels.  ;)

So?  If one wants to be the "master of their domain" and have slides, I could consult on how to insert this little item on board.

As they said in the movie Jaws, "We're gonna need a bigger boat! Or...something like that!
A fully restored 1957 Flxible Starliner and a 2014 Marathon Coach
 

Re: Newbie Question: How To Make The First Coach The Last Coach

Reply #93 –
The price point of the Entegra's is attractive but you are limited to a few floor plans. If your first coach is to be your last you may want to design the last coach first. Entegra doesn't provide that option, which Foretravel, Newell, and the Provost platforms do.

What Florida residents should keep in mind is that the best 45ft coach is the one that's parked. With 20 million residents and 100 million visitors, the roads aren't inviting.  ;)