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Request for Diagnosis Assistance

April 17, 2011, 12:44:30 pm

We finally got our new to us 1996 295 back after a 7 week stent in NAC. I filled up at just over half full about 60 miles from home in Austin. The coach has run fine.

Yesterday I started the generator to get the cobwebs out.

Initially it started on the second try but died after about 30 sec-1 min. I opened the hood and started it from the gen room. It would run fine for a while then slow down until almost stopped (in fact did a time or two) and then catch up and run fine for a while. The longest it ran well was probably 5 min.

I saw no strange smoke altho once it coughed and I thought I saw a puff of black smoke.

Does this sound like
bad diesel?
Air in the lines?
The need for Cetane booster?


The gen has ~2000 hrs. It was serviced at MOT mid January of this year.

Thanks

Elliott Bray

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #1 – April 17, 2011, 12:49:05 pm

Elliott, my guess would be either a partially clogged fuel filter or small cracks in the fuel line allowing air to enter the fuel system. The two items are a common malady on coaches from the 90's like ours. There are others much more knowledgeable than me that I'm sure will chime in as well.

There have been a number of posts over the last 6 months addressing these issues.

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #2 – April 17, 2011, 01:00:42 pm

Try getting a gallon of diesel and running it from that fuel source. At that age you could be sucking air from a crack in the line at a bend. Its happened to several of us...

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #3 – April 17, 2011, 01:33:35 pm

Sounds like the issue is between a bad/split/leaking fuel line OR need for a new Facet electric fuel pump.  Either is not expensive. 
If there is a need for new fuel pump, do your self a big favor and go with the Facet round pump, Have seen prices from about $35.00 to $200.00 so be careful,  someone listed a place where they were about the 35 buck area.
Even if the problem is bad hose, put the pump in also, you will be the happy camper if you do.
2000 hours on a Kubota is still a new engine if you are taking care of it.
Cheers

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #4 – April 17, 2011, 02:54:22 pm

Mine acted similar to this. It was a clogged pre-filter on the input of the facet pump. You can verify good flow by disconnecting the line after the pump where it goes into the secondary filter. Put it in a jar or container and momentarily running the fuel pump to see if you get good flow. I had almost none. After the new filter it flowed very well without any stalling. I have a IDL 8000 in a 99 U270. I think yours may be similar. You can purchase them at NAPA. Here is what they look like and the part number. Be careful not to overtighten it. You can snap it off in the pump. Dont ask me how I know.

Regards, Mark

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #5 – April 17, 2011, 08:46:10 pm

Mark, I am just wondering if that displayed filter is the only filter between the fuel tank and the electric pump ??
I thought they all had a much larger filter before the electreic pump, the Racor with the R12T element.
The one you have in the pix is more of a trash strainer, not a real fine filter, so glad it got stopped up, I would hve a good look at the fuel filter on the engine too.
Anyway, good info, thanks

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #6 – April 17, 2011, 09:26:25 pm

Sounds like fuel lines to me, especially if the gen was just serviced.  I messed with the gen on my 1996 for two years: changing the fuel filter, bleeding the metal fuel lines, new fuel pump--it was still unreliable and would not continue running.  Do that short new hose test, from a can of diesel to the inlet of the pump:  see if the gen will stay running.  I got new hose from my local Ace/CarQuest, installed it and have had no trouble since. 

I only replaced the hose that was inside the gen compartment and had been exposed to heat.  Used clamps and joiners, took less than an hour.  The old hose held its shape when cut loose, the bends and twists being rigid. 

Andy1

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #7 – April 17, 2011, 09:43:30 pm

I had that problem and it was the inline fuel filter before the pump. Dan Stansel 36 U270 99 for sale

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #8 – April 17, 2011, 11:35:43 pm

Dave,
    I have looked for the other filter on mine and it has no other inline filter. I have also replaced the secondary screw on filter. The last owner let it sit for a year and had some sludge come through the line since I bought it a year ago. Found a bunch of crud in the primary cummins filter too.

Regards, Mark

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #9 – April 18, 2011, 01:56:01 am

I suggest that you go ahead and run the generator for a while and see if it will finally straighten out and run correctly. Every once and a while my unit will exhibit the same tendencies and then run just fine for four months and then be cranky again for a week or so and then run just fine for another 5 months. I suspected a fuel line air leak but it isn't likely I will confirm it until it totally quits and will not run again. Might be a leaking O ring on the fuel filter or some other thing affecting the fuel supply. If you can get it to run, make it power both air conditioners for a while (3-4 hours) and maybe it will blow your problems away.

Regards,
Jon Twork

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #10 – April 18, 2011, 02:48:11 am

Mark, Your sludge sounds like Algae (not sure of spelling, but slimy like substance) when diesel fuel sits and had some water in it, the Algae growth is tough to get rid of. Major issue on ships.
Had a case of it on a Mercedes Benz diesel once.
Keep extra filters handy as you will need them as the filters will clog up from the Algae.

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #11 – April 18, 2011, 09:29:44 pm

Well, The simplest solution was submitted by Jon Twork - try it again ...

I went to the coach this morning and after trying to figure out where the fuel lines came from/went to I started the gen.
Started and ran like it was suppose to. I ran both A/Cs and putzed for about 1 1/2 hours.

Came back this afternoon to do some other work and ran then again. No problems.

I am somewhat suspicious of fuel quality. We had run the coach for about an hour before my initial problems. Fuel return could have stirred the 'critters' up.

I suspect the Cummins is more tolerant than the Kubota. I'll look at some fuel additives but I suspect a 500 mile run this weekend will take care of a bunch.

Thanks for all the places to look .

elliott bray

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Re: Request for Diagnosis Assistance

Reply #12 – April 18, 2011, 09:35:33 pm

That is great, take extra fuel filters.

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